Jon Garland

[tonyho7476]

What is his status? Can he leave after this year? Or will we have him again next year? Does anyone think we can sign him long term? What will that cost? Why am I so full of questions?

[DBAHO]

I think he's still arbitration eligible, but the Sox agreed a 1 year deal with him this season for about $3.4 million. I think he's got 1 year left of arbitration, but I'm probably wrong on that.

[SuperSteve]

We have all five locked up for another season IIRC.

[aboz56]

He's eligible for FA after next season.

 

Buehrle: 3-Year worth 18M- will make 3.5M in 2004, 6M in 2005 and 7.75M in 2006- deal includes 2007 option worth 9.5M or 1M buyout

 

Contreras: 4-Year worth 32M- will make in 2003- 4M and a 6M signing bonus, in 2004 and in 2005- 7M, in 2006- 8M- + signing bonus paid 2M each year in 03 and 04 and 1M each year in 05 and 06- after trade in 2004, contract partially paid by Yankees

 

El Duque: signed 2-year worth 8M thru 2006 on 12/22/04- he will make 3.5M in 2005 and at least 4.5M in 2006- + he can earn 1.5M in bonuses in 2005 based on innings pitched- + a 1/3 amount of whatever amount of the 1.5M in incentives he earns in 2005 is added to his 2006 salary- + he can earn 2M in bonuses in 2006, making the total value of the deal with all incentives earned, 12M

 

Garcia: signed 3-Year EXTENSION worth 27M on 7/6/04- will make 8M in 05, 9M in 06, and 10M in 07

[Punch and Judy Garland]

Garland figures to make what? About $6-7 million in arbitration if he wins 16 games or so? Does that sound like an accurate conservative estimate?

[aboz56]

Garland figures to make what? About $6-7 million in arbitration if he wins 16 games or so? Does that sound like an accurate conservative estimate?

I'd say 6 million at the most unless he is a 18-20 game winner that makes the all-star team.

[Wedge]

We should have a shot of signing him long term in the $6-8 million range/4 years, I'd guess.

[Chisoxrd5]

I'd say 6 million at the most unless he is a 18-20 game winner that makes the all-star team.

 

He will sign a 3 yr, 26 million dollar deal after the season ends..consider yourself informed

[aboz56]

He will sign a 3 yr, 26 million dollar deal after the season ends..consider yourself informed 

I'd do 4 years and 30 if he has a great year.

[southsider2k5]

I'd do 4 years and 30 if he has a great year.

 

And considering what assclowns like Benson and Wright got, that is a bargin, even if he settles in closer to his career numbers than he is pitching now.

[knightni]

JR doesn't like signing pitchers to long term deals.

 

He wouldn't with McDowell, Fernandez, Alvarez, Sirotka, Parque..etc.

 

Only recently have the Sox signed a pitcher for more than 2 to 3 years.

[SuperSteve]

I'd see only 3 year contract at most.

[Punch and Judy Garland]

Who was the last pitcher to get more than three years, navarro? I would let Jon go to arbitration and make him prove himself all of this year and next before signing a long term deal.

[Balta1701]

Who was the last pitcher to get more than three years, navarro? I would let Jon go to arbitration and make him prove himself all of this year and next before signing a long term deal.

 

Problem with that is...if he keeps this up this year...we don't sign him...and then he does this again next year, he might be looking at Kevin Brown type numbers for a long-term contract. If you sign him to a 3 year deal after this season is over...yeah it costs you more next year, but then you save more the next 2 years.

 

Can you imagine...if the Yankees or Red Sox miss the playoffs this year, what they would pay to get a 27 year old who has just come off 2 stellar seasons with the White Sox, if Garland pulls that off?

 

It's nice to make "Certain" that he can prove himself, but if he gets out on the free agent market, I wouldn't expect him back. He'll earn way too much.

[Punch and Judy Garland]

I don't really like the idea of having a rotation that makes $40-50 million annually either though

[Balta1701]

I don't really like the idea of having a rotation that makes $40-50 million annually either though

 

Think about this as a rotation then...Garcia's locked up at $9 a year...At some point in 2 or 3 years we'll have BMac and Gonzalez up, both of whom will be in the low millions their first few years...barring another pitcher coming up (Adkins) that'll leave us with 2 more roster spots to fill. Buehrle and Garland strike me as an ideal pair...and that gives us roughly a $30 million starting 5, and Kenny Williams won't need to trade for any more pitchers.

 

That's the nice thing about bringing up the young guys - they don't cost a lot.

