Trade Revisited

[Guest JimH]

First off id like to say your crazy... Crede Viz and shingo for Chavez is just so dumb its not even funny.

 

2nd off I much rather us trade for a guy like Randa who wouldnt even require a good prospect I bet they would trade Randa for like Baj and Crede.... that way Baj gets a chance in the majors and we lose Crede.... Randa is also the perfect stop-gap for Fields... Randa can stay another 2-3 years until Fields is ready.

 

Id love Chavez dont get me wrong, but B-Mac is too important to this team, not because he is our top prospect but because he is our 6th starter..... BTW I think Texas is going to hit him pretty hard hopefully everyone wont jump off his bandwagon than.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Just as crazy is the White Sox giving up Joe Crede straight up for Joe Randa, let alone sending the Reds another player.

 

Crede has way way way more trade value than Randa. Why would the Reds want Crede long term anyway? He's under control for one more year, thru 2006, and I think then he's eligible for FA and his agent is Boras. They have Randa under control thru 2006 anyways. Reds may end up dumping Randa but it'd be for a lot less than Joe Crede. Not to mention Randa will be 36 later this year while Crede is 27.

[TLAK]

JUST SAY NO....

To trading BMAC

Agreed. You never ever ever ever ever trade stud young pitching unless

 

a. he's hurt

b. he's a jag

c. your'e the cubs

[GoodAsGould]

Just as crazy is the White Sox giving up Joe Crede straight up for Joe Randa, let alone sending the Reds another player.

 

Crede has way way way more trade value than Randa.  Why would the Reds want Crede long term anyway?  He's under control for one more year, thru 2006, and I think then he's eligible for FA and his agent is Boras.  They have Randa under control thru 2006 anyways.  Reds may end up dumping Randa but it'd be for a lot less than Joe Crede.  Not to mention Randa will be 36 later this year while Crede is 27.

 

 

Except the point of getting Randa is to be a stop gap for Fields... and at this point I dont think Crede has much value.... certainly not as much as some of you think it to be.

[Chisoxfn]

Just as crazy is the White Sox giving up Joe Crede straight up for Joe Randa, let alone sending the Reds another player.

 

Crede has way way way more trade value than Randa.  Why would the Reds want Crede long term anyway?  He's under control for one more year, thru 2006, and I think then he's eligible for FA and his agent is Boras.  They have Randa under control thru 2006 anyways.  Reds may end up dumping Randa but it'd be for a lot less than Joe Crede.  Not to mention Randa will be 36 later this year while Crede is 27.

Thank god, at least someone else agrees with me on that. There is no way I'd give up anything more than Crede and even if I did that I'd be hard pressed. I've long said Crede, plus a guy like Diaz/Munoz and a filler (maybe Spidale) could get the Sox a quality 3rd baseman (whose more than a stopgap).

 

I wouldn't not give up a few talented guys because Fields is down in AA. Its not like he's on the fast past to Chicago right now.

[Guest JimH]

Except the point of getting Randa is to be a stop gap for Fields... and at this point I dont think Crede has much value.... certainly not as much as some of you think it to be.

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So what do you do with Crede? You're suggesting trading Crede to Cincinnati for Randa, not following your logic ... ?

[Chisoxfn]

So what do you do with Crede?  You're suggesting trading Crede to Cincinnati for Randa, not following your logic ... ?

I could see the Reds being interested...but the Sox would have to get something more in return and I just don't know what else the Reds have to offer (that they would be willing to part with).

 

They wouldn't deal Ryan Wagner (even if the Sox through in a guy like Munoz so the deal doesn't make sense, imo). Crede >>>> Randa (trade value wise).

[doUrememberwhen]

Agreed.  You never ever ever ever ever trade stud young pitching unless

 

a.  he's hurt

b.  he's a jag

c.  your'e the cubs

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

EXACTAMUNDO----

If Kdubs is actually considering this trade, I'd have to ask him what our teams goals our again. PITCHING & Dfense. So let's just trade away our best pitching prospect and one of if not our slickest fielder. Please KW lay off of the BMAC trade, b4 we find ourselves trading away for yet another pitcher.................

