Gene Honda Civic Posted October 19, 2004 Share Posted October 19, 2004 List you top FA targets for this offseason.. Starting Pitcher 1. Bradke - F the twins 2. Pavano - Probably gonna cost too much 3. Clement - F the Cubs 4. Lowe - GB pitcher, Absolutely get him if you can get rid of Konerko. That woud leave us with a GG caliber infield; Lowe, Garland, and Buehrle would all benefit. 5. Odalis Perez - Not a big fan, but he's an improvement. 6. David Wells - Throws strikes. No free passes 7. Wilson Alvarez -- Bring him in as #6 starter, throw him out of the pen, use him instead of the rotating T-ball stand when #5 fails Lieber - if his option is declined would slide into the middle of that list... Hopefully the Sawks crush him tonight, and we can sneak in for a deal. not likely though. I left off pedro(too expensive), Clemens(won't leave Houston), Millwood(no thanks), Ortiz(no thanks), the other ATL pitchers(no mazzone = no good) Second/Short 1. Placido Polanco - see blog 2. Omar Vizquel - Old, I don't know which Omar we'd get. 3. Mark Bellhorn -- Gets on base a ton, but probably doesn't do the little things KW and Ozzie are looking 4. 4. Todd Walker -- I don't know why, but I've always liked that guy. 5. Eric Young -- Strongly should be considered to Platoon w/ Harris, and fill in the outfield if needed. last three seasons(.294/.383/.436) vs. LHP -- Harris is (.186/.234/.233) over that span in the same situation. I would be happy if KW just went out an got EY. Singing any of 1,2, or 5 will make this a much better team. I left off (Kent, Renteria, Garciaparra, and Cabrera cuz they are going to be too expensive) [/b]Outfield[/b] 1. Beltran -- Quit playing so well damnit 2. Drew -- Lefty bat I like 3. Finley -- he went to Southern, why not? 4. Dye -- will cost about the same as everett, will produce bout the same as everett. I don't know why I put him on the list 5. Moistness Alou -- He'll end up in SF, but we should at least inquire. 6. Ben Grieve -- Ben Greive??? I know you all think I'm crazy, but check out his stats. Lefty bat? Check. High OBP? Check. Cheap? Check. Who the f*** cares if he strikes out... Kenny this should be the guy you have on the team instead of TIMO. Ok I got tired of making my list... Let's see yours -- In summary, Ben Grieve and Eric Young are cheap guys that we should look at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 SP 1. Radke-The guy just knows how to pitch. He doesn't walk ANYONE. He'd be the first guy I'd look at getting. 2. Clement-Numbers were pretty damn good, imagine those numbers if the Cubs actually scored for him once in awhile. 3. Lowe 4. Pavano-He'll be targeted by EVERYONE. Probably will get a ridiculous contract. 5. Lieber-Still knows how to pitch, hopefully the Yanks go for bigger and better fish and forget him 6. Perez-I can see his numbers just sky rocket coming to Chicago, he'd still be better than Grilli tho. 7. Alvarez-I wanted him last year for our 5th starter. I wanted him BAD. Dodgers got a pretty good season out of him. I'd like to see him return to the Southside. 8. Russ Ortiz-He's the opposite of what I want. When he's on he's on, but still WALKS people. He's been a guy Kenny has been targeting though, so we'll probably get him. Middle Infield 1. Omar Vizquel-Does it all. Age doesn't bother me, should come cheaply. Win-win situation. 2.Walker-I'd take him. Class act, said a nice comment about Sox in Chicago paper. 3.Polanco-I didn't know about him until someone brought his name up last week, if he's available go for it. OF 1. Beltran-DUH! We won't sign him though. 2. Drew-Stud. Previous injuries could be a concern 3. Catalanatto-Isn't he a free agent? If so sign him up. He'd come cheap, puts up pretty good numbers. CWSOX45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted October 20, 2004 Author Share Posted October 20, 2004 Catalanotto saigned a new deal -- He wasn't very good this season anyways.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchetman Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 man, you've been a sox fan too long...offseason wishes consisting of eric young and ben grieve. jesus man. EY is horrible at 2B. he only played 20 games there. 38 years old. holy christ, kill me now. one of those top three pitchers you mentioned would be nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 man, you've been a sox fan too long...offseason wishes consisting of eric young and ben grieve. jesus man. EY is horrible at 2B. he only played 20 games there. 38 years old. holy christ, kill me now. one of those top three pitchers you mentioned would be nice. They may not be the best but if you look at their numbers closely they can help are needs alot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AddisonStSox Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 Mostiure Alou? C'mon man. I want Pavano. Badly. He will end up being worth whatever he gets this offseason; he's a sure thing. After him... 1. Vizquel (Dude is a vaccume) 2. Bullpen Help (Dennis Eckersley for all I care) That's it. The rest would not be worth the money, we have multiple positions we need to take care of...Beltran, Russ Ortiz (Please stay away KW, I know he's tempting), no thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchetman Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 They may not be the best but if you look at their numbers closely they can help are needs alot. i did look at the numbers closely. even examined their splits cuz i was giving cheat the benefit of the doubt. i just don't see any value there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 Starting pitchers(leaving out Pavano and Pedro due to the price) 1. Brad Radke(will probably be resigned by Minnesota) 2. Odalis Perez(possibility he is let go, and I think he could be the sleeper of the offseason) 3. David Wells(has a little gas left, throws strikes, gets