[Punch and Judy Garland]

Right but you don't use them if all of your starting five is under contract. While B-Mac should be in the rotation next year, he won't be. Moving Garland after the season at a high value could be a smart move

[Balta1701]

Right but you don't use them if all of your starting five is under contract. While B-Mac should be in the rotation next year, he won't be.  Moving Garland after the season at a high value could be a smart move

 

I think moving a pitcher might be a smart move, but I'd disagree with the "after the season" part.

 

As far as I've been able to see, your best chance at getting an absolute steal in a trade is to make a deal just before the trading deadline. If you've got a starting pitcher to move...2 months into the season, you'll have guys lining up at your door offering the shirt off their back if that's what it takes. Look what we gave up for Garcia! Or again, look what the Mets gave up for Kazmir, etc.

 

And if we were to consider moving a pitcher...I'd suggest Hernandez before Garland - assuming Garland only goes through arbitration, both of their contracts will be up at the end of 2006, and Garland has much mor eof a future.

[Punch and Judy Garland]

I don't believe that contending teams should trade away starting pitching. Then, you throw B-Mac into the pennant race which could be unwise. I think you'd get a better deal by waiting.

[SuperSteve]

I think moving a pitcher might be a smart move, but I'd disagree with the "after the season" part.

 

As far as I've been able to see, your best chance at getting an absolute steal in a trade is to make a deal just before the trading deadline.  If you've got a starting pitcher to move...2 months into the season, you'll have guys lining up at your door offering the shirt off their back if that's what it takes.  Look what we gave up for Garcia!  Or again, look what the Mets gave up for Kazmir, etc.

 

And if we were to consider moving a pitcher...I'd suggest Hernandez before Garland - assuming Garland only goes through arbitration, both of their contracts will be up at the end of 2006, and Garland has much mor eof a future.

So trade a proven guy so we can going into the playoff race with guys who have never been in the majors before?

[Balta1701]

So trade a proven guy so we can going into the playoff race with guys who have never been in the majors before?

 

It's worked for Oakland.

 

At some point you have to decide what you want your team to do...they can be good almost every year if you keep the right people in...and then you can take your chances in the playoffs, sometimes with unproven guys. Or you can be great for 1 or 2 years, have a better chance in the playoffs for those 2 years, and then have a sudden dropoff when you lose those people (see Cleveland in 2000).

 

Personally...I think that our best chance is to try to put together a very good team every year, and hope someone like McCarthy magically does a Josh Beckett and pulls off a miracle during the playoffs. Given how volatile things can be in the postseason...if you're in there, you've got a chance, even if its just as a wild card.

 

Unless of course, you're the Yankees and you can buy everyone and their grandmother to fill your pitching staff.

[SuperSteve]

It's worked for Oakland.

 

At some point you have to decide what you want your team to do...they can be good almost every year if you keep the right people in...and then you can take your chances in the playoffs, sometimes with unproven guys.  Or you can be great for 1 or 2 years, have a better chance in the playoffs for those 2 years, and then have a sudden dropoff when you lose those people (see Cleveland in 2000).

 

Personally...I think that our best chance is to try to put together a very good team every year, and hope someone like McCarthy magically does a Josh Beckett and pulls off a miracle during the playoffs.  Given how volatile things can be in the postseason...if you're in there, you've got a chance, even if its just as a wild card.

 

Unless of course, you're the Yankees and you can buy everyone and their grandmother to fill your pitching staff.

Well they did win back to back World Series'...they also got a ton for Giambi and Tejada. How did it work for Oakland, I cannot recall them trading a SP to use a minors SP midway through the season.

[NUKE_CLEVELAND]

I don't really like the idea of having a rotation that makes $40-50 million annually either though

 

 

We'll get a lot more punch out of that 50 million dollar rotation than the Spankees are getting with their 100 million dollar rotation.

[Wedge]

We'll get a lot more punch out of that 50 million dollar rotation than the Spankees are getting with their 100 million dollar rotation.

 

I agree. That'd be about the smartest $50 million we could spend. I'd rather have B-Mac and Gio eventually replacing Contreras and Duque than Garland. That way, we have guys that came up in the Sox system that should have more signability, due to club loyalty. Whether you have loved or hated Garland in the past, we've all sat back and taken our lumps waiting for him to mature.

 

Trading your best Starting Pitcher when you're in a potential pennant race is just dumb.

[JUGGERNAUT]

It all depends on whether Jon wins the CyYoung. If that happens then he's in line for a 40M/4yr deal like Halladay & Santana. Maybe a little less but not by much.

 

Whether that happens or not you have to keep Jon because of his history.

Garland will always be famous in Chicago for the Flub trade & that will always make him special in the eyes of the media & the fans. You need to keep that.