Chisoxfn Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 First off, just want to say welcome aboard Bryan. Want to clarify something on your comments about Rodriguez and Orionny Lopez. Their was a reason they were promoted, these type of promotions happen all around the minors and in every organization. It was an organizational promotion in a sense, but it also deals with the fact that Charlotte is completely and utterly banged up. They went through about a two month period, where they were lucky if they had 2-3 guys available in the pen to pitch in relief. During the final week they needed some spot starts because the Sox called up Munoz, Grilli, and eventually Baj (Wilson Valdez too, but that was when the season ended). Obviously they needed guys to come up and your not going to mess or promote a guy from Bham, considering they are in the playoffs and you don't mess with chemistry. Winston Salem is also in that same position. Remember, these minor league teams want to win and have attendance as well and if you mess around they or any other minor league team wouldn't want to be affiliated with your organization. As far as Honel goes, sure he threw innings, but the Sox were always quite careful with him and you have to look at pitch count as well. He started his career in 2001 with rougly 74 innings. Plus he had pitched in high school. Then in 2002 he pitched roughly 158 innings. Thats definately a jump up, but when you mix in his high school innings it really isn't. The Sox also limited his pitch count and were careful with him. In 2003 he actually pitched less innings at 145. Their is no reason to say the Sox had him throw too many innings. When you look at Bmac, your looking at a juco pitcher. He has had time for his arm to build up. While this is his first full season (instead of short season) he still threw 101 innings last year with Great Falls and 78 innings the year before with Arizona. But he also pitched in games prior to the start of the season in "extended spring training". Sure he's thrown more innings this year, but the Sox once again watch his pitch count. He has great control and hasn't shown signs of arm trouble (knock on wood). No reason to hold a guy back simply because the innings are there. Its all the babying around that creates problems. Shut him down, why don't you ask him if he'd want to be shut down. This is a guy working his way up and doing what it takes to reach the majors. He isn't a bonus baby as you happened to mention and is gonna bust his ass to get their and has done a hell of a job thus far. Now in regards to Sweeney, Idon't have the numbers in front of me, but I can say pretty confidently that he hit over .300 in the 2nd half of the season, and I'd think its more around .320 to .330 in the second half of the season. No one and I mean no one expected for him to hit with power. What he did, as one of the youngest (I think he was the youngest at one point, not sure if he still is) players in high A ball is supurb, imo. The guy did nothing to fall on his face. He also played impressive defense and flashed a good arm making himself the top RF prospect in the Sox organization. Now lets talk about trades. I'll be the first to say the Sox traded away some prospects over the past few years. HOWEVER, I look and see what they gave up compared to how many they gave up. This is off the top of my head Scott Dunn - Called up to Anaheim when rosters expanded Bittner - may have a shot to be a back of the pen reliever (extreme if, although the angels seem to like him) Josh Rupe - probably the best of the bunch..pitching wise John Rauch - nothing...headcase, arm troubles, blah stuff Gary Majewski - I like him, good fastball, good slider, closers mind Mike Morse - doing good down in AA for the Mariners. May have a shot, but despite the numbers has a long long way to go. Francisco Rodriguez (Rangers) - definately has a power arm, but no one and I mean no one would of thunk he'd do what he did this year. Webster - doing solid, may have a shot (very overrated though by BA). Jeremy Reed - has a shot, but I doubt will be a "special player", not many guys are and its not a knock on him. I like Reed a lot. Ring - Don't think much of him Edwin Almonte - Ehhh Joe Valentine - last I looked I thought he was like the 5th starter in cinncy now, converted from a reliever. Still..I doubt he'll amount to that much Tim Hummel - waived and then claimed by Boston (I think). What I'm saying is, I don't see any real LEGIT prospects that would all of a sudden make this system amazing. Remember, every year your also bringing in more prospects, plus Kenny got guys like Cotts, Pacheco (albeit he was a huge dissapointment this year), Ruddy Yan, Edwin Valdez, etc via some trades. Haven't really looked at the top 10, but a quick one off the top of my head would be: - BMac - Brian Anderson - Ryan Sweeney - Josh Fields - Felix Diaz - Gio Gonzalez - Arnie Munoz - Sean Tracey - Tyler Lumsden - Wes Whisler I don't have Borch on there anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Bryan, I should add, I'm not a big fan of sending Bmac to AFL. I think its a tremendous honor for him, but I don't want to see him make many starts. I think he's had a hell of a season and leave it at that. My hope is the Sox just have a thing or two to work with him (maybe they try teaching