Texsox Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 LUFKIN, Texas -- A 19-year-old East Texas man faces a life prison sentence for causing his teenage girlfriend to miscarry twins, even though she wanted to end the pregnancy. Gerardo Flores was accused of causing the miscarriage by stepping on his girlfriend's stomach. He was prosecuted under the state's new fetal protection law. Erica Basoria acknowledged asking Flores to help end her pregnancy. But the 17-year-old can't be prosecuted because of her legal right to abortion. The defense contended that Basoria punched herself while Flores was stepping on her, making it impossible to tell who killed the twins. The jury reached a verdict after deliberating four hours. Because prosecutors declined to seek the death penalty in the case, Flores received the automatic life sentence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted June 7, 2005 Author Share Posted June 7, 2005 If he had a medical license, it would have been legal. Two people commit the same crime to their baby, one spends the rest of his life in prison, the other is free because she had a "right" to do it?! :headshake It all seems soooooo wrong and illogical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelasDaddy0427 Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 I'm going to say about right. Just because these kids are obviously too stupid for their own good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonxctf Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 only in Texas. :headshake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 (edited) Does Texas have a "Parental notification law" for abortions for those under 18? I'll bet you based on this case that they do, and I'll bet you this is one of the end results. I don't think life in prison is a good option at all, but there definately needs to be an incredibly long period of counseling for both of them. I'd say institutionalization would be a better recourse for both them and society. Might give them a chance someday. Edited June 7, 2005 by Balta1701 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mreye Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 QUOTE(Texsox @ Jun 7, 2005 -> 11:18 AM) If he had a medical license, it would have been legal. Two people commit the same crime to their baby, one spends the rest of his life in prison, the other is free because she had a "right" to do it?! :headshake It all seems soooooo wrong and illogical. My thoughts exactly. What a shame. I thought we would only have these things happening when we outlaw abortion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 QUOTE(Jeckle2000 @ Jun 7, 2005 -> 05:22 PM) I'm going to say about right. Just because these kids are obviously too stupid for their own good. :puke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Controlled Chaos Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jun 7, 2005 -> 12:33 PM) Does Texas have a "Parental notification law" for abortions for those under 18? I'll bet you based on this case that they do, and I'll bet you this is one of the end results. I don't think life in prison is a good option at all, but there definately needs to be an incredibly long period of counseling for both of them. I'd say institutionalization would be a better recourse for both them and society. Might give them a chance someday. She decided sometime after the 4th month she didn't want it so she beat her stomach and her boyfriend jumped on it...and you blame it on a notification law instead of the two persons involved. I'm not a big anti abortion activist or anything. In fact, I think theres a place for it sometimes...but this is not one of those times. Just deciding down the road...ah I dont want it now...is not the right reason. Now I don't know exactly how far along she was and I ain't big into the science of abortions or anything...I just did a google search for 4 month fetus...and I'll tell you what...if she punched that and he jumped on it....it looks just like jumping on and punching a baby. So I say enjoy your sentence. Fifth Month Size: about 12 inches; weighs about 1 pound The baby's eyelashes have become apparent. He has developed a sucking reflex and can suck his thumb. His mother can feel him moving now. This is the halfway point through pregnancy. Your prayers have helped the baby's mother continue with her pregnancy and seek the help she needs. Fourth Month Size: about 9 inches; weighs about 6 ounces Right now, the baby's already well-formed body is gaining weight and strength rapidly. Her brain has begun the maturing process that will not be completed until she is about 14 years old. The eyelids are sealed together and won't open again until about the seventh month. Fingernails and toenails appear; fingers and toes have their own unique prints that will remain unchanged throughout a lifetime. The baby kicks, sleeps, swallows and opens and closes his mouth. Her tastebuds are working. At this age doctors have recorded REMs (rapid eye movements), a sign of dreaming Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 QUOTE(Controlled Chaos @ Jun 7, 2005 -> 12:39 PM) She decided sometime after the 4th month she didn't want it so she beat her stomach and her boyfriend jumped on it...and you blame it on a notification law instead of the two persons involved. Do you think I'm admiring them? Not at all. I think that they need some serious help. I was not trying to blame the law, only to note that it could have been important. Remember, these are still teenage kids. Every other country other than the U.S. and Somalia has signed onto a treaty saying that children under the age of 18 need to be dealt with differently by countries' legal systems because in many (not all) cases, they don't have the judgement to understand how insane what they're doing really is. These kids were clearly wrong. Of course. No one in their right mind would say otherwise. But when you put enough different ideas in the minds of a person who hasn't fully developed the ability for rational decision making, these sorts of things are the net result. Clearly, if there was a parental notification law, it's not the only factor, but I would say you shouldn't discount it as being a possible factor. (By the way...in general I'm in favor of those laws as long as they're teamed with education). I would hope that both of those teenagers received an enormous amount of counseling and treatment after what happened here. I don't think that it deserves life in prison for 1 of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 Here's an update on the laws in Texas that could have played a role in this mess. In 2003, Texas passed an anti-abortion law that instituted a 24-hour waiting period; required doctors to show women pictures of fetuses, tell them about adoption procedures, and warn them that an abortion could lead to breast cancer; and forced abortion providers to keep the identities of all their patients in their records. And one more thing, as the Fort Worth Weekly reported at the time: The bill as passed also includes another requirement that managed to escape the floodlights of controversy and debate: Abortions from 16 weeks onward now can be performed only in hospitals and ambulatory surgical centers. The clause is a major Catch-22. Very few Texas hospitals perform elective abortions, and the few that do charge extremely high fees and require that the patients go through complicated ethics reviews. And of the state's hundreds of surgical centers, none performs abortions. So, with no place to get an abortion after 16 weeks, what does a panicky, 17-year-old girl do if she's four months pregnant? Erica Basoria decided to try to induce a miscarriage. When that didn't work, she asked her boyfriend to step on her stomach. A week later she miscarried. