Levine Reports on Sox Offers

[fathom]

Another thing is that we already have our lefty off the bench in R. Gload. We didn't really need a designated lefty hitter off the bench besides him. I would have actually liked to see a right handed reserve outfielder that could play for Podsednik against the real tough lefties in our division.

 

 

Pierzynski and Borchard/Escobar is better than Davis and Timo

[redandwhite]

QUOTE(fathom @ Jan 4, 2005 -> 07:29 PM)

Reserve outfielders are a dime a dozen.  Hell, the week after we signed Timo for one million, two other reserves in D. Mohr and Hollandsworth, who are a lot better than Timo, signed for base contracts which were cheaper.  Another thing about a reserve outfielder is that you want them to be good enough on defense where they can be brought in as a defensive replacement if needed.  Timo has a good arm, but his range in the outfield is pathetic.

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..but Timo Perez tied a game in Anaheim in a White Sox loss! he's so clutch!

 

:rolly

 

By the way, that game was Ross Gload's doing, not Timo's.

[Chisoxfn]

..but Timo Perez tied a game in Anaheim in a White Sox loss! he's so clutch!

 

:rolly

 

By the way, that game was Ross Gload's doing, not Timo's.

Gotta disagree with ya on one thing. No way is Joe Borchard better then Timo. Sad but true.

[CanOfCorn]

Reserve outfielders are a dime a dozen.  Hell, the week after we signed Timo for one million, two other reserves in D. Mohr and Hollandsworth, who are a lot better than Timo, signed for base contracts which were cheaper.  Another thing about a reserve outfielder is that you want them to be good enough on defense where they can be brought in as a defensive replacement if needed.  Timo has a good arm, but his range in the outfield is pathetic.

 

 

C'mon, Hollandsworth is injury prone and Mohr isn't a good outfielder. Check out the Z Ratings. Timo had some clutch hits for us last year and filled in pretty well for Maggs when he was in there. It's $1 million...if he isn't working out for us, we can trade him...he is a very serviceable 4th OF.

[redandwhite]

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Jan 4, 2005 -> 07:34 PM)

Gotta disagree with ya on one thing.  No way is Joe Borchard better then Timo.  Sad but true.

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I'll take his .590 ops over Timo's .420 ops anyday of the week.. then again they both are horrible, horrible players.

 

[southsider17]

:headshake

 

So then who is our reserve outfielder?  Borchard, or Escobar?

 

 

I think the better question is where else was Timo going to sign for $1 mil (or even less). We could have had Dustin Mohr for less, probably. And if Escobar is healthy I'd rather have him than Timo. Much more versatile.

[CanOfCorn]

I'll take his .590 ops over Timo's .420 ops anyday of the week.. then again they both are horrible, horrible players.

 

 

 

Where'd you get .420 ops...it's a whopping .623!!

[redandwhite]

QUOTE(TheDybber @ Jan 4, 2005 -> 07:40 PM)

Where'd you get .420 ops...it's a whopping .623!!

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That must have been the "clutch" fodder that ace tried feeding me last night. Oops.

[Guest JimH]

I think the better question is where else was Timo going to sign for $1 mil (or even less).  We could have had Dustin Mohr for less, probably.  And if Escobar is healthy I'd rather have him than Timo.  Much more versatile.

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The thing with Dustin Mohr though was playing time. His agent only shopped him where he'd get lots of playing time, the White Sox couldn't offer him that. Mohr is trying to rebuild (build?) his value for bigger paydays down the line. Given the current OF situation, Mohr would not have come here.

 

I like Escobar's versatility as well. I don't know what they'll do with him, but it really comes down to Escobar himself. If he has a great spring, the Sox will probably find a way to keep him and bump somebody else out. As it stands now I'd rather have the depth Perez brings because no one really knows what Escobar brings to the table.

 

The utility infielders are coming off the board, per the rumors thread. Pokey Reese and Ramon Martinez both gone. I fully expect the White Sox to settle the whole infield situation very soon, if not this week then for sure by Sox Fest.

