A New SS for the Sox on Wed?

[beck72]

If STL fails to offer Renteria arbitration by this Tues the sox have to be considered the favorites to land him. [They probably won't, as a STL paper recently wrote that STL's payroll will hold steady at 2004 level, and they need a stud SP, and pay Walker some cash--Renteria would see an increase over his $7 + mill salary; STL's offer of $32 mill over 4 yrs was supposedly backloaded, meaning STL wants to get a low salary for 2005 and pay more in later yrs]. Also, Renteria hasn't responded to the Cards offer. If Renteria lets the offer sit, and STL doesn't offer Arb., STL can't sign him until May 1st.

 

Bos. wants a SS for 1 yr, when top prospect Hanley Ramirez should be ready. Ana. is going after Beltran, and also need some SP. The Cubs might. But if the sox and Cubs offer similar cash, Renteria doesn't seem the type to rub salt in the Cards eyes by jumping ship to an arch rival.

 

I know people have talked about his price tag, maybe being $10 mill a yr for 4 yrs. Yet regardless of his price, what do people think about the possibity of Edgar at SS for the Sox for 4 yrs? [it's not Beltran, who would keep the sox from getting other players--basically it'd be PK off the roster]

 

I know people will say its a long shot. Yet the Sox have few position players locked up for a few years, like they do w/ pitching. Besides Rowand and Uribe, and Lee, the sox could use a guy to build around. With OFers like Sweeney and Anderson being talked up as potential building blocks, locking in a top SS makes sense [and we know how Ozzie love the SS position]

 

[And before people post the "Sox are cheap", "it won't happen" blah blah, try posting about the direction the Sox would take if it pans out]

[WHarris1]

Getting Renteria would make me a happy SOB.

[qwerty]

I do think it is too much for the stats he puts up. But i feel you could possible explode for another season or two like he had in 2003. I know he can hit i just wish he would learn how to walk a little more to get his obp consistently in the .350-.360 range. I will not be very mad if they sign him for four years ten million per, just think he only should get around eight million per season.

[jackie hayes]

If STL fails to offer Renteria arbitration by this Tues the sox have to be considered the favorites to land him. [They probably won't, as a STL paper recently wrote that STL's payroll will hold steady at 2004 level, and they need a stud SP, and pay Walker some cash--Renteria would see an increase over his $7 + mill salary; STL's offer of $32 mill over 4 yrs was supposedly backloaded, meaning STL wants to get a low salary for 2005 and pay more in later yrs]. Also, Renteria hasn't responded to the Cards offer. If Renteria lets the offer sit, and STL doesn't offer Arb., STL can't sign him until May 1st.

 

Bos. wants a SS for 1 yr, when top prospect Hanley Ramirez should be ready. Ana. is going after Beltran, and also need some SP. The Cubs might. But if the sox and Cubs offer similar cash, Renteria doesn't seem the type to rub salt in the Cards eyes by jumping ship to an arch rival.

 

I know people have talked about his price tag, maybe being $10 mill a yr for 4 yrs. Yet regardless of his price, what do people think about the possibity of Edgar at SS for the Sox for 4 yrs? [it's not Beltran, who would keep the sox from getting other players--basically it'd be PK off the roster]

 

I know people will say its a long shot. Yet the Sox have few position players locked up for a few years, like they do w/ pitching. Besides Rowand and Uribe, and Lee, the sox could use a guy to build around. With OFers like Sweeney and Anderson being talked up as potential building blocks, locking in a top SS makes sense [and we know how Ozzie love the SS position]

 

[And before people post the "Sox are cheap", "it won't happen" blah blah, try posting about the direction the Sox would take if it pans out]

Rotoworld reports that the Cards will "likely" offer arbitration -- could just be speculation, but I'm betting that they do (they have money, and the difference isn't that great, $1 or 2 mil). And I definitely wouldn't discount the Cubs that quickly, unless they sign Nomar, in which case they don't sign him anyway.

 

If we sign him, I think he's a solid piece. But it cuts down on payroll flexibility -- at $10 mil, probably too much. He's very good, but that just seems excessive for our payroll. I think Uribe is a better option if the bidding is around there. But at least I have confidence he'll be an asset, unlike Vizquel.

[southsider2k5]

Out of curiousity, how would people feel if the only two moves we made this off season were to sign Renteria and Jared Wright? Would that be "successful"?

[SkokieSox]

Out of curiousity, how would people feel if the only two moves we made this off season were to sign Renteria and Jared Wright?  Would that be "successful"?

