Steff Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 Article from Newsweek: GOD BLESS AMERICA ( and Great Britian) Adnan Shaker has a tiny passport picture of himself that he’s somehow managed to save during his three years in one of Saddam Hussein’s prisons. It shows a handsome man in his 20s, lean and fit, with a luxurious mustache and thick black hair. Today his own three children would probably not recognize him as the same person. HIS HAIR is cropped short. Half his teeth have been knocked out, his face is battered and the eyes sunken and haunted-looking. His chest is covered with 50 separate cuts from a knife, his back has even more marks, which he says are cigarette burns. Two of his fingers were broken and deliberately bent into a permanent, contorted position and there’s a hole in the middle of his palm where his torturers stabbed him and twisted the blade. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Inside a Basra torture chamber April 8, 2003 — ITN’s Bill Neely reports on an alleged Iraqi government torture chamber discovered by British troops in Basra. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Today, though, Adnan was a happy man, so happy that he could barely restrain his excitement. He was finally freed from a prison in downtown Basra, after British troops entered the city and drove the remaining defenders away. And as he took a small group of American journalists on a tour of the hospital, he enthusiastically led a crowd of fellow ex-prisoners, their families, friends and passersby in the first rendition of a pro-American chant that any of us have so far heard: “Nam nam Bush , Sad-Dam No” (“Yes, yes, Bush, Saddam No”). They chanted and danced, filling one of their former cells in a spontaneous celebration. The prison was originally the School for Adult Reeducation, until the authorities converted it after the Shiite uprising against Saddam in 1991 and, perversely renaming it the Jail for Adult Reeducation, used it as a place to punish rebellious Shiites. The white walls outside are covered with blue-painted Baathist and pro-Saddam slogans, but nothing announces that it’s a prison. In the central courtyard, there’s a long-disused basketball hoop, under which are arrays of metal beds for prisoners who were lucky enough to sleep outside. Arrayed around that were groups of classrooms, now cells, which housed so many men that they had to lie down in shifts to sleep. Prisoners whose families had enough money to bribe the authorities at the prison went into Unit One, where they were only occasionally beaten; it cost at least three million Iraqi dinars for that privilege (about $1,000 at the current rate). Unit Two was worse, and so on. In Unit Four, where Adnan lived for his 10-year sentence, the prisoners say they were tortured daily, sometimes thrice daily. Only Unit Five was worse, in a sense. It was where they took them to die. Adnan says his initial crime was simply stealing some bread, but even that had a political dimension. “The bread was only for the ruling Baathists and the rest of us could go hungry—they didn’t care. We had no choice but to steal.” In prison, though, he was tortured to get him to admit that he was an enemy of the regime. “They wanted me to say I stole the bread because I was against the party.” He wouldn’t admit that, but when they asked him to say. “Long live Saddam,” he refused. Adnan claims the tortures became daily occurrences, and he and other prisoners practically dragged us visitors through a succession of cells and torture chambers. In one, electrodes hung from the ceiling. He showed how they were placed on either side of his head while the voltage was turned on. On a wall were some hooks, high up. They produced a concrete reinforcing rod that had been bent into a sort of twisted figure eight, so that each loop served as manacles, and the middle was hooked to the wall. One room even had a complete dentist’s chair and drill set, which the prisoners could use for tooth problems if their relatives paid enough—but was more commonly employed solely to inflict pain. Now, says Adnan to general consent, “I want to kill all Baathists, I want to kill Saddam.” He pulled up his shirt to show the knife wounds and turned around to show the cigarette burn marks. “When we said we were thirsty they brought us out here to drink,” he says, running over to a drainage channel in the middle of the old basketball court, and miming getting down on his knees with his hands tied behind his back and drinking the greenish muck that streamed through. Unit 4 was reached through an oddly yellow fence with spikes on top, and the mostly windowless cells were filthy and bedless. Perhaps saddest were two rooms, each hardly bigger than a normal bedroom, reserved for children; they had been crammed with scores of kids from 12 to 16 years old, say the former inmates. Ali Nasr, 13 at the time, was caught up in a sweep when Shiites throughout Iraq rioted after the murder of their Grand Ayatollah, Mohammed Sadiq al-Sader (also called Sader II) in Najaf. Sader had been gunned down with his two sons, and Iraqi authorities claimed to have no knowledge of who killed him. Nonetheless, it followed the killings of a series of lesser Shiite leaders in previous years, and the regime’s execution of one of his fellow ayatollahs for his role in the 1991 uprising. Ali spent six months in the juvenile wing of Unit Four, sleeping on his feet when the cell was too crowded to lie down, or taking turns on the floor with other prisoners. The boy was still too scared to talk about it, even now. Then there was Unit Five, a long corridor where prisoners were hanged or, in many cases, simply left to die of their torture wounds. In the looted rubble of the prison office, the liberated prisoners pulled out ID cards and photographs of men they had known who went to Five. There was Hilal Abbas, whose Ministry of Defense ID card said he was an officer in the Army; he had been heard chanting “Death to Saddam” during the uprising, and was hanged. Abdul Latif Sabhan had already had an eye put out by torture by the time his ID card photo was taken; he died of torture wounds. Fadil Jarallah died similarly, but