Rex Hudler Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 In keeping with consistency, Indiana scores just two points in a six minute, 28 second stretch in the second half or 4 points in 8 minutes, fourteen seconds, whatever seems worse....... Bracey Wright = Antwaan Randel El That is not a good thing....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goldmember Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 illini roll on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 In keeping with consistency, Indiana scores just two points in a six minute, 28 second stretch in the second half or 4 points in 8 minutes, fourteen seconds, whatever seems worse....... Bracey Wright = Antwaan Randel El That is not a good thing....... Well at least I did well on my final.... I immediately went to find a boxscore after I got back, and I'm not too surprised. Our inside guys are too timid. Bracey did have a good game though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 SIU Salukis knocked off Murray State at the SIU Arena, 80-71. Southern was up 12 with 10 minutes to play and it was cut to 4 with 2 minutes left before Hairston hit a couple of 3's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 I like the fact that the illini actually nailed their free throws today, 19-22. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedoctor Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 you have to love the way illinois plays team ball. looks like they'll keep that ranking for another week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnB Posted December 11, 2004 Share Posted December 11, 2004 you have to love the way illinois plays team ball. looks like they'll keep that ranking for another week. no question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 That was a great show up in Chicago, good atmosphere as well. Team ball all around is correct. It's just a machine right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiff Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 forget post depth/strength um, maybe in december. come march we'll see where lack of an inside game gets them. early, second round exit ala chris thomas & torin francis two years ago? perhaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 um, maybe in december. come march we'll see where lack of an inside game gets them. early, second round exit ala chris thomas & torin francis two years ago? perhaps. Powell has been a beast up front Augie was better today, hopefully he can get the job done along with Nick, Jack. If we are going to have a weakness i'd rather have it be post scoring. Our guard play is best in the nation and our defense is top notch. No team is perfect, and few teams have dominant inside games. I'll take on anyone right now 2nd round exit? Please. If you watched that Nd game two years ago, it was more ND's ridiculous 3 point shooting than anything else. We had Brian Cook on that team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Also add: Self being badly outcoached. I don't see that happening with Weber thus far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlliniKrush Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Fatigue can't slow Illinois' shock jocks Rick Morrissey December 12, 2004 You sit there and find yourself thinking Illinois isn't playing particularly well. Or at least you find yourself thinking, on a December afternoon, the Illini are not playing like the No. 1 team in the country. Nothing that would cause palpitations anyway. And then you look up and notice Illinois leads Oregon by 14 points at halftime. Not only that, Illinois is shooting 56 percent from the floor, has made all 12 of its free throws and is holding the Ducks to 41.4 percent shooting. If Illinois isn't playing well and still doing this amount of damage to a decent team, then what? Then what happened in the second half happens. The Illini shoot 60 percent from the floor after halftime, limit Oregon to 39.3 percent shooting and end up winning 83-66 at the United Center. This is an Illinois team that has played four games in eight days, the last three while holding the top spot in the polls. A fraud would fall under similar circumstances. "I think the travel and the number of games took a little bit out of us," Illini coach Bruce Weber said. There hasn't been this much excitement for a game at the United Center since Michael Jordan was a Bull and the Bulls were an NBA team. "I had a lot of friends calling me and saying, no offense to any other teams, but Illinois is basically sort of like our professional team," guard Dee Brown said. "We're almost up there with the Bulls." There were 21,224 people in attendance, many of them wearing orange, who might argue the Bulls are almost up there with the Illini. They would have a pretty good argument. The college basketball world already knew Illinois shot well and ran well. Now it is starting to find out about an Illini defense that is murder on an opposing team's breathing passages. There is so much quickness on Illinois' roster and so much desire to get the ball going in the other direction that only a talented, veteran opponent has a chance of surviving. Oregon started two freshmen, two