JoshPR Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 Offseason an off season for Cubs, Sox December 19, 2004 BY JAY MARIOTTI SUN-TIMES COLUMNIST We tend to overrate October as a month of baseball glory. Truth be told, pennants are won and lost in December, as both sides of a tormented sports town are realizing again. The weather is turning frigid at a fitting time, with reality kicking in that the Cubs likely are stuck with Sammy Sosa while the White Sox are too cheap to support their new pitching-and-fielding mechanism with necessary pitchers and fielders. In other words, why will 2005 be any different than the previous 96 years on the North Side and 87 years on the South Side? There are megamillions to burn in the industry these days, thanks to a rebound in the game's popularity. But while ballclubs in New York, Boston, Seattle, Atlanta, San Francisco and even Phoenix gather around the hot stove, the Cubs and Sox are in a deep freeze. Neither club is getting much done, other than announcing increases in ticket prices. The Cubs are at least trying to dump Sosa the albatross, but the market for a shrunken-headed, broken-down, sneeze-vulnerable troublemaker is bleak. That is, unless Tribune Co. wants to swallow all or part of the $21.5 million owed him for next season, a scenario less probable than Bob Greene's return to the newspaper. Sosa's continued presence means the Tribsters won't be pursuing Carlos Beltran, who probably is headed to the Yankees anyway as George Steinbrenner welcomes Randy Johnson and pushes his payroll over $200 million. Given the prosperity of the sport and the clicking of the Wrigley Field turnstiles, the Tribsters should be chasing Beltran regardless of Sosa's situation, knowing they'll be done with him after next season. But it's clearly an either/or dilemma, and unless a miracle sucker emerges, Sosa looms as a destructive daily distraction starting in Mesa. We are reminded by a sign in the bar at Harry Caray's that spring training is only eight weeks away. Yet I still see no reliable closer, as big a problem as the dead weight in right field. What's maddening about the Cubs is how they remain stagnant while their chief division and pennant rival, the St. Louis Cardinals, recovered from a major loss with a big trade Saturday. They added a much-needed ace in Mark Mulder, which strengthens the rotation as they lose shortstop Edgar Renteria. Meanwhile, the Houston Astros stand to be weakened. If they don't re-sign Beltran, Roger Clemens won't return. That said, we know the Cubs will be competitive into September. The same can't be said about the Sox, who are in a death spiral because they perpetuate the Reinsdorfian pattern of underbidding for vital talent. Sox are too cheap The latest example is pitcher Matt Clement, who rejected a reported Sox bid of $21 million over three years to sign a better offer --$25.5 million over three -- with the Red Sox. For weeks, all we've heard from Clement is that he wanted to stay in Chicago after his fun Cubs experience. But general manager Ken Williams shortchanged him and failed to sign the only remaining free-agent pitcher capable of major impact. Dare I ask if the Sox intentionally lowball free agents because they have no interest in signing them? It's fair to ask after Williams offered only two years to shortstop Omar Vizquel, the player the Sox coveted most for their radical philosophical change. The future Hall of Fame shortstop quickly signed with the Giants for $12.25 million over three years. Do the math. If the Sox had given Clement an extra $5 million and Vizquel an extra year and $3 million, they would have a quality No. 3 starter behind Freddy Garcia and Mark Buehrle and a fielding wizard to anchor the infield. But because they bid low in both cases, they'll be a .500 team next year. Or worse. And you wonder why I often suggest it's time for chairman Jerry Reinsdorf and his partners to sell the team. They aren't trying hard enough or spending well enough. As the departed Magglio Ordonez said, "They don't care about winning. They only care about making money.'' Allow me to bring in Clement's agent to further prove the point. His name is Barry Axelrod, a respected veteran in the trade, and he was asked by MLB.com why the Red Sox won out over the Anaheim Angels, the Sox and four other teams. "The teams that were still in it were teams willing to pay the price,'' Axelrod said. "I think the overriding factor became where Matt thought the best chance for him was to win for all three years. Boston and the Angels have dedicated ownership and management to have them in contention year after year.'' The Sox do not have dedicated ownership. Or else someone named Jason Grilli wouldn't be plugged in as their No. 5 starter. Can't get rid of this guy Wouldn't it be so tragicomic, so Cub, if Sosa is stuck here next season? The Wrigley Field ivy will stage a protest and refuse to grow. Fans who once exchanged love taps with him will flip middle fingers and hope he trips on his right-field sprint. The dugout cam will ignore him when he approaches it. And his boom box, symbolic of a romance turned sour? Someone will destroy it the first day in Mesa, just as someone destroyed it when he quit on his team the last day of