I think a trade or two would have to occur, to possibly boster the pen slightly, but I would say it would be successful.

[TheBlackSox8]

seeing how it's what we need...i think it would be successful. But me and many others are probably looking for a few deals...not just two.

[qwerty]

Out of curiousity, how would people feel if the only two moves we made this off season were to sign Renteria and Jared Wright?  Would that be "successful"?

We need at the very least one bullpen arm if not two. We need osuna back, he is very damn solid. One of the best middle relievers on the market for a pretty cheap price.

[AddisonStSox]

Out of curiousity, how would people feel if the only two moves we made this off season were to sign Renteria and Jared Wright?  Would that be "successful"?

Almost, SS, but not quite.

 

I think that although a Renteria/Wright offseason looks good on paper, we would have done nothing to address bullpen needs. If we aquire both Edgar and Wright via free agency, then trade Paulie for a top-notch reliever and a couple prospects, we would have a first-class offseason for a team that practices "reisndorfian baseball."

[witesoxfan]

We need pen help, period.

 

I am not comfortable going into the year with a bullpen of Shingo-Marte-Politte-Adkins-Cotts and then probably Diaz and maybe even Grilli or Munoz.

 

We need atleast 1 reliever, and 2 would be better. A lefty would be good, so that way we could have Cotts go down to the minors to stretch out his arm a little(or maybe just have him stretch it out over the year), because he could be a very solid starter some day. And I would not mind Osuna at all, assuming he came quite cheaply. Osuna or maybe Julio or Baez in a trade, someone like that.

 

I'd like another OFer too, so that way Craziness doesn't have to start in RF for us...but if the Sox do not have the money to get one, he can stay in RF.

[jackie hayes]

Out of curiousity, how would people feel if the only two moves we made this off season were to sign Renteria and Jared Wright?  Would that be "successful"?

I'd be okay w/ that. Still a little uncertain about the bullpen and catcher, especially. But not bad. I assume you mean the only major moves. I hope they'd still take some fliers on a couple veterans and non-tenders.

[CWSGuy406]

I do think it is too much for the stats he puts up. But i feel you could possible explode for another season or two like he had in 2003. I know he can hit i just wish he would learn how to walk a little more to get his obp consistently in the .350-.360 range. I will not be very mad if they sign him for four years ten million per, just think he only should get around eight million per season.

My sentiments exactly.

 

I'm not exactly thrilled at giving Renteria ten million per year, on the factor of consistency alone. Like Qwerty said, if he's able to give us his 2003 year for a couple years, than he's definitely worth that ten million.

 

But you won't hear me complaining if he's our SS. I'd prefer closer to eight million per year, but ten million isn't overpaying that much.

 

 

And SS2k, while Wright and Renteria would be very nice, we need to -- NEED to address the bullpen situation. We need to pick up at least one more arm who we can be confident with towards the end of a game.

[Gene Honda Civic]

I still don't think you'll see anything happen imediately after the deadline... More likely there will be some signings next weekend, as the winter meetings kick into full swing.

[southsider2k5]

I'd be okay w/ that.  Still a little uncertain about the bullpen and catcher, especially.  But not bad.  I assume you mean the only major moves.  I hope they'd still take some fliers on a couple veterans and non-tenders.

Yeah, I am thinking in terms of impact moves (ie things that cost the team real money) I am sure they will take some shots on guys like Zimmerman and Nen who can fill up the pen.

[AddisonStSox]

Yeah, I am thinking in terms of impact moves (ie things that cost the team real money) I am sure they will take some shots on guys like Zimmerman and Nen who can fill up the pen.

In that case, yes: an offseason of Renteria and Wright would be successful. I, too, think the Sox will make some lower-level aquisitions via free agency or trade; but let's just hope if Paulie is dealt, we recieve something of value (ie bullpen, prospects) in return.

[beck72]

Out of curiousity, how would people feel if the only two moves we made this off season were to sign Renteria and Jared Wright?  Would that be "successful"?

It would be a decent offseason if they were the 2 biggest moves. But other moves would still have to happen, like adding another solid bullpen arm, and another leadoff type/ contact hitter.

[beck72]

I still don't think you'll see anything happen imediately after the deadline... More likely there will be some signings next weekend, as the winter meetings kick into full swing.

I was just thinking if STL didn't offer arb. to Renteria [which is the biggest suitor out there for him] then it would set things in motion for the Sox to be in the best position to sign him.

