Why we are 12-4

[JUGGERNAUT]

@ DET W4-3 DP - 2 (M Buehrle-J Uribe-P Konerko, W Harris-J Uribe-P Konerko).

@ DET W9-1 DP - 2 (P Konerko-J Uribe-P Konerko, T Iguchi-J Uribe-R Gload).

v MIN W3-1 DP - 3 (J Uribe-P Konerko, J Uribe-T Iguchi-P Konerko 2).

v MIN W5-4 DP - 3 (J Crede-T Iguchi-P Konerko, J Uribe-T Iguchi-P Konerko, T Iguchi-J Uribe-P Konerko).

v SEA L5-4 DP - 1 (J Crede-T Iguchi-P Konerko).

v SEA W2-1

v SEA W6-4 DP - 1 (J Crede-T Iguchi-P Konerko).

@ CLE L8-6 DP - 1 (O Hernandez-W Harris-R Gload).

@ CLE W5-4 10 IN

@ CLE W2-1 OFA S Podsednik (R Belliard at 3rd base). DP - 1 (P Ozuna-P Konerko).

@ MIN L5-2 DP - 1 (J Uribe-T Iguchi-P Konerko).

@ MIN W8-6 DP - 2 (J Uribe, J Crede-T Iguchi-P Konerko).

@ MIN W5-1 DP - 1 (J Uribe-W Harris-P Konerko).

v CLE L11-5 E - J Crede (2, throw); J Uribe (1, ground ball).

v CLE W4-3

v CLE W1-0 DP: 2 (J Crede-T Iguchi-P Konerko 2).

 

4th in DP's, 3rd in Assists, 15th in E (Best in ALC: KC 1st, CLE 3rd, DET 7th, MIN 12th)

http://cbs.sportsline.com/mlb/stats/teamso...SIC?&_1:col_1=7

 

Intangibles: 5th in SB, 1st in SF, 5th in SH

http://cbs.sportsline.com/mlb/stats/teamso...EXT?&_1:col_1=3

 

We're not as far behind in TB either.

http://cbs.sportsline.com/mlb/stats/teamso...IC?&_1:col_1=11

 

Is it a stretch to say the 2005 White Sox are one of the best defensive teams in the majors? A fun team to watch!

Edited April 22, 2005 by aboz56

[SoxFanForever]

Should the title say "Why we are 12-4"?

[JUGGERNAUT]

Should the title say "Why we are 12-4"?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah. :banghead - I saw it right away but there's no option to edit the topic title for us non-mods.

[kapkomet]

Does there have to be statistics up the ass to say why we're 12-4?

 

I think it has to do with one word: attitude.

 

Stats can't do s*** for a winning attitude.

[JUGGERNAUT]

Does there have to be statistics up the ass to say why we're 12-4?

I think it has to do with one word:  attitude.

Stats can't do s*** for a winning attitude.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

It's more than just attitude. It's talent. That's the point of looking at the stats. The Sox wouldn't be among the leaders in run-saving, jam-ending DP's if they didn't have the talent.

Edited April 22, 2005 by JUGGERNAUT

[kapkomet]

This team is more "talented" then last year's team? Except the pitching staff, I respectfully disagree.

 

They are playing well together. It's called the intangibles - that's why they are winning games.

 

To be honest, I in a morbid sort of way am looking forward to how they handle some diversity. Once they slay that dragon, we're in for a special year.

[JUGGERNAUT]

This team is more "talented" then last year's team?  Except the pitching staff, I respectfully disagree.

 

They are playing well together.  It's called the intangibles - that's why they are winning games.

 

To be honest, I in a morbid sort of way am looking forward to how they handle some diversity.  Once they slay that dragon, we're in for a special year.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Are you seriously suggesting that Crede-Valentin-Uribe-Konerko was more talented

defensively than Crede-Uribe-Iguchi-Konerko? If so I strongly disagree. Uribe playing SS is a BIG reason why the White Sox are 12-4. That's more talent than attitude.

 

He's struggling offensively, but defensively he's been a MAJOR upgrade over Valentin.

[daa84]

Are you seriously suggesting that Crede-Valentin-Uribe-Konerko was more talented

defensively than Crede-Uribe-Iguchi-Konerko?  If so I strongly disagree.  Uribe playing SS is a BIG reason why the White Sox are 12-4.  That's more talent than attitude.