out, cheap, likes Chicago) 4. Derek Lowe(severe ground ball pitcher, and with a potential GG defense in the IF, Lowe could be very good for the Sox. If he signed with us, it would be a good idea to use Uribe at 3B, Harris at 2B, Gload at 1B, and Vizquel at SS...he could be lights out) 5. Jaret Wright(possibly cheap, decent starter, had a good comeback year...will probably resign with Atlanta) Middle Infielders(leaving out Garciaparra, Renteria, and other high priced MI's) 1. Vizquel(good defense, good hands, handles the bat, gets on base, cheaper, good stopgap until Uribe is ready to take over fulltime) 2. Polanco(limited range, good glove, very good with a bat) 3. Walker(see Polanco) 4. Eric Young(good range, decent arm, good glove, good speed) 5. No one...if they're this bad, you may as well go with Harris) Outfielders 1. Beltran(duh) 2. Jose Guillen(obviously, he's not a FA...but he's close enough to me...and he's a stud) And then the rest of Cheat's list, except Grieve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted October 20, 2004 Author Share Posted October 20, 2004 (edited) man, you've been a sox fan too long...offseason wishes consisting of eric young and ben grieve. jesus man. EY is horrible at 2B. he only played 20 games there. 38 years old. holy christ, kill me now. Nope I'm not a slave to names... but I am a slave to produciton, and understand the fiscal constraints that surround this team... You may not like the sound of Grieve and Young, but consider the alternative of Perez and Harris :puke. EY only played 20 games at 2B because of soriano, who's a selfish bastard, and wouldn't switch to outfield... EY has always had good range at 2nd, and he wouldn't be brought in for his D anyway, it would strictly be to platoon with Willie-can't-hit-LHP-to-save-my-life-Harris... EY is younger than Vizquel(by a month) . yet he's very coveted around here... Grieve has only once in his career had an OPS+ less than 102, and has a career mark of 112. Timo Perez clocked in with an OPS+ of 58 this year. :puke and a career mark of 81 :puke. Edit: I should add, I'm not advocating either one of these guys to get a ton of AB's, but we saw what a piss poor bech can mean for this team. Platooning harris, will help eliminate this teams terrible record vs. LHP last season, and replacing Timo/Borchard/whoever with grieve gives us someone who actually gets on base, while not sacrificing power. Edited October 20, 2004 by The Cheat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchetman Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 i really think you are overestimating EY's defensive capabilities. he sucked when he played for the cubs. regardless, his OBP last year was WAY above what it was the previous 3 years. fluke? did he learn a new skill? i dunno, but i wouldn't count on it again. grieve had a ops+ of 106 last year....strictly in a platoon situation. think about a lefty of'er who only hits against righties. you should have an ops of at least 120..a matt stairs or dan pasqua type. but yes, he would be better than timo. unfortunately kw has pretty much said timo will be back. at 150 AB's or less they would be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSF Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 Cheat, your list is good for everyone except Wells. His remarks about Frank's injury in 2001 turned me off to him (that, and the fact he may not even provide 3/4 of a season). The only good part about his brief tenure in Chicago was that he was somewhat of a good influence on Buerhle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AddisonStSox Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 How can you call Pavano a sure thing? Its not like you could see him building up to this. Last year was his 1st year with double digit wins, and last year was pretty much his first season healthy. Pavano had a breakout season this year. How can you call next year a sure thing right after a breakout year? The only sure thing on the market is that Beltran is going to get a s***LOAD of $$$. If you have watched him progress as a player like I have, you would know what I'm talking about. He's young, healthy, and has confidence. He was very reliable in the 03 playoffs, he has a ring, and he is only getting better. Yes, he is as sure a pitcher as you will see on the free agent market, as is Radke(who won't be leaving Minn.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchetman Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 guys that pique my interest polanco (he's gonna get a huge payday) olmedo saenz (press crede a bit - actually could be better) hollandsworth (a much better timo) chad fox (not sure when he'd be ready) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 polanco (he's gonna get a huge payday) How big of a contract do you think he is gonna get? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supernuke Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 Can anyone tell me for sure if Lance Berkman is a free agent or not I see him listed some places but not in others. If he is availible thats who I would target. A switch hitter with a career OBP over .400 would replace Maggs nicely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted October 20, 2004 Author Share Posted October 20, 2004 How big of a contract do you think he is gonna get? He won't get > $5M from anyone... I think he'll get on a sliding scale based on legth of contract $4+M @2 years $4M @3 years $3+M @ 4 years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted October 20, 2004 Author Share Posted October 20, 2004 Can anyone tell me for sure if Lance Berkman is a free agent or not I see him listed some places but not in others. If he is availible thats who I would target. A switch hitter with a career OBP over .400 would replace Maggs nicely. Not until '05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 