him a new pitch, who knows) and AFL is a good time to do that. However, if they want him to throw another 20 innings or so, I'm not for it. Then again, he at least gets a little bit of a rest period for his arm, but I'd get him ready and watch him carefully next year. On the plus side, he's getting a good amount of minor league innings under his belt, which should better prepare him for the workload at the major league level and what not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Hey welcome to the site Bryan. Its good to see you took everything constructively, that instantly gives me respect for you, and your operation. I'll agree you have some overwhelming competition when it comes to scouting the minor leaguers. We have people ranging from season ticket holders, White Sox minor leaguers, and the founders of futuresox who regularly visit the Sox affiliates and view their games to compete with. These guys know their stuff. Good luck with your site, and hope to see you around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Hi guys, I'm the half-idiot that created this list, Bryan Smith. I saw through my list of referrers that I was linked here, and wanted to come over and respond. I should start off by saying that I'm from Chicago, and while I lean to the Cubs, definitely like the Sox. I went to probably 8 games during the summer, because my family has season tickets there. First of all, in response to Soxman, I definitely didn't try to make it sound like the Sox have nothing. Ken Williams has sacrificed the farm system in recent years, and it shows. But the Sox have proven very resilient, and keep finding players worth talking about. And now to my largest critic, Rex... I will definitely stand by the fact that Lopez and Rodriguez shouldn't have been promoted to AAA, and McCarthy shut down. The fact is that prospects need to be treated like the bonus babies they are. Kris Honel threw more than 300 innings in 2002-2003, and it proved to hurt the system. I like Honel, I saw him in high school, and I would hate for what happened to him to happen to a talent like McCarthy. Is a minor league playoff push worth the second coming of Black Jack? Do you honestly care about your minor league teams that much? Same thing for Lopez and Rodriguez. Both handled the promotion well, and it probably won't turn out to be a big deal. But, the potential damage to a pitcher's psyche was not worth it. And yes, my wording was hard on Ryan Sweeney. No, he didn't fall flat on his face. But if I remember correctly, and I'll try to find the link, the Sox were saying in Spring Trainining that Sweeney was advanced enough to go to AA and possibly be up by year's end. He's a good prospect, in the Brad Nelson mold, but he isn't what they thought in Spring Training. I'm sure from Ozzie's expectations, it's fair to say he fell on his face. Maybe I dropped the ball down the rankings, and I'm sorry for that. Spidale looks solid to me, and probably shouold have been before Gray. I like constructive criticism a lot, as it helps me learn what I did wrong. You guys probably know the system better than I do, this was what my bird's eye look did. Thanks for calling me out on it. Welcome to soxtalk, where debates are good and tough skin is a good thing to have.......... I'm not going to get into a point for point argument with you here, but you are way off on both the AAA promotions and McCarthy. From your arguments, it seems obvious to me that you know little about how minor league systems work as a whole (hang around, you'll soak a lot in). Sending Lopez and Rodriguez to AAA was harmless. There is a MAJOR difference between promoting a guy in the middle of the season to the Majors, watching him get rocked and jettisoning him back to the minors hours later and allowing a kid to toss a game or two at the end of the season at a higher minor league level at the end of a season. At worst it would give thme an idea that they still have work to do to get to that level. At best it can give them the confidence that they can compete and make them work even harder in the offseason. There is no way they are going to, nor should they shut McCarthy down in the middle of the season. NO team does that. He has the whole offseason to rest. A few more innings now aren't going to hurt him a bit and AA experience can only help. I'm sorry to put it this way, but shutting him down is so far out of LF that it is inconceivable to me. He's strong and rolling along. I hope you will stick around and continue to offer input. Like I said before, I agreed with much of what you said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Agreed on the Sweeney front, and I'm one of the few on here. I wouldn't say fell flat on his face, but his first half was atrocious. For a guy that was called a God by a scout or some baseball guy on the inside, .283 just doesn't cut it imo. He isn't that great of a prospect. Next season is make or break time. If he doesn't have a great season next year, he isn't a great prospect. It's that simple. That's not me saying that he won't be any good, or won't make the majors, but he has to start producing in regular season ball (not Spring Training) before I think he is as good as advertised. You are kidding, right?? Next year a make or break year? C'mon man. The kid was in high school a year ago just