Hillary could win presidency in '08

[CubsSuck1]

[Middle Buffalo]

I have a TON of respect for McCain, but I can't stand that he went around stumping for GW before the last election. GW showed McCain no respect in 2000, but because McCain wants to run in '08 he swallowed his pride and went with the party. I'm tired of the politics in politics.

[Chisoxfn]

I have a TON of respect for McCain, but I can't stand that he went around stumping for GW before the last election.  GW showed McCain no respect in 2000, but because McCain wants to run in '08 he swallowed his pride and went with the party.  I'm tired of the politics in politics.

And Hillary essentially hand picking her seat in New York isn't politics??

[YASNY]

I have a TON of respect for McCain, but I can't stand that he went around stumping for GW before the last election.  GW showed McCain no respect in 2000, but because McCain wants to run in '08 he swallowed his pride and went with the party.  I'm tired of the politics in politics.

 

Which shows that McCain was man enough to put personal differences aside and do what he believed was best for the country. It's all in how you spin it.

[Texsox]

And Hillary essentially hand picking her seat in New York isn't politics??

Hillary and her husband were being evicted from their home. They had to move somewhere.

 

As for being polled, or not, does everyone of those 100 talk to telephone solicitors? The pollsters will not come out and say "this is Betty from the McCain campaign and we want to ask you a couple questions for a poll regarding whose will win the Presidency in 2008".

 

Instead my most recent one went along the lines of

 

"this is not a solicitation call, we just want to ask you a couple questions regarding Abortion." (Most people don't allow the conversation to move beyond that). The questions were how important is abortion rights in my choice of candidates, would I be willing to support a pro-choice candidate, etc. I am fairly certain a candidate was exploring a state wide bid. My intuition tells me it was Texas Comptroller Carole Keeton Strayhorn for Governor but of course the pollsters are not allowed to reveal who is paying for the poll.

[southsider2k5]

Which shows that McCain was man enough to put personal differences aside and do what he believed was best for the country.  It's all in how you spin it.

 

Or he just campaigned for the guy that was way closer to his personal belief system.

 

Its just like Howard Dean, Joe Lieberman, and the others campaigning for Kerry.

[Texsox]

Or he just campaigned for the guy that was way closer to his personal belief system.

 

Its just like Howard Dean, Joe Lieberman, and the others campaigning for Kerry.

 

Or he was rehearsing for '08

[TheBigHurt35]

However, I still believe that the best chance for a female would be on a GOP ticket. The GOPerheads would vote for her because she isn't a Dem and the Dem's would vote for a female just to prove their liberalism.

 

I wouldn't necessarily think that. The Labour Party members in England didn't exactly support Margaret Thatcher to prove their liberalism.

 

Agreed that our first female president will be a Republican. Kay Bailey Hutchinson could probably win.

 

McCain and Guiliani are probably the most electable GOPerheads, although the former has fallen out of favor with some members of his party. As long as Howard Dean continues to run his mouth while running the Jackass party, either will likely beat Hillary.

[KevHead0881]

A republican woman? Kill me now if thats gonna happen.

[LowerCaseRepublican]

Which shows that McCain was man enough to put personal differences aside and do what he believed was best for the country.  It's all in how you spin it.

 

Conversely it shows that he, and I'm just playing Devil's advocate here, has a spine of Jell-O. They push polled in states insinuating that McCain had an illegitimate black child. For more info...

 

From the web: http://www.stcynic.com/blog/archives/2004/...in_and_bush.php

After McCain's surprising defeat of Bush in the New Hampshire primary in 2000, the Bush campaign targeted South Carolina, the next big primary, and began calling voters, particularly elderly voters, to ostensibly take a poll. But rather than asking how they felt about an issue, they asked this question: "Would you be more or less likely to vote for John McCain if you knew that he had fathered a bi-racial child?". Now, they didn't actually say that he DID father a bi-racial child. But at campaign stops, you could see McCain and his wife Cindy with their dark-skinned daughter, Bridget. They adopted Bridget from an orphanage in Bangladesh. This is how you play dirty politics, folks. You plant seeds that push buttons, all with plausible deniability. But it's vile as hell.

