Time to revisit the attendance concerns

[sox-r-us]

It helps because it's more logical than just saying our attendance sucks.

 

It helps because sound arguments are presented as opposed to complaining about attendance.  There is less tension on the board.

 

Complaining about attendance when you live far away almost sounds like a personal attack on Sox fans who live here.  It sometimes (not always) comes off as saying "Why aren't you doing your part?"  Most of us on here do do our part.

We had the same discussion on a DePaul message board.  We came up with ideas and sent it to the school.  There was far less bickering.

 

Sleepy

 

While it may help keep people feel less insecure about themselves, it does not really help solve the problem you are b****ing about. DO you agree? There is no way Ozzie is dropping Timo based off our venting? (It may still happen but not because of our posts). Neither is Cruddy going to improve based of our analysis of why he sucks.

 

It may help with self-rationalization and hence is more therapeutic in nature, I disagree that it really helps solve the problem we are b****ing about to begin with.

 

NOne the less, thanks for your opinions. You have some sound points.

[SleepyWhiteSox]

Yeah, no one came out and just said the attendance sucks. sox-r-us was trying to have a discussion about why it sucks and what will improve it because so far, everybody who said, "wait til june" was wrong.

 

And I've yet to hear a good way of improving it from ANYBODY.

 

Personally, I don't even have any clue why attendance is the problem that it is to begin with. I have no idea why fans aren't coming.

[nitetrain8601]

Well then I'd have to disagree with you. Supporting the team is one thing, buy it doesn't mean you have to go to the park. I don't think a fan that has season tickets can be labeled a better fan than the one who goes to 2 games a year because of financial reasons. And as far as homefield advantage in baseball, that would be what the Twins have, being used to playing in a dome or on their turf or whatever or taking away opposing teams hot water, stuff like that. The rest is all mental which shouldn't matter if home or away if you're a professional baseball player, imo.

 

It shouldn't matter just like a reliever shouldn't have to have a special mentality to close out games or a basketball player shouldn't feel any more pressure in a 1 point deficit with 3 seconds left and the ball in his hands than the middle of the 2nd quarter. . Fact is it does matter for whatever reasons.

 

I agree with you completely about Chicago fans. Chicago is a die-hard sports town. Always has been, always will be.

 

Living out west myself, I only have the media to rely on, but as far as attending Cubs games, I read that a lot of people are there for reasons other than being a hard core fan. Maybe it's true, maybe it isn't, but the neighborhood, the bars, etc., etc., all seem to suggest this is true.

 

While I remember Bears home games being blacked out years ago (many, many years ago), the baseball games have always been broadcast on TV (RIP, Harry). I don't know, but maybe in this day and age, the ballpark itself is a big factor. I can't comment on the Cell as I've never seen it, but is it possible that the park isn't a big enough attraction? Just hypothesizing here, but what if JR built the new park on the lakefront, similar to the Giants' SBC Park, for example? With the games available on cable, local TV, the internet, the proliferation of sports bars; do you think this provides a disincentive to see the games live?

 

I guess I could look it up on the Sox website, but since I'm posting, I'll ask you guys. What do seats cost nowadays? Are they overpriced? I haven't lived in Chicago since '77, but IIRC, tickets were only $5 that year. Back then, that was less than one hour's wages, on the average.

 

http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/04003995...7&minorcatid=10

[sox-r-us]

Yeah, no one came out and just said the attendance sucks. sox-r-us was trying to have a discussion about why it sucks and what will improve it because so far, everybody who said, "wait til june" was wrong.

 

Thanks nite train. Yes, Sleepy, I did not just come out to b****. Read my posts carefully again. I gave reasons that were previously given as being no longer applicable.

 

Maybe I will be proven wrong soon and maybe we sell out eveyr game going forward. I would love that, but I fear that will not happen. And my bigger fear is that will hurt us in the offseason again. We may have to get used to seeing some project like Gload at 1B next season.

[SleepyWhiteSox]

Sleepy

 

While it may help keep people feel less insecure about themselves, it does not really help solve the problem you are b****ing about. DO you agree? There is no way Ozzie is dropping Timo based off our venting? (It may still happen but not because of our posts). Neither is Cruddy going to improve based of our analysis of why he sucks.

 

It may help with self-rationalization and hence is more therapeutic in nature, I disagree that it really helps solve the problem we are b****ing about to begin with.

 

NOne the less, thanks for your opinions. You have some sound points.

 

So how does talking about attendance solve anything?

 

All I see it do is cause more arguments than usual, if that's possible.

[nitetrain8601]

And I've yet to hear a good way of improving it from ANYBODY.

 

Personally, I don't even have any clue why attendance is the problem that it is to begin with.  I have no idea why fans aren't coming.

 

Which is the mission sox-r-us is on to find out.

Edited June 4, 2005 by nitetrain8601

[3 BeWareTheNewSox 5]

I agree with you completely about Chicago fans. Chicago is a die-hard sports town. Always has been, always will be.

