Very crazy trade idea

[YASNY]

Since they do not have to trade him, it will be more like what they want is what they get.

For all practical intents and purposes, they do have to trade him. Hiring Backman signifies a continued youth movement and RJ is not going to be a happy camper with a bunch of youngsters after last year.

 

Book it. RJ will be traded.

[qwerty]

For all practical intents and purposes, they do have to trade him. Hiring Backman signifies a continued youth movement and RJ is not going to be a happy camper with a bunch of youngsters after last year. 

 

Book it.  RJ will be traded.

I know what you are saying, but they can get more from teams by saying, well we really don't have to give him up, because he is a big draw for us. So it is gonna be hard for you to pry him away from us. Then teams will start offering ridiculous amount of talent for one year of him.

[YASNY]

Well, I don't have a source for this, but I just heard Backman has been fired already.

[qwerty]

Well, I don't have a source for this, but I just heard Backman has been fired already.

Yes he has, there have been numerous threads about it today.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1916771

[Chisoxfn]

You do know how much the diamondbacks want for him right?

I think if the Sox dealt them Lee or Konerko and got a 3rd team involved to get one of the two giving the Dbacks prospects and you could get Rj.

 

I wouldn't make that deal either. It completely kills this offense. Carlos Lee is already one of the better hitters in all of baseball. He's also emerging into potentially one of the best hitters in all of baseball (some may disagree with me on this).

[CWSOX45]

I don't do this trade because we have to give up Konerko and Lee. I do think that if this deal does get done, it will be a three way deal involving another team. Should be interesting to see how this goes down this off-season.

 

CWSOX45

[Guest hawaiisoxfn]

Trading Konerko and Lee at all is ridiculous. Konerko was second in the AL in homeruns last year and Lee is turning out to be a five tool star. Hudson had a 3.53 ERA this past year, which for what you offered is not very good. And why Eric Byrnes? I dont get that one at all. If we trade Konerko and Lee, and Maggs still leaves, Frank is our only real slugger. Rowand, Uribe and Thomas would make a nice one two three but after that it would be all downhill. Who would hit fourth and fifth? Crede and Byrnes? I dont even want to think about that. If I were the opposing manager, Frank would never get one AB all year because Id pitch around him every day. With this trade, wed go from having one of the leagues strongest lineups to one of the weakest. And our rotation wouldnt be improved enough to get us anywhere either. Im sorry if I sound harsh, but this trade is lame.

[The_Godfather]

As almost everyone knows by now, there are rumors of a potential Konerko for Hudson trade(we only have like a 180 post thread about it...if you missed it, WAKE THE f*** UP).  I brought up an idea to bring Byrnes to the Sox, and how it would help us a ton.  This does bring up a point though...why would Beane trade Byrnes?  He's cheap, young, and is good...he doesn't need to get rid of him for a couple years.  So, I got to thinking about something that could work, but it gets pretty complicated...so complicated in fact that it involves 4 teams.

 

To start the deal, the White Sox send Carlos Lee, Paul Konerko, and a large package of prospects(3 or so...2 pitchers, 1 OF...these players are a little closer to the big league but are not big time impact players, or in all likelyhood will not be) to Oakland for Hudson and Byrnes.  In addition with the package of Konerko, Lee, and prospects, the White Sox send $6 mill...I'll get to that very shortly.

 

After that is done, the A's then send Konerko and one of the prospects they received from us to Pittsburgh for Jason Kendall and $12 mill(I seem to remember reading that Pittsburgh will take on around 35% of Kendall's remaining $34 mill, but not much more then that...that means in the $11-12 mill neighborhood).  That's where the $6 mill the Sox sent along with Konerko, Lee, and the prospects comes into play.  The Pirates pick up $8 mill of Kendall's $10 mill for 05, and $2 more the following years.  The Sox pick up $2 mill of Kendall's contract for 05 and $4 mill for 06.

 

But from that math, Oakland's still paying Kendall $7 mill in 06 and 07...too much by a couple mill.  That's where the 4th team comes in, and this is probably the most objectionable part of the whole trade, and this is where it very well could break down.

 

The Athletics then send Arthur Rhodes to St. Louis for a prospect and $4 mill...the prospect would be decent, but does not have to be anything spectacular...the key to that is the $4 mill St. Louis sends Oakland.