his case was tragic even by Iraqi standards. He had, they said, looked at a Baathist on the street the wrong way. There were 16 other cards of men identified by the ex-prisoners as having died there. Many others perished as well; how many, they couldn’t say. Just before British troops entered Basra on Sunday, their guards locked them all in their cells and fled ahead of the advance. Among them was the warden, Jamal al-Tikriti, a member of Saddam’s home tribe. “We’ll find the Baathists,” said Adnan. “And even if they have guns, we’ll tear them to pieces with our teeth.” And with that he led another chant of “Nam Nam Bush, Sad-dam No.” Elsewhere in Basra, buildings were set on fire by looters and some of the unruly crowds were even denouncing the invaders. But for Adnan and his friends, there was no doubt whose side they were on now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 Wow. That really gives perspective to show you dispite the flaws in our criminal justice system, what a difference there really is! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moochpuppy Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 And how nice to see people in the streets cheering and supporting our troops and even caring American flags without fear of ending up like Adnan Shaker or worse. God Bless the work our troops have done over there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 And how nice to see people in the streets cheering and supporting our troops and even caring American flags without fear of ending up like Adnan Shaker or worse. God Bless the work our troops have done over there. pretty emotional day in baghdad isnt it... for those who dont know...in the arab world it is a huge insult to show someone the bottom of your shoe..and its even worse to put it in someone's face..that's the significance of the iraqi people takingtheir shoes off and rubbing them over the statues and pictures of saddam..its the ultimate insult i 2nd that..god bless our troops...also god bless those in power that remained strong in the face of wrongful opposition so that this effort was carried out quickly and as safely as possible..most of all..god bless all those , from every country who suffered under the evil of saddam... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted April 9, 2003 Author Share Posted April 9, 2003 My uncle called my grandmother last night and said that "it's been an emotional 2 days" there. They've seen a lot of horrible things the past 48 hours. He didn't get to detailed but he did say that they found a family - mother with 7 children (one dead). The mother had been seriously wounded because they (Iraqi soldiers) did not believe her when she told them her husband was already taken into battle. She had been beaten upside the head so badly that they could see her skull. The oldest child - who he estimated to be about 7 or 8 - had been taking care of her and the rest of the children. They were eating molded bread (it was at the stage where none of it was white any longer) and drinking muddy water. The child that was dead was female. Was nude with cuts and burns all over her body. She was covered in blood but it appeared that she had been sexually assulted due to cuts and bruises in the pubic area. He said she was maybe 4 (diaper nearby indicates maybe she was younger). Now when I think about what that little one went through.. I think of my neice, who is almost 3, and if anything or anyone EVER did ANYTHING to hurt her how I'd KILL them. These assholes. However right or wrong you think this war is, s*** like this can NOT be tolerated. Ever. No matter what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted April 9, 2003 Author Share Posted April 9, 2003 One more thing.. he said that of the resistance that his unit has come across there has been a lot of refrence to the 9/11 attacks. From their mouths, not actual evidance. One guy he said had a newspaper from that day and held it up to their faces and laughed before he was restrained. They are sick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OfficerKarkovice Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 Apu...I noticed you have yet to respond to any of the sentiments in this thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 Apu...I noticed you have yet to respond to any of the sentiments in this thread? Wednesday is my busy day (class 11, 12, 1, 2) and I was also helping out with an event sponsored by PRIDE so I only recently got back to my room, haha. What I saw on TV seemed to be one side of the event. I've read plenty of news reports from the Guardian etc. that have shown many Iraqis angry at the US for civilian slaughter, bombing mistakes etc. What is on TV is only one side and there are 2 sides to every story, no matter how much the pro-Bush media wants to spin it. But then again, what would I know, I'm just a French/German/Russian anti-war hippie loving commie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moochpuppy Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 news reports from the Guardian etc. that have shown many Iraqis angry at the US for civilian slaughter, bombing mistakes etc. US Bombing mistakes have led to some civilian casualties as opposed to Saddam slaughtering his people purposefully. Let's get this straight apu....the US has not slaughtered (massacred, butchered) any Iraqi civilians by any means. Choose your words carefully. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 US Bombing mistakes have led to some civilian casualties as opposed to Saddam slaughtering his people purposefully. Let's get this straight apu....the US has not slaughtered (massacred, butchered) any Iraqi civilians by any means. Choose your words carefully. How about opening fire on that car of women and children? Or the missile that flew into the market? Or the snipers taking shots to get soldiers when there are "expendible" civilians in the way? (their excuse, "the b**** wouldn't move") We've done our fair share of harming Iraqi civilians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 Apu...I noticed you have yet to respond to any of the sentiments in this thread? Why does anybody here even give a rats fat ass what Apu thinks about what is going on today in Iraq ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI1020 Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 Apu...I noticed you have yet to respond to any of the sentiments in this thread? Why does anybody here even give a rats fat ass what Apu thinks about what is going on today in Iraq ? Damn good question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OfficerKarkovice Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 Apu...I noticed you have yet to respond to any of the sentiments in this thread? Why does anybody here even give a rats fat ass what Apu thinks about what is going on today in Iraq ? Damn good question. Because he is very vocal on war efforts and I was curious to hear his opinion on this topic...no harm in that I don't think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 Apu...I noticed you have yet to respond to any of the sentiments in this thread? Why does anybody here even give a rats fat ass what Apu thinks about what is going on today in Iraq ? Damn good question. Because he is very vocal on war efforts and I was curious to hear his opinion on this topic...no harm in that I don't think. None at all Karko. I was just stating my feelings. That's all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonkeyKongerko Posted April 9, 2003 Share Posted April 9, 2003 How about opening fire on that car of women and children? There was a sign or twenty that said "b****, u bettah stop that car or we gonna shoot yo' ass" in Arabic, sorry if my translation is not exact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Apu...I noticed you have yet to respond to any of the sentiments in this thread? Wednesday is my busy day (class 11, 12, 1, 2) and I was also helping out with an event sponsored by PRIDE so I only recently got back to my room, haha. What I saw on TV seemed to be one side of the event. I've read plenty of news reports from the Guardian etc. that have shown many Iraqis angry at the US for civilian slaughter, bombing mistakes etc. What is on TV is only one side and there are 2 sides to every story, no matter how much the pro-Bush media wants to spin it. But then again, what would I know, I'm just a French/German/Russian anti-war hippie loving commie. apu..you suffer from whats called the "flat world" syndrome...in the face of overwhelming facts that prove you were wrong on just about everything you posted on this war ( the iraqi people didnt want us there , the war plan was going horribly wrong , the war was illegal , the war would take years with 5 million dead iraqi children ,ect ect ect) , you still refuse to accept the truth..thousands of iraqis are taking to the streets in every city....in iraqi and in every country that iraqis are living in exile...look at the parade in deerborn michigan...one iraqi went and changed his name to george bush...but there you sit...spining away..no no no , thats not the truth....when its right in front of your eyes...the world is still flat isnt it apu?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Hell ain't a bad place to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 apu..you suffer from whats called the "flat world" syndrome...in the face of overwhelming facts that prove you were wrong on just about everything you posted on this war ( the iraqi people didnt want us there , the war plan was going horribly wrong , the war was illegal , the war would take years with 5 million dead iraqi children ,ect ect ect) , you still refuse to accept the truth..thousands of iraqis are taking to the streets in every city....in iraqi and in every country that iraqis are living in exile...look at the parade in deerborn michigan...one iraqi went and changed his name to george bush...but there you sit...spining away..no no no , thats not the truth....when its right in front of your eyes...the world is still flat isnt it apu?? 1000 people celebrated. Baghdad has 5 million inhabitants. If the US is squashing Saddam, where is all the support at from the people if only that small of an amount shows up? I never demeaned the ends. I just heartily disagree with the means that we got to the ends. This war IS illegal as well. I've read the law and know what I am talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted April 10, 2003 Author Share Posted April 10, 2003 Apu.. there were waaaaaaaay more than just 1000 people. My uncle said they couldn't move the tanks through the streets for several hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moochpuppy Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Apu.. there were waaaaaaaay more than just 1000 people. My uncle said they couldn't move the tanks through the streets for several hours. Steff, obviously your uncle is a liar. I'm sure that's what Bush told him to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowerCaseRepublican Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Apu.. there were waaaaaaaay more than just 1000 people. My uncle said they couldn't move the tanks through the streets for several hours. The media is showing 1000. Let's say it's 10,000 then, possibly 20,000 that still doesn't change the fact that it's an incredibly small minority of a city that has over 5 million in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted April 10, 2003 Author Share Posted April 10, 2003 I dunno.. average family has 8 children there. If the father is out partying.. and the mom is home with the kiddo's.... Not to mention most of the g'ment workers hitailed it outta there. All of "upper class" downtown was a desert (no pun intended) when they rolled in there Monday morning. All Saddams troopers likely went north as well (approx 750K?) Makes a bit of sense to me. And since I'm getting this info first hand from my uncle who is there.. I'm going to lean on his word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moochpuppy Posted April 10, 2003 Share Posted April 10, 2003 Makes a bit of sense to me. And since I'm getting this info first hand from my uncle who is there.. I'm going to lean on his word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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