southsideirish71 Posted May 31, 2005 Author Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:23 PM) Stupid ass argument made by a stupid ass poster. Not suprised it came from you. Glad you helped your part of the debate with this spectacular gem of insight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(qwerty @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:20 PM) Uribe had the very best zone rating along with izturis last year. How can you deny the fact that he has great range? Nothing you have said makes me believe that ozuna will get to more balls than uribe does. Why because he is faster? Their are alot faster short stops than uribe but that doesn't make them any better of a fielder. Uribe gets good reads on the ball and has excellent jumps more so than almost any infielder in baseball. But stats mean nothing or very little. Speed is overrated in the field, look at A-row in CF. Alot of people will complain about his range, and his speed, but the guy gets ridiculous reads on the ball when it comes off the bat, not to mention he takes some of the best routes to fly balls that I have ever seen. Some players just seem to be in the right place at the right time all the time. One player who stands out in my mind other than A-row is Vizquel, the guy doesnt have the strongest arm, and isnt crazy fast,(but he is quick) but the guy is flat out one of the best SS's i have ever seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChWRoCk2 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 (edited) the reds need pitching so obviously they are going to want crede but maybe we could throw in adkins or cotts id rather have ryan freel= Edited May 31, 2005 by chi-guy2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(JimH @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:25 PM) Nite, I like them both but I would say Uribe is the better SS. Way better arm and for some reason with that awkward style of his he's great w/the glove and will only get better. I see what you're saying about him being suited for 2B but from my view it's because Uribe is such a good athlete he did a fine job at 2B and 3B also. So much so they wanted to keep him as the super sub and bring in Vizquel. Uribe was clearly brought in to be the SS of the future, and I think there's a reason why Pablo has basically been a career reserve. No one thought enough of him to offer him a 40 man spot, even after a very good AAA year last year. He had to have a world beater spring to make the White Sox. I'm very happy to have Ozuna and like him a lot, but I think Uribe is definitely more talented as a SS, on several levels. Except maybe drawing walks and laying down bunts LOL. Wasnt Ozuna hurt? and missed a year, and thats why he was stuck in the minors? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:25 PM) Glad you helped your part of the debate with this spectacular gem of insight. Just finished saying I never said Uribe was butcher in the field. Find me where I said that smartasses. Also said that Ozuna is just a better fielder(didn't say how much better) and that Uribe is better suited at 2B and 3B. I guess people can't accept that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabroni Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 (edited) Just finished saying I never said Uribe was butcher in the field. Find me where I said that smartasses. Also said that Ozuna is just a better fielder(didn't say how much better) and that Uribe is better suited at 2B and 3B. I guess people can't accept that. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You never said Uribe is a butcher at SS but you are trying to say that Ozuna is a better defensive SS than Uribe. That is just plain wrong. Keep in mind that I love Ozuna. Edited May 31, 2005 by Jabroni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(chi-guy2 @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:27 PM) the reds need pitching so obviously they are going to want crede but maybe we could throw in adkins or cotts id rather have ryan freel= Im a big reds fan, so part of me doesnt want them to get ripped off in THAT deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChWRoCk2 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(Jabroni @ May 31, 2005 -> 04:29 PM) You never said Uribe is a butcher at SS but you are trying to say that Ozuna is a better defensive SS than Uribe. That is just plain wrong. uribe has a better arm, ozuna is just hitting better of late and i guess thats leading him to think ozuna is an all around type of guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChWRoCk2 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 04:30 PM) Im a big reds fan, so part of me doesnt want them to get ripped off in THAT deal. i like the reds also, but its like swapping players you like for another you like, but the reds need some sort of pitching Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(Jabroni @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:29 PM) You never said Uribe is a butcher at SS but you are trying to say that Ozuna is a better defensive SS than Uribe. That is just plain wrong. Oh yeah, because you have seen the type of prospect he was and have seen every one of his games. Not. And again, I didn't say, Ozuna>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Uribe times a trillon. I said I think he's a better fielder. I didn't say he is most definately the best fielder in the game or is vastly better than Uribe at SS. Did I? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 09:26 PM) Speed is overrated in the field, look at A-row in CF. Alot of people will complain about his range, and his speed, but the guy gets ridiculous reads on the ball when it comes off the bat, not to mention he takes some of the best routes to fly balls that I have ever seen. I've been a little disappointed in Rowand's outfield play this year. He's dropped some VERY catchable fly balls, and his arm so far has been nothing short of awful. As a whole, our outfield has been extremely disappointing on defense this season. It's nowhere near the strength that people thought it would be coming into the season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabroni Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 (edited) Oh yeah, because you have seen the type of prospect he was and have seen every one of his games. Not. And again, I didn't say, Ozuna>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Uribe times a trillon. I said I think he's a better fielder. I didn't say he is most definately the best fielder in the game or is vastly better than Uribe at SS. Did I? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Ahhh, backtracking. You said that Ozuna was a better defensive SS than Uribe. You are wrong. Edited May 31, 2005 by Jabroni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(chi-guy2 @ May 31, 2005 -> 09:30 PM) uribe has a better arm, ozuna is just hitting better of late and i guess thats leading him to think ozuna is an all around type of guy Ozuna's hitting better lately? The next time he hits a ball out of the infield, it will be a first. He's leading the world in fewest feet per hit. Ozuna was a nice story in ST and all, but he definitely hasn't carried over his hitting ability into the regular season. I like Ozuna because of his hustle and attitude, but if we have to count on him to play more than twice a week.....we're screwed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(Jabroni @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:32 PM) Ahhh, backtracking... Did I? It's not backtracking if I didn't say it, is it? Just answer those two questions, I don't want to hear anything else, just answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(RockRaines @ May 31, 2005 -> 04:26 PM) Speed is overrated in the field, look at A-row in CF. Alot of people will complain about his range, and his speed, but the guy gets ridiculous reads on the ball when it comes off the bat, not to mention he takes some of the best routes to fly balls that I have ever seen. Some players just seem to be in the right place at the right time all the time. One player who stands out in my mind other than A-row is Vizquel, the guy doesnt have the strongest arm, and isnt crazy fast,(but he is quick) but the guy is flat out one of the best SS's i have ever seen. I am not gonna complain about a guy that in consistantly in the top of baseball in zone rating ( rowand) first last year for center fielders. Second this year only to reed who is not that far ahead of him. What i do have a problem with is his handling of grounders which is very poor but i have stated it many times in the past. Also he doesn't seem to have as accurate of an arm this year than last year... but all in all i have no qualms with his defense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(fathom @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:33 PM) Ozuna's hitting better lately? The next time he hits a ball out of the infield, it will be a first. He's leading the world in fewest feet per hit. Ozuna was a nice story in ST and all, but he definitely hasn't carried over his hitting ability into the regular season. I like Ozuna because of his hustle and attitude, but if we have to count on him to play more than twice a week.....we're screwed. I'm not talking about the offense because I know Uribe is a better offensive player than Ozuna. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabroni Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 Did I? It's not backtracking if I didn't say it, is it? Just answer those two questions, I don't want to hear anything else, just answer. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> What in the hell does it matter how much better Ozuna is defensively at SS than Uribe? All that matters is that you said Ozuna is a better defensive SS than Uribe. And you are wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 Juan is a top 3 defensive SS in baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish71 Posted May 31, 2005 Author Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:33 PM) I'm not talking about the offense because I know Uribe is a better offensive player than Ozuna. Are you sure, you may want to consult the same tea leaves that tell you that Ozuna is a better defensive SS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(Jabroni @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:35 PM) What in the hell does it matter how much better Ozuna is defensively at SS than Uribe? All that matters is that you said Ozuna is a better defensive SS than Uribe. And you are wrong. Still waiting for my answers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 Willing to bet the reds message boards didn't have a twenty page thread about randa when they signed him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(fathom @ May 31, 2005 -> 03:31 PM) I've been a little disappointed in Rowand's outfield play this year. He's dropped some VERY catchable fly balls, and his arm so far has been nothing short of awful. As a whole, our outfield has been extremely disappointing on defense this season. It's nowhere near the strength that people thought it would be coming into the season Seriously??? I think he has made it to several gap shots and short pop ups that would'vve been dropped in previous years. I think the defense has been good, with the exception of Dye's errors, I think we have caught many balls that we wouldnt have before. I think that the speed has gotten us several more outs, and the good jumps that we have been getting have spoiled us into thinking balls have to be caught. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(WHarris1 @ May 31, 2005 -> 04:35 PM) Juan is a top 3 defensive SS in baseball. John Rockers mullet has spoken.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabroni Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 Juan is a top 3 defensive SS in baseball. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> But Ozuna is a top 2 defensive SS in baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted May 31, 2005 Share Posted May 31, 2005 QUOTE(kyyle23 @ May 31, 2005 -> 04:36 PM) John Rockers mullet has spoken.... Damn straight. Do you agree or no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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