 

It didn't stop there. They also put out "anonymous" pamphlets all over South Carolina telling people that McCain's wife had a history of drug addiction (she apparently was addicted to prescription pain killers at one point). Again, plausible deniability while spreading vicious rumors to kill one's political opponents. For a full report on the smear campaign, go here.

 

Even worse is Bush's association with Ted Sampley, the absolutely loathsome former green beret and POW/MIA pimp who has claimed that John McCain is a traitor and even a communist spy that the Soviets had turned into a "Manchurian candidate". He's the same guy behind the attacks on John Kerry now, by the way.

 

After what the Bush campaign did to McCain in 2000, you'd think that McCain would be pretty pissed off, wouldn't you? He said in 2000 that there was obviously no limit to how low Bush would go to win election after what they did to him, at one point even yelling at Bush when Bush grabbed his hand and telling him to "get your hands off me". But this is politics and McCain is now lending his image and endorsement to Bush in 2004. Why? Because it's his party and if he doesn't go along, he doesn't get party money and support when running for reelection to the senate.

 

Again it is the political party "You will follow the party line, eh comrade?" dictating all the rules -- because if McCain calls shenanigans and actually voices his opinion of being pissed off about those slimeball tactics, he gets on the outs with the party & then will have a very difficult time in getting a Presidential nod. The whole monolithic concept of political parties seems to keep any deviation from the party line to compromise in check. There is no way for candidates to get approval for working together and actually getting things done that don't f*** over the American people because whatever they do -- they're bound to piss off the "Party faithful" which can be a problem come election time.

[Nokona]

The only reason i'd vote for Hilary is because of Bill.

[Jabroni]

The only reason i'd vote for Hilary is because of Bill.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's pitiful.

[Reddy]

3 words:

 

I Hate Hilary

 

and i'm even a dem...

 

 

EDWARDS '08!

[Punch and Judy Garland]

I will never vote for a Republican but at least Rudy is on board with protecting abortion rights and gun control so he's the one I could most live with from that side. The Republicans aren't going to want him to run though.

[Be Good]

That's pitiful.

No its not. More then half of the Hililary voters are going to vote for her because of Bill. For me that's one of the reasons.

[Nokona]

Personally, over the last two years I've seen Giulani go absolutely nuts. He still seems to clutch to 9/11 whenever i hear him speak.

 

Kinda like our current Prez.

[KipWellsFan]

No its not.  More then half of the Hililary voters are going to vote for her because of Bill.  For me that's one of the reasons.

 

True, having one of the most well respected men on the face of the earth at your side isn't usually a bad thing.

[whitesoxmurph]

Polls are becoming less and less accurate. Two recent example were the exit polls in Wisconsin, Ohio and Penn. in the last Presidential election (all having Kerry a big double digit winner in each State) and the polls of the California recall election. The recall election for those of you who don't know or remember was in 2 parts... 1- should Governor Davis be recalled and... 2- If he is recalled who should take his place Arnold , Lt. Gov. Cruz Bustamante, Gary Coleman, etc... The LA Times poll 3 days before the recall, had the recall going down to defeat by over 20 points and in the case Davis was recalled, it had Bustamante ahead of Arnold by over 15 points. The results were just the opposite, the recall and Arnold both won convincingly. This Hillary poll has a couple of numbers that seem to jump out as being wrong... #1 9% of the people surveyed think she is a Conservative? Did they just call trailer parks or only people with a low IQ? She has been trying to move closer to the center for her run in 2008 but she is about as Conservative Ted Kennedy. #2 33% of Conservatives are likely to support her? Maybe 10% of the right are so unhappy w/Bush that they would support her, but I find it highly unlikely that any real conservatives.