hit .283 with 32 extra base hits and 66 RBI while only striking out only 65 times in HIGH A. He played in 132 games and got 515 AB's and that is a failure? Would you have been happy if he it .305 in low A? You gotta get past the first month or two and realize the kid is allowed a learning curve. For one I think he did quite well for his first full season of professional baseball. It looks like he held up well physically too, which is not as automatic as some think. You guys gotta stop believing the ST hype. The fact someone called him a God is laughable. He is a 19 yr old that played well. He may be a great player someday soon, but he is no ARod. He never was going to shoot up to the Majors in one year. I think it is an absolute joke if someone was disappointed in what Sweeney brought to the table this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randar68 Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Well welcome Bryan Smith. Anyways, I'm going to have to agree about Sweeney. You get called a god then you should start producing within the next few years. I think he'll have a hell of year next year though. Sorry, but Sweeney was a 2nd round draft pick out of IOWA HS and never even played most of his Senior year of HS baseball, yet comes from a partial season in Great Falls and hits .283 with decent peripheral numbers and some very solid defense as a 19 year old in high A ball? Scout rhetoric is scout rhetoric, just like their overheard conversaition about Gonzalez going straight to Kanny. It's not like Sweeney was saying he was the second coming. People hold this crap against him like their false-pretenses of greatness are the only measure of expectations. Jesus F'in Christ. Whoever is that critical of that kid should be taken out back and shot for their ignorance. Pure and simple. Any Cub fan who starts praising Francisco Hernandez has been poaching info off this or other sites unless they or someone they are close with has seen him play. McCarthy should be shut down? I wouldn't send him to the AFL, but you're out of your freaking mind to shut him down before the end of the season and playoffs, punishing both he and his teammates. Your minor leagues are an integral part of player development, and pissing off affilliates over crap like that is a good way to lose the trust and relationships with those clubs, something any numbnuts who has been to a few minor league games would know. Lopez, who is a marginal prospect and doesn't belong in the top 20-25 of the Sox' prospect list at #7? Puhlease. Lopez and Rodriguez getting a combined 3 appearances in AAA as fill-ins at the end of the year after Charlotte spent the last 2 months of the season starting many games with just 2-3 guys available out of the pen and had threatened to leave the Sox' affiliation over their feelings of neglect by the Sox? As for a Top ten? Jason (ChiSoxFn) 's list is a good start and add in Honel and Wing who, although they were injured were a part of the list a year ago, are probably still considered right there around the 8-10 range. Chris Young and Robert Valido and Pedro Lopez and Spidale probably complete about your top 15. Sorry if some of these things seem harsh, but they are. And anyone who is writing assessments of these systems with the info you apparently have or don't have needs to be called on it. Rex isn't your biggest critic, I was just biting my tongue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randar68 Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 You are kidding, right?? Next year a make or break year? C'mon man. The kid was in high school a year ago just hit .283 with 32 extra base hits and 66 RBI while only striking out only 65 times in HIGH A. He played in 132 games and got 515 AB's and that is a failure? Would you have been happy if he it .305 in low A? You gotta get past the first month or two and realize the kid is allowed a learning curve. For one I think he did quite well for his first full season of professional baseball. It looks like he held up well physically too, which is not as automatic as some think. You guys gotta stop believing the ST hype. The fact someone called him a God is laughable. He is a 19 yr old that played well. He may be a great player someday soon, but he is no ARod. He never was going to shoot up to the Majors in one year. I think it is an absolute joke if someone was disappointed in what Sweeney brought to the table this year. Amen, Rex, I couldn't have said it better myself. How many K's did Fields have in W-S? Speaking of Fields, he must have hit about .320 for the last month or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Yep, I left Honel and Wing off mainly cause of injuries. Wing underwent his surgery and should be back by the start of the season and with Honel who knows. The second they are back on the mound and 100%, they jump right back into my top 6 or so. We know I'm a huge Wing fan. And Young, definately legit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randar68 Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Yep, I left Honel and Wing off mainly cause of injuries. Wing underwent his surgery and should be back by the start of the season and with Honel who knows. The second they are back on the mound and 100%, they jump right back into my top 6 or so. We know I'm a huge Wing fan. And