sophomores and a junior Saturday. That's not going to get it done against Illinois. The Ducks came into the game averaging 80 points and left a bit deflated and perhaps even a little de-feathered. "That was a shock to [the players'] system to see a team work that hard," Oregon coach Ernie Kent said. "I think we hit people with a little bit of shock treatment," Weber said. That's what these Illinois athletes are. Shock jocks. "When our defense is strong the way it is, there are not many teams that can hang with us," Illini guard Deron Williams said. Luther Head, who had 23 points Saturday, gives Illinois another offensive weapon in the backcourt. James Augustine isn't a wide body, but he's athletic. Roger Powell can score. Jack Ingram can play. It's hard to say the Illini came together during their rise to the No. 1 ranking because they already were close. The players seem to respect Weber, and they can live with his raspy, plaintive cries from the sidelines. When Weber yells "Luuuuuther!" it sounds more like Head has lost the keys to Weber's car than lost his man. There was a moment in the second half that might help explain the way this team thinks. Weber was sure Oregon's Malik Hairston was trying to pass the ball when the forward was fouled. But the referees had Hairston on the free-throw line for two shots and Weber was in full rasp, to no avail. As the Illini brought the ball up the court, Weber hailed a passing referee, Ted Hillary. "Teddy, he pushed him," Weber pleaded. "I'll bet you." The Illini were up 19 points at the time. If the players are going to be frenetic, it makes sense that the coach is, too, even in a blowout. Before the game, the players gave Weber a hard time for forgetting to take off a clip-on microphone before showing up for a meeting with the team. "They said, 'Oh, that's great, coach. We're trying to hold on to No. 1 and you're promoting your TV show,"' Weber said. Everybody's having fun. The Illini might not have been all they could be Saturday, but that had more to do with fatigue than nerves. They seem comfortable with their ranking. The Illini are 9-0 and don't play again until Dec. 19. They can use the rest. And college basketball gets a much-needed breather from Illinois. This team will wear you out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Post play doesn't really concern me. Weren't Wake and Gonzaga supposed to have great post games? Yeah, that really hurt us. We'll have to wait and see though. Auggy satisfies me as a 5th scoring option, same with Powell as a 4th. Ingram is a pretty damn good post defender. Let's keep it rollin, next stop: Valpo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Good article right here... It will take time for this team to develop Bob Kravitz December 12, 2004 LOUISVILLE, Ky. -- Tom Coverdale sat right behind the Indiana bench Saturday, watching one shot after another clang off the iron, wishing he could grab another few years of eligibility. Once again, his alma mater had fallen short, this time against Kentucky at Freedom Hall, and once again, it had done so for the same essential reasons the Hoosiers have lost four of their first six games: They couldn't shoot. Too often, they couldn't even get a decent shot. Against man-to-man, they often chose to shoot into the giant mitts of the Wildcats' 7-3 human eclipse, Shagari Alleyne. Against the zone, a defense the young Hoosiers often regard as more complicated than quantum physics, they continued to be rendered helpless. "I wish I could help them," said Coverdale, who played professional ball in Germany last year and is now hanging up the sneakers to work in medical sales and start a coaching career. "I can see, though, they've got a lot of potential. They're just so young. I'm sure people are saying the usual things, but I'm not ready to give up on them yet. You really have to look at the teams they're playing right now. It's going to take awhile. "The offense they're running now, that's all the same stuff we ran when I was there, but it's a read-and-react kind of offense. If you're playing a bunch of freshmen, there are times it's going to look really ugly. Nobody wants to hear about patience, especially in Bloomington, but that's what it's going to take." He's right: Nobody wants to hear about patience. But they're going to hear about it again. Like it or not. It's really quite simple: The Hoosiers overscheduled themselves into this early hole -- many thanks again to long-departed athletic director Michael McNeely -- and anybody who expected much better suffers from a severe case of impaired judgment. Should they have looked better in early victories over Indiana State and Western Illinois? Absolutely. Is there any excuse for losing at home to Notre Dame and looking so lifeless in the process? Absolutely not. But they were more than competitive against No. 8 North Carolina. They were a few minutes short of knocking off No. 7 Connecticut in Hartford. And while they never had a chance to beat Kentucky except for those first five minutes, the Hoosiers didn't get run out of Freedom Hall, either, by the No. 10 Wildcats. Imagine if IU played Kentucky's nonconference cupcake-loaded schedule: Coppin State, Ball State, Georgia