 

He's struggling offensively, but defensively he's been a MAJOR upgrade over Valentin.

uribe has made his share of errors, especially on easy plays, much like valentin. he needs to get better at it. he has made 3 errors thus far which projects at 30 on the year. valentin had a better range factor and better zone rating...i will say that baseball prospectus had uribe as the top defensive SS by projected defensive VORP at teh beginning of the year, so hopefully he will get it goin. im not sayin hes worse than valentin at SS, but thus far this year he has yet to show that he has been better. That said, he will be better, but it has 0 reason to do with 12-4. 12-4 is clearly in the hands of clutch hitting and good pitching, and clutch pitching (if there is such a thing)

[JUGGERNAUT]

uribe has made his share of errors, especially on easy plays, much like valentin. he needs to get better at it. he has made 3 errors thus far which projects at 30 on the year. valentin had a better range factor and better zone rating...i will say that baseball prospectus had uribe as the top defensive SS by projected defensive VORP at teh beginning of the year, so hopefully he will get it goin. im not sayin hes worse than valentin at SS, but thus far this year he has yet to show that he has been better. That said, he will be better, but it has 0 reason to do with 12-4. 12-4 is clearly in the hands of clutch hitting and good pitching, and clutch pitching (if there is such a thing)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Before this week Uribe had the highest zone rating amongst SS (.909). Meaning he was getting to less than 10% of the balls w/in the max limits of the SS zone. This week he's had some problems & it's dropped down to .847. But considering the Sox are just 2 DP's shy of leading the majors & Uribe's name is assoc with nearly all of them he's getting the job done much better than Valentin had.

 

It's not just about racking them up. It's about getting the ones that matter most.

Yesterday's game is a prime example when Hermanson had 2 on & nobody out. It's Uribe's arm that is making the difference. It's far superior in accuracy & speed than Valentin's was.

 

You're entitled to your opinion as much as the next person but if you are suggesting the Sox are still 12-4 with Valentin playing SS instead of Uribe I strongly disagree. The game logs tell the story there.

[RockRaines]

I agree with your posts Juggs, I think that Uribe and Gooch is the best dp tandem since Joey and Ozzie. I really like the way Gooch turns 2, and I think that Uribes arm is a large reason why we get so many close plays.

[AssHatSoxFan]

so double plays are the reason a team will end up with a better record than a losing team at the end of the year?

[tonyho7476]

so double plays are the reason a team will end up with a better record than a losing team at the end of the year?

 

Yes, that and the 40 time of the batboy!

[kapkomet]

Uribe is at best a wash (SO FAR) as far as on field performance for Valentin, and I am NOT a Jose fan.

 

But I do think that Uribe has a better attitude on the field.

[santo=dorf]

Juggs, have you ever thought that maybe the reason why we are 12-4 is due to our BA after 2-1 counts? :rolly

[AssHatSoxFan]

Uribe is at best a wash (SO FAR) as far as on field performance for Valentin, and I am NOT a Jose fan.

 

But I do think that Uribe has a better attitude on the field.

we all know that Jose rocked the that awesome dirty sanchez mustache though

[JUGGERNAUT]

Juggs, have you ever thought that maybe the reason why we are 12-4 is due to our BA after 2-1 counts?  :rolly

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think I included links to all the stats that define why we are 12-4. The intangibles have made a difference as well. The fact that we are only lagging a little behind the Twins in TB means are offense has been struggling but still effective.

 

But if you were to narrow it down to one element of the game as to why the Sox are 12-4 I believe it has more to do with run-saving, jam-ending DP's than anything else.

A timely hit does nothing to boost a pitcher's confidence but a rocket off the hand of Uribe does. Just about every arm on the team has benefited from one of these DP sits.

Hermy yesterday was a prime example. If that DP isn't turned that's likely a bigger inning & a possible loss. The same can be said about many games this year.

 

For me that's a really good thing, because that's something you can count on. It's a part of the dimension of the player. What's more is that the C's & pitchers will pick up on. Maybe even call the game to lean towards it. Having veteran experience in that dept helps as well.

 

As for comparing him to Val there is none. Unless you look back to 2000.

