ANGELS MAKE US EAT SHIT

[Chisoxfn]

Its amazing how observant fans can identify things like this but certain hitting coaches, who have the luxury of film and scouting reports, and a good many of the players cannot.

Easier said than done. I pitched for a reason when I played. It was because I coudln't hit worth a lick. I understood what you should do with different pitches and could recognize them, but for the life of me I coudln't do anything aside from pull the ball (its why I was such an awful hitter).

 

Hitting a baseball is the hardest thing of any sport, imo. You have to adjust between a 94 MPH fastball or an 80 MPH offspeed pitch (changeup) plus a curve or slider. Good luck.

 

Walker has preached and does preach going opposite way. Now Crede and a few others may not be great hitters, but that isn't because Crede isn't doing the work (its because his swing just isn't a fit for the majors, imo) nor is it because Walker is telling him to pull the ball (no hitting coach would preach that).

[southsideirish71]

Easier said than done.  I pitched for a reason when I played.  It was because I coudln't hit worth a lick.  I understood what you should do with different pitches and could recognize them, but for the life of me I coudln't do anything aside from pull the ball (its why I was such an awful hitter). 

 

Hitting a baseball is the hardest thing of any sport, imo.  You have to adjust between a 94 MPH fastball or an 80 MPH offspeed pitch (changeup) plus a curve or slider.  Good luck. 

 

Walker has preached and does preach going opposite way.  Now Crede and a few others may not be great hitters, but that isn't because Crede isn't doing the work (its because his swing just isn't a fit for the majors, imo) nor is it because Walker is telling him to pull the ball (no hitting coach would preach that).

 

 

But if you have a pitcher who is concentrating in a zone. You have a better chance. This guy was hitting a zone and our hitters refused to make adjustments. This game is difficult, if it wasnt everyone would be a major leaguer. The frustrating thing for me is not the result, its the lack of adjustments. If you have a guy who is throwing strike one down the middle or middle away. And then its slider city, you may not want to take that pitch. Or you may want to concentrate on the outside pitch. Its all about adjustments.

 

I hear walker preach in the papers about hitting the ball the other way. But this team is pull city. That is all they do, you spot the ball on the outside corner and then its a 2 to 4 hitter for the opposing pitcher.

[southsider2k5]

Its amazing how observant fans can identify things like this but certain hitting coaches, who have the luxury of film and scouting reports, and a good many of the players cannot.

 

And you know what that saids to me? IT ISN'T THAT EASY!!!!

 

If it were THAT easy, WE would be doing it, and having some dopes on message boards tearing us apart for getting shutout FOR THE FIRST TIME THIS YEAR!!!

[Guest JimH]

13+ ERA going into tonights game. "Best" team in baseball should be able to do something offensively other than Iguchi and Konerko

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Just like the sun rising in the east and setting in the west, how predictable that you resurface after this game.

 

********

 

Whoever said Santana's fastball was straight ... call Pearle Vision. It was moving like crazy, he worked up and down as well as both sides of the plate.

 

********

 

Biggest problem for the Sox hitters was not trying to pull everything. It was not being aggressive early in the count.

 

Of course, if they were aggressive early in the count ... all the Baseball Wizards on this board would be on the hitters' asses for not taking a few pitches.

 

********

 

Crede's mechanics are screwed up again, and when I say mechanics I mean between the ears.

 

As for Uribe, he needs a day off, maybe 2. His approach at the plate is totally off, he's guessing wrong on everything.

[beck72]

If the sox were due for a "dead day", this was it. Yet Santana looked awfully good, getting ahead in the count by throwing a lot of strikes. The Sox should look better in the next few days

[Steff]

And you know what that saids to me?  IT ISN'T THAT EASY!!!! 

 

If it were THAT easy, WE would be doing it, and having some dopes on message boards tearing us apart for getting shutout FOR THE FIRST TIME THIS YEAR!!!

 

 

 

[Yossarian]

He is their version of mccarthy. People need to calm the f*** down. He is gonna be a very good pitcher in this league if he can stay healthy. I honestly do not think he is quite ready yet. He should still be in the minors for at least another half season i think but who knows.

 

Why is it o.k. for a white sox rookie to pitch well but for an opposing teams pitcher to do so it is unacceptable?

Because the White Sox under Jerry Manuel had a habit of tanking against mediocore pitchers and pitchers they had never faced before. This type of game brings back bad memories from the recent past.

[aboz56]

We got shut out by a turd, just face it and move on.

 

We got beat due to our approach, not Ervin.

 

Time to make some adjustments and go the opposite way and quit trying to hit everything into the left field seats.

 

Also Crede and Timo were horrible in the field as they shouldn't have even scored those two early runs.

[thomsonmi]

There's been so much talk about how Santana sucks because he was bombed in his first outing I thought I'd do some research for myself. Baseball America ranks Santana as the Angels #7 prospect and many others write pretty glowing scouting reports on him, like the one below. My point here is that everyone should step back from the ledge.