He won't get > $5M from anyone... I think he'll get on a sliding scale based on legth of contract $4+M @2 years $4M @3 years $3+M @ 4 years That is what i thinking that also. But he said huge so i was wondering what he was thinking because if he gets any more than then you said i will be really shocked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 Absolutely get him if you can get rid of Konerko. --Get rid of Konerko? The guy finished second in the league in hrs and this makes him sound like he had a Crede or Jose-like season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 Absolutely get him if you can get rid of Konerko. --Get rid of Konerko? The guy finished second in the league in hrs and this makes him sound like he had a Crede or Jose-like season. We all know konerko is good. But the thing is he has 1 year left on his contract and he can possibly bring 2-3 guys in return. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxman352000 Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 1. Brad Radke-He throws strikes and is durable, but sometimes he goes through stretches where it looks mlike he is throwing batting practice to some hitters. 2. Placido Polanco- He gets on base and has speed (Both are exactly what the Sox need) 3. Carl Pavano- Pitched well this year and has great stuff, but I wouldn't get him for the big money he is asking for 4. Omar Vizquel- Veteran who knows how to swing the bat, could be a good pick up for the right price. His defensive skills have gone down some what, but they are still good enough 5. Carlos Beltran- DREAM ON Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted October 20, 2004 Author Share Posted October 20, 2004 Absolutely get him if you can get rid of Konerko. --Get rid of Konerko? The guy finished second in the league in hrs and this makes him sound like he had a Crede or Jose-like season. I love what pauly brings to this team, but I see a viable cheaper replacement behind him, who plays a better defensive first base... There would be money saved in dealing Konerko, or at the very least quality players in return. The infield Defense of Crede-Uribe-Harris-Gload would be great, and would make Lowe that much better. That is not a potent offensive infield, but I would expect to have a dominant SP staff, and a great offensive outfield if Pauly was gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFanForever Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 man, you've been a sox fan too long...offseason wishes consisting of eric young and ben grieve. jesus man. EY is horrible at 2B. he only played 20 games there. 38 years old. holy christ, kill me now. one of those top three pitchers you mentioned would be nice. This actually made me laugh pretty hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox61382 Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 I am surprised that none of you guys list Morris. I think he could really be a sleeper. He is a guy whos value has decreased because of a so-so year going into FA. If you compare this year to previous years, than it becomes obvious that this year was the fluke(never posted a 3.76 ERA or higher before this year). His peripherals were very similar to past years(increase in HR is the only major difference). I know that people are scared of the 35 HR's, but that is a fluke. Morris is one of the top groundball pitchers in the game with a groundball to flyball ratio of 1.59(in 2004) and a career ratio of 1.69. Furthermore, he had never given up more than 20 HR in a season before this year. Not to mention that Busch and Commisky are similar when it comes to hitters parks. He might not be an ace anymore, but I think he would look pretty solid in the middle of the Sox rotation, especially since his asking price has taken a hit with his performance this year. These are the type of values that the Sox will probably have to look for. I mentioned Hollandsworth in a previous thread, and I think he would be a great addition. He could be a cheap option in right field as a platoon player(starting against righties). Over the last 3 years, he has posted the following stats against righties: 700 AB .286 BA 25 HR 100 RBI 52 2B 71 BB 146 SO .351 OBP .481 SLG .832 OPS I don't think it would be too unreasonable to expect a .280/15/60 30 2B 50 BB .800 OPS numbers in about 450 AB's mostly against righties. If the Sox spend what little money they have on pitching and a leadoff hitter/middle infielder, than I think Hollandsworth would be a great addition for about 2M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted October 20, 2004 Share Posted October 20, 2004 Starting Pitchers: Pavano-Have I said that enough. Lowe- I'm putting him this high because of the money factor, I really like the idea of signing him now, if we can sign lowe we might have some money left over with a trade of konerko to go do some more in the fa market Radke-Great control, solid pitcher Perez- Would scare the crap out of me but he's still relatively young with good stuff, definitely an upgrade from what we have now. Relievers: Percival-Unhittable after injury, always been a good closer Benitez- Going to make the most money out of any reliever but he's a very solid closer Williamson- If healthy he's a premier setup man and could be a closer too. Infielders: Vizquel or Polanco- I really don't favor one or the other, I like both of them, both can run, get on base, good defense, good top of the order hitters. Outfielders: Beltran-He's ok Drew-Great hitter, very good defender, can run, he can basically do everything Finley- Old but still very good If we add an outfielder I wouldn't be surprised to see that through a trade EDIT: I also think Lieber would be a good bargain if the yanks don't pick up his option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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