Aj's agent cofirms chisox made offer

[Chisoxfn]

Addy, I think if the Sox want to, they have the financial resources to get both AJ and a 2nd baseman. It looks like they still have 6-8 mill available. Although I think some of that money will go to Arow when its all set and done.

[santo=dorf]

A lot of people said Carl Everett was a "cancer" before we traded for him and he ended up being anything but.  You gotta take a chance on this guy.  He's got over 150 rbi's the last 2 years.  It's worth the risk!

The difference was that KW talked to Showalter and other players for Texas and everyone told KW how good of a teammate Carl was/is. KW said a couple weeks ago that after doing some background checking, it was determined that AJ was not a fit for the Sox.

 

Has KW talked to AJ personally yet?

[SnB]

like someone said...if we get one of these 2 guys, i'd be extremely happy w/ this team.

there aren't many teams out there that would only have 1 hole on their entire team, we'd be one of the most solid...definitely.

[beck72]

I love how you just assume we will be signing Iguchi.

 

Sorry fella, ain't happening.

 

Kenny will sign either Iguchi/Cora or AJP...it won't be both.  We will be improved no matter who he signs out of those three.

Iguchi won't get more than $2 mill from any team. Make 2006 $4 mill; a 2 yr $6 mill deal. Cora or Cairo would make even less.

 

AJ could be had for a 2 yr deal, $3 mill this yr, make 2006 an option yr at $5 mill.

 

Around $5 mill to fill both positions this year could do it

[JUGGERNAUT]

This guy has gotten a bad rap. It just doesn't fit w the numbers, & the effectiveness of the pitchers he caught in that time. I like him for the CWS.

 

He knows just about everything with the MIN starters, & hitters. That's a big plus.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=6109

A.J. Pierzynski:

 

Hitting

Pierzynski generally hits the bad pitches at which he's hacking. He is a gap hitter who uses all fields. Team officials believed he could develop into a 25-plus home-run hitter.

 

Baserunning & Defense

-One of the league's best behind the plate.

-Eexceptionally good at blocking low pitches,

-Better-than-average arm and calls a solid game.

-Smart baserunner w good-speed

con: he argues w umps too much

 

VS. LEFT: .227 / .544 VS. RIGHT: .283 / .775 HOME: .283 / .737 AWAY: .261 / .720

A major improvement over what we have. If Davis is worth 1M than AJP is worth at least 2M.

[Al Lopez Ghost (old)]

This guy hasn't gotten a bad rap.  It just doesn't fit w the numbers, & the effectiveness of the pitchers he caught in that time.  I like him for the CWS.

 

He knows just about everything with the MIN starters, & hitters. That's a big plus.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=6109

A.J. Pierzynski:

 

Hitting

Pierzynski generally hits the bad pitches at which he's hacking. He is a gap hitter who uses all fields. Team officials believed he could develop into a 25-plus home-run hitter.

 

Baserunning & Defense

-One of the league's best behind the plate.

-Eexceptionally good at blocking low pitches,

-Better-than-average arm and calls a solid game.

-Smart baserunner w good-speed

con: he argues w umps too much

 

VS. LEFT: .227 / .544 VS. RIGHT: .283 / .775 HOME: .283 / .737 AWAY: .261 / .720

A major improvement over what we have.  If Davis is worth 1M than AJP is worth at least 2M.

I thought he threw out only 30% of the stolen base attempts against him. That's pretty bad.

I'd still take him, because I think the stolen base is a small factor in today's game, and AJ can help you a lot of other ways, as you pointed out.

[Nokona]

What I always respected about him, was the fact that he would talk s*** to you if you were Willie Harris or Barry Bonds. He's the kind of guy who KW wants, a grinder. Just take a look at him, he looks like a baseball player. He has "the face".

 

And hey, a lefty bat wouldn't hurt.

[Reddy]

I thought he threw out only 30% of the stolen base attempts against him. That's pretty bad.

I'd still take him, because I think the stolen base is a small factor in today's game, and AJ can help you a lot of other ways, as you pointed out.