State, Tennessee Tech, North Carolina and Morehead State. The Hoosiers would have been 5-1 heading into Saturday's game, and everybody would be talking about IU's amazing freshmen. What's important is, while the Hoosiers lost, they didn't get blown away during this stretch, didn't get thrashed in a way that might kill a team's confidence. Every game, they continued to fight until the end. Every game, coach Mike Davis and his players believed they accomplished something, grew in subtle ways, improved, especially on the defensive end. "Believe it or not," Davis said after an unusually calm day with Kentucky, "we're a lot better than we were four weeks ago." The problem is, that belief requires a leap of faith. The Hoosier Nation wants victories, not promises, and that figures to happen with a schedule that gets more civilized now. Keep in mind, too, that while the Big Ten is terrific at the top, there isn't any depth. And the Hoosiers get a break in conference play, facing Illinois, Iowa and Michigan State just once. Yeah, it's been ugly at times, just as Coverdale said. Too often, the offense has been a still life. Too often, it's been Bracey Wright and nobody else. Too often, the design seems to be, "OK, Marshall Strickland, you dribble it on the perimeter for 20 seconds, then Bracey, you chuck up a fadeaway 22-footer with one second left on the shot clock." For a generation raised on Bob Knight's perpetual motion offense, it's difficult to watch. But it's not the X's and O's. It's the players, too many of whom still don't get it. That's why Davis had everybody on such a short leash Saturday, going deep into his bench early and often. Even after six games, he has no real sense of who can play and who plays best with whom. A year ago, Davis made the mistake of staying too long with his scholarship guys, a mistake he recognized in the Big Ten tournament. He wasn't going to make that mistake again. Even Errek Suhr played. And it wasn't garbage time. Sometime in the next month, Davis must find some interior scoring and somebody he can count upon to be a consistent secondary scorer. No wonder Wright came to speak with the media after the game with his right arm wrapped in ice. "It's going to come," Davis said. "We've got to remain positive and not focus on the losses. We all knew this would be a tough stretch." Patience, people, patience. Unless they start losing to Oral Roberts, Furman and Northwestern. Then the gloves come off and Patience Time is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 That's a major fluff piece...... one that skips right by the bigger problems. I have a hard time being patient when they look so bad. It's not so much the losing as it is how inept they look doing it. it's more that the offense has looked s***ty like this for 2 1/2 years, so it is hard for me to keep hearing the "their young" statements. While it may be true, they can't be young forever. That cannot be a perpetual excuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
He_Gawn Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Great Article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 That's a major fluff piece...... one that skips right by the bigger problems. I have a hard time being patient when they look so bad. It's not so much the losing as it is how inept they look doing it. it's more that the offense has looked s***ty like this for 2 1/2 years, so it is hard for me to keep hearing the "their young" statements. While it may be true, they can't be young forever. That cannot be a perpetual excuse. C'mon Rex...Yes, this isn't fun, but we're starting 2 freshman, a sophomore, and 2 juniors. This isn't exactly the greatest time to have to learn how to play against the competition. It'd be nice if we played a UNC and then played a Willow Tree Univeristy of Arabia like most schools do. However, these freshmen don't really get to do that. Be patient, this was supposed to be a slow year. Next year's going to be huge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Next year's going to be huge. What, are you guys going to actually get to the NIT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 What, are you guys going to actually get to the NIT? Hilarious. :finger I believe we'll still be in the tourney this year. However, next year all these freshmen will have a year under their belts. We will finally have a true inside presence with the addition of Ben Allen and Marco Killingsworth. It'll really be similar to the 2002 team w/ J.J., and that will open up the 3 point shot again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 C'mon Rex...Yes, this isn't fun, but we're starting 2 freshman, a sophomore, and 2 juniors. This isn't exactly the greatest time to have to learn how to play against the competition. It'd be nice if we played a UNC and then played a Willow Tree Univeristy of Arabia like most schools do. However, these freshmen don't really get to do that. Be patient, this was supposed to be a slow year. Next year's going to be huge. greasy, the problem is the "next year is going to be huge" argument can't continue on forever. This team has had the same problems offensively for 2 1/2 years, not just the for the first 6 games