 

I think it's a stupid sports town, and I live here. Why else would a majority of the city support a losing team, only because it is the hip thing to do, when the attendants aren't even fans of the team or sport. Obviously I'm talking about the Flubs, but even if you look at the Bulls, hell I've cheered and and watched since rebuilding process day 1, and they have no business drawing what they do. Then an organization like the Sox, obviously committed to winning is here, and having something special, and the rest of Chicago doesn't care. The city is full of idiot sports fans, and I personally don't want their fair weather fans in the Cell. If Sox fans fill it up, then great, if no one goes, I still don't care, I'm enjoying this season, and that is all I have on this subject for tonight, bed time.

[nitetrain8601]

Yep, it's sleepytime.

[SleepyWhiteSox]

Which is the mission sox-r-us is on to find out.

 

Lemme know what you guys come up with. I think attendance is a major problem too and would really like to have it fixed.

[sox-r-us]

I think it's a stupid sports town, and I live here. Why else would a majority of the city support a losing team, only because it is the hip thing to do, when the attendants aren't even fans of the team or sport. Obviously I'm talking about the Flubs, but even if you look at the Bulls, hell I've cheered and and watched since rebuilding process day 1, and they have no business drawing what they do. Then an organization like the Sox, obviously committed to winning is here, and having something special, and the rest of Chicago doesn't care. The city is full of idiot sports fans, and I personally don't want their fair weather fans in the Cell. If Sox fans fill it up, then great, if no one goes, I still don't care, I'm enjoying this season, and that is all I have on this subject for tonight, bed time.

 

So do you call Sox fans that have supported the Sox all these years stupid too by your logic? It is not like we have won anything forever either....you know that right?

[sox-r-us]

Lemme know what you guys come up with.  I think attendance is a major problem too and would really like to have it fixed.

 

I am sure by tomorrow there will be another 100 posts in here (50 of which wil be useless like Jabroni's and out of the other 50, hopefully 10 of them will hint at what we are trying to understand here).

[Jabroni]

I am sure by tomorrow there will be another 100 posts in here (50 of which wil be useless like Jabroni's and out of the other 50, hopefully 10 of them will hint at what we are trying to understand here).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This thread could go on for 1000 posts and you still won't find the answer. But whatever...

[AirScott]

I wouldn't mind the fair weather fans, they could end up paying AJ Burnett's or some other marquee free agents' salaries.

[sox-r-us]

This thread could go on for 1000 posts and you still won't find the answer.  But whatever...

 

You mean I will never find any answers on a message board. Woe my existence

[drowninginflame]

I think we're starting to turn heads and if we go big this season, we'll have people coming to more and more games.

 

Well, I hope.

[nvxplorer]

http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/04003995...7&minorcatid=10

Wow! I remember three categories from old Comiskey - box, grandstand and bleachers (They may have divided them up before I left in '77, but I know there weren't a dozen different classifications of seats.)

 

Some of the prices seem reasonable, but what's the deal with the variable rates? For example, Upper Box: $9-$32. Is that 9 and 32, or 9 to 32? And what's the difference between the $9 seats and the $32s? I can't believe a seat can cost three times as much as another in the same section.

[knightni]

Hey Jabroni - when are you going to answer this from post #11? You obviously seem to be ignoring it.....maybe it was too difficult so I reproduced it below 

 

===================

 

QUOTE(Jabroni @ Jun 4, 2005 -> 06:04 AM)

Will b****ing about the attendance change a f***ing thing?

 

Nope.

 

So why even bother b****ing?

=====================

So will b****ing about Ozzie change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about Cruddy change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about giving up BMac for Chavez change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about Shingo change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about Jizzcan change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about Brantley change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about Timo Focking Perez change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about Paulie change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about Dead change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about Moronotti change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about DJ change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about Cotts change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about corpseball change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about Walker change anything? So why even bother?

 

So will b****ing about the Spankees losing to the Twinkies change anything? So why even bother?

Someone could use a "vacation". :headshake

[Rowand44]

Sox R us, it's so ridiculous that you make all these attendance threads. You're b****ing about people not going to the park when you never go, just think about what you're saying. If you want people to go to the park then get your ass to the park and I don't give a s*** if you live on the west coast, that's your problem. You want the attendance to go up then put your ass in a seat at the cell, if not just shut up about this already.

[Kyyle23]

I dont really see a direct correlation between fan support and raise in payroll. Jerry makes decisions on payroll with a board, not by himself. They decide before the season where the payroll should be set at, and it really hasnt changed in the past 3 years. So many factors and different sources of money go into payroll, saying "Everyone go to more games, we would have signed Tejada if you went to more games two years ago..." is absolutely ridiculous. The Sox would have had an equal chance of signing "studs" if you were harping on everyone on this site about not buying Sox merchandise.