the season. After all the thrills he produced way back when, thrills that now seem artificial and insulting to our intelligence, the Sosa experience has deteriorated into the ultimate Cubbie frustration. Try as general manager Jim Hendry does to dump him, there are no bites and barely some nibbles. Negatives attached to Sosa's image are so weighty -- health, age, attitude and, in the wake of the Barry Bonds/Jason Giambi steroids admissions, his dramatic body changes -- that teams are demanding Tribune Co. pay dearly for their interest. Specifically, the Baltimore Orioles want the Cubs to pick up a stunning 80 percent of the $21.5 million owed him for 2005, which doesn't include the $22.5 million a team would owe him in 2006 if he's traded. Those stuffy Tribsters would rather streak down Michigan Avenue on a 10-degree morning than eat a fortune. So unless some sucker stuck in 1998 decides to bail out the Cubs and absorb the contract, he isn't going anywhere but right field, where an inactive grenade recently was lobbed from Sheffield Avenue by someone who might not like Sammy. And even if a taker was found, the players association likely won't approve a contract restructuring that would provide relief for his team in the second season. Cubdom's fears are confirmed. Sosa's image is so soiled and his reliability quotient so damaged, he's virtually impossible to unload. All of which leads to a sobering outlook for next season. Regardless of the people skills of Hendry and Dusty Baker, Sosa's presence will kill any World Series chances. There are too many frayed relationships, too many wounds to mend with a manager and his teammates and a public tired of his act. Add Todd Walker and Ryan Dempster to the growing list of Sosa critics. How can he possibly come back and save face? They don't have these strange questions in other baseball towns. Only here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnthraxFan93 Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 This article is stating the facts: 1. we low ball FA only to have them sign elsewhere 2. For once KW didn't f*** something up and give Clement that type money 3. JR only cares aboutt Money and not winning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 f** boy really nails it, on both sides of town. He does however fail to point out the most fatal flaw of both teams, both having paralysed themselves by self-dellusional fantasies(Cubs that they'd trade ME, Sox that they'd get RJ) that they now find themselves unable to make or have already missed the basic moves that their teams needs to compete this yr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 One of the very, very rare times I agree with Moronatti. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 I would have liked some of the free agents out there too. I would have liked to have kept Magglio, which I think we could have done, but these FA's asking prices are outrageous. Where is the sanity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 He's still an ass. "But general manager Ken Williams shortchanged [Clement]" - Refusing to pay $8+ million a year to a question mark like Matt Clement with a $65-$75 million budget isn't called shortchanging. I'm leaning towards reasonable. "failed to sign the only remaining free-agent pitcher capable of major impact" - Odalis Perez, Derek Lowe, Kevin Millwood. Is Clement really that much better than these guys? And Clement must be told beforehand if he is expected to make 'major impact'. His agent told me he's not very comfortable with that. "If the Sox had given Clement an extra $5 million and Vizquel an extra year and $3 million, they would have a quality No. 3 starter behind Freddy Garcia and Mark Buehrle and a fielding wizard to anchor the infield" - What ever will we do without the defensive prowess and wizardry of an aging player who would've been 40 to start the last year of his contract? Oh wait. Uribe is a better defensive shortstop than Vizquel, and 13 years younger. And we locked him up for a few years too? Nice. I just hope KW decides to spend some of that saved payroll and not sit on it going into the season. We could patch up at least one if not two of our holes, and Mariotti would have to eat his words, not that there's any chance he would, of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 The World Series drought will continue. Getting past the Red Sox or Yankees would require a miracle. So reality states we are just trying to win a division. It doesn't take a $90mil payroll to win the Central. Until baseball decides that having 3 or 4 uber-teams and some road kill for them to play is a bad idea, we'll continue to march towards 100 years without a World Series win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoda Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 Sox are too cheap No.... really? :rolly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 Marriotti wrote the other day that Clement wouldn't sign with the Sox because he knew what a screwed up situation it is. Now he says its because the Sox didn't pony up the cash. This guy is so full of s***. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted December 19, 2004 Share Posted December 19, 2004 The World Series drought will continue. Getting past the Red Sox or Yankees would require a miracle. So reality states we are just trying to win a division. It doesn't take a $90mil payroll to win the Central. Until baseball decides that having 3 or 4 uber-teams and some road kill for them to play is a bad idea, we'll continue to march towards 100 years without a World Series win. Once again, Tex, you nailed it. Except that it's not so much a "march" towards 100 title-free years, it's more of a drunken stumble... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 I thought it was a good article. I like when he rips our ownership for not overspending like Steinwhacker, the BoSox and the 4-5 other big spenders. It would be nice if we'd sign some free agents once in a while if we are serious about winning. Mariottis is right. As the team roster stands now, we don't have the talent to win with our new Ozzieball philosophy unless miracle of miracles Uribe, Harris, Crede and our catching platoon all have career years. We're not going to score enough runs. Rowand, the guy with the long name and Dye are not going to instill fear in any pitching staff. We could be in for a long year like Mariotti says unless somehow our pitching staff wins a s***load of 3-1 games. p.s. Funny, however, how the owners continue to spend incredible amounts of money, continuing to make it impossible for the Sox, Royals, et. all to win a Series. In some ways I wish baseball was hockey, have a lockout for a couple years and get some sanity back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 (edited) Once again, Tex, you nailed it. Except that it's not so much a "march" towards 100 title-free years, it's more of a drunken stumble... Dead Men Walking Chicago could be a perennial powerhouse, in the elite with the Red Sox. All that needs to happen is the Cubs or Sox move. The surviving team would own the market and could easily afford a $100-$130 mil payroll. Instead we have two mid-market teams. Edited December 20, 2004 by Texsox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 Ok so Kotex Boy has a problem with us not signing Clement and Vizquel. 1 - Who would you rather have over 3 years. Juan Uribe for less $$$, or Omar Vizquel when he hits his 40's and isn't an everyday player. 2 - What happens if Clement's arm goes snap, if he throws one too many hard breaking sliders. Kotex Boy just wants us to splash some cash on anybody, even if he's remotely not good, so he can't use the argument that we don't have ownership shortchanging in a large market, even though there are 2, (count em' Jay) 2 teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 mariotti sounds an awful lot like some soxtalk posters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 "But general manager Ken Williams shortchanged [Clement]" - Refusing to pay $8+ million a year to a question mark like Matt Clement with a $65-$75 million budget isn't called shortchanging. I'm leaning towards reasonable. "failed to sign the only remaining free-agent pitcher capable of major impact" - Odalis Perez, Derek Lowe, Kevin Millwood. Is Clement really that much better than these guys? And Clement must be told beforehand if he is expected to make 'major impact'. His agent told me he's not very comfortable with that. I just hope KW decides to spend some of that saved payroll and not sit on it going into the season. We could patch up at least one if not two of our holes, and Mariotti would have to eat his words, not that there's any chance he would, of course. Yes that is shortchanging because it was obvious the market price was higher than what we offered. We let ourselves be shortchanged by Milwaukee in terms of talent, precisely to be able to make a market offer to Clement; we failed to do so. It's a matter of opinion, but I think Clement is decidedly superior to those on your list, except for Perez. We could spend the money on "plugging holes" - the problem with that is we'd be spending money on more mediocre players who may be a bit better than the mediocre players we currently have; that doesn't win you anything. The great hitting catcher whom everyone wants, has a OBP of .320 with no power - better than Ben DAvis (offensively; not defensively) but not very good. Spending 2-3 million on players of that caliber, if overdone, is a ticket to last place. On the other hand, spending money on Clement of Perez gives us a GOOD player; plugging holes won't give us a good player Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 Dead Men Walking Chicago could be a perennial powerhouse, in the elite with the Red Sox. All that needs to happen is the Cubs or Sox move. The surviving team would own the market and could easily afford a $100-$130 mil payroll. Instead we have two mid-market teams. So you're saying that the Sox getting the stadium deal in the late 80's ( and therefore avoiding the move to St. Petersburg ) caused the Cubs not to win anything for the past 15 years or so? ......nice....