Olivo was under 40% IIRC and his arm was "amazing"

[qwerty]

Olivo was under 40% IIRC and his arm was "amazing"

He has amazing arm strength just not amazing accuracy. Also has pitchers that take while to get the ball to the plate does not help anyone.

[Reddy]

He has amazing arm strength just not amazing accuracy. Also has pitchers that take while to get the ball to the plate does not help anyone.

but my point is, AJs throwout % is not really a huge problem... so what if his arm isnt as strong? he's probably more accurate and all his other plusses more than make up for whatever weakness he has in this area... which i think isnt much but maybe thats just me.

[KittleWalk83]

I know I'm going to sound like the typical The Sky is Falling White Sox fan. But there is no way the projected starting 5 is a solid staff and/or ranks up there with the best in the AL.

 

MB

Garcia

Conty

Orlando

Garland

 

MB-While still young, he has never been asked to be the ace of a team that is still in the race at the end of the season. Can he handle the pressure? If the White Sox lose 2-3 games in a row can MB stop the streak when it matters? Think Pink Floyd Bannister. Great stats and stuff but when the pressure was on he wasn't the ace. The Druggy Hoyt was the ace and you could even make a case the Dotson was the real ace of the White Sox staffs.

 

Garcia-has never been able to pitch as well as he did in 2001. Not a second half pitcher for most of his career.

 

Conty-A bust with the Yankees and now the White Sox expect him to be a solid starter?

 

El DoNothing-The more innnings he pitches the higher his ERA. He's coming off rotator cuff injury. He's about 40, no matter what he says and is getting older and more injury prone.

 

Garland-A young kid who is running out of chances to become a solid major league starter.

 

 

Can the top four pitchers, no matter who they are, win 80 games for the White Sox? Take any four and no combination has won 80 games. Even their best seasons. MB-19 wins, Garcia 19. El DoNothing-17 Garland 12, Conty-10. Remember take only four.

 

And both El DoNothing and Conty do not have the Yankees run support to back them up. Or even the Yankees defense.

 

I think the signing Hermanson was a good thing. He can fill many roles. If Shingo struggles then Dustin can become the closer. If Shingo continues his success as a closer, Dustin can be the set up man or if one of the starters falter he can set right in.

 

I have some concerns about Shingo being able to continue his success. But I'm comfortable with him as the closer and seeing what happens. If I had to make a bet, I would bet he continues that success and is a quality closer.

[AddisonStSox]

He's a solid catcher. Hell, some might make the argument that he is one of the top 3-5 catchers in the game. I'll admit it, I'm a little worried about his clubhouse presence, I think there are fairgrounds for concern.

 

However, does anyone else think Ozzie wouldn't tolerate s*** from any of his "kids," especially a new-comer? I believe Ozzie is one of the few managers in the leauge that truly runs a tight ship. If AJP is signed and a problem arises, I think Ozzie would get a handle on it early on.

 

Wow. These AJP talks are fun. I can't believe we are having them again.

[Dick Allen]

Why is everyone worried about AJ's "clubhouse presence"? Last I checked, his teams have been in contention the last several years. If he was or is such a negative presence, it obviously didn't affect his teammates play on the field.

[Soxbadger]

Its not Ozzies tight ship that I think would make AJ a good presence, its the laid back attitude and the fact Ozzie always is saying, people start fresh with him.

 

Kittle,

 

While the Sox rotation may not be infallible, name a team that has a rotation that is perfect 1-5.

 

The Sox have at worst, a good rotation, and at best the best rotation in the AL.

 

I mean even the Red Sox and Yankees will be counting on pitchers who are unreliable at best. I mean arguments could be made that Wells, Wright, and even Clement are not even close to proven commodities. Who knows what Pavano will do in the AL, Red Sox are with out Pedro, leaving an aging Schilling coming off a leg injury...The Yankees prospective best pitcher will be over 40, and has had a major injury in the past 2 years.

 

We may not be the best, but most teams would want our 1-5.