[fathom]

I find it interesting how so many people like Timo, and one of the reasons for that in my opinion is how Hawk always has great things to say about him. However, Hawk also had tremendous things to say about Pierzynski, as he always said how he caught the best games against the Sox out of all the catchers that had been in the AL.

[AddisonStSox]

Well, if the market drives up the price on one of these guys, who would you all rather see Kenny overpay/sign to a good contract?

 

Personally, I think AJP is the guy to pull out all the stops for. Yes, he has an attitude problem. Who cares!? This will be his first year in our clubhouse and it will be a new beginning. Ozzie runs a tight ship and I have a feeling AJP will be a fan favorite in two months time. This guy comes to play everyday. He really is a hard-nosed grinder.

 

More importantly, he'll probably provide more offense than Iguchi. If Kenny had to gamble on a guy that has been with three clubs in three years or a thirty year old Japanese second basemen, I say gamble on AJP.

 

Would I love to see both guys in Black and Silver? Yes.

 

Will it happen? Meh.

 

Lets hope Shingo's words mean a lot in terms of recruiting Iguchi and signing him to a resonable contract.

 

If Kenny signs both of these guys, he gets an A on this off-season. Hands down. No questions asked.

[Sanjay2000]

What is with all the Timo bashing? He was one of our best hitters with runners in scoring position last year and with games on the line, he consistently has the best at-bats out of any one on the team. You guys mentioned the Anaheim game when he hit the triple off of Rodriguez, but what about the Florida game in which he hit the game tying homer off of Armando Benitez, a 7 million dollar closer, in the ninth inning to tie a game that we eventually went on to win. HE CONSISTENTLY HAS EXCELLENT AT BATS AGAINST SOME OF THE BEST PITCHERS IN BASEBALL. Timo brings something to the table that other bench guys cannot, not only in his clutch hitting, but in his bat control. He can hit the ball exactly where he WANTS to hit the ball and can move runners along as well. Is Timo worth 1 million dollars? Maybe he is slightly overpriced...but Neifi Perez of the Chicago Cubs is also making a million dollars so there are other similarly priced contracts out there. I am sure if Kenny Williams tried to trade Timo right now, there would be some teams surely displaying interest in him. With a bench of Timo, Everett, Gload, and Burke, the White Sox have one of the deepest benches in the league to go along with an excellent bullpen and a much improved pitching staff. Timo is an essential part of this.

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(fathom @ Jan 4, 2005 -> 01:29 PM)

Reserve outfielders are a dime a dozen.  Hell, the week after we signed Timo for one million, two other reserves in D. Mohr and Hollandsworth, who are a lot better than Timo, signed for base contracts which were cheaper.  Another thing about a reserve outfielder is that you want them to be good enough on defense where they can be brought in as a defensive replacement if needed.  Timo has a good arm, but his range in the outfield is pathetic.

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Todd Hollandsworth was given a deal by the Cubs that could be worth as much as $1.7 Million, and Mohr signed for $900,000 and both are in a situation where they can compete for a starting job. You are concerned about missing out on AJ by $500,000. Find me an outfielder who will cost no more than $500,000 and will eb more productive than Timo in a bench role.

[jackie hayes]

Mohr is trying to rebuild (build?) his value...

 

Lol, nice. I don't agree about Timo and depth. Good players make depth, Timo's not a good player. I think it's a wasted roster spot, but I very much doubt it is making any difference in negotiations w/ AJ.

[SoxFan562004]

Well, if the market drives up the price on one of these guys, who would you all rather see Kenny overpay/sign to a good contract?

 

Personally, I think AJP is the guy to pull out all the stops for.  Yes, he has an attitude problem.  Who cares!?  This will be his first year in our clubhouse and it will be a new beginning.  Ozzie runs a tight ship and I have a feeling AJP will be a fan favorite in two months time.  This guy comes to play everyday.  He really is a hard-nosed grinder. 

 

More importantly, he'll probably provide more offense than Iguchi.  If Kenny had to gamble on a guy that has been with three clubs in three years or a thirty year old Japanese second basemen, I say gamble on AJP. 

