SuperSteve Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 Konerko had a great year, no question about it, but in today's game he is overpaid at $8.5 million + and extra $500,000 if he is traded. Tim Hudson, if traded, will be traded for young, cheap top of the line prospects, who Beane can hold on to for several seasons, not overpaid players in the final year of their contracts. Oakland has won with pitching, they aren't going to trade one of their aces for a 1b/DH. It ain't happening. Yeah, that's why I brought up a package. A deal would be centered around these two, and would either involve prospects or more likely cash. Something like Hudson, Rhodes/Durazo, and a prospect for Konerko and Munoz wouldn't surprise me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 This is true. BTW, the only reason Beane would trade Hudson is because he will be a free agent at the end of the year, and he would like to get something for him. It makes no sense that this something is Konerko, considering he also is a free agent at the end of the year. I believe this to be BS. Dick, over the past few words I've determined that the word "Beane" translates to "Three-way deal" in modern english. I can see Beane sending Konerko to another team. CWSOX45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 Yeah, that's why I brought up a package. A deal would be centered around these two, and would either involve prospects or more likely cash. Something like Hudson, Rhodes/Durazo, and a prospect for Konerko and Munoz wouldn't surprise me. I'd be thrilled with that deal. Arthur Rhodes will help us in the pen for those late innings. I feel a lot better giving up Paulie than giving up Carlos. In my mind, Ross Gload is more than capable of starting everyday at 1st for the Sox. CWSOX45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AddisonStSox Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 The dummest statement ever made The dumbest statement ever made. Wait... Which one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 More than likely, one of Bmac/Anderson/Sweeney are gonna have to be in the deal IMO. They are not too far away and Oakland does need an OF when Dye is gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 The dummest statement ever made Oh the irony... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shagar69 Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 More than likely, one of Bmac/Anderson/Sweeney are gonna have to be in the deal IMO. They are not too far away and Oakland does need an OF when Dye is gone. dye is gone but they dont need an OF. their OF is kotsay, swisher, and byrnes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 (edited) I'm not talking about Lee seeming slow. I'm talking about his work ethic, heart and desire for playing baseball. I think KW and Ozzie have hinted at this. Both said Lee "knows what he needs to work on" this past year. Seeing how he didn't make any errors, had a great offensive yr [except for his HR swings], and was very consistent overall, they never said Lee was a building block. He should be, but something is probably happening behind the scenes that we fans don't know about here. I don't think you can question Lee's work ethic. He has gone from being one of the worst defenders at any position in either league to being one of the better defensive LFers in the game. And, quite honestly, I'm not sure how much validity there is to him having little heart or desire. I can't prove that he does have it, but I am pretty sure you are in the same boat as I am because you can't prove that he doesn't have it. If that's KW's reasoning behind trading him, it is a bad trade. You can trade Lee for Hudson...there is nothing wrong with that at all. But I trade Lee to Oakland for Hudson because Lee has value and Oakland doesn't take Konerko+ for Hudson. Quite honestly...I'm not sure I buy Konerko for Hudson, simply because I'm not sure how much Konerko helps Oakland. They have Hatteberg and Durazo in there right now, and both of those two are more effecient players for Oakland(and what I mean by that Oakland is getting a better bang for the buck with those 2 then they are with Konerko...Konerko will give them better stats, but at a much higher cost, and I don't think Oakland has any need to make that move). Oakland could use another OFer...I believe they have Byrnes in LF right now, but I think his arm is strong enough that he could move to RF without a ton of problems. I also think Beane can then slip Lee into LF, tell him to worry about getting on base and being patient at the plate, and Lee will respond by putting up good numbers. I do not think getting Hudson is out of the question at all. There is no doubt about that in my mind. I'm just not sure how much it would cost, and I'm not sure I want to know how much it would cost. EDIT: Dammit, I keep forgetting about Swisher in RF. Oh well...my above statements still hold true Edited November 4, 2004 by witesoxfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted November 5, 2004 Author Share Posted November 5, 2004 dye is gone but they dont need an OF. their OF is kotsay, swisher, and byrnes. What a nice young core of outfielders they have. That is I guess, if Swisher turns into what they expect him to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 Dick, over the past few words I've determined that the word "Beane" translates to "Three-way deal" in modern english. I can see Beane sending Konerko to another team. CWSOX45 That might be true, but Beane could get a heck of a lot more for Hudson than he could for Konerko. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punch and Judy Garland Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 This affects some of the rumors mentioned earlier: The A's are reported to be interested in trading Arthur Rhodes for Chalres Johnson. This from yahoo fantasy sports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 The blue jays seem to have interest in zito. http://www.nypost.com/sports/33028.htm October 31, 2004 -- Barry Zito or Tim Hudson is available, Randy Johnson is almost certain to be, and many clubs (not just the large markets) have money to spend. Let the intrigue known as the baseball offseason begin with these seven key issues: HILL OF BEANES Oakland GM Billy Beane could keep his big three starters (Zito, Hudson, Mark Mulder) together for a 2005 title push. But he's leaning toward proactively dealing one and taking a step back by adding young talent while creating payroll flexibility to sign one of the others long-term. Beane prefers that long-term man be Hudson, but he is the only one of the trio who is a free agent after next season. So if Oakland doesn't think he will re-enlist, he is most likely to go. Clubs are scared off by Mulder's chronic hip condition and poor finish, making Zito the more probable bait. Toronto, for sure, wants Zito, and the Yankees, Mets, Texas and Baltimore will have interest in an Oakland starter. Aggressive Beane wants to act now, which is problematic for the Yanks, who want to save chips to see if Arizona dangles Johnson, who could still end up a Dodger, Angel or Cardinal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punch and Judy Garland Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 Ordinarily I would assume a Jose Reyes for Zito swap as the Mets would be willing to give up the farm for Zito to reunite him with Peterson, but I don't think the Met prospects/young players necesariyl fit with the A's style of all walking and no running. Ricciardi covets Zito and you have to think that the Beane/J.P. relationship gives the Jays the inside track for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 Ordinarily I would assume a Jose Reyes for Zito swap as the Mets would be willing to give up the farm for Zito to reunite him with Peterson, but I don't think the Met prospects/young players necesariyl fit with the A's style of all walking and no running. Ricciardi covets Zito and you have to think that the Beane/J.P. relationship gives the Jays the inside track for now. I don't think Beane could try to pull one over on JP either. The A's are trying to dump some salary (I've heard/read Durazo and Rhodes amonst others, plus Dye is gone), and bring in some other pieces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 So then why is Konerko rumored at all??? Dump some of the dead money they have, so they can bring in someone, ie Konerko, who is a little more costly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 The dumbest statement ever made. Wait... Which one? LMAO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 Now that I got to thinking about my post a little more...does anyone think there is any way that we could get Byrnes and Hudson for Lee and prospects without having to kill ourselves for the future? KW wants grinders...guys who dont do anything too special or make things flashy, but they get the job done and they do it well. When I think of that, I think of 3 players off the topf of my head...Darin Erstad, Aaron Rowand, and Eric Byrnes. There are others too, those are just the 3 that come to mind initially right now for me. I also know that Beane does not like to give up good, cheap players...that's exactly what Byrnes is. However, Beane would have value in acquiring Carlos Lee, especially with the A's lack of a RH power bat. And Carlos Lee is not as expensive as Konerko is(he makes $1 mill less, if both were to be traded). Is a package of Lee and maybe 2-3 better prospects(maybe a pitcher or two and an OFer) good enough for Hudson and Byrnes? I'd imagine Byrnes could step into the leadoff role then(though he really could hit almost anywhere in the order). He gets on base enough that it would be worthwhile to have him there, and he can steal bases pretty well too(considering that he stole 17 for an A's team that had only 8 people steal a base ball year, including Byrnes, and had a combined total of 37 stolen bases. He stole almost half of the A's bases this year. He was also only caught 1 time stealing...so he steals bases pretty well. If that were to occur, then Vizquel could be brought in and he would be put in a spot where