2000 J Val 456A, 118DP, 36E

2003 J Val 395A, 96DP, 20E

2005 Uribe 54A 12DP - on pace for 540A, 120DP's

 

This is just my opinion, but when a guy plays beyond the range of his talent he's prone to more errors. I would say that definitely described Valentin in 2000 & applies to Uribe in 2005.

[NUKE_CLEVELAND]

Does there have to be statistics up the ass to say why we're 12-4?

 

I think it has to do with one word:  attitude.

 

Stats can't do s*** for a winning attitude.

 

 

That's exactly the reason we're winning. The atmosphere surrounding this team is just the same as it was in 2000. Everyone's loose, there's no ill will in the clubhouse & there's no pressure. Combine that with the high level of skill and balance of various skills and you have a winning team.

[JUGGERNAUT]

I want to add that although Uribe is struggling at the plate he's still been pretty effective at moving runners over. That's something Val could not do. His DP & sacrfice bunt to move BOTH runners into scor pos for Pods was very important to Thurs win. The Sox are 7-1 in 1 run games. Over 1/2 their games. Uribe's played a major part in that.

 

I wish they recorded inning ending DP's because I'm sure the Sox would lead the league in that category. They are only a few DP's away from leading the league as it is.

But inning ending DP's are the most important. Especially when there is a runner on 3rd. The Sox have had a few of those sits & Uribe has come up big in them.

Edited April 22, 2005 by JUGGERNAUT

[kapkomet]

Juggs, take this in the spirit it's meant (not as a personal slam), but do you statistically analyze your s***, too? Just friggin' enjoy the baseball, dude.

[Al Lopez Ghost (old)]

It's only 16 games, but one other thing we are doing much better this year than last is not allowing the opponent to score in the next half-inning after we score. So far, this has been one terrific pitching staff.

[Wedge]

It's only 16 games, but one other thing we are doing much better this year than last is not allowing the opponent to score in the next half-inning after we score. So far, this has been one terrific pitching staff.

 

Very good point. Our friend E-Lo almost always coughed up a lead. These pitchers are tough when they get a lead and they don't freak out when they fall behind by a run or two. They're a really tough bunch, which is good!

[SoxFan1]

We can change the name of the thread to "Why we are 13-4" now......

[JUGGERNAUT]

Last night was a message to the rest of the league: this team is not just built on pitching & defense. The talent is there to hit as well. If the opposition makes a mistake we will pounce. That's what happened last night.

 

This is a tracking thread. The links are included so that you can look at them weekly & see how the Sox compare to the rest of the league. I firmly believe now they will lead the ALC in TB before it's over as well.

 

Watching, reading, & just absorbing everything there is to know about this team is a fan's dream right now. The Sox look like a 100 win team. Mark mentions the team needs a losing streak to see whether it's good or not. Well that's not coming any time soon. This team is more poised to go on a thumping tear than a losing streak.

 

J Uribe: He's heating up. Now 6th in TB (20), & 3rd in RBI (10) on the Sox.

 

DYK? 1919 was the last time the Sox held the lead in their first 17 games. Colorado owns the ML record (19 gms in 2003). That's soon to fall.

 

Start saving for the playoff tickets now.

Edited April 23, 2005 by JUGGERNAUT

[AssHatSoxFan]

yeah why dont we just schedule a worlds series now vs the dodgers :rolly

 

still a lot of games to be played

[JUGGERNAUT]

ESPN is pissing me off. I can't believe their lame arse comments about our team. Some simple math even the guys at ESPN might understand.

 

Win distribution: SP 10, RP 3. Projected Apr: SP 14, RP 4

2004 monthly:

May SP 12, RP 4

Jun SP 9, RP 3

Jul SP 9, RP 2

Aug SP 10, RP 2

Sep SP 13, RP 6

Tot: SP 53, RP 17 = 70 wins

 

If the team plays no better than the 2004 team the next 5 months it's still on pace for 88 wins. What's the likelihood of that happening? Slim.

We should get Thomas back before the chi-town series starts & we have a much better rotation & bullpen than 2004. This team is capable of winning 100 gms this year & until we see evidence on the field to the contrary ESPN should just shut it's mouth if it doesn't have anything good to say about the ChiSox.

 

In honor to the White Sox when this team racks up 50 wins going into JuL the guys at ESPN should put together a theme of crow being served around the table.