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 - What ever will we do without the defensive prowess and wizardry of an aging player who would've been 40 to start the last year of his contract? Oh wait. Uribe is a better defensive shortstop than Vizquel, and 13 years younger. And we locked him up for a few years too? Nice. Better defensive shortstop? Uribe was a first yr arb guy, he wasn't going anywhere anyhow. Unless he magically turns into Miguel Tejada that contract can only be fair or hurt us. Vizquel at 40 is still a better baserunner than Uribe. It doesn't matter what you or I think of Omar, it's what KW thinks and KW thought he was the first Key aquisition to this off-season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 Better defensive shortstop? Uribe was a first yr arb guy, he wasn't going anywhere anyhow. Unless he magically turns into Miguel Tejada that contract can only be fair or hurt us. Vizquel at 40 is still a better baserunner than Uribe. It doesn't matter what you or I think of Omar, it's what KW thinks and KW thought he was the first Key aquisition to this off-season. So if Juan Uribe doesn't put up Miggy Tejada like numbers at some period of his 3 year deal, he won't have performed adequately then? Let's just have a look at other shortstops from the past season who will have made more than Uribe. Orlando Cabrera ($6,000,000) - .264, 10 HR's, 62 RBI's Jose Valentin ($5,000,000) - .216, 30 HR's, 70 RBI's Alex Gonzalez ($2,800,000) - .232, 23 HR's, 79 RBI's. Cristian Guzman ($3,725,000) - .274, 8 HR's, 46 RBI's. Alex Gonzalez ($5,750,000) - .225, 7 HR's, 27 RBI's. In the final year of his 3 year deal, Omar Vizquel will be 40 years old. In 2 of the last 4 seasons, he has hit .255 or worse. Would you rather have Juan Uribe coming into his prime in the final year of his deal, and possibly putting up Tejada like numbers or Vizquel? I still think Uribe will hit around .280 with at least 20 HR's over the next 3 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LosMediasBlancas Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 I still believe there is a real good chance that Sammy will be moved. The Cubs might have to take it in the azz on the deal, but it can be done. They are pretty close to having all the pieces in place, why fall short now? Even if they get stuck with Sammy, they should still go after and get Beltran. They have the $$$. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanOfCorn Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 I compare FA signings to ebay. There are certain things that are priceless...things that I would pay anything for. and then there are the things that would be nice to have, but I have a cap on what I'm willing to pay. Then there are the bargains/steals... In baseball, there are very few of the first. There are some where I'd be willing to go higher than I can normally afford, but I'd still have a cap (Beltran, A-Rod, etc.). Most fall into the second category. Clement is in that category. I think $7 mil a year is more than adequate for Matt Clement. If the Red Sox want to overpay, that's their business. Vizquel is in this category. If the Giants want to guarantee a third year for a 38 yo player, that's their business. But you know that Mariotti would be screaming bloody murder if we signed these two guys to the contracts that they agreed to and then didn't produce or got injured. i can see it now... "The White Sox organization should have known that Clement's arm was going to literally fall off and that Vizquel's hips were going to break before they signed them to the HUGE contracts. It's time for the Reinsdorfians to sell the team." Mariotti is just doing his job by stirring things up, but it pisses off the smart people who pay attention, because he is constantly contradicting himself. What a dope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 Better defensive shortstop? Uribe was a first yr arb guy, he wasn't going anywhere anyhow. Unless he magically turns into Miguel Tejada that contract can only be fair or hurt us. Vizquel at 40 is still a better baserunner than Uribe. It doesn't matter what you or I think of Omar, it's what KW thinks and KW thought he was the first Key aquisition to this off-season. Uribe had a better fielding pecentage with higher range factor and zone rating at SS than Vizquel, chuckles. :fyou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted December 20, 2004 Author Share Posted December 20, 2004 Uribe had a better fielding pecentage and higher range factor at SS than Vizquel, chuckles. Fielding stats are mis leading. No way in hell Uribe is a better defensive Shortstop than Vizquel. Uribe is a good player no doubt, But he ain't better with the Leather than Vizquel Ohh and why the Finger? Can't prove a point or tell your opinion without getting all fuzzed up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 Uribe at 25 is undoubtedly a better shortstop than Vizquel at 38. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted December 20, 2004 Author Share Posted December 20, 2004 Uribe at 25 is undoubtedly a better shortstop than Vizquel at 38. Again Uribe will be a good player but Omar is Omar no matter how old he is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted December 20, 2004 Share Posted December 20, 2004 Again Uribe will be a good player but Omar is Omar no matter how old he is. ...And there's where you lose credibilty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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