[Guest JimH]

I could see the Reds being interested...but the Sox would have to get something more in return and I just don't know what else the Reds have to offer (that they would be willing to part with). 

 

They wouldn't deal Ryan Wagner (even if the Sox through in a guy like Munoz so the deal doesn't make sense, imo).  Crede >>>> Randa (trade value wise).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Their bullpen is a mess and as you indicate they're high on Wagner, he was their 1st pick, he's 22, and they ultimately want him to be their closer.

 

None of this makes sense. The only way the White Sox will go after Randa is if Crede goes down to injury.

[GoodAsGould]

So what do you do with Crede?  You're suggesting trading Crede to Cincinnati for Randa, not following your logic ... ?

 

 

Well KW is in the win now mode isnt he? So whose going to help us win more... Randa or Crede? Obviously Randa even at 37 is the better ball player right now and will get us 1 step closer to being a better team.

 

Like I said Crede has done nothing but suck since being in the majors... he had that short stretch this year but most part he hits at the .200 level.... You guys are way over-valueing Crede at this point...

 

but if what you say is true and crede is more valuable... than fine have them throw someone else in too, the point is to get Randa.

[Milkman delivers]

Randa

.285 AVG 4 HR 23 RBI .370 OBP .437 SLG .807 OPS

 

Crede

.238 AVG 4 HR 16 RBI .300 OBP .378 SLG .678 OPS

 

Randa makes 2.1 million this year, Crede makes 400 thousand. If Randa's D is around that of Crede, I think he'd be better for this team. Especially since he can be signed for another year as a stopgap until Fields is ready.

[nitetrain8601]

I would trade anyone and I mean anyone minus BMac. I would trade either Sweeney/Anderson and Lumsden/Tracey/any other pitching prospect that isn't named Brandon McCarthy and Crede for Chavez. And this is coming from a guy who started the online Crede's Crew.

[3E8]

For some reason, Chavez hits worse at US Cellular than any other park.

[nitetrain8601]

Wait, is there any substantial evidence that this is a true rumor and not some rumor started by some guy on the mlb.com boards that Mac, Jurko, and Harry just started to pick up.

[Milkman delivers]

For some reason, Chavez hits worse at US Cellular than any other park.

 

Except when he's hitting 700 foot bombs.

 

I know that means nothing, I'm just referencing that gigantic homer.

[Cerbaho-WG]

Just as crazy is the White Sox giving up Joe Crede straight up for Joe Randa, let alone sending the Reds another player.

 

Crede has way way way more trade value than Randa.  Why would the Reds want Crede long term anyway?  He's under control for one more year, thru 2006, and I think then he's eligible for FA and his agent is Boras.  They have Randa under control thru 2006 anyways.  Reds may end up dumping Randa but it'd be for a lot less than Joe Crede.  Not to mention Randa will be 36 later this year while Crede is 27.

 

Wow, when did Crede start putting up anything near .260-25-75 to garner any of the money Randa gets? The only way you're going to move Crede is by packaging him with someone else to get something in return. Crede won't get you a prospect, he won't get you a solid utility player, he won't get you anything remotely good. The best you're going to get for a streaky, stubborn hitter who has trouble getting over a .300 OBP is a PTBNL and that's it.

 

I don't really crae much about Crede's age in comparison to Randa's. Crede has had no production whatsoever while Randa has produced when it was assumed he would fall off with age. If there is any way Crede doesn't play 3rd base, you have to consider that a positive thing.

Edited May 25, 2005 by Cerbaho-WG

[doUrememberwhen]

Except when he's hitting 700 foot bombs.

 

I know that means nothing, I'm just referencing that gigantic homer.

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700 ft huh....hmhm

[Guest JimH]

Well KW is in the win now mode isnt he?  So whose going to help us win more... Randa or Crede?  Obviously Randa even at 37 is the better ball player right now and will get us 1 step closer to being a better team.

 

Like I said Crede has done nothing but suck since being in the majors... he had that short stretch this year but most part he hits at the .200 level.... You guys are way over-valueing Crede at this point...