 

To put it in a simplified sort of fashion, here's how it breaks down

 

Sox give: Konerko, Lee, 3 prospects, and $6 mill

A's give: Hudson, Byrnes, and Rhodes

Pirates give: Kendall and $12 mill

Cards give: prospect and $4 mill

 

Sox receive: Hudson and Byrnes

A's receive: Lee, Kendall, and a combined total of $22 mill

Pirates receive: Konerko and a prospect

Cards receive: Rhodes

 

The reason the Sox make it is obvious...they improve a ton.  The reason Oakland makes the move is because they get essentially the same production out of Lee and Kendall as they do with Posada and Byrnes(this assuming that New York would send Posada out west along with taking on a considerable chunk of his salary for Hudson), their payroll stays the same, and Beane no longer has to worry about paying a middle reliever/set up guy $3-4 mill.  Pittsburgh makes the trade because they get rid of Kendall's albatross of a contract and get a little something-something in return in the prospect they receive(along with the prospects they'd probably get for trading Konerko at the deadline).  And St. Louis makes the trade because they get a replacement for Steve Kline while giving up a prospect and $4 mill total in 06 and 07.

 

Another reason I think Oakland and Beane maybe want to work with KW is that he realizes the Sox are not nearly as close to winning it all as the Yankees are, and by trading Hudson to New York, he improves the Yankees rotation a ton to the point where they are a World Series favorite again.  That's probably wishful thinking however.

 

 

 

Anyways...comments on the craziness of this trade?

Looks like you took awhile thinking about this, but you gotta be f***ing joking why would we trade Kong and LEE oh yea and 3 prospects + 6 million.........LMAO thats is the most retarded s*** I have ever read on this website were gonna give all that up for Hudson and Byrnes..... My god someone please smack some sense into this fool. Why would we trade our best two hitters leaving us with huge holes in our order to be filled for those two guys??

 

Paulie for Hudson yea I see that but your saying Lee three prospects and 6 million for Byrnes. :puke

 

"The reason the Sox make it is obvious...they improve a ton."

 

The only area they improve in is SP'ing thats is it this trade would not help us at all it wouyld weaken our lineup to the point that the only true homerun threat we would have is Frank Thomas... And that is not a pretty thought. Who else would we have Carl?, Rowand?, Crede? Im not sure about you but me I dont even want to consider what they may or may not do next year.... I said on a different post here that I think Carl will have a huge year but that doesn't mean I want to bet the teams chances of winning next year on him.

 

You say they improve a ton expalin this to me I see how Hudson for PK improves us but Lee for byrnes I think were getting the s***y end of the stick there plus we give them 3 prospects to the one guy you dont want picking through you system and 6 million. I guess you want Billy to write another book HUH " How I f***ed Kenny Williams" Thank GOD your not our GM cause the team would be s*** with you running it. :dips***

[witesoxfan]

Trading Konerko and Lee at all is ridiculous. Konerko was second in the AL in homeruns last year and Lee is turning out to be a five tool star. Hudson had a 3.53 ERA this past year, which for what you offered is not very good. And why Eric Byrnes? I dont get that one at all. If we trade Konerko and Lee, and Maggs still leaves, Frank is our only real slugger. Rowand, Uribe and Thomas would make a nice one two three but after that it would be all downhill. Who would hit fourth and fifth? Crede and Byrnes? I dont even want to think about that. If I were the opposing manager, Frank would never get one AB all year because Id pitch around him every day. With this trade, wed go from having one of the leagues strongest lineups to one of the weakest. And our rotation wouldnt be improved enough to get us anywhere either. Im sorry if I sound harsh, but this trade is lame.

I'm looking past Hudson's ERA this year, and am looking more towards the ERA he usually posts, which is around 3.00.

 

Everett is moved to LF then with Gload taking over at 1B for Konerko.

 

This trade is also making the assumption that we sign Vizquel. The lineup would look similar to this(I think I already posted it once, but I'll do so again anyways)...

 

Byrnes - CF

Vizquel - SS

Thomas - DH

Everett - LF

Rowand - RF

Gload - 1B

Uribe - SS

Crede - 3B

Davis - C

 

There are worse lineups out there then that...I can guarantee you that...and we improve defensively just due to the fact that Everett is moving from RF to LF.

 

There is an outside shot that KW could ask for Beane to give him Durazo as part of the trade too, and Durazo would then be used either as the starting 1Bman, or off the bench.

