DBAHO Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Lieber's status with the Phillies. Now tell me this, is it worth giving Lieber $22 million over 3 years? Lieber, who was offered arbitration, and the Phillies are close to a three-year deal for $21 million. Lieber, who made $3.5 million in base salary last year when he went 14-8 with a 4.33 ERA in 27 starts, could have been retained for next season if the Yankees had picked up an $8 million option and not let him get to free agency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Lieber's status with the Phillies. Now tell me this, is it worth giving Lieber $22 million over 3 years? My gut reaction answer to your question is .... Yes. He's a quality, healthy pitcher who has proven he knows how to pich and win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted December 8, 2004 Author Share Posted December 8, 2004 Lieber's status with the Phillies. Now tell me this, is it worth giving Lieber $22 million over 3 years? Yes, without a doubt. We have a pretty good idea what kinda numbers he will be putting up. We need to avoid the gapping hole for our fifth starter. After that i would go for bullpen help, honestly, because i do not see us signing a second baseman or shortstop this off-season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Lieber for 7 mill in 2005. Cairo from 1 to 2.5 mill OR Polanco for 3 to 5 mill in 2005. Setup guy (Tom Gordon, Steve Kline etc.) for $4 mill. That scenario is still very much possible, and payroll would be at about $75 mill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted December 8, 2004 Author Share Posted December 8, 2004 Lieber for 7 mill in 2005. Cairo from 1 to 2.5 mill OR Polanco for 3 to 5 mill in 2005. Setup guy (Tom Gordon, Steve Kline etc.) for $4 mill. That scenario is still very much possible, and payroll would be at about $75 mill. I believe kline will be a yankee, but anyway imagine if the sox did sign kline some how. We would have two of the top five left handed relievers in all of baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted December 8, 2004 Author Share Posted December 8, 2004 The New York Post has joined the Times in reporting that Jon Lieber will sign with the Phillies. According to the Post, it will be a three-year, $21 million contract. Dec. 8 - 4:18 am et From rotoworld. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 I believe kline will be a yankee, but anyway imagine if the sox did sign kline some how. We would have two of the top five left handed relievers in all of baseball. Yeah I know, but I was tossing the first name of a top set-up guy that came to mind. But KW has shown over the past few seasons that he will fill a need in the bullpen, and hopefully he'll do it again. But we do have guys like Baj waiting for a chance as well. Who knows what will happen in spring training come 2005, that's how Jon Adkins got on the team in the 1st place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 The New York Post has joined the Times in reporting that Jon Lieber will sign with the Phillies. According to the Post, it will be a three-year, $21 million contract. Dec. 8 - 4:18 am et From rotoworld. If that's the case, that's an excellent deal for the Phillies and props to Ed Wade for once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 I hope KW swoops in from under the radar and steals Leiber from the Phils. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted December 8, 2004 Author Share Posted December 8, 2004 If that's the case, that's an excellent deal for the Phillies and props to Ed Wade for once. The yankees are idiots for not picking up his option and trying to resign him for more years. :headshake But they have money and can do whatever they please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Tizzle Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 I hope KW swoops in from under the radar and steals Leiber from the Phils. Let's be realistic here. I don't understand how some of you were supportive of signing Lieber, yet completely dismissive of Jaret Wright recieveing a similar amount. Both have had prior injuries problems, both had good seasons. KW won't steal Lieber from underneath the Phillies because he will not pay him 22 million+ over 3 years. If any of you are under the assumption JR has money stashed away and is awaiting the perfect moment to spend it you're sorely mistaken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted December 8, 2004 Author Share Posted December 8, 2004 Let's be realistic here. I don't understand how some of you were supportive of signing Lieber, yet completely dismissive of Jaret Wright recieveing a similar amount. Both have had prior injuries problems, both had good seasons. KW won't steal Lieber from underneath the Phillies because he will not pay him 22 million+ over 3 years. If any of you are under the assumption JR has money stashed away and is awaiting the perfect moment to spend it you're sorely mistaken. Lieber has had more than one decent to good year in his career, wright has not done so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Exactly qwerty! Leiber has more of a history of being a quality pitcher, consistently, than Wright. You also can forget about the Mazzone factor with Leiber. Wright just might turn into the Jaret Wright we remember prior to Mazzone's impact on him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Exactly qwerty! Leiber has more of a history of being a quality pitcher, consistently, than Wright. You also can forget about the Mazzone factor with Leiber. Wright just might turn into the Jaret Wright we remember prior to Mazzone's impact on him. And that was the Jaret Wright who was waived by the San Diego Padres 16 months ago. Starting pitching has truly become THAT unpredictable these days from year to year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 No. I'd offer a competitive contract with the Yankees. Something I guarantee Williams didn't do. Above 8 million/yr is ridiculous. Might as well sign Perez for that amount. I honestly don't know what else to say on this issue. I can't create an imaginary bidding war between myself and George Steinbrenner. IF you're going to guarantee something, prove it. Let's see your "competitive contract" that you would have offered Wright. Wright is going to sign with the Yankees for 3 years for at least $21 million, You counter with...