qwerty Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 (edited) Quentin Richardson will be dealt to the Knicks in exchange for Kurt Thomas and a future conditional number one draft choice. This deal is pending league approval and should be announced following Game 7 of the NBA Finals on Thursday. The deal was confirmed to me by a source close to the trade negotiations. There was little doubt that one of the Suns’ five starters from the 2004-2005 season would not be back for the 2005-2006 season and Richardson is the player who that Bryan Colangelo and the Suns have decided to move. The move will clear room for the Suns to re-sign restricted free agent Joe Johnson. Thomas is signed through the 2009 season, while Richardson, whose game overlaps with Johnson, is signed through the 2009 season as well and the Suns have a team option for the 2009-2010 season. Richardson averaged 15 points and 6 rebounds per game in his first season in Phoneix. He made 226 3-pointers with the high-powered Suns, compared to 120 in his final season in Los Angeles. Thomas, a 10-year veteran, gives the Suns a player who averaged 11.5 and 10.4 rebounds per game last season with the Knicks. He will allow Shawn Marion to slide back to the small forward position and Amare Stoudemire will have an easier time at center by playing beside a veteran power forward. http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives...or_kurt_thomas/ The knicks could very well have the worst record in the nba at this rate. They now have a lineup of three guys who shoot the ball alot and don't make it enough not to mention they have virtually no frontcourt. Edited June 23, 2005 by qwerty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 Isiah has to be the worst gm of the modern era. You trade your best rebounder and defender for another 3 point gunner with a s***ty b-ball iq? Marbury, Crawford, and Richardson on the same team? YIKES! This is a pretty good move for the Suns. I do question how Thomas will fare in a more up tempo attack. But they get some much needed size upfront. Thomas also has a great mid-range shot. I'm sure he'll get plenty of open looks with Nash and Amare on the floor. This also has to mean that they will indeed resign Joe Johnson. Man, all the Suns really have to do is strengthen their bench and they're looking pretty good. They've got a first and second round pick. They should look at adding some more size and a back-up for Nash if possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 03:50 AM) Isiah has to be the worst gm of the modern era. You trade your best rebounder and defender for another 3 point gunner with a s***ty b-ball iq? s***ty basketball IQ? This was his first year shooting the 3 like that, and he was just taking what was being given to him in that particular offense. It was more a product of that system. Although his shot selection has not been the greatest as of late, he is still one of the top rebounders for his position and a solid NBA player. By no means am I calling him a superstar or even star at this point, but I've seen enough of his game in high school, college, and the NBA to know his basketball IQ is not as bad, or s***ty, as you put it. Damn, I am going to hate seeing him in a Knicks jersey if this does go through... Will Isaiah even realize they need a frontcourt? And now I have to think about what that does to Matrix's numbers in terms of fantasy...His boards will surely go down... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 this sucks, i really enjoyed watching Q-Rich on that Suns team... well I guess its a good thing if you consider the Knicks are going to suck anymore... what are they doing over there first trade Nazr Muhamed who was having a good season and now Thomas... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buehrle>Wood Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 Damn, I really liked watching Q on that Suns team as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChWRoCk2 Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 smart move by the suns, get a hell of a player in thomas and a first pick, knicks got owned in that trade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 The suns weren't going to win in the west with the ability of San Antonio to go out and dominate on the defensive end and on the boards. If they get more rebounds on the defensive end, it will lead to more fast break points by the Suns. This is a good trade for both teams...I think New York gets the better player, but Phoenix gets a better piece for their puzzle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimenez4MVP Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 The Knicks get the NBA 3point Champion and sharp shooter from the arc.. I like this move for the Knicks, Q is the man.