[The_Godfather]

I'm looking past Hudson's ERA this year, and am looking more towards the ERA he usually posts, which is around 3.00.

 

Everett is moved to LF then with Gload taking over at 1B for Konerko. 

 

This trade is also making the assumption that we sign Vizquel.  The lineup would look similar to this(I think I already posted it once, but I'll do so again anyways)...

 

Byrnes - CF

Vizquel - SS

Thomas - DH

Everett - LF

Rowand - RF

Gload - 1B

Uribe - SS

Crede - 3B

Davis - C

 

There are worse lineups out there then that...I can guarantee you that...and we improve defensively just due to the fact that Everett is moving from RF to LF.

 

There is an outside shot that KW could ask for Beane to give him Durazo as part of the trade too, and Durazo would then be used either as the starting 1Bman, or off the bench.

The Marlins Lineup looked better when the just joined the league then that s***y lineup NO THANKS

[witesoxfan]

The Marlins Lineup looked better when the just joined the league then that s***y lineup NO THANKS 

Get real.

 

I think I might actually compare that lineup to the Twins. All their lineup's done is win them 3 straight division championships.

[The_Godfather]

Get real. 

 

I think I might actually compare that lineup to the Twins.  All their lineup's done is win them 3 straight division championships.

The twins lineup is far better then that one Im sorry I dont like the feeling that the only power in the order is Thomas,Carl.... of which both are coming off injuries. Not to mention that Thomas has been s*** three of the last four years a shadow of his former self... ( Im A HUGE Thomas Fan BUT it is the TRUTH ) Then the rest of the Lineup is very suspect just not something I would like to see.

[greasywheels121]

The twins lineup is far better then that one Im sorry I dont like the feeling that the only power in the order is Thomas,Carl.... of which both are coming off injuries. Not to mention that Thomas has been s*** three of the last four years a shadow of his former self... ( Im A HUGE Thomas Fan BUT it is the TRUTH ) Then the rest of the Lineup is very suspect just not something I would like to see.

Power is overrated...(ex. White Sox since the beginning of time)

 

....and BTW everyone in wite's lineup still has pop.

[witesoxfan]

The twins lineup is far better then that one Im sorry I dont like the feeling that the only power in the order is Thomas,Carl.... of which both are coming off injuries. Not to mention that Thomas has been s*** three of the last four years a shadow of his former self... ( Im A HUGE Thomas Fan BUT it is the TRUTH ) Then the rest of the Lineup is very suspect just not something I would like to see.

Byrnes and Rowand both hit 20 or more homers last year and posted .800 or .900 OPS's, and I think given full playing time next year, both could hit in the area of 25-30 homers and could post .850-.900 OPS's. Juan Uribe hit 20 homers or so and had an OPS of .800. Joe Crede hit like 24 homers or something close to that, and Gload could hit 15-20 homers too.

 

Everett and Thomas are not the only power in the lineup. Not by a long shot.

[Ishmookie]

just do pk for hudson its too much to give up lee and pk

[The_Godfather]

Some of the guys that put up numbers last year I dont see repeating those numbers again.

 

Yes I agree that power is not everything but it does help to have atleast a solid 3,4,5 hitters who could on one swing put you up 2 or 3 runs.

 

I agree we need a leadoff hitter there is no doubt about that but not for the price you are mentioning for Byrnes in that trade of yours.

 

Also we need more LH Hitters Byrnes is a righty that doesnt help with the whole balancing of the lineup.

 

Thomas & Carl would be the only PROVEN power in the lineup I dont past judgement on someone based off of one year. That said I like Rowand alot and think he should have a good year but at the same time we can not sit here and assume he will based off what he did one season.

 

Gload who the hell really knows what he is capable of doing during a full season most teams really didnt pay much attention to him but next year if he is indeed staring they will have a book on him and be much better prepared to pitch to him.

 

In short regardless of what anyone here thinks I feel it is in our own best interest to work with what we have if we must make any trades it should only include one or the other (Lee / PK) not both.

 

This website would crash if that were to happen with people whinning about it

 

:fthecubs

[Guest hawaiisoxfn]

Byrnes and Rowand both hit 20 or more homers last year and posted .800 or .900 OPS's, and I think given full playing time next year, both could hit in the area of 25-30 homers and could post .850-.900 OPS's.  Juan Uribe hit 20 homers or so and had an OPS of .800.  Joe Crede hit like 24 homers or something close to that, and Gload could hit 15-20 homers too.

