Chisoxfn Posted December 1, 2004 Author Share Posted December 1, 2004 what would the payroll be if we did this trade? Isn't Vazquez at 3/$34 mil? Something like that. But I think between Garland and Konerko, given Vazquez current year salary the payrolls would be basically a wash. The Sox would take on more cash in the long run. However, if the Yanks include cash with the package, it could make Vazquez a little more affordable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 However, if the Yanks include cash with the package, it could make Vazquez a little more affordable. I thought I read the Yanks were only going to send $4 million to Arizona. :headshake Will MLB allow the Sox to trade for Vazquez and recieve cash from BOTH the D'Backs and Yanks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Something like that. But I think between Garland and Konerko, given Vazquez current year salary the payrolls would be basically a wash. The Sox would take on more cash in the long run. However, if the Yanks include cash with the package, it could make Vazquez a little more affordable. Espn insider said the deal is as reported with the Yankees picking up $4 million a year of Vazquez's salary. The Big Stein is going to be writing about $300 million in checks next year if you include salaries, revenue sharing and penalties for being over the thresehold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 1, 2004 Author Share Posted December 1, 2004 I thought I read the Yanks were only going to send $4 million to Arizona. :headshake Will MLB allow the Sox to trade for Vazquez and recieve cash from BOTH the D'Backs and Yanks? Well if it were an offical 3 team deal, yes, if not, then no. However the Dbacks could then take the cash and swing it to the Sox in the deal. Who knows, I still have to think if the Sox made that offer, that RJ will be a White Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 1, 2004 Author Share Posted December 1, 2004 I think that means Vazquez makes like 5 million this year, which would be well worth it. I'd get him and Gordon and then the Sox could have the cash to pickup a 5th starter. Cause a deal of Vazquez (at 5 mill this year) plus Gordon (3.75) would actually save the Sox a little money this year. Dbacks save over the long haul. So the Sox save 2 mill when if their payroll goes up to 75 mill they can spend somewhere around 12-14 mill. With the 2 mill in savings from this years deal that gives the Sox 14-16 mill to spend after adding Gordon and Vazquez. This means the Sox can still add Wright or someone else to the rotation (Perez could be really nice too), pick up a bat to replace Konerko or pick up a RF and stick with Gload. Alright, warning, pipedream: Sox deal Konerko, Diaz, and Garland for Vazquez and Gordon. Sox sign Odalis Perez to a 3 yr 15 mill deal with incentives that could bump it higher Sox trade Neal Cotts for Kyle Farnsworth and a prospect Sox deal Carlos Lee for Ryan Klesko and Ramon Hernandez Sox sign Jay Gibbons when he's non tendered. New Lineup Willie Harris - 2nd Juan Uribe - ss Frank Thomas - DH Ryan Klesko - LF Aaron Rowand - CF Jay Gibbons - RF Ramon Hernandez - C Ross Gload - 1b Joe Crede - 3rd Thats not the most beautiful offense in the world, but its got a good mix of righties and lefties and should be good defensively. Thats a great defensive infield and Rowand and Gibbons are both good outfielder and Klesko is a good left fielder. You also have Everett on the bench. The one weakness is the top of the lineup. But starting rotation Vazquez Buehrle Garcia Odalis Perez Jose Contreras Bullpen Takatsu Gordon Marte Farnsworth Politte Munoz The pitching staff is very very complete, imo. Obviously all that crap wouldn't have to be done, just throwing it out their. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punch and Judy Garland Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Yeah Gammons is pathetic Addison, hopefully he'll lose the tv and newspaper gigs to become a more reputable and distinguished message board poster like yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AddisonStSox Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Espn insider said the deal is as reported with the Yankees picking up $4 million a year of Vazquez's salary. The Big Stein is going to be writing about $300 million in checks next year if you include salaries, revenue sharing and penalties for being over the thresehold. Could you imagine...even for just a moment...what it would be like for Sox management to pay a luxury tax for a single MLB season. Amazing isn't it. The Yankee fans have no idea how lucky they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AddisonStSox Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Yeah Gammons is pathetic Addison, hopefully he'll lose the tv and newspaper gigs to become a more reputable and distinguished message board poster like yourself. Meowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww. Relax shooter. If you are a reporter for whatever field, and you are wrong, even if it is a handful of times, you need to be called on it. Its like watching the weathermen on TV, can you think of another single profession where you can be wrong 50% of the time and keep your job. You think he's cute don't ya? I read ya. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Chisoxfn; Why do you want Carlos Hernandez? He wasn't that good for houston as a knuckleballer. I know, you meant RAMON Hernandez. I think KW learned his lesson from the Barry/Berry f*** up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 1, 2004 Author Share Posted December 1, 2004 On this Randy Johnson stuff. The Red Sox I guess are thinking about RJ as well. This is what they are saying on PTI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 1, 2004 Author Share Posted December 1, 2004 Chisoxfn; Why do you want Carlos Hernandez? He wasn't that good for houston as a knuckleballer. I know, you meant RAMON Hernandez. I think KW learned his lesson from the Barry/Berry f*** up. I'm great at doing things like that, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 That's an awful small price for Johnson. He must really not wanted to come to Chicago. He's got one maybe two years left to win another WS ring. I'll bet he