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerhead johnson Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 QUOTE(SleepyWhiteSox @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 02:13 PM) Although his shot selection has not been the greatest as of late, he is still one of the top rebounders for his position and a solid NBA player. By no means am I calling him a superstar or even star at this point, but I've seen enough of his game in high school, college, and the NBA to know his basketball IQ is not as bad, or s***ty, as you put it. Richardson is an energy guy first and foremost, a tough rebounder for his size, and an above average defender out of the SG slot. That said, the addition of Kurt Thomas is pertinent to what they're trying to do over there. I'd also let go of Joe Johnson and go after a defensive stopper like Raja Bell at SG and a couple of solid bench players, as they'll still have plenty of offense in Stoudamire/Marion/Nash/Thomas. I know that Phoenix wouldn't have a fan base if not for offense (due to lack of interest, as is the case with many west coast teams), so I won't hate on their philosophy. Still, they will never be able to win a championship without areas of excellence on the defensive end. You look at teams like Detroit, San Antonio, and Indiana, and they could shut down both the paint and the perimiter. The Suns just don't have the personnel to do anything like that. QUOTE(SleepyWhiteSox @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 02:13 PM) And now I have to think about what that does to Matrix's numbers in terms of fantasy...His boards will surely go down... Who cares about fantasy numbers? His natural position is SF. He could play tough mid-range defense out of that slot and be opportunistic out on the perimiter, whereas, at PF, he's getting murdered as guys are backing him down and getting easy shots. Marion at PF is almost as retarded as Odom, Walker, or Jamison at PF...these SFs just don't have the length or beef required to hang with PFs like Duncan, Garnett, Jermaine O'Neal, Sheed, Brand, Martin, Randolph, Howard, Okafor, Boozer, Webber, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 Actually, I would say that Phoenix might even have a chance at a championship without prowess at the defensive end, if they can accomplish 2 things. 1. They need to own the defensive boards. This is not an option. Those rebounds will lead to fast breaks, and giving up offensive boards will destroy the few defensive stops they get. 2. They need to be very close to the top of the league in steals; same reasons as above. Fast breaks and defensive stops. If they can do those things well, they will keep people from scoring more than 100-110 against them, and they will actually be able to outscore everyone else. The biggest problem I saw with the Suns in the Spurs series was rebounding. The Spurs owned the boards, which prevented a lot of the Suns fast breaks and gave the Spurs a lot of 2nd chance points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 02:20 PM) Richardson is an energy guy first and foremost, a tough rebounder for his size, and an above average defender out of the SG slot. Yep. QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 02:20 PM) I'd also let go of Joe Johnson and go after a defensive stopper like Raja Bell at SG and a couple of solid bench players Nope. QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 02:20 PM) Who cares about fantasy numbers? I clearly stated that that comment was from a fantasy perspective. Anyone who likes fantasy basketbal would care because he was having a monster rebounding year for himself and Kurt will obviously take away from that. I would have drafted him top 5 (maybe) if not for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerhead johnson Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 05:49 PM) This is a good trade for both teams A good trade for both teams? They just traded their best inside player, a guy who at only 6'9 and 225 pounds was tough enough to play center for them down the stretch. Let's review: 2005/2006 Knicks PG: Stephon Marbury (16.5 million) SG: Allan Houston (19.1 million), Anfernee Hardaway (15.7 million), Jamal Crawford (6.5 million), Quentin Richardson (6.3 million) SF: Tim Thomas (14 million), Shannon Anderson (6.7 million), PF: Maurice Taylor (9 million), Malik Rose (6 million), Junkyard Dog (6 million) C: ??? Keeping track? 106 million spread out for this crap with no center. The only promising young player that they have is Mike Sweetney, whom Isiah wanted/wants to trade. No trade is a good trade for the Knicks. Isiah also wants Vince Carter, Jalen Rose, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerhead johnson Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 07:27 PM) Actually, I would say that Phoenix might even have a chance at a championship without prowess at the defensive end, if they can accomplish 2 things. 