 

Everett and Thomas are not the only power in the lineup.  Not by a long shot.

So you get Byrnes, who MIGHT give you 30 homers, but you lose PK AND Carlos who WILL give you 30+ homers each.

[witesoxfan]

So you get Byrnes, who MIGHT give you 30 homers, but you lose PK AND Carlos who WILL give you 30+ homers each.

And you get one of the best 3 starters in the league. You can't leave that out.

 

Offense is not everything, and it is quite apparent that KW is thinking the exact same thing.

[Goober]

And you get one of the best 3 starters in the league.  You can't leave that out.

 

Offense is not everything, and it is quite apparent that KW is thinking the exact same thing.

agreed, but you still can't just not worry about losing 2 30+ homer guys

[santo=dorf]

And you get one of the best 3 starters in the league.  You can't leave that out.

 

Offense is not everything, and it is quite apparent that KW is thinking the exact same thing.

I rather give up one power guy, and get Randy Johnson.

[witesoxfan]

Some of the guys that put up numbers last year I dont see repeating those numbers again.

 

Yes I agree that power is not everything but it does help to have atleast a solid 3,4,5 hitters who could on one swing put you up 2 or 3 runs.

 

I agree we need a leadoff hitter there is no doubt about that but not for the price you are mentioning for Byrnes in that trade of yours.

 

Also we need more LH Hitters Byrnes is a righty that doesnt help with the whole balancing of the lineup.

 

Thomas & Carl would be the only PROVEN power in the lineup I dont past judgement on someone based off of one year. That said I like Rowand alot and think he should have a good year but at the same time we can not sit here and assume he will based off what he did one season.

 

Gload who the hell really knows what he is capable of doing during a full season most teams really didnt pay much attention to him but next year if he is indeed staring they will have a book on him and be much better prepared to pitch to him.

 

In short regardless of what anyone here thinks I feel it is in our own best interest to work with what we have if we must make any trades it should only include one or the other (Lee / PK) not both.

 

This website would crash if that were to happen with people whinning about it

 

:fthecubs

I don't think the offense would be as good as I want it to be...but it wouldn't be nearly as bad as you think it would be. And while you can't assume everyone will have as good of years next year, you have to assume they will be good enough for us, and that if they aren't, you go out and acquire smaller pieces to help improve the team.

 

As a quick comparison...I'll put up a Twins VS Sox lineup

 

Stewart => Byrnes

Ford > Vizquel

Hunter

Morneau > Everett

Koskie

Jones => Gload

Guzman

Cuddyer > Crede

Blanco

 

> or or =

 

And it should be noted that Mauer will be back behind the plate next year for Minnesota, making them stronger then us.

 

Also...to say that our 3,4,5 would not be solid is wrong. It would not be among the league's best, but Thomas, Everett, and Rowand could hold it's own.

 

This team was terrible against LHP last year after Maggs and Frank went down. If anything, we need a lineup that can hit both LHP and RHP...we do not need more LH hitting.

 

I don't see how you can say that Byrnes, Rowand, Uribe, and Crede are not proven power...they all hit 20+ homers last year, isn't that proven enough? And they did it in the majors, that's all I care about. I do not care that it was the first time for all of them, they all did it, and that's all that matters. You can't get much more proven then doing it. According to you, you want guys that have done it for years and years, but then we may end up having the black hole at the end of our rotation again. I'd rather have a bonafide ace and have to worry about fixing an offense come the trade deadline then worry about getting a starter, because getting pitching at the deadline is ugly. If the offense struggles, there is almost always a quick fix, easy, and fairly cheap solution out there for that somewhere. There is no such thing as a quick fix, easy, fairly cheap solution for SPing. You either have to catch lightning in a bottle, or you have to give up a ton.

 

To make moves like this you have to take risks. All Gload has ever done at any stop in his career is hit. He hits the hell out of the ball, and always has. Now's as good a time as any to see if he is for real...if he is, we have a 1Bman for a couple years, and if not, we can go out and pick up a cheapie somewhere and hope he gives us .260 20 65 .800.