 

Attendance is what it is. People are fickle, and the media has convinced people that the Southside is scary and only "hardcore" fans are brave enough to venture to 35th and Shields.

 

Now, while i dont necassarily buy Jabroni's point saying "you cant b**** until you get your ass in a seat", I cannot dismiss that there is a small point there. People fly across country to go to Cubs games. Thats just a fact. The Cubs are a national team. It isnt so with the Sox, they are a Chicago team. Chicago still is having a strange love affair with the Cubs, but the affair has turned into short booty-calls. Unless Dusty takes this team to the playoffs, it could be a little while before they compete again. Attendance will fluctuate, provided the Sox keep up their end of the bargain and keep winning.

 

For now, I cannot attend games. Sadly, my life consists of working and watching my 4 year old daughter. I do my part by paying my cable bill, to which a small portion goes to comcast, to which a small portion goes to the licensing and television agreement that the Sox have with comcast. Does that make you happy? My two cents from my cable bill this month goes to "studs". Jerry should be thrilled.

[southsider2k5]

I want to put an end to all of this "I can't go to games, but I want to throw rocks at other glasshouses crap now"

 

For all of you who like to complain about attendance, but claim to not to be able to go, how do you support your team? You do realize that merchandizing puts a ton of money into the team, right? Are you on whitesox.com all of the time ordering more jersies? Are you buying more hats? Or are you just on here complaining? If you were REALLY that concerned, you could find a way to put money in the teams pockets, instead of worrying about how other people are spending their money.

[Yossarian]

*Posts it again, in hopes that someone will see the light*

I've seen the light and you've said maybe more than you realize. I didn't read this whole long thread but the opinion has been voiced that possibly Chicago is no longer able to support two teams. I don't agree with bashing the poster who started this thread. Attendance issues make Sox fans defensive, but last night they had 27,000 + to see the dynamic Pirates beat the Braves. The Sox couldn't at least equal that? The Pirates have an ownership group among the worst in baseball, and are headed for their 13th straight losing season. Three more and they tie the record. The economy has sucked since the 1960's. Pittsburgh is the champ of Rust Belt decay. On top of that it is one of the most football oriented MLB cities. It's time to quit making excuses. The 94 season, the white flag trade are now all ancient history. This owner will never sell the team. The team is 36-18. People need to start showing up. People notice, the baseball world sees this lack of support.

[southsider2k5]

I've seen the light and you've said maybe more than you realize. I didn't read this whole long thread but the opinion has been voiced that possibly Chicago is no longer able to support two teams. I don't agree with bashing the poster who started this thread. Attendance issues make Sox fans defensive, but last night they had 27,000 + to see the dynamic Pirates beat the Braves. The Sox couldn't at least equal that? The Pirates have an ownership group among the worst in baseball, and are headed for their 13th straight losing season. Three more and they tie the record. The economy has sucked since the 1960's. Pittsburgh is the champ of Rust Belt decay. On top of that it is one of the most football oriented MLB cities. It's time to quit making excuses. The 94 season, the white flag trade are now all ancient history. This owner will never sell the team. The team is 36-18. People need to start showing up. People notice, the baseball world sees this lack of support.

 

I have posted this stuff before, but since no one seems to remember I will post it again.

 

Attendance for April and May of 2005 was the highest since 1994. It is already up 10% over 2004 right now. And this is also factoring in how many ticket price increases since 1994? Attendance IS GOING UP. It is going up by double digit percentages, how many other teams can say that?

 

It is irrational for people to expect with a season ticket base of about 10,000 people for an extra 30,000 people to be able to go to every single game. Find me a team that has gone from an average attendance of 20K a night to one that has gone to 35K a night. Find me any team EVER that has made that jump of attendance.

[Yossarian]

I have posted this stuff before, but since no one seems to remember I will post it again.

 

Attendance for April and May of 2005 was the highest since 1994.  It is already up 10% over 2004 right now.  And this is also factoring in how many ticket price increases since 1994?  Attendance IS GOING UP.  It is going up by double digit percentages, how many other teams can say that?

 

It is irrational for people to expect with a season ticket base of about 10,000 people for an extra 30,000 people to be able to go to every single game.  Find me a team that has gone from an average attendance of 20K a night to one that has gone to 35K a night.  Find me any team EVER that has made that jump of attendance.

Attendance just isn't quite where it should be, taking everything into consideration. Nobody expects the Sox to match the cubs right now. At the end of the year I'll reevaluate. In the meantime I make my first visit to Chicago and the old ball yard since 2001 during the week of July 4. The mighty Devil Rays are in town. Maybe I'll see one or more of you. I may even pop for a beer.

[BigNDfan80]

What's even scarier about Friday's attendance.....There were A LOT of Indian fans there.

[SoxFan1]

School is out in 2 weeks. Day games will be more attended and night games as well. The season is still young and the Sox are playing well. The people will come, the people will most-definitely come.