 

Would I love to see both guys in Black and Silver?  Yes.

 

Will it happen?  Meh.

 

Lets hope Shingo's words mean a lot in terms of recruiting Iguchi and signing him to a resonable contract.

 

If Kenny signs both of these guys, he gets an A on this off-season.  Hands down.  No questions asked.

 

I would rather have him "overpay" for AJ. I think he is a proven MLB player an a good offensive add. No doubt that he gets an A if he adds both or AJ and Cairo. However, I really think it's a B- if this is the team he goes into ST with, I just look at the line-up and think another bat has to be added.....

[redandwhite]

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Jan 4, 2005 -> 07:50 PM)

Todd Hollandsworth was given a deal by the Cubs that could be worth as much as $1.7 Million, and Mohr signed for $900,000 and both are in a situation where they can compete for a starting job.  You are concerned about missing out on AJ by $500,000.  Find me an outfielder who will cost no more than $500,000 and will eb more productive than Timo in a bench role.

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Joe Borchard, Alex Escobar within the team, although there are others available.

[AddisonStSox]

What is with all the Timo bashing?  He was one of our best hitters with runners in scoring position last year and with games on the line, he consistently has the best at-bats out of any one on the team.  You guys mentioned the Anaheim game when he hit the triple off of Rodriguez, but what about the Florida game in which he hit the game tying homer off of Armando Benitez, a 7 million dollar closer, in the ninth inning to tie a game that we eventually went on to win.  HE CONSISTENTLY HAS EXCELLENT AT BATS AGAINST SOME OF THE BEST PITCHERS IN BASEBALL.  Timo brings something to the table that other bench guys cannot, not only in his clutch hitting, but in his bat control.  He can hit the ball exactly where he WANTS to hit the ball and can move runners along as well.  Is Timo worth 1 million dollars?  Maybe he is slightly overpriced...but Neifi Perez of the Chicago Cubs is also making a million dollars so there are other similarly priced contracts out there.  I am sure if Kenny Williams tried to trade Timo right now, there would be some teams surely displaying interest in him.  With a bench of Timo, Everett, Gload, and Burke, the White Sox have one of the deepest benches in the league to go along with an excellent bullpen and a much improved pitching staff.  Timo is an essential part of this.

 

Many of us feel Timo's contract/presence will hurt the club in the long run. We have an outfield of Podsednik, Rowand, Dye. We have Escobar, Gload, and Borchard off the bench and we have Anderson and Sweeny only a few years away. Why have Timo? Why?

 

Was: "C'mon Timo, C'mon Timo, C'mon Timo" fun? Yes.

 

If we miss out on either AJP or Iguchi because of this guy's contract will Timo backers continue to sing his prasies? I dunno. He'll produce for your ballclub, but we have other needs.

[fathom]

  Maybe he is slightly overpriced...but Neifi Perez of the Chicago Cubs is also making a million dollars so there are other similarly priced contracts out there.

 

The Timo and Neifi signings were two of the most ridiculed by different baseball experts because both players are well below average at their positions for the cost. Mark Sweeney just signed for 550k with the Padres. Last year, he had an OPS of .885 and was the most dangerous bat off the bench in baseball. If we had spent a million on him, then I wouldn't have had a problem with him. Don't forget that Dye isn't exactly good at avoiding injury. When Timo had to start in the outfield last year, he was awful.

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(AddisonStSox @ Jan 4, 2005 -> 01:54 PM)

Many of us feel Timo's contract/presence will hurt the club in the long run.  We have an outfield of Podsednik, Rowand, Dye.  We have Escobar, Gload, and Borchard off the bench and we have Anderson and Sweeny only a few years away.  Why have Timo?  Why?

 

Was: "C'mon Timo, C'mon Timo, C'mon Timo" fun?  Yes.

 

If we miss out on either AJP or Iguchi because of this guy's contract will Timo backers continue to sing his prasies?  I dunno.  He'll produce for your ballclub, but we have other needs.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That's why we brought back Timo, and there's no need to rush Sweeney or Anderson either. Secondly, why b**** about Timo's contract when Ben Davis is making the same amount and get this, is playing the same position as AJ? Shouldn't these pessimists worried about giving out $1 million to a bench player in a large market be more concerned with Davis' contract rather than Timo's?