 

Keeping one of them is something that could be done. All I did was go out on a limb and propose something bold. What's wrong with that? There are positives to trading both of them, with one positive being that we come out very good financially. Clearing $5 mill total or so(Lee + Konerko is $16.5 mill, Hudson and Byrnes is about $7.5 mill, so that equals $9, plus the $4 we'd pay this year = $5) helps make room for someone we initially would have no room for...perhaps Jose Guillen from Anaheim, perhaps someone via FA...who knows. There are a lot more things you can do in today's game with $5 mill then there was a couple years ago.

 

I just think that people are perhaps overvaluing Lee and Konerko, or are undervaluing Hudson(or maybe a little of both)...I've said that before. Hudson-Buehrle-Garcia-Contreras-Garland is probably the best rotation in the majors, or is, at the very least, a top 3 rotation, and would make us one of the favorites to win it all if we were to make it to the playoffs.

 

 

Ishmookie...I've said that if Hudson for Konerko would work out, that we should do it in a second, and not even worry about this entire mess, because Beane is being stupid. Konerko for Hudson will not happen.

 

That's not saying that Hudson coming to Chicago couldn't happen though...I think that's what this thread is saying.

[witesoxfan]

agreed, but you still can't just not worry about losing 2 30+ homer guys

I agree 100%. There are ways that could be addressed.

 

I think after I have thought about this a little more that the main reason I'd do a similar trade to this is because offense is easier to acquire at the trade deadline then pitching is. I think we can all agree on that.

[Guest hawaiisoxfn]

Trade both Carlos and Konerko gives us one of the worst lineup in baseball. Maggs is gone, so it would be Rowand, Uribe, Thomas and then who? Show me your complete offseason plan, and 2005 roster. I want to see what this new team looks like.

[chisox05]

Trade both Carlos and Konerko gives us one of the worst lineup in baseball. Maggs is gone, so it would be Rowand, Uribe, Thomas and then who? Show me your complete offseason plan, and 2005 roster. I want to see what this new team looks like.

If we were to trade konerko and lee....

 

Our lineup would definetely not be "the worst in baseball" in fact, if we get a shortstop at 4-6 million and an outfielder at 1-3 million we would have a top 15 at least offesnive team while acquiring 2 arms-probably hudson or big unit and someone else giving us.

 

1.Randy Johnson/Tim Hudson

2.Mark Buehrle

3.Other pitcher we get this offseason-odalis perez???

4.Freddy Garcia

5.Jose Contreras(if he cant get it after 4 starts and mccarthy continues to progress, i wouldnt be surprised if he would be up here)

 

 

So, I would not want to lose both of these guys, but pending what we get in return, we would be improved.

[witesoxfan]

Trade both Carlos and Konerko gives us one of the worst lineup in baseball. Maggs is gone, so it would be Rowand, Uribe, Thomas and then who? Show me your complete offseason plan, and 2005 roster. I want to see what this new team looks like.

Complete offseason plan...I'll try.

 

From what I can tell about players who I see being on the roster as of right now or are in the crosshairs for being on the team, we are at roughly $67 mill as of about right now(I have Garcia, Buehrle, Contreras, and Garland down for a combined $22 mill, Shingo, Marte, Politte, Cotts, and Adkins down for a combined total of $7 mill, Davis and Burke down for a total of $3 mill, Gload, Thomas, and Konerko down for a total of $18 mill, Uribe, Harris, and Crede down for $2 mill, Lee, Rowand, Everett, Escobar(who I think will be on the roster next year), and Perez down for $15.5(the .5 being Escobar)...add that up and you get about $67.5 mill.

 

As for my moves...I sign Omar Vizquel to a 2-year $8 mill deal with a $5 mill option for the 3rd year or a $.5 mill buyout. Payroll = $70.5 mill.

 

Then I make this trade I have proposed(and while it may be overpaying, to play along, I'll keep the same proposal...not saying it couldn't be changed at a later date or that we couldn't get more for them...that's just my max offer for Hudson and Byrnes...if they want anymore then that, they can shove it).

 

After that move is made, I figure our payroll is around $65.5, so we have around $6-10 mill more to fool around with. I'll then sign Percival to a 2-year, $10 mill deal($4 mill in 05, $5 mill in 06, plus a $7 mill option for 07 or a $1 mill buyout). The payroll is now $69.5 mill, and I figure I have between $2-6 mill left.