 

SB

[CWSGuy406]

MB-While still young, he has never been asked to be the ace of a team that is still in the race at the end of the season.  Can he handle the pressure?  If the White Sox lose 2-3 games in a row can MB stop the streak when it matters?  Think Pink Floyd Bannister.  Great stats and stuff but when the pressure was on he wasn't the ace.  The Druggy Hoyt was the ace and you could even make a case the Dotson was the real ace of the White Sox staffs.

Mark Buehrle's numbers in 'big' games this year:

 

April 10th, @ NY - 8 IP, 2 R (0 ER)

April 20th, NY - 2 IP, 8 R (8 ER)

May 16th, MIN - 6.2 IP, 0 R

May 21st, @ MIN - 7 IP 2 R (2 ER)

June 2nd, @ OAK - 6 IP, 1 R (1 ER)

June 29th, @ MIN - 8 IP. 2 R (2 ER)

July 4th, @ CHI - 7 IP, 1 R (1 ER)

July 16th, @ OAK - 6 IP, 4 R (4 ER)

July 26th, MIN - 6.1 IP, 4 R (4 ER)

August 15th, @ BOS - 7 IP, 2 R (2 ER)

August 20th, BOS - 6 IP, 9 R (7 ER)

 

I didn't put in the September starts, because at that point, we were out of it and everybody knew it, but for those who do care, he pitched twice against Minny, one game he pitched pretty well (2 ER), and another start he pitched poorly (but still pitched eight innings).

 

 

My point being -- don't tell me that Buehrle isn't a big-game pitcher, because Buehlre stepped up everytime we needed him. It seems to me the only time that Buehrle got hit hard was when he was being seen the second time in less than a week (as shown against Boston and New York). Otherwise, he dominated, or -- at the very least -- kept us in the game.

[Reddy]

whats crazy is i think the mets have one of the best rotations in baseball... above the yanks and maybe even redsox... maybe not perfect but damn near close...

 

Pedro

Glavine

Benson

Zambrano

Trachsel

[KittleWalk83]

Its not Ozzies tight ship that I think would make AJ a good presence, its the laid back attitude and the fact Ozzie always is saying, people start fresh with him.

 

Kittle,

 

While the Sox rotation may not be infallible, name a team that has a rotation that is perfect 1-5.

 

The Sox have at worst, a good rotation, and at best the best rotation in the AL.

 

I mean even the Red Sox and Yankees will be counting on pitchers who are unreliable at best. I mean arguments could be made that Wells, Wright, and even Clement are not even close to proven commodities. Who knows what Pavano will do in the AL, Red Sox are with out Pedro, leaving an aging Schilling coming off a leg injury...The Yankees prospective best pitcher will be over 40, and has had a major injury in the past 2 years.

 

We may not be the best, but most teams would want our 1-5.

 

SB

You're right nobody has a perfect starting staff. What I am saying is that the White Sox should not have signed El Do Nothing and went after either Perez, Clement, or Millwood. I know the change in leagues is a concern for all three of those pitchers. But they are better options than El Do Nothing (who was the cheaper option)

 

And while I like to look forward and don't want to dwell on the past, why did the White Sox trade for Loiaza for Conty? Loiaza would have been a FA and the money saved from not signing him could have gone to a Pavano or though I'm not in favor of it, making a trade for Mulder or Hudson. The money freed up by Loiaza contract could have gone to signing Mulder and Hudson to long term contracts.

[Reddy]

the White Sox should not have signed El Do Nothing

 

where'd you get this great nickname from? I'm a fan of nicknames but i'd save the degrading ones until we at least see him pitch...

[Rowand44]

You're right nobody has a perfect starting staff.  What I am saying is that the White Sox should not have signed El Do Nothing and went after either Perez, Clement, or Millwood.  I know the change in leagues is a concern for all three of those pitchers.  But they are better options than El Do Nothing (who was the cheaper option)

 

And while I like to look forward and don't want to dwell on the past, why did the White Sox trade for Loiaza for Conty?  Loiaza would have been a FA and the money saved from not signing him could have gone to a Pavano or though I'm not in favor of it, making a trade for Mulder or Hudson.  The money freed up by Loiaza contract could have gone to signing Mulder and Hudson to long term contracts.