this year. I am well aware that we are young. I am also aware that the offense they seem to be running rarely seems to work. At least not with any consistency. They can't win being a one man show with Bracey. Bracey and Marshall have played the same way for the past two years and it isn't working. Strickland makes stupid mistakes still and looks like a freshman. Bracey does what he can, but somewhow they have to figure how to incorporate the others so he doesn't have to do it all by himeself. When he scores 31 of the team's 58 points, it makes the others worse, not better. It sets progress back. I like how they battle defensively. I like some of the young talent. But let's look at the difference between Indiana and Illinois. Illinois has a freshman big man named Shaun Pruitt (sp?) who would be starting right now for the Hoosiers. Right now he can't get off the bench in Champaign. There is a major difference between the level of the two programs. Bracey Wright probably wouldn't even start for Illinois. (Chill out Illini fans, this is an IU discussion, not an opportunity for you to make fun) If he did, he would simply be a role player. I'm not looking at how things are right now as much as I am looking at the past three years. The Hoosiers were coming off an appearance in the championship game, had experience returning (yes, losing Jare Jeffries early hurt big time) and good recruits coming in. After 8 games, the team forgot how to play basketball. Unfortunately, they haven't figured out how to play offense since. Last year they had some experience and two soph guards that got lots of PT as freshman. Did that help? Nope Leach never got better. Strickland arguably got worse. Mike Roberts has never improved. Sean Kline has gotten worse. At least in the past, those kind of players improved enough to help out. Players like Steve Eyl, Jarred Odle, Brian Sloan and others were no different than Roberts and Kline, yet we aren't seeing progress with the players we have now. It seems to me that IU is constantly talking up that next great recruiting class, while the current recruiting class continues to struggle. IU isn't going to win by Davis recruiting the 5 best players in the country. They will find no consistency that way. The role players have to improve and contribute and not just move to the end of the bench so the next inconsistent freshman can come in and take their place. The experienced players need to step up and make the others better. None of that is happening right now. Maybe it will two months from now, but I don't see any evidence that a return to glory is anytime near. When I see evidence that this year's team is finally getting it, then maybe we can look to next year. But until then, I can see the same excuses next year about how "young" they are. They will continue to be young until Davis figures out which players to play and allows them to play more than 3 minutes at a time. So far, I can't see that happening any time soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Look at UNC a couple years ago with this same team that is now in the top 10.....All I have to say is this stuff happens; I don't see it staying like this forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 C'mon Rex...Yes, this isn't fun, but we're starting 2 freshman, a sophomore, and 2 juniors. For the record, Kentucky started two freshman, a junior (transfer in his first year), another junior and a senior. The player that had the biggest impact on yesterday's game was a sophomore who is still considered a project and barely got off the bench last year. You don't see people talking about Kentucky as rebuilding. The fact is, most teams are built with quality freshman and sophomores. Especially if coaches want to recruit the top talent, they have to figure out how to compete that way because the top guys won't stick around for four years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Look at UNC a couple years ago with this same team that is now in the top 10.....All I have to say is this stuff happens; I don't see it staying like this forever. Be careful comparing the UNC situation to ours. Let's not forget that the situation at UNC cost one coach his job. If you want to compare apples to apples, who is going to replace Davis and come in and make the big impact?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Be careful comparing the UNC situation to ours. Let's not forget that the situation at UNC cost one coach his job. If you want to compare apples to apples, who is going to replace Davis and come in and make the big impact?? I don't know that; I can't really think of anyone. That's why I'm still backing Davis. I don't really know who you could bring in. What options do you think we have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan99 Posted December 12, 2004 Share Posted December 12, 2004 Look at UNC a couple years ago with this same team that is now in the top 10.....All I have to say is this stuff happens; I don't see it staying like this forever. UNC had Sean May go down that year and before that they were actually doing real well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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