 

I then either

 

a - trade Crede as part of a package for either a reliever or a decent prospect and then sign Koskie to a 2-year, $12 mill deal($5 in 05, $6 in 06, $8 opt or $1 mill buyout). We then sign a guy like Greg Colbrunn or Dave Hansen who can play a little 1B too, because with Everett starting, our backup 1Bman is in the everyday lineup, and we really can't have that.

 

I could also see a guy like Ryan Hankins being called up in this instance, and having him play a little C and 1B for us too, with Burke doing the same.

 

OR

 

b - trade for Jose Guillen(maybe a Spidale or Munoz type for him), and he becomes my RFer, and I can now choose who between Byrnes and Rowand who plays LF and who plays CF. I'll put the stronger throwing Rowand in CF, though Byrnes could easily play their too...that's all a matter of choice.

 

 

I'm sure there's a creative way I could do both, but I'll spare the trouble.

 

Those are in the order I'd do them too. Choice A weakens the Twins, strengthens the Sox, and makes the Sox lineup more dangerous from 1-9. Choice B is basically a backup plan...if Koskie reinks with Minny or if he goes elsewhere and gets a longterm deal, we need to do something to create more depth to the offense, because while the lineup I proposed above is good enough, there is no one on the bench who really could come in and do any damage whatsoever(unless Escobar captures lightning in a bottle).

 

And, while this last part won't happen because KW and the Sox

 

Those are all the moves I make. My roster is then, for the most part, set.

 

Rotation of...

Hudson

Buehrle

Garcia

Contreras

Garland

 

Shingo, Marte, Percival, Politte, Cotts, Adkins, and a 12th pitcher out of the pen(whoever wins it in ST...just basically a mopup guy)

 

Byrnes - CF

Vizquel - SS

Thomas - DH

Koskie - 3B

Rowand - RF

Everett - LF

Uribe - 2B

Gload - 1B

Davis - C

 

That's plan A...notice that we have a guy that will could put up a .280 20 75 .800 season in the #8 slot...I love the strength from 1-9 this lineup provides.

 

Byrnes - LF

Vizquel - SS

Thomas - DH

Guillen - RF

Rowand - CF

Gload - 1B

Uribe - 2B

Crede - 3B

Davis - C

 

with Everett coming off the bench and playing 1B and all 3 OF spots for about 80-90 games. Everett has to be able to play 1B for this lineup to work out. If not, you can just simply dump his ass elsewhere.

 

 

Bench is then

 

Burke - C/1B/3B/OF

Harris - 2B/LF/CF

Colbrunn/Hankins/Hansen/someone - 1B(and maybe C and OF too)

Escobar - OF

 

That's plan A again...if we go by plan B, there is no need for the 1B and maybe C and OF type on the team, because we already have that player in Everett, and he can play all 3 OF positions too.

 

As far as I can tell, the payroll for this team would be in the neighborhood of around $73-75 mill total(Plan A is roughly $75 mill while Plan B is $73...when you add up just the salaries of the players, you get $71 and $69 respectfully, but I forgot to add the $4 mill that is given to Oakland in the major trade...dumb me ).

 

Not sure how many games this team would win...but I figure either would fair pretty well. Plan B is a lot riskier then Plan A is, simply due to the fact that you are having a lot of guys on the team who you are depending on to get it done but they have not gotten it done in their careers up to this point. Plan B also has a lot more potential to become the more dangerous offense, due to the depth it provides if Crede were to bust out and have a good year and Ben Davis was finally able to put together a real good year and hit in the .260-.270 range with 10-15 homers and a .750 OPS, along with having Everett on the bench. Plan A I prefer because it is more assured of being a good up and down the lineup, but it does not provide much depth at all, and the bench is fairly weak(though that is something easily fixed at the trade deadline or via the waiver wire...there are guys like that all the time).

 

The real clincher is the pitching staff. With just 2 signings, I feel that the pitching staff goes from being very mediocre to being very good. The bullpen would still have the potential to be a little suspect at times, but it would be much better then Koch, Shingo, Marte, Politte, Adkins, Cotts, and Jackson that we went into last year with. And I figure Cotts and Adkins have to improve just due to the experience they picked up last year. They might not be great pitchers, but I think they'll do well in the roles they have, and that's all that really matters.

 

Anyways, I'd say that pretty much sums it up. That's what I'd try to do at the very least...not sure how possible it is, but that'd be what I'd attempt to do.