 

Top Prospect alert - Ervin Santana

 

By Schuyler Dombroske

DOB: 1/10/83, Age: 20, Height: 6’3’’, Weight: 160, Bats: R, Throws: R. Acquired: Angels – Signed out of the Dominican Republic in 2000. 2002 Stats: (Low-A – Cedar Rapids) 14-6, 4.18 ERA, 147 IP, 133 H, 10 HR, 48 BB, 146 K. 2003 Stats: (High-A – Rancho Cucamonga) 10-2, 2.53 ERA, 125 IP, 98 H, 9 HR, 36 BB, 130 K; (AA – Arkansas) 1-1, 3.94 ERA, 30 IP, 23 H, 4 HR, 12 BB, 23 K.

 

The artist formerly known as Johan Santana was one of the top sleeper prospects in baseball at the beginning of the year, but his rapid ascent this year, along with his Futures game selection, has likely ended his time "under the radar". Santana is an absolute stringbean of a pitcher, weighing in around 160 pounds despite his 6’3" frame. What he lacks in mass, however, he makes up for in arm speed. Santana has been clocked as high as 97 mph, and routinely throws 92-95. He also has a nasty slider that is getting better very quickly, and a changeup that, as with most young pitchers, is rather inconsistently effective. For a power pitcher (especially a young one), Santana’s control is good. He walked almost exactly three batters per nine innings last season at Cedar Rapids, and has cut that number by just over 0.1 this year. In each season he has struck out almost a batter an inning, so his K/BB ratio is over 3.0, which is an extremely positive figure for a pitcher his age. As clear as it is that Santana has electric stuff and well above average command of it, it is equally clear that he still is learning how to pitch. A pitcher with his stuff and command should never allow double figures in homers in a minor league season, but Santana has done that both last year and this year. If Single-A guys can take you 375 feet, you can bet your bippy that the big leaguers won’t find it all that difficult either. Other than that issue, Santana is as exciting a pitching prospect as there is in baseball right now. The name change combined with his participation in "Agegate" (he aged roughly ten months) has continued to suppress his prospect status, but he is clearly one of the top pitching prospects in the minors.

[YASNY]

After being up for the Cub series, and the long flight with the subsequent jetlag ... well, I know they are excuses, but something to be taken into consideration before going out on the ledge.

[aboz56]

There's been so much talk about how Santana sucks because he was bombed in his first outing I thought I'd do some research for myself.  Baseball America ranks Santana as the Angels #7 prospect and many others write pretty glowing scouting reports on him, like the one below.  My point here is that everyone should step back from the ledge.

 

Top Prospect alert - Ervin Santana

 

By Schuyler Dombroske

DOB: 1/10/83, Age: 20, Height: 6’3’’, Weight: 160, Bats: R, Throws: R. Acquired: Angels – Signed out of the Dominican Republic in 2000. 2002 Stats: (Low-A – Cedar Rapids) 14-6, 4.18 ERA, 147 IP, 133 H, 10 HR, 48 BB, 146 K. 2003 Stats: (High-A – Rancho Cucamonga) 10-2, 2.53 ERA, 125 IP, 98 H, 9 HR, 36 BB, 130 K; (AA – Arkansas) 1-1, 3.94 ERA, 30 IP, 23 H, 4 HR, 12 BB, 23 K.

 

The artist formerly known as Johan Santana was one of the top sleeper prospects in baseball at the beginning of the year, but his rapid ascent this year, along with his Futures game selection, has likely ended his time "under the radar". Santana is an absolute stringbean of a pitcher, weighing in around 160 pounds despite his 6’3" frame. What he lacks in mass, however, he makes up for in arm speed. Santana has been clocked as high as 97 mph, and routinely throws 92-95. He also has a nasty slider that is getting better very quickly, and a changeup that, as with most young pitchers, is rather inconsistently effective. For a power pitcher (especially a young one), Santana’s control is good. He walked almost exactly three batters per nine innings last season at Cedar Rapids, and has cut that number by just over 0.1 this year. In each season he has struck out almost a batter an inning, so his K/BB ratio is over 3.0, which is an extremely positive figure for a pitcher his age. As clear as it is that Santana has electric stuff and well above average command of it, it is equally clear that he still is learning how to pitch. A pitcher with his stuff and command should never allow double figures in homers in a minor league season, but Santana has done that both last year and this year. If Single-A guys can take you 375 feet, you can bet your bippy that the big leaguers won’t find it all that difficult either. Other than that issue, Santana is as exciting a pitching prospect as there is in baseball right now. The name change combined with his participation in "Agegate" (he aged roughly ten months) has continued to suppress his prospect status, but he is clearly one of the top pitching prospects in the minors.