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LosMediasBlancas Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 If you really want a guy, sometimes you have to over pay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 If you really want a guy, sometimes you have to over pay. Which in the Sox case means they would have to open up another hole to get that player. If they overpay for someone, it means that they will have to trade away payroll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchetman Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 it seems like the price of doing business has increased this offseason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomsonmi Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 The price of doing business has increased. I don't think we should expand our payroll to sign a one year wonder like Jaret Wright. Can you say "Todd Ritchie?" Expand our payroll to sign Edgar Renteria, the money is there to do that with Valentin and Maggs gone. This whole Jaret Wright hysteria is almost funny. I have to conclude that most of you are just desperate for any kind of move. I prefer our GM to act with thoughtful, deliberation not desperation. I live here in Colorado where out of desperation the Rockies signed Denny Neagle and Mike Hampton to ridiculous contracts some 4-5 years ago. They still suck because of those deals. While we're talking Rockies, Shawn Chacon will be a better starting pitcher over the next couple years than Jaret Wright will be and he will cost about 1/4 as much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 The price of doing business has increased. I don't think we should expand our payroll to sign a one year wonder like Jaret Wright. Can you say "Todd Ritchie?" Expand our payroll to sign Edgar Renteria, the money is there to do that with Valentin and Maggs gone. This whole Jaret Wright hysteria is almost funny. I have to conclude that most of you are just desperate for any kind of move. I prefer our GM to act with thoughtful, deliberation not desperation. I live here in Colorado where out of desperation the Rockies signed Denny Neagle and Mike Hampton to ridiculous contracts some 4-5 years ago. They still suck because of those deals. While we're talking Rockies, Shawn Chacon will be a better starting pitcher over the next couple years than Jaret Wright will be and he will cost about 1/4 as much. Yours are very interesting points. You're right, everyone is very anxious for a move of any sort. Also, there's a reason why all these teams are clamoring over Chacon. His stats were horrible last year but he's got a really good arm. It's a risk, but it's the exact same risk teams take every year ... "we think we can harness his talent". Re: Chacon, some team will be very right, or very wrong. Extremely good point on Neagle and Hampton. One big difference is the White Sox would never hand out a contract like those to a pitcher. Those were huge contracts, and in retrospect not very bright. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LosMediasBlancas Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Thom, and when another team outbids us on Renteria, then what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Yours are very interesting points. You're right, everyone is very anxious for a move of any sort. Also, there's a reason why all these teams are clamoring over Chacon. His stats were horrible last year but he's got a really good arm. It's a risk, but it's the exact same risk teams take every year ... "we think we can harness his talent". Re: Chacon, some team will be very right, or very wrong. Extremely good point on Neagle and Hampton. One big difference is the White Sox would never hand out a contract like those to a pitcher. Those were huge contracts, and in retrospect not very bright. And you can expound on that list forever. Honest question. Who was the last big name pitcher to sign as a free agent, that didn't end up with an albatross for a contract? It seems like most of the impact pitchers were aquired in trades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuskyCaucasian Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Since the Yankees got him, could we go after Lieber? I'd rather have him anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomsonmi Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Re: Chacon, some team will be very right, or very wrong. One of the things I like about Chacon is that the very wrong won't be as expensive as the very wrong on "Wright." Matt Clement is another pitcher that I like. Clement will cost more than Chacon but hopefully less than Wright. There are still a number of possibilities out there for pitching, including a trade for someone like Vasquez. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomsonmi Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Thom, and when another team outbids us on Renteria, then what? I will be disappointed if we don't get Renteria. The tough thing is that I don't expect that we will get him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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