 

but if what you say is true and crede is more valuable... than fine have them throw someone else in too, the point is to get Randa.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Randa is a good player but it won't happen.

 

The Reds might have some excess OF but that's not a White Sox need, and the Reds certainly don't have any pitching to spare, nor are they deep in prospects.

 

If you're basing all this on Crede sucking ... well, I agree he has sucked especially lately but they won't trade him to bank on Joe Randa. Randa has had a bad foot and he's battled back problems in recent years. The White Sox value Crede's defense and unless it's a long term or significant upgrade, they won't give up 8 years in a trade and pick up salary to boot.

[Milkman delivers]

700 ft huh....hmhm

 

Yeah, I didn't think something that was so blatantly sarcastic would need to be green.

[Guest JimH]

Wow, when did Crede start putting up anything near .260-25-75 to garner any of the money Randa gets? The only way you're going to move Crede is by packaging him with someone else to get something in return. Crede won't get you a prospect, he won't get you a solid utility player, he won't get you anything remotely good. The best you're going to get for a streaky, stubborn hitter who has trouble getting over a .300 OBP is a PTBNL and that's it.

 

I don't really crae much about Crede's age in comparison to Randa's. Crede has had no production whatsoever while Randa has produced when it was assumed he would fall off with age. If there is any way Crede doesn't play 3rd base, you have to consider that a positive thing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You're being blinded by your dislike of the player.

 

To be blunt, you don't know what you're talking about here. Crede won't get you a solid utility player? That's all I needed to read.

 

Cincy would make that deal all day long, and the White Sox wouldn't make that deal all day long.

[doUrememberwhen]

Yeah, I didn't think something that was so blatantly sarcastic would need to be green.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well Joe B. hits some monster shots in the cell too.... LETS CALL HIM UP!!!!

[WHarris1]

Well Joe B. hits some monster shots in the cell too.... LETS CALL HIM UP!!!!

Can you read?

I know that means nothing, I'm just referencing that gigantic homer.

[Milkman delivers]

Can you read?

 

Thank you for sparing me the effort.

[Harry Chappas]

I get the feeling that if it is BMac and Crede it is Chavez and a ML ready or already in ML pitching prospect. My thought is that McCarthy is up here to get an idea of what he is made of. Is he Felix Diaz or a ML starter? This is not only for the Sox to see if they need someone later or for another team to see for trade value. Due to the contract status of Chavez, I think he is at his lowest trade value right now. Is there the question for every player whose performance has slipped (steroids)? with him. Is BB ready to rid himself of the contract and will take Crede and Tracy? Are Chavez and Haren (not Harden) enough for Crede and McCarthy? I do not think Haren is lighting it up, he is more of an example, maybe Cruz???? Who is the dude with the funky curve, the guy that hit Crede but didn't really hit him. I think if McCarthy is dealt it will be for a proven young middle/end of the rotation guy.

 

Here is something think simply from the money side, Harden/Chavez---McCarthy/Crede/Anderson. Is this a total cub trade? Think of the money again.

[GoodAsGould]

Im not a Crede hater.... I try to be positive with the guy if for nothing else I like seeing guys succeed that come up through our minors... but to the point he just isnt getting it done at 3B and I think Randa would offer a huge offensive boost and like I said would be a stop gab for Fields... so it would give Fields this year and next year to be ready for the bigs.

 

A course if there is something else that could be done that you have in mind... what exactly would you do with Crede... I think its time for us to give up on him ever being even an average hitter in the big leagues.

[Cerbaho-WG]

You're being blinded by your dislike of the player.

 

To be blunt, you don't know what you're talking about here.  Crede won't get you a solid utility player?  That's all I needed to read.

 

Cincy would make that deal all day long, and the White Sox wouldn't make that deal all day long.

 

Do you honestly, and I want you to think some here, that a 27 year old represented by a mega-agent who puts up .250/.300/.400 is going to attract any market value? You are seriously overvaluing a player who has overrated defensively capabilities, won't walk unless a gun is pointed at him, and an inability to hit for a good average. I would love for you to name me one team that would say, "Damn, here's an arbitration elgible player that is the equivalent of a black hole on offense! Let's get him!"

 

Please.