 

 

If you look at the prospect handbook, it says he has two average to above average pitches in the fastball and slider and that his changeup has a chance to be average. Not a very glowing review. Also he is not ranked anywhere in the top 100 prospects by Baseball America.

 

Also, Cleveland, the WORST hitting team in the AL, nailed him.

[southsideirish71]

If you look at the prospect handbook, it says he has two average to above average pitches in the fastball and slider and that his changeup has a chance to be average.  Not a very glowing review.  Also he is not ranked anywhere in the top 100 prospects by Baseball America.

 

How many guys need to bat sub .250 before we realize that the Pull only method isnt work. Any pitcher who can spot a fastball on the outside corner and throw a breaking pitch near the plate will shut this team down. We need to change the approach at the plate and start to become better hitters. I would rather have a bunch of guys hitting 275 or better with less homers than a bunch of goofy trying to park one and hitting 214.

[aboz56]

How many guys need to bat sub .250 before we realize that the Pull only method isnt work. Any pitcher who can spot a fastball on the outside corner and throw a breaking pitch near the plate will shut this team down.  We need to change the approach at the plate and start to become better hitters.  I would rather have a bunch of guys hitting 275 or better with less homers than a bunch of goofy trying to park one and hitting 214.

Don't you f***ing get it, Ervin Santana is a STUD.

 

In all seriousness, there was no excuse for last night to get beat like that. Someone needs to find out when the last time was that the best team in baseball got beat in a complete game shutout by a pitcher making his second career start. Wait, I bet its never happened.

[Spiff]

If you look at the prospect handbook, it says he has two average to above average pitches in the fastball and slider and that his changeup has a chance to be average.  Not a very glowing review.  Also he is not ranked anywhere in the top 100 prospects by Baseball America.

 

Also, Cleveland, the WORST hitting team in the AL, nailed him.

 

 

Did you see his changeup last night?? Did you SEE it?

[YASNY]

Don't you f***ing get it, Ervin Santana is a STUD.

 

In all seriousness, there was no excuse for last night to get beat like that. Someone needs to find out when the last time was that the best team in baseball got beat in a complete game shutout by a pitcher making his second career start.  Wait, I bet its never happened.

 

I'm not going to research it, but I'd be inclined to believe that it has happened.

[southsideirish71]

Don't you f***ing get it, Ervin Santana is a STUD.

 

In all seriousness, there was no excuse for last night to get beat like that. Someone needs to find out when the last time was that the best team in baseball got beat in a complete game shutout by a pitching making his second career start.  Wait, I bet its never happened.

 

 

The best team in baseball needs to learn how to string a few hits together. Stop trying to park pitches and make contact.

 

Small ball where are thou

[southsideirish71]

Did you see his changeup last night?? Did you SEE it?

 

 

He didnt start to throw that until the 4th inning. For the first few innings he was just fastball and slider. Once he got some confidence that we were not changing the approach then it was changeup city.

[aboz56]

Did you see his changeup last night?? Did you SEE it?

I painfully watched the whole game.

[Spiff]

I painfully watched the whole game.

 

Well then don't talk to me about a changeup that "has a chance to be average". If you saw the game, you know it is a lot more than that.

[southsideirish71]

Well then don't talk to me about a changeup that "has a chance to be average".  If you saw the game, you know it is a lot more than that.

 

 

Lets get off that this guy is the second coming of Johan Santana the minny pitcher.

 

He spotted a fastball on the outside corner and threw a few breaking pitches that we fished for. Chris George, Jaret Wright lots of crappy pitchers shut us down on 4 or less hits doing the same thing last year.

 

Take Mike Sweeney/Jeter/Manny/etc and put him in that situation. He might get fooled the first time. The next time he is driving the ball to right. They make adjustments.

 

Our guys are stepping in the bucket trying to park the slider in the dirt in the othe batters box.

[aboz56]

Well then don't talk to me about a changeup that "has a chance to be average".  If you saw the game, you know it is a lot more than that.

Just because Joe Crede, Timo Perez and Carl Everett made it look good, doesn't mean s***.

 

The first two are fringe hitters and Everett sucks right now.

[DonkeyKongerko]

For every "Sweeney/Jeter/Manny/etc" there are a hundred Credes. It's time to accept that fact and move on.

[aboz56]

For every "Sweeney/Jeter/Manny/etc" there are a hundred Credes.  It's time to accept that fact and move on.

No there is only one Cruddy and he plays for us, unfortunately.

[Guest JimH]

Pierzynski didn't have a good game at the plate, nor did Podsednik. Both guys have been pretty hot lately, which tells me the Angels starting pitcher was pretty good last nite. If I'm not mistaken, Pierz and Pods combined to go 0-8.

[southsider2k5]

For every "Sweeney/Jeter/Manny/etc" there are a hundred Credes.  It's time to accept that fact and move on.

 

I was just thinking the samething. How many superstar hitters do you expect us to have?