[Chisoxfn]

Polls are becoming less and less accurate. Two recent example were the exit polls in Wisconsin, Ohio and Penn. in the last Presidential election (all having Kerry a big double digit winner in each State) and the polls of the California recall election. The recall election for those of you who don't know or remember was in 2 parts...  1- should Governor Davis be recalled and... 2- If he is recalled who should take his place Arnold , Lt. Gov. Cruz Bustamante, Gary Coleman, etc... The LA Times poll 3 days before the recall, had the recall going down to defeat by over 20 points and in the case Davis was recalled, it had Bustamante ahead of Arnold by over 15 points. The results were just the opposite, the recall and Arnold both won convincingly. This Hillary poll has a couple of numbers that seem to jump out as being wrong... #1  9% of the people surveyed think she is a Conservative? Did they just call trailer parks or only people with a low IQ? She has been trying to move closer to the center for her run in 2008 but she is about as Conservative Ted Kennedy.  #2  33% of Conservatives are likely to support her? Maybe 10% of the right are so unhappy w/Bush that they would support her, but I find it highly unlikely that any real conservatives.

It was later told that the LA Times had some fraudelent polls and they corrected them just before the recall. Now they acted as if it were a mistake, but as a republican I can tell you its bulls*** (imo). They did there very best to hold out and try and rally an anti recall so the worse freaking governor in the history of this state (Gray Davis) could somehow stick around.

 

Lucky for him Arnold has a very strong backing. Hell, Arnold isn't great but he's a hell of a lot better than Gray Davis.

[DBAHO]

It was later told that the LA Times had some fraudelent polls and they corrected them just before the recall.  Now they acted as if it were a mistake, but as a republican I can tell you its bulls*** (imo).  They did there very best to hold out and try and rally an anti recall so the worse freaking governor in the history of this state (Gray Davis) could somehow stick around.

 

Lucky for him Arnold has a very strong backing.  Hell, Arnold isn't great but he's a hell of a lot better than Gray Davis.

Still should have voted in the Porn Star I reckon.

[KipWellsFan]

Conversely it shows that he, and I'm just playing Devil's advocate here, has a spine of Jell-O.  They push polled in states insinuating that McCain had an illegitimate black child.  For more info...

 

From the web:  http://www.stcynic.com/blog/archives/2004/...in_and_bush.php

After McCain's surprising defeat of Bush in the New Hampshire primary in 2000, the Bush campaign targeted South Carolina, the next big primary, and began calling voters, particularly elderly voters, to ostensibly take a poll. But rather than asking how they felt about an issue, they asked this question: "Would you be more or less likely to vote for John McCain if you knew that he had fathered a bi-racial child?". Now, they didn't actually say that he DID father a bi-racial child. But at campaign stops, you could see McCain and his wife Cindy with their dark-skinned daughter, Bridget. They adopted Bridget from an orphanage in Bangladesh. This is how you play dirty politics, folks. You plant seeds that push buttons, all with plausible deniability. But it's vile as hell.

 

It didn't stop there. They also put out "anonymous" pamphlets all over South Carolina telling people that McCain's wife had a history of drug addiction (she apparently was addicted to prescription pain killers at one point). Again, plausible deniability while spreading vicious rumors to kill one's political opponents. For a full report on the smear campaign, go here.

 

Even worse is Bush's association with Ted Sampley, the absolutely loathsome former green beret and POW/MIA pimp who has claimed that John McCain is a traitor and even a communist spy that the Soviets had turned into a "Manchurian candidate". He's the same guy behind the attacks on John Kerry now, by the way.

 

After what the Bush campaign did to McCain in 2000, you'd think that McCain would be pretty pissed off, wouldn't you? He said in 2000 that there was obviously no limit to how low Bush would go to win election after what they did to him, at one point even yelling at Bush when Bush grabbed his hand and telling him to "get your hands off me". But this is politics and McCain is now lending his image and endorsement to Bush in 2004. Why? Because it's his party and if he doesn't go along, he doesn't get party money and support when running for reelection to the senate.

 

Again it is the political party "You will follow the party line, eh comrade?" dictating all the rules -- because if McCain calls shenanigans and actually voices his opinion of being pissed off about those slimeball tactics, he gets on the outs with the party & then will have a very difficult time in getting a Presidential nod.  The whole monolithic concept of political parties seems to keep any deviation from the party line to compromise in check.  There is no way for candidates to get approval for working together and actually getting things done that don't f*** over the American people because whatever they do -- they're bound to piss off the "Party faithful" which can be a problem come election time.