1. They need to own the defensive boards. This is not an option. Those rebounds will lead to fast breaks, and giving up offensive boards will destroy the few defensive stops they get. 2. They need to be very close to the top of the league in steals; same reasons as above. Fast breaks and defensive stops. If they can do those things well, they will keep people from scoring more than 100-110 against them, and they will actually be able to outscore everyone else. The biggest problem I saw with the Suns in the Spurs series was rebounding. The Spurs owned the boards, which prevented a lot of the Suns fast breaks and gave the Spurs a lot of 2nd chance points. They're not going to own the defensive boards or any boards for that matter, that's the point. Any center that they throw out there will be waaay undersized. They have no perimiter defense outside of Marion, who is more a mid-range guy like Kirilenko or Posey. Of the 15 or so pertinent defensive categories, the only one that they show up in is least fouls committed, and even that is a fluke. They can never be a good all-around defensive team. Hell, they'll never have one particular area of defensive excellence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 Apparently the Kincks are trying to move Tim Thomas as well. I say they have to move him and Marbury because when the Knicks are ready to compete with their core, those guys will be old. The Knicks got the better player, but they also gave up a future first. Plus they lost a low post presence. As it stands now, Jamal Crawford is on the bench now from what I hear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerhead johnson Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 07:40 PM) Apparently the Kincks are trying to move Tim Thomas as well. I say they have to move him and Marbury because when the Knicks are ready to compete with their core, those guys will be old. The Knicks got the better player, but they also gave up a future first. Plus they lost a low post presence. As it stands now, Jamal Crawford is on the bench now from what I hear. First off, the Knicks have no core, but that is so obvious that further elaboration is pretty f***ing far from necessary. You consider a core to be Richardson/Crawford/Sweetney? That is an absolute nightmare. Marbury: 2005/2006: 16 Million 2006/2007: 18 Million 2007/2008: 20 Million 2008/2009: 22 Million Unless you can clone Isiah and place him in the GM position for the Raptors or somebody, no team is going to take on that enormous contract from a guy who is arguably the biggest loser in the NBA. I say arguably because you still have guys like Antoine Walker and Jalen Rose around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZoomSlowik Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 Isiah continues to amaze me with his total lack of competent moves. They're going to need to put another ball on the floor with Marbury, Crawford, and Q. I can't believed he traded his one credible post player instead of someone from his plethora of 2 guards (Marbury might as well be one with his style). They might have been passable if he kept Thomas, drafted someone like Frye, and traded someone from the Marbury/Crawford/Houston trio for another credible post player. The payroll is through the roof and they have no chance to compete. Why does he still have a job? I still don't know what to think about Phoenix. they definitely needed another big man; they just couldn't stop anybody with Amare at the center spot and Marion at PF. I think they might be okay if they can find some bench players (with a focus on D and rebounding. Nash, Amare, Johnson, and Marion give you plenty on offense). Marion is already a solid defender, Johnson is okay, and Amare, while currently pretty bad, has enough athletic ability to dominate. I think Thomas will help in both areas. They already were a better team than virtually everyone in the league, they just need to find a way to stop Duncan, the two Wallaces, and Shaq to have a real chance to win it all. I don't think this deal solves it, but they'll be better than they were in that area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted June 24, 2005 Author Share Posted June 24, 2005 (edited) QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 02:20 PM) Richardson is an energy guy first and foremost, a tough rebounder for his size, and an above average defender out of the SG slot. That said, the addition of Kurt Thomas is pertinent to what they're trying to do over there. I'd also let go of Joe Johnson and go after a defensive stopper like Raja Bell at SG and a couple of solid bench players, as they'll still have plenty of offense in Stoudamire/Marion/Nash/Thomas. I know that Phoenix wouldn't have a fan base if not for offense (due to lack of interest, as is the case with many west coast teams), so I won't hate on their philosophy. It was kinda shaky before richardson was dealt but now it is all but done in my opinion ( resinging johnson). If johnson was practically any place but the suns he could be a 25 point scorer. He is so damn fun to watch because of his explosiveness. This is actually really bad for the cavs who have had serious interest in johnson for months now. They need another scorer other than james, while ilgauskas is a good scoring option he is much better suited to be the third scoring option rather than their second. The Suns' attempt to have a more traditional structure is going to make them lose their edge. The best thing they had going were the constant mismatches, but now other teams centers will have someone to guard, a 4 won't be trying to keep up with Marion on the perimeter and in transition, and they won't have 4 3 point shooters kicking it around the outside. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I saw this and agree with it 100%. Can anyone believe this fool wants the full mle? They better let him walk, much better players out there for the full f***ing mle. This should be the trade that gets thomas fired. I mean he just traded for another chucker that shot .389 from the field. Crawford and richardson will fight each other for a worse shot. Edited June 24, 2005 by qwerty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 QUOTE(qwerty @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 07:52 PM) It was kinda shaky before richardson was dealt but now it is all but done in my opinion ( resinging johnson). If johnson was practically any place but the suns he could be a 25 point scorer. He is so damn fun to watch because of his explosiveness. Yet someone suggested to let him go and pick up raja bell...Maybe their NBA package didn't include Suns games... Joe Johnson is clearly a good player, and suggesting that they let him go and pick up raja bell when they've been trying to figure out how to re-sign him since practically before this season sounds ridiculous... QUOTE(qwerty @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 07:52 PM) Can anyone believe this fool wants the full mle? They better let him walk, much better players out there for the full f***ing mle. No comment from me. I'll end up showing my DePaul bias...I'll just say he is long and athletic and could be a decent shot-blocker... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 QUOTE(SleepyWhiteSox @ Jun 24, 2005 -> 11:05 AM) No comment from me. I'll end up showing my DePaul bias...I'll just say he is long and athletic and could be a decent shot-blocker... And the basketball IQ of a mule (believe me I watched him in Orlando for 3 seasons). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jun 23, 2005 -> 08:16 PM) And the basketball IQ of a mule (believe me I watched him in Orlando for 3 seasons). I watched him for about 2. I watched more magic games on the Sunshine Network while attending school in Florida than I care to mention... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted June 24, 2005 Author Share Posted June 24, 2005 He has something going for him anyway... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerhead johnson Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 QUOTE(SleepyWhiteSox @ Jun 24, 2005 -> 01:05 AM) Yet someone suggested to let him go and pick up raja bell...Maybe their NBA package didn't include Suns games... Joe Johnson is clearly a good player, and suggesting that they let him go and pick up raja bell when they've been trying to figure out how to re-sign him since practically before this season sounds ridiculous... You won't get an argument out of me as far as his scoring potential is concerned, but Johnson is a weak defensive player who tends to disappear at times. I see guys like that all over the league. He's not worth the money, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted June 24, 2005 Author Share Posted June 24, 2005 QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ Jun 24, 2005 -> 12:28 PM) You won't get an argument out of me as far as his scoring potential is concerned, but Johnson is a weak defensive player who tends to disappear at times. I see guys like that all over the league. He's not worth the money, IMO. Joe defensive is pretty damn good defensively. Are you thinking of linton johnson? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerhead johnson Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 QUOTE(qwerty @ Jun 24, 2005 -> 08:28 PM) Joe defensive is pretty damn good defensively. Are you thinking of linton johnson? Really? From what I've seen of him throughout his career, he's gotten torched an awful lot. He doesn't have that rep either (unless I've been sleeping and he put in more effort on the defensive end this year). Maybe I went too far in calling him a weak defensive player, but he doesn't really do much for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwerty Posted June 24, 2005 Author Share Posted June 24, 2005 QUOTE(hammerhead johnson @ Jun 24, 2005 -> 03:36 PM) Really? From what I've seen of him throughout his career, he's gotten torched an awful lot. He doesn't have that rep either (unless I've been sleeping and he put in more effort on the defensive end this year). Maybe I went too far in calling him a weak defensive player, but he doesn't really do much for me. I do know that alot of people are impressed with his defense. Several teams want him because of both his scoring and defensive abilities because they are lacking defense in that position. Either way he is gonna geta a nearly max contract this summer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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