has a short list of teams he would be interested in and you can start with the playoff teams from last year, and drop the Twins. I will be mildly surprised if he winds up in the AL, but only if it isn't NY or Bos. I would probably also eliminate the fading Braves from the equation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 He's got one maybe two years left to win another WS ring. I'll bet he has a short list of teams he would be interested in and you can start with the playoff teams from last year, and drop the Twins. I will be mildly surprised if he winds up in the AL, but only if it isn't NY or Bos. I would probably also eliminate the fading Braves from the equation. He should think about it more logically than that. He must know that if he were to join the Sox, our pitching staff alone would give us the division (barring injuries). All we'd have to do is get there. He knows from prior experience that with a little help he can try to carry the team on his back to the World Series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redandwhite Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Boston Dirtdogs is also reporting it as: According to a Boston Dirt Dogs source, Diamondbacks pitcher Randy Johnson is not coming to Boston. "You're right on Johnson. They (Arizona) don't want Arroyo." The source added that the New York Yankees will acquire RJ (should be next week) in exchange for starting pitcher Javier Vazquez, third-base prospect Eric Duncan, $4M per year, plus a "yet-to-be-determined part, either a new pitcher the Yankees acquire or, less likely, set-up man Tom Gordon." The same Boston Dirtdogs that had Scott Sauerbeck traded to the Cubs two seasons ago, and Alex Rodriguez in a Red Sox uniform last year. This deal is far from complete, thats a guarantee. It's quite a good deal for the Diamondbacks in my opinion. Vazquez could easily go back to his Expo form back in the National League, and paying 6 million to do that is more than fair. Eric Duncan has some excellent tools to work with, and the added part could be huge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSteve Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 WOW, How bad are we that the Yankees can get RJ for a RP and Minor leaguer... When we offered better players. Um, Vasquez too, whom was a huge guy on the market last offseason. A good deal for the DBacks (money aside, as I am sure they will recieve some) IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 He should think about it more logically than that. He must know that if he were to join the Sox, our pitching staff alone would give us the division (barring injuries). All we'd have to do is get there. He knows from prior experience that with a little help he can try to carry the team on his back to the World Series. Yankees or a team that hasn't won a post season series in decades and decades? Logically if I was a HoF pitcher, which one would I take? Plus look at the questions surrounding the Sox. Will Maggs and Frank be around? Who is playing short? Will Takatsu pitch strong for a full season and be a stud closer? Who will be catching? Absent a suitable offer from a top 5 or 6 team, maybe. But until then, he's going to talk to the big guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 Yankees or a team that hasn't won a post season series in decades and decades? Logically if I was a HoF pitcher, which one would I take? Plus look at the questions surrounding the Sox. Will Maggs and Frank be around? Who is playing short? Will Takatsu pitch strong for a full season and be a stud closer? Who will be catching? Absent a suitable offer from a top 5 or 6 team, maybe. But until then, he's going to talk to the big guys. What the Yankees have done in the past shouldn't affect his decision that much. It's clear a White Sox team with Randy Johnson could take the Central division. The Yankees have to contend with the reigning World Series champions. I know they're losing Pedro, but they'll probably be adding Pavano. If the Yanks don't win the East, don't be so sure they'll lock up the Wild Card considering the talent in the West. I think his easiest route to guaranteed postseason would be with the White Sox, taking into account the weakness of our division. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 2, 2004 Author Share Posted December 2, 2004 Stark indicated that it wasn't a done deal in any instance, although he figures in the end RJ will go their. So I think his stance is a lot different then Gammons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 New Lineup Willie Harris - 2nd Juan Uribe - ss Frank Thomas - DH Ryan Klesko - LF Aaron Rowand - CF Jay Gibbons - RF Ramon Hernandez - C Ross Gload - 1b Joe Crede - 3rd For some reason, that lineup kinda depresses me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 What the Yankees have done in the past shouldn't affect his decision that much. It's clear a White Sox team with Randy Johnson could take the Central division. The Yankees have to contend with the reigning World Series champions. I know they're losing Pedro, but they'll probably be adding Pavano. If the Yanks don't win the East, don't be so sure they'll lock up the Wild Card considering the talent in the West. I think his easiest route to guaranteed postseason would be with the White Sox, taking into account the weakness of our division. You mean a weak AL Central that includes an Indians team that won 79 games last year and will only get better, and a Tigers team that figures to spend in the upwards of $70 mill in salary, along with the 3-time winning AL Central champ Twins, who will likely resign Radke and could end up resigning Koskie too? I also do not think he'll like the fact that, as of right now, Carl Everett is penciled in to be our starting RFer, our up the middle combo is giong to be Uribe-Harris, we have Crede at 3B who regressed offensively in a year he should have progressed, our bullpen is not good at all, we will lose our starting 1Bman and one of our SPs in the trade for him, and we will have little money left to sign anyone to fix any of these holes if we were to acquire RJ. Getting RJ is not a clear cut way to victory...not when Cleveland is potentially 2 or 3 pieces away from running away with