Millwood is much worse then El duque, and Clement and Perez have and will come at a much higher rate then Hernandez. There is no doubt when El duque is healthy he's still a great pitcher. As far as contreras I think the sox have proven they can't win a bidding war with anyone so it is very unlikely they would have got Pavano. I see your concern with Jose but personally I feel like he'll have a very solid year but I guess we just have to wait and see.

[KittleWalk83]

Mark Buehrle's numbers in 'big' games this year:

 

April 10th, @ NY - 8 IP, 2 R (0 ER)

April 20th, NY - 2 IP, 8 R (8 ER)

May 16th, MIN - 6.2 IP, 0 R

May 21st, @ MIN - 7 IP 2 R (2 ER)

June 2nd, @ OAK - 6 IP, 1 R (1 ER)

June 29th, @ MIN - 8 IP. 2 R (2 ER)

July 4th, @ CHI - 7 IP, 1 R (1 ER)

July 16th, @ OAK - 6 IP, 4 R (4 ER)

July 26th, MIN - 6.1 IP, 4 R (4 ER)

August 15th, @ BOS - 7 IP, 2 R (2 ER)

August 20th, BOS - 6 IP, 9 R (7 ER)

 

I didn't put in the September starts, because at that point, we were out of it and everybody knew it, but for those who do care, he pitched twice against Minny, one game he pitched pretty well (2 ER), and another start he pitched poorly (but still pitched eight innings).

 

 

My point being -- don't tell me that Buehrle isn't a big-game pitcher, because Buehlre stepped up everytime we needed him.  It seems to me the only time that Buehrle got hit hard was when he was being seen the second time in less than a week (as shown against Boston and New York).  Otherwise, he dominated, or -- at the very least -- kept us in the game.

Do you know what pressure games mean? They aren't in April or May. They are in August and Sept when your team is within 3-5 games of first place. The White Sox haven't been in that position for so long that we don't know how MB will handle those situations. You know what a big game pitcher is? Andy Pettite when he was with the Yankees. August and Sept he was awesome.

 

Talk is cheap, we can talk until we are blue in the face but until MB is in that situation then we'll find out if he's a real big game pitcher.

[KittleWalk83]

There is no doubt when El duque is healthy he's still a great pitcher.  As far as contreras I think the sox have proven they can't win a bidding war with anyone so it is very unlikely they would have got Pavano.  I see your concern with Jose but personally I feel like he'll have a very solid year but I guess we just have to wait and see.

El Do Nothing is a great pitcher when he's healthy? Come on. I'll give you pitching once a week during the playoffs he's good. But during the season, pitching on four days rest he gets bombed. Take a look at his ERA. The more innings he throws the higher his ERA. He's only pitched over 200 innings once though he did have a 195 inning season, though with a 4.51 ERA. Does that make him a great pitcher?

 

Millwood and Perez still hasn't signed, unless they are dumb their asking price has to go down. If the White Sox took Loiaza's salary and some of the other cost saving measures, they could have signed one or both of them. At the very least have the flexibility to make what I consider better decisions.

[Rowand44]

El Do Nothing is a great pitcher when he's healthy?  Come on.  I'll give you pitching once a week during the playoffs he's good.  But during the season, pitching on four days rest he gets bombed.  Take a look at his ERA.  The more innings he throws the higher his ERA.  He's only pitched over 200 innings once though he did have a 195 inning season, though with a 4.51 ERA.  Does that make him a great pitcher?

 

Millwood and Perez still hasn't signed, unless they are dumb their asking price has to go down.  If the White Sox took Loiaza's salary and some of the other cost saving measures, they could have signed one or both of them.  At the very least have the flexibility to make what I consider better decisions.

The he pitched over 200 innnings his era was 4.12 while pitching in the american league is pretty good His career era is 3.96, if you have an era under 4 in the american league you're doing something right. Once again Millwood is not as good as Orlando and he's going to get paid far more then Hernandez. Lets pretend we went into the offseason having 2 open holes in the rotation, we've figured out we have a hard time winning any bidding wars, do you really have confidence we would have been able to find two starting pitchers on the market??

