S720 Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 I take Kenny Williams as a GM over anyone! I love his serious attitude when it comes to winning for his team. http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...tesox-headlines Sox GM denies Cubs extra help Coleman has words with Williams after he's kept from dugout By Paul Sullivan Tribune staff reporter May 22, 2005 White Sox general manager Ken Williams wondered aloud before Saturday's game whether his desire to win may have cost him a good friend. Williams and Cubs minor-league baserunning instructor Vince Coleman engaged in a heated exchange during Cubs batting practice Saturday as Sox coach Tim Raines, Cubs bench coach Dick Pole and others watched in disbelief. Coleman was upset Williams denied the Cubs' request to let Coleman sit in the dugout during the City Series. Coleman hasn't been with the Cubs since spring training, but appeared Friday to help give a "refresher course" to Cubs baserunners this weekend. Teams are allowed to add a "seventh coach" in the dugout during September call-ups with Major League Baseball's approval, and also may do it during the season if the opposing team OK's it. Because the Sox rely heavily on their running game, and because Coleman was one of his era's great base-stealers, Williams believed Coleman's presence could be detrimental to the Sox. Coleman was allowed to help out on the field before the game and pitched batting practice. Williams approached Coleman near the batting cage before Saturday's Sox-Cubs game as Coleman was talking to Raines. After Williams made an off-hand comment, Coleman stalked off in a huff. Williams asked Coleman to come back and talk, then got angry when Coleman refused. Williams yelled that Coleman should take it as a "compliment" the Sox were wary of his knowledge. He then walked off the field in disgust. After cooling off, Williams acknowledged his friendship with Coleman probably was in jeopardy, but he was not about to apologize for putting his team first. "It's nothing personal," Williams said. "I attended Vince's wedding last winter. Our kids play on the same football and baseball teams in Scottsdale. But this man has a tremendous amount of knowledge and I wouldn't be surprised if he helps out a major-league club as a manager some day. "I can't afford to let someone with such knowledge give them an edge [about] trying to stop our attack, especially when I have the option of [keeping him out of the dugout]." Cubs manager Dusty Baker confirmed Saturday the Cubs had made the request to allow Coleman in the dugout, and the Sox denied it. Baker did not witness the Coleman-Williams altercation and declined to answer questions about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabroni Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 (edited) Why would Kenny want to help the Cubs? Vince Coleman would have tried to steal our signs to guys like Pods and Willie. I think it's obvious that that's what the Cubs were trying to do. f*** that and f*** them. :finger Good job, Kenny. Williams approached Coleman near the batting cage before Saturday's Sox-Cubs game as Coleman was talking to Raines. After Williams made an off-hand comment, Coleman stalked off in a huff. Williams asked Coleman to come back and talk, then got angry when Coleman refused. Williams yelled that Coleman should take it as a "compliment" the Sox were wary of his knowledge. He then walked off the field in disgust. I just love that Cubune bias. :headshake Edited May 22, 2005 by Jabroni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capn12 Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 Hell, I woulda done the exact same thing. You dont let someone with Colemans knowledge of the running game give your opposition an advantage unless you have to. Props to K-Dub Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 If Vince Coleman makes that much difference in KW's opinion, and he is KW's good friend, why, when the White Sox have had so many problems baserunning through the years, and are transitioning into a running team, wasn't Coleman hired as a White Sox major league coach? The Cubs stole a couple of bases yesterday. What can Coleman do sitting on the bench that he can't do pregame or sitting in the clubhouse? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 If Vince Coleman makes that much difference in KW's opinion, and he is KW's good friend, why, when the White Sox have had so many problems baserunning through the years, and are transitioning into a running team, wasn't Coleman hired as a White Sox major league coach? The Cubs stole a couple of bases yesterday. What can Coleman do sitting on the bench that he can't do pregame or sitting in the clubhouse? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Tim Raines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabroni Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 If Vince Coleman makes that much difference in KW's opinion, and he is KW's good friend, why, when the White Sox have had so many problems baserunning through the years, and are transitioning into a running team, wasn't Coleman hired as a White Sox major league coach? The Cubs stole a couple of bases yesterday. What can Coleman do sitting on the bench that he can't do pregame or sitting in the clubhouse? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Steal signs. Also, Corey Patterson and his 4 stolen bases on the season could be a good reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 QUOTE(Jabroni @ May 22, 2005 -> 08:00 AM) Steal signs. Also, Corey Patterson and his 4 stolen bases on the season could be a good reason. The Cubs had no problem stealing bases yesterday. They just couldn't get on first. Contreras was awesome. My whole point is I really don't think Coleman being on the bench is going to make any difference in the game, and if it does make a difference, its crazy that this guy is a minor league instructor. He's going to be in the clubhouse if he's not on the bench. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabroni Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 (edited) The Cubs had no problem stealing bases yesterday. They just couldn't get on first. Contreras was awesome. My whole point is I really don't think Coleman being on the bench is going to make any difference in the game, and if it does make a difference, its crazy that this guy is a minor league instructor. He's going to be in the clubhouse if he's not on the bench. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> It's not exactly hard to steal on Contreras' slow-ass delivery and Pierzynski's weak arm. Patterson had 18 SB in 2002, 16 SB in half a season in 2003, and 32 SB last season. He currently has only 4 SB and is on pace for only 16 SB this season. That is called regression. Obviously, Vince Coleman hasn't really done a great job with Patterson. Kenny must have felt that Coleman WOULD make a difference. Coleman could have tried to steal signs and then told Blanco when Pods or Willie were going to try to steal. It isn't that hard to believe. Edited May 22, 2005 by Jabroni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 QUOTE(JimH @ May 22, 2005 -> 01:50 PM) Tim Raines Exactlly, would also add that it would be Ozzie's call not KW's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Lopez Ghost (old) Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 This is KW's way to tell his team, "I've got your back." Even if it's only symbolic, I think the players appreciate KW being tough on the opposition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted May 22, 2005 Share Posted May 22, 2005 Whether Coleman could have had an effect or not, the point is that KW thought he possibly could have effected the outcome of the game. If in doubt, punt. And Kenny booted his ass right out of the dugout, as he should have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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