this division and Minnesota is still a very solid team, along with an up and coming Detroit team. The White Sox are the team on the fall, and they were never that high to begin with. The clear cut way to the playoffs is by going to the Yankees. This is a team that has won 95 games or more in 7 of the last 8 years(and the year they did not win 95 games, 2000, they ended up winning the Series anyways), and they've won 100 games or more in 3 straight years. I do not see how they are not like a lock to win the division again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 You mean a weak AL Central that includes an Indians team that won 79 games last year and will only get better, and a Tigers team that figures to spend in the upwards of $70 mill in salary, along with the 3-time winning AL Central champ Twins, who will likely resign Radke and could end up resigning Koskie too? I also do not think he'll like the fact that, as of right now, Carl Everett is penciled in to be our starting RFer, our up the middle combo is giong to be Uribe-Harris, we have Crede at 3B who regressed offensively in a year he should have progressed, our bullpen is not good at all, we will lose our starting 1Bman and one of our SPs in the trade for him, and we will have little money left to sign anyone to fix any of these holes if we were to acquire RJ. Getting RJ is not a clear cut way to victory...not when Cleveland is potentially 2 or 3 pieces away from running away with this division and Minnesota is still a very solid team, along with an up and coming Detroit team. The White Sox are the team on the fall, and they were never that high to begin with. The clear cut way to the playoffs is by going to the Yankees. This is a team that has won 95 games or more in 7 of the last 8 years(and the year they did not win 95 games, 2000, they ended up winning the Series anyways), and they've won 100 games or more in 3 straight years. I do not see how they are not like a lock to win the division again. Cleveland lost Vizquel and will lose Belliard too. Unless they sign a starting pitcher, they still have two very big holes in their staff. If they sign Clement, they'll probably be the biggest threat. By the way, is it really a fact that they are only getting better? If anything happens to C.C., they're done. Don't even talk about Detroit contending, that starting pitching staff is a mess. Even if they sign a free agent. Kansas City, no explanation needed. I still see Minnesota as our biggest competition. However, I feel they will get outbid on Radke. "Radke almost certainly has better offers on the table than the Twins' three-year, $21 million proposal. If the Twins keep raising their offer by $1 million a day, they'll be serious contenders by the start of the winter meetings on Dec. 10." Unless he is loyal, he could be gone. Resigning Koskie? The Central division is shaking in it's collective boots. I like how you point out our weak position players. We can't have an All-Star at every position, you know. There's nothing wrong with Uribe either. This White Sox team contended fairly late into the season against Minnesota without Maggs, Frank, and a 5th starter. Even with Diaz or Grill as the 5th starter, I'm very confident that a healthy White Sox rotation including: Johnson Buehrle Garcia Contreras wins the Central division by more than a few games, even if Jurrasic is in RF, and Willie is at 2B. That team has a better chance to win its division than any other AL team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurcieOne Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 If this team can play CONSISTENT baseball for longer periods of time where they play fundamental baseball... im confident we can win the central.... Pitching... then not hitting... Hitting.... then not pitching... Doing both.... then booting the ball around doesnt cut it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurcieOne Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 Also... forgot to add... The talent on this team is here... it has been... we gotta put it all together! Ozzie that on you killa... lets do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 Jayson Stark and Ken Rosenthal are both reporting that the Yanks have pulled there offer for RJ and will focus on Pedro. Rosenthal -- http://msn.foxsports.com/story/3208792 Stark --http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/stor...yson&id=1936460 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USAF_11F4H Posted December 2, 2004 Share Posted December 2, 2004 For those curious Eric Duncan was the Yanks 1st round pick back in 2003. He's a 3rd baseman who played for the Tampa Yanks and Battlecreek Yanks last year. Hit .254, and .260 with a combined 16 HR's. He was taken out of high school. Duncan is thought of as one of the best 3rd base prospects in baseball and is supposed to have some serious power potential. Of course based on his numbers you can see he still has a long way to go. Duncan can hit, but he's getting by on natural talent against 18-20 year olds as of now (obviously). He's got a stiff and ugly stance, but what a goddamn gorgeous swing. He's got one of those "natural Griffey-like" left-handed swings. Sadly, Duncan is almost completely and utterly useless at 3B. He makes at least two errors a game that are officially recorded, another 2-3 mental errors, and usually manages another error that somehow never gets attributed to him. Having watched him for a great length of time and having sat 30 feet or so away from him, I have gotten some close looks at the kid. [i'm secure in my sexuality -- he's a kid that probably gets it alot..]. I know I've probably confused and aggrivated the s*** out of him with my "Atta' boy Eric" when he trots out onto the field after his ABs, in conjunction with my "Jesus Christ Dorn, stop with that Ole' s***!" when he's in the field. But, is he a prospect that I'd want in my organization? Yeah. He's going to be in the show someday, I just don't know if it will be at another position or as a good-hitting/poor-fielding 3B. I suppose he could always have better defense drilled into him along his minor league career.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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