[Soxbadger]

El Duque was a smarter decision for the White Sox.

 

You say Milwood, Clement, or Wright.

 

We can discount Wright, outside of last year and 1998 what has he done to earn $7mil a year. He also failed the first physical, not a good sign for a pitcher who for the first time since 1999 he pitched more than 60 pitches. In fact he tripled his innings pitched from 2003 to 2004. $7million dollars, and we would have been bidding against the Yankees. They can throw $10mil at Wright, and if he fails, not even flinch. We invest $20+ mil into Wright and we may feel the impact for years.

 

Clement, we offered a reasonable contract, other teams were willing to pay unreasonably for him. Since his move from Florida to the Cubs, he has been a consistent 2-4 in a line up. Although post All-Star he was not very good, posting a 5.0 era, 2-5 record, and giving up on average a HR per start. That type of implosion will only be exasperated by the Cell. For what ever reason, it seems that balls just get hit hard there, and you undoubtedly will see an increase in HR per game. Also, as an NL pitcher he has thirved on the bottom of the order. From the sixth spot down, he keept their averages under .200 and OPS under .600. Prior to the sixth spot the lowest average is .250 and the lowest ops. is .731 With deeper AL line ups, he could potentially run into major problems. Thus it came down to money and potential risk, the Red Sox won in the end, because they can withstand Clement being a 5.0 era pitcher.

 

Milwood, I personally liked, especially back when he was with Atlanta. But $7mil one year, dealing with Boras, was there really any chance the White Sox had at getting him? I thought a reasonable value for Milwood was, 3 years 18 million, 4mil first year, 6mil second year, 8 mil team option third year. 1 year $7mil is to much, that would be investing 10% of our payroll into Milwood, with not even a 2 year committment.

 

Split ERA W L Sv SvO G GS IP H R ER HR BB SO BAA

Post-All Star 3.86 3 1 0 0 7 7 32.2 32 15 14 0 13 34 .252

Post-All Star 3.28 7 2 0 0 14 14 79.2 68 29 29 8 33 79 .228

 

Which would you want to invest in? At the same price its hard to even argue for one of them, let alone for perhaps $3mil more.

 

Mulder and Hudson were probably not going to the White Sox, unless we were giving up a ton of prospects. Think Sweeney, Anderson, Cotts, McCarthy/Munoz. Mulder maybe, because he is signed for more than 1 year, but the trade suggests maybe there is more to his injury. I would have paid pretty much any cost for Mulder, but I just have a feeling that Beane was not dealing with the AL. Hudson, we would have had to give up alot, and then signed him to a $10mil + a year contract, or atleast hope he agrees to one and doesnt go to free agency. Unlike Atlanta, we really dont set our sights on a guy and then just give him what he wants.

 

El Duque is not as flashy, he might be a risk, and who knows how well he will perform. But the $3mil that we get to use on other players (AJ, Iguchi, who knows if we even use it) will probably mean that El Duque + player will be > than any one of the options we could have had at a similar price.

 

At lower prices, the other pitchers may have been better options. But if other teams decide to pay unreasonable amounts, we should not walk off the cliff with them.

 

SB

[qwerty]

116 career era+ for hernandez. That is all i really have to say, carry on.

[CWSGuy406]

Do you know what pressure games mean?  They aren't in April or May.  They are in August and Sept when your team is within 3-5 games of first place.  The White Sox haven't been in that position for so long that we don't know how MB will handle those situations.  You know what a big game pitcher is?  Andy Pettite when he was with the Yankees.  August and Sept he was awesome. 

 

Talk is cheap, we can talk until we are blue in the face but until MB is in that situation then we'll find out if he's a real big game pitcher.

Well, whatever -- you believe what you want, but a game is worth just as much in September and August as it is in April -- one. When we needed a big game out of Buehrle against the Twinkies, Buehrle stepped up and pitched well.

 

Like I said, you believe what you want -- I'll take Buehrle over any other starting LHP not named Santana or Johnson.