Young, definately legit. You got confirmation on the Wing surgery, I couldn't recall if that had been released or not. Any indication of the severity? Shoulder injuries scare the bejeezus out of me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 You are kidding, right?? Next year a make or break year? C'mon man. The kid was in high school a year ago just hit .283 with 32 extra base hits and 66 RBI while only striking out only 65 times in HIGH A. He played in 132 games and got 515 AB's and that is a failure? Would you have been happy if he it .305 in low A? You gotta get past the first month or two and realize the kid is allowed a learning curve. For one I think he did quite well for his first full season of professional baseball. It looks like he held up well physically too, which is not as automatic as some think. You guys gotta stop believing the ST hype. The fact someone called him a God is laughable. He is a 19 yr old that played well. He may be a great player someday soon, but he is no ARod. He never was going to shoot up to the Majors in one year. I think it is an absolute joke if someone was disappointed in what Sweeney brought to the table this year. Ok slow down. I meant make or break in terms of being a top prospect. He did have a good year, but the expectations are not going to be met. I guess I just poorly stated what I meant. Mostly, you are right in flaming me. I still say that he didn't meet expectations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Amen, Rex, I couldn't have said it better myself. How many K's did Fields have in W-S? Speaking of Fields, he must have hit about .320 for the last month or so. Whoever is that critical of that kid should be taken out back and shot for their ignorance. Pure and simple. I think you did. LOL And for the record, Fields had 18 BB and 74 K in 66 games (256 AB). And that does not yet worry me. Repeat that strikeout rate next year and we may be talking Borchard again, but you gota give a guy some rope to learn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randar68 Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Ok slow down. I meant make or break in terms of being a top prospect. He did have a good year, but the expectations are not going to be met. I guess I just poorly stated what I meant. Mostly, you are right in flaming me. I still say that he didn't meet expectations. Then that's your fault for setting unrealistic expectations in your own mind. I think he's done exceptionally well, playing at a higher level than most any HS draftee from his draft class and most college draftees, including many 1st rounders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Smith Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 First of all Randar, it's rude to say I've been 'poaching' info off this or other sites. You are calling me out for plagirism? I love dialogue between me and readers, but that pisses me off. You definitely reflected poorly on yourself there. But, I guess you're just searching for things to disagree with. Ok, I'll admit mistakes on Lopez and Gray. Spidale should have been on the list, and I would put Wing in as well. I considered Valido, who is probably a year away. And I'll back off the McCarthy comment. The Cubs shut down Bobby Brownlie last year, because they thought he had pitched too much that season. I like the idea in a lot of ways, and probably did not evaluate the relationship between team and affiliation enough. But creating a stricter pitch count system would be good (see Scott kazmir), even if he was drafted from Junior College. I knew that Sweeney had a good second half, and I do love that in a prospec. I'll be plugging August stats soon, and I can't wait to see what Sweeney did. But, his sub-.100 ISO has to be worrisome for fans, since it was his power that was touted out of high school. He's only 19, and many say power is the last to come. I just can't see putting him above fifth. Finally, let me say I love Chris Young. If they can get him to cut down on the strikeouts, he very well could be the best player in this system. And that's high praise when considering McCarthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heads22 Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Heck, most of the competition ain't even good in Iowa. Although, a buddy of mine did call him a baseball God, but that was little league. Sweeney's so far ahead oh a lot of 19 year olds in isn't even funny. Yeah, I'm gonna pull for him cause he's from CR Xavier, but he's done damn well. Buy him a Coke and congratulate him on a good season. He deserves it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randar68 Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Whoever is that critical of that kid should be taken out back and shot for their ignorance. Pure and simple. I think you did. LOL And for the record, Fields had 18 BB and 74 K in 66 games (256 AB). And that does not yet worry me. Repeat that strikeout rate next year and we may be talking Borchard again, but you gota give a guy some rope to learn. Rex, I'm with you. His first month in W-S he was K'ing at an extremely alarming rate, but you just gotta let the guy adjust. He knew what he had to work on and was jovial about it. He definitely improved and like you said, he'll probably start at AA and if he does that in the second