 

I really don't get it. So if we sign AJ are these same whiners going to be complaining about Timo's contract because they feel it won't allow us to add a player at the trade deadline (hell we may not even need someone as the rate this offseason is going. )

[Pods70Rowand33]

I think our bench will be, Gload, Perez, Valdez, Burke and Everett whenever Thomas comes back.

[fathom]

That's why we brought back Timo, and there's no need to rush Sweeney or Anderson either.  Secondly, why b**** about Timo's contract when Ben Davis is making the same amount and get this, is playing the same position as AJ?  Shouldn't these pessimists worried about giving out $1 million to a bench player in a large market be more concerned with Davis' contract rather than Timo's? 

 

 

Difference between signing someone like Davis to $1 mil and Timo to the same amount is that you know that Davis, being one of the top 2 catchers on the team with or without A.J., is going to start around 20 to 25 pct of the games behind the plate. Not only that, but there would have likely been more teams willing to give Davis around that same amount of money to come to the team as a BACK-UP catcher and see if he can fulfill some of his potential. That's the thing though, he's no better than a back-up catcher. That's why we need A.J. The difference between Victor Martinez, Mauer, and I-Rod is ridiculous when compared to Ben Davis. A.J. makes the Sox a lot more respectable.

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(fathom @ Jan 4, 2005 -> 01:56 PM)

The Timo and Neifi signings were two of the most ridiculed by different baseball experts because both players are well below average at their positions for the cost.  Mark Sweeney just signed for 550k with the Padres.  Last year, he had an OPS of .885 and was the most dangerous bat off the bench in baseball.  If we had spent a million on him, then I wouldn't have had a problem with him.  Don't forget that Dye isn't exactly good at avoiding injury.  When Timo had to start in the outfield last year, he was awful.

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Of course you do realize that he played in Colorado last season, and his road splits were .216/.327/.351 and it still doesn't ave the $500,000 to sign AJ?

 

RISP (Road): .239 BA

 

No thanks.

[southsider17]

Many of us feel Timo's contract/presence will hurt the club in the long run.  We have an outfield of Podsednik, Rowand, Dye.  We have Escobar, Gload, and Borchard off the bench and we have Anderson and Sweeny only a few years away.  Why have Timo?  Why?

 

Was: "C'mon Timo, C'mon Timo, C'mon Timo" fun?  Yes.

 

If we miss out on either AJP or Iguchi because of this guy's contract will Timo backers continue to sing his prasies?  I dunno.  He'll produce for your ballclub, but we have other needs.

 

Gload is not .... REPEAT NOT ... a viable option in the outfield. Very good option at first but again .... NOT THE OUTFIELD!

 

While Frank is gone (if at all) I'd put Everett out in the outfield (not a pretty picture either) to spell the starters and use Gload as the DH.

[AddisonStSox]

Ugh'.

 

OF: Podsednik, Rowand, Dye, Escobar, Everett, Gload, Burke, Perez

IF: Crede, Uribe, Harris, Konerko...um...Valdez? Big Frank?

 

Who starts if someone goes down in the infield? Say Uribe tears his ACL, who are you going to field at shortstop? Valdez? Ok. Then you have an infield of Crede, Valdez, Willie f***ing Harris, and Paulie? Ouch.

 

We need help in the infield. We do not need help in the outfield. Perez is expendable. I'd love to see him traded for an arm or a middle infielder.

 

However, while he is a member of the Sox, I'll root just as hard for him as always.

[Pods70Rowand33]

I agree with you about gload not being able to play the outfield...i would rather see everett out there before they put gload in the outfield. If thomas is going to miss time which it looks like he will, we should just have everett DH...and when they want to give him a day off have gload dh, or konerko, and put gload at 1st...if they want pods to sit, or dye or rowand, put everett in the outfield and have gload dh, and put willie or pods in center and have uribe play 2nd. and put valdez at short.