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mreye Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 Send them both both up the river. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Controlled Chaos Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jun 7, 2005 -> 03:14 PM) what does a panicky, 17-year-old girl do if she's four months pregnant? Erica Basoria decided to try to induce a miscarriage. When that didn't work, she asked her boyfriend to step on her stomach. A week later she miscarried. I'd buy that argument at 13, but not 17. If you're 17 and you rob a place, kill a person, rape a person, stab a person you can't use the I was young and dumb excuse. You are treated as an adult. So why should the young and dumb excuse fly here. Why is a 17 yr old in this case not expected to be responsible for their actions, but a 17 yr old that robs a store is. This poor panicky girl had no problem doing the deed and I'm quite sure she knew the possible consequences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanOfCorn Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 Ridiculous. Horrible what they did, but jail isn't the answer. He'll be dead within the year. He should've known better, but that doesn't make him a killer. This is one of those cases that will be appealed and appealed and appealed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 QUOTE(Controlled Chaos @ Jun 7, 2005 -> 01:33 PM) I'd buy that argument at 13, but not 17. If you're 17 and you rob a place, kill a person, rape a person, stab a person you can't use the I was young and dumb excuse. You are treated as an adult. So why should the young and dumb excuse fly here. Why is a 17 yr old in this case not expected to be responsible for their actions, but a 17 yr old that robs a store is. This poor panicky girl had no problem doing the deed and I'm quite sure she knew the possible consequences. I'll strongly disagree that they understood the consequences. Do you think that the kids would have done it if they knew that 1 of them would face life in prison? Secondly...just because some states think that if you're 17 and do any of those things you should be tried as an adult doesn't mean that its the right thing. There are very high percentages of youths who genuinely aren't in a position to make sound judgements at that age. That's why most every other country in the world sets the bar at the age of 18 for allowing children to be treated as an adult by the legal system, and that's why I think it should be set that way in this country. Whether or not that's the case in this situation (they weren't prepared to make a decision), I don't have a clue. These people could have been the wisest, most mature 17 year olds in the country for all I know. But then again...if they're 17, pregnant, and don't really have any plans for what to do, do you really think they're emotionally developed to the point of making sound, rational, adult decisions? Do you think that kids who get pregnant at the age of 17 are the sorts who really stop to consider all the consequences of their actions? Doesn't the fact that she got pregnant in the first place argue that her ability to make sound decisions isn't fully developed yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jun 7, 2005 -> 03:45 PM) But then again...if they're 17, pregnant, and don't really have any plans for what to do, do you really think they're emotionally developed to the point of making sound, rational, adult decisions? Do you think that kids who get pregnant at the age of 17 are the sorts who really stop to consider all the consequences of their actions? Doesn't the fact that she got pregnant in the first place argue that her ability to make sound decisions isn't fully developed yet? GMAFB. JMO.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxFanForever Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 Not that I am much older but I still find this quote funny and contradictory... A 19-year-old East Texas man 19 and man just don't go together for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Controlled Chaos Posted June 7, 2005 Share Posted June 7, 2005 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jun 7, 2005 -> 03:45 PM) I'll strongly disagree that they understood the consequences. Do you think that the kids would have done it if they knew that 1 of them would face life in prison? Secondly...just because some states think that if you're 17 and do any of those things you should be tried as an adult doesn't mean that its the right thing. There are very high percentages of youths who genuinely aren't in a position to make sound judgements at that age. That's why most every other country in the world sets the bar at the age of 18 for allowing children to be treated as an adult by the legal system, and that's why I think it should be set that way in this country. Whether or not that's the case in this situation (they weren't prepared to make a decision), I don't have a clue. These people could have been the wisest, most mature 17 year olds in the country for all I know. But then again...if they're 17, pregnant, and don't really have any plans for what to do, do you really think they're emotionally developed to the point of making sound, rational, adult decisions? Do you think that kids who get pregnant at the age of 17 are the sorts who really stop to consider all the consequences of their actions? Doesn't the fact that she got pregnant in the first place argue that her ability to make sound decisions isn't fully developed yet? Actually when I spoke of consequences I was just talking about her knowing she could get pregnant and doing it anyway. I don't think you have to be emotionally developed or a sound and rational adult to know that punching you're own stomach and having your boyfriend step on you to kill your twin fetuses is kinda f***ed up. Either way...it's a very messed up situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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