The Gigantic all encompassing TRADE THREAD

[upnorthsox]

No, they are paying one million this year and two million next year.

 

We got $3 mil with Contreras, he's making $8.5 mil this yr and next. The $3 mil was to offset the rest of '04(500k) and this yr to bring his salary down to $6 mil($2.5 mil). We are on the hook for all of '06 for $8.5 mil.

 

This btw was KW's 2nd worst trade.

[VAfan]

Again, Contreras is only 6 million and not 8 million. Yankees are picking up some of his contract.

 

I read we got Contreras and $3 million from the Yankees for Loaiza. Do you think they are giving us $2 million more each year?

 

If so, all the more reason SF would make the Schmidt/Vizquel for Contreras/Uribe + prospects deal, as they would be saving $5+ million next year instead of just $3+ million. Indeed, that would allow us to take one of the prospects off the table.

 

**************

This post is so long I can't read to the end before responding, though a couple of my responses have already been put up. Sorry if people think I'm being redundant.

Edited June 29, 2005 by VAfan

[Kyyle23]

Burnett and Schmidt wont be there by the deadline.  Boston/Baltimore will make a run at either.

 

Cuddyer got hurt today.  Hit by a pitch. They took him for xrays.  If he is hurt and out for a while, the twins will have to make a move.  They cant rely on Terry Tiffie as a viable 3rd baseman.

 

havent they been starting some Williams kid there anyways?

[southsideirish71]

havent they been starting some Williams kid there anyways?

 

He is hurt also. They moved Cuddyer over to 2b.

[Dam8610]

True but Schmidt > Garcia and 05 Sox > 04 Sox.

 

I'd really like to know why everyone seems to be so in love with a struggling 32 year old with velocity problems.

 

As many teams as there are out there looking for starting pitching, it's going to cost us a ton if that's what we go for.  We will literally be in a bidding war if we go after Schmidt.  Yankees, Red Sox, Orioles, Rangers, hell they could all use another starter.  We're in a much better position that almost anyone else in the league.

 

This is precisely why the Sox should go after Burnett. With Schmidt's past couple of years, the Giants are going to want a HUGE package for Schmidt, who may or may not be