 

 

Great role models :headshake

[JUGGERNAUT]

In 2006 & 2008 the central issue will be healthcare. The costs have spiraled out of control & the industry & beuracrats (AMA, etc.) are not offering solutions. The people are fed up.

 

Hillary faced stiff opposition when she first attempted to expand government's power & influence over our healthcare system. A decade later the tune is radically different. The polls show the people now believe more government involvement is needed to lower costs.

 

The problem both parties face though is how far are they willing to anger the current healthcare leaders to appease their constituents. The wealth & power of those in the healthcare industry has grown dramatically since Hillary's first proposal during Bill's terms. In particular the Democrats are not so willing to sell out business leaders for votes as they have in the past.

 

The party that win's this issue will win the presidency & the senate.

[Middle Buffalo]

Conversely it shows that he, and I'm just playing Devil's advocate here, has a spine of Jell-O.  They push polled in states insinuating that McCain had an illegitimate black child.  For more info...

 

From the web:  http://www.stcynic.com/blog/archives/2004/...in_and_bush.php

After McCain's surprising defeat of Bush in the New Hampshire primary in 2000, the Bush campaign targeted South Carolina, the next big primary, and began calling voters, particularly elderly voters, to ostensibly take a poll. But rather than asking how they felt about an issue, they asked this question: "Would you be more or less likely to vote for John McCain if you knew that he had fathered a bi-racial child?". Now, they didn't actually say that he DID father a bi-racial child. But at campaign stops, you could see McCain and his wife Cindy with their dark-skinned daughter, Bridget. They adopted Bridget from an orphanage in Bangladesh. This is how you play dirty politics, folks. You plant seeds that push buttons, all with plausible deniability. But it's vile as hell.

 

It didn't stop there. They also put out "anonymous" pamphlets all over South Carolina telling people that McCain's wife had a history of drug addiction (she apparently was addicted to prescription pain killers at one point). Again, plausible deniability while spreading vicious rumors to kill one's political opponents. For a full report on the smear campaign, go here.

 

Even worse is Bush's association with Ted Sampley, the absolutely loathsome former green beret and POW/MIA pimp who has claimed that John McCain is a traitor and even a communist spy that the Soviets had turned into a "Manchurian candidate". He's the same guy behind the attacks on John Kerry now, by the way.

 

After what the Bush campaign did to McCain in 2000, you'd think that McCain would be pretty pissed off, wouldn't you? He said in 2000 that there was obviously no limit to how low Bush would go to win election after what they did to him, at one point even yelling at Bush when Bush grabbed his hand and telling him to "get your hands off me". But this is politics and McCain is now lending his image and endorsement to Bush in 2004. Why? Because it's his party and if he doesn't go along, he doesn't get party money and support when running for reelection to the senate.

 

Again it is the political party "You will follow the party line, eh comrade?" dictating all the rules -- because if McCain calls shenanigans and actually voices his opinion of being pissed off about those slimeball tactics, he gets on the outs with the party & then will have a very difficult time in getting a Presidential nod.  The whole monolithic concept of political parties seems to keep any deviation from the party line to compromise in check.  There is no way for candidates to get approval for working together and actually getting things done that don't f*** over the American people because whatever they do -- they're bound to piss off the "Party faithful" which can be a problem come election time.

Great stuff - and exactly what I was talking about.

 

My problem with McCain leading up to the '04 election is that he swallowed his pride (which I'm sure is immense) because he was keeping an eye on the '08 election. He really should have kept a low profile. Of course, GWB needed a true American hero to trot out to counter Kerry. For what it's worth, I think Kerry way overplayed the war hero thing.

 

Remember, also, that there was talk of McCain running with Kerry as his VP candidate. Wishful thinking? Probably.

[KipWellsFan]

"John Kerry... reporting for duty"

 

lol

[HighHeat45]

Im not even gunna think about the 2008 election untill Janurary 2008 at the earliest.