he would be more comfortable in the order at the #2 spot, Rowand would be able to move down to the 5 or 6 spot in the lineup, and Everett would be in LF, where I know we are all more comfortable with him(some, including I, do not want him here at all...but I'd much rather have him in LF then CF or RF). You can still trade Kong, of course too, with Gload on the bench, and cheap replacements galore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 Now that I got to thinking about my post a little more...does anyone think there is any way that we could get Byrnes and Hudson for Lee and prospects without having to kill ourselves for the future? KW wants grinders...guys who dont do anything too special or make things flashy, but they get the job done and they do it well. When I think of that, I think of 3 players off the topf of my head...Darin Erstad, Aaron Rowand, and Eric Byrnes. There are others too, those are just the 3 that come to mind initially right now for me. I also know that Beane does not like to give up good, cheap players...that's exactly what Byrnes is. However, Beane would have value in acquiring Carlos Lee, especially with the A's lack of a RH power bat. And Carlos Lee is not as expensive as Konerko is(he makes $1 mill less, if both were to be traded). Is a package of Lee and maybe 2-3 better prospects(maybe a pitcher or two and an OFer) good enough for Hudson and Byrnes? I'd imagine Byrnes could step into the leadoff role then(though he really could hit almost anywhere in the order). He gets on base enough that it would be worthwhile to have him there, and he can steal bases pretty well too(considering that he stole 17 for an A's team that had only 8 people steal a base ball year, including Byrnes, and had a combined total of 37 stolen bases. He stole almost half of the A's bases this year. He was also only caught 1 time stealing...so he steals bases pretty well. If that were to occur, then Vizquel could be brought in and he would be put in a spot where he would be more comfortable in the order at the #2 spot, Rowand would be able to move down to the 5 or 6 spot in the lineup, and Everett would be in LF, where I know we are all more comfortable with him(some, including I, do not want him here at all...but I'd much rather have him in LF then CF or RF). You can still trade Kong, of course too, with Gload on the bench, and cheap replacements galore. I like every word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 If we got Byrnes at all I'd s*** my pants and put my face in it. He's my second favorite non-sox player (Baldelli, Byrnes, Furcal) goes all out on every play, and just helps his team win at any cost. He, and Rolen I have deep respect for when it comes to playing the game. He's one the most underrated players (esp. devensively) in the game right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 I like Byrnes too but bear in mind he strikes out a lot. Over 100 times this year if I'm not mistaken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punch and Judy Garland Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 Sometimes younger players will improve theri K #'s. THis was his first completely full year so there could be improvement in that area. He'd be an instant fan favorite here, which also means it will be hard for Oakland to trade a popular guy like that, gien his low salary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 Sometimes younger players will improve theri K #'s. THis was his first completely full year so there could be improvement in that area. He'd be an instant fan favorite here, which also means it will be hard for Oakland to trade a popular guy like that, gien his low salary. He is gonna be 29 next season, a player usually peaks between the ages of 28-32. I am not saying he will not improve, but the chances of it are less likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 Yes, that's the only downfall in his game. Eric reminds me of Carlos. One year he'll walk a good number and K less, (03'-400 ab) the next he'll walk less and K more (this year 500 ab) I think he is more suited as a super utility man (hits lefties very well, and plays all parts of the field, and you can shift him with another player) The thing that impressed me about eric is that he hit .283 at both home and on the road. That's pretty good considering how Oakland's park is very big and the road is alot tougher to hit at. He still hasn't even had a break out year yet. I'd take him on my team anyday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punch and Judy Garland Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 That's a good point about the peaking of ages. I'm not sure how it will effect a player with less experience. Either way, his k's are at the least liveable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted November 5, 2004 Share Posted November 5, 2004 I'll ask this question. Is it more likely the A's would want Lee to replace Byrnes or Konerko to replace Durazo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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