[beck72]

Rotoworld reports that the Cards will "likely" offer arbitration -- could just be speculation, but I'm betting that they do (they have money, and the difference isn't that great, $1 or 2 mil).  And I definitely wouldn't discount the Cubs that quickly, unless they sign Nomar, in which case they don't sign him anyway.

 

If we sign him, I think he's a solid piece.  But it cuts down on payroll flexibility -- at $10 mil, probably too much.  He's very good, but that just seems excessive for our payroll.  I think Uribe is a better option if the bidding is around there.  But at least I have confidence he'll be an asset, unlike Vizquel.

The key is STL doesn't want Renteria to make $9 + mill in 2005, with all the long term big money they are putting out. I read a STL columnist who wrote that the owners want to keep payroll at 2004 levels, while paying out $4 mill to Walker, and still get a top SP [w/ all the RJ talk, and being after Hudson]. That makes Renteria unaffordable.

 

My guess is w/ Renteria it'll come down to what he wants. Can Ozzie and co. talk him into being a key building block for a young team that could and should be near the playoff for his 4 yrs, where he is looked to for leadership and given a prominent role on the club? Or does he want to be a lesser piece to a possible WS club, where he's viewed as a steady contributor, but must take a back seat to the HR power guys?

 

It sounds and looks like the backloaded offer was a slap at Renteria. He would probably have been making less in 2005 than the $7 mill he made in 2004, with more in later yrs. Money isn't everything, and a few million here or there may seem like nothing to us. But getting a respectable offer, that would put him among the elite SS's in baseball [which Renteria is, prob. in the top 5], does go a long way for anybody.

[beck72]

We need at the very least one bullpen arm if not two. We need osuna back, he is very damn solid. One of the best middle relievers on the market for a pretty cheap price.

What that shows is the sox need to use other means besides the FA market to address the bullpen hole. Osuna prob. won't cut it.

[qwerty]

What that shows is the sox need to use other means besides the FA market to address the bullpen hole. Osuna prob. won't cut it.

I would take a mid three era any day of the week. I am not saying he would solve all of the bull pen problems but he would be a good head start. He would also be very cheap which is always a good thing.

[SuperSteve]

I would take a mid three era any day of the week. I am not saying he would solve all of the bull pen problems but he would be a good head start. He would also be very cheap which is always a good thing.

I agree. I would take Osuna back with open arms, just as long as he is happy not being the closer.

[jackie hayes]

The key is STL doesn't want Renteria to make $9 + mill in 2005, with all the long term big money they are putting out.  I read a STL  columnist who wrote that the owners want to keep payroll at 2004 levels, while paying out $4 mill to Walker, and still get a top SP [w/ all the RJ talk, and being after Hudson]. That makes Renteria unaffordable.

Nah...

 

Whatever he gets in arbitration, he'll get that much in a long-term offer from someone. They'll offer arbitration. It may be a risk, but only a small one. They're smart guys in St Louis.

[beck72]

Nah...

 

Whatever he gets in arbitration, he'll get that much in a long-term offer from someone.  They'll offer arbitration.  It may be a risk, but only a small one.  They're smart guys in St Louis.

We'll see how smart they are. They're raising ticket prices, building a new stadium, but still not raising team payroll? Doesn't sound smart to me.

 

But STL might be afraid to go to arb. with him. He'd likely get close to $9 mill. By all accounts, they don't want him to get that much in 2005. Another big option is signing Polanco for 2B, and getting a cheaper SS, that many fans and people in the org. seem OK with.

[beck72]

I would take a mid three era any day of the week. I am not saying he would solve all of the bull pen problems but he would be a good head start. He would also be very cheap which is always a good thing.

The Sox need a guy who can give them 60-70 innings from the pen, who can go 1+ innings at any given time, and pitch a few days in a row. Osuna isn't cut out for that role

[jackie hayes]

We'll see how smart they are. They're raising ticket prices, building a new stadium, but still not raising team payroll? Doesn't sound smart to me.

 

But STL might be afraid to go to arb. with him. He'd likely get close to $9 mill. By all accounts, they don't want him to get that much in 2005. Another big option is signing Polanco for 2B, and getting a cheaper SS, that many fans and people in the org. seem OK with.

He might get $9 mil, but I think that's an upper limit after such a disappointing season. I don't think Renteria would risk it. If he gets an offer for $8.5 mil per for 2+ years (which he almost certainly will), he'll take it. The Cards, knowing that, will offer arbitration. Anyways, I haven't seen details on their $32 mil/4 yr offer, but you'd think it includes at least $6 mil in the first year. Would they risk losing him for nothing over a $2-something mil difference?