half next year, I'll be worried. My point was more to the comparison that Fields K'd more in a partial High-A season than Sweeney did the whole year, was several years older and the #18(IIRC) pick in the draft. Enthusiasm sometimes runs away with itself and people just are ready to jump off a bridge unless these guys put of Jeremy Reed 2003 numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heads22 Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 First of all Randar, it's rude to say I've been 'poaching' info off this or other sites. You are calling me out for plagirism? I love dialogue between me and readers, but that pisses me off. You definitely reflected poorly on yourself there. But, I guess you're just searching for things to disagree with. Ok, I'll admit mistakes on Lopez and Gray. Spidale should have been on the list, and I would put Wing in as well. I considered Valido, who is probably a year away. And I'll back off the McCarthy comment. The Cubs shut down Bobby Brownlie last year, because they thought he had pitched too much that season. I like the idea in a lot of ways, and probably did not evaluate the relationship between team and affiliation enough. But creating a stricter pitch count system would be good (see Scott kazmir), even if he was drafted from Junior College. I knew that Sweeney had a good second half, and I do love that in a prospec. I'll be plugging August stats soon, and I can't wait to see what Sweeney did. But, his sub-.100 ISO has to be worrisome for fans, since it was his power that was touted out of high school. He's only 19, and many say power is the last to come. I just can't see putting him above fifth. Finally, let me say I love Chris Young. If they can get him to cut down on the strikeouts, he very well could be the best player in this system. And that's high praise when considering McCarthy. You and Jason are the big Chris Young backers.....me I can't wait for Bikowski to totally break out.... I'll be happy if he turns into the next Jeremy Reed.....great contact and the ability to get on base with power being secondary. Of course, if he turns out better than Reed, thats OK too. Sweeney's best asset is his age, IMO. Also, Bryan, check out FutureSox.com....it's our minor league page and we have an interview with players like McCarthy and Reed under Player Spotlights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 I'll also add, that I would be worried a bit about Sweeney if his halves were flip-flopped....... but I'd call what he did this year "player development" - which is the point. Gotta run, going to listen to BMac and the boys at Mobile. Let's hope they haven't forgotten how to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Enthusiasm sometimes runs away with itself and people just are ready to jump off a bridge unless these guys put of Jeremy Reed 2003 numbers. Exactly people look at Reed as a 2nd round pick who tore up Winston Salem and Birmingham with his numbers. They see Sweeney who's in his 1st season of minor league out of high school not reach those numbers and think he's not a top prospects anymore. It's an unjust criticism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Any online broadcast for the Barons game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randar68 Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 First of all Randar, it's rude to say I've been 'poaching' info off this or other sites. You are calling me out for plagirism? I love dialogue between me and readers, but that pisses me off. You definitely reflected poorly on yourself there. But, I guess you're just searching for things to disagree with. Ok, I'll admit mistakes on Lopez and Gray. Spidale should have been on the list, and I would put Wing in as well. I considered Valido, who is probably a year away. And I'll back off the McCarthy comment. The Cubs shut down Bobby Brownlie last year, because they thought he had pitched too much that season. I like the idea in a lot of ways, and probably did not evaluate the relationship between team and affiliation enough. But creating a stricter pitch count system would be good (see Scott kazmir), even if he was drafted from Junior College. I knew that Sweeney had a good second half, and I do love that in a prospec. I'll be plugging August stats soon, and I can't wait to see what Sweeney did. But, his sub-.100 ISO has to be worrisome for fans, since it was his power that was touted out of high school. He's only 19, and many say power is the last to come. I just can't see putting him above fifth. Finally, let me say I love Chris Young. If they can get him to cut down on the strikeouts, he very well could be the best player in this system. And that's high praise when considering McCarthy. Bryan Smith, I'm not one to mince words. Don't let my post count here fool you one iota. Frankly, I could give a rat's ass about "reflecting poorly upon myself" after some of the silly comments you have made so far. - Please enlighten me about where you received your Francisco Hernandez information, then, a stat sheet? He's in rookie level Bristol but that high on your list? I'm sure you'll be more than willing to cite your source. - "But, I guess you're just searching for things to disagree with." I didn't have to search very hard. - Pitch count systems and radar guns should be thrown away - Brownlie hasn't exactly been a model of consistency or health, bizarre example. - The question with Sweeney from the VERY START was how much power he'd develop, as he didn't have a pure power stroke. The long-term potential is all anyone with a clue has recognized as being a possibility, something that is always hard to project. The kid can hit anything and hits bad pitches, many times opposite field, too often with just a slap-stroke, instead of waiting for pitches to drive. Something easily corrected with experience, but quotes an "ISO"??? GMAFB. Need I really go on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Smith Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Bryan Smith, I'm not one to mince words. Don't let my post count here fool you one iota. Frankly, I could give a rat's ass about "reflecting poorly upon myself" after some of the silly comments you have made so far. - Please enlighten me about where you received your Francisco Hernandez information, then, a stat sheet? He's in rookie level Bristol but that high on your list? I'm sure you'll be more than willing to cite your source. - "But, I guess you're just searching for things to disagree with." I didn't have to search very hard. - Pitch count systems and radar guns should be thrown away - Brownlie hasn't exactly been a model of consistency or health, bizarre example. Randar-- I'm not going to start fighting with you like I was some guy at U.S. Cellular Field, sorry. I don't have the ability to see minor league games, or get minor league scouting reports. I go off statistics, and would tell you that on my site. Francisco Hernandez caught my eye while looking at Bristol's stats, and while seeing his youth on Kannapolis' roster. Switch-hitting catchers interest me. It would almost be too easy to rip into you for saying pitch count systems should be thrown away. My collegue Will Carroll would love me too, but instead I'll just recommend you read Saving the Pitcher, and then tell me that. Radar guns? I guess we agree on something. Finally, the Cubs have handled Bobby Brownlie exceptionally well since drafting him. He had some arm troubles in college, but the fact that they got a full season from him this year speaks well of shutting him down early last year. If Ryan Sweeney turns into a star, I'll be happy. I ranked him fifth, behind four very good prospects. That's not an insult, at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randar68 Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 It would almost be too easy to rip into you for saying pitch count systems should be thrown away. My collegue Will Carroll would love me too, but instead I'll just recommend you read Saving the Pitcher, and then tell me that. Radar guns? I guess we agree on something. It would be too easy because you're trumpeting someone esle's opinion? I'm not fighting with you, rather pointing out very glaring weaknesses in your arguments and points. The primary necessity, IMO, for pitch counts are: 1) pitching coaches that don't know what they are doing 2) The drive to win at all costs at some levels of organized baseball 3) The Radar Gun 4) Inadequate throwing programs at the low levels and in amateur baseball. Frankly, because Will Carroll says something, does not make it exclusively so, and he'd tell you that before I'd have to. Additionally, any half-ass pitching coach can recognize both poor mechanics and a tiring pitcher. Not pitching those guys in situations where they are likely to hurt themselves is 100% independant of pitch counts, as every individual is different, which is the very basis of the stupidity in applying a large-numbers statistical analysis to every player uniformly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 You got confirmation on the Wing surgery, I couldn't recall if that had been released or not. Any indication of the severity? Shoulder injuries scare the bejeezus out of me. Not sure on the severity, but he did have surgery. Stumm also had surgery, I know you mentioned you thought he was going to. The Sox expect Stumm back this spring at 100%. I was thinking he may consider retirement or something. From what I know, they expect Wing back at norm. I don't have the email on this computer, so I'm going off memory, I'll look at it tomorrow though and see if there was any specifics on what type of surgery. Off the top of my head I was thinking it was a labrum, but I could be off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Sweeney never was hyped to have pro power at this point. Scouts did feel and still do feel that he projects to have good power, not sure if its plus power, we'll wait and see how he fills out and what not. Hell, from talking with Sweeny, he'll tell you what scouts say, they call him "gap to gap" at this point but feel he will develop home run power. He's just a kid. I truly think offensively he compares to Garret Anderson. The more I look at some of the clips I have of his swing and think of GA's (I see tons of Angel games) and I see similarities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Bryan Smith welcome to the board. i hope you like the place. we as die hard fans defends our boys and love to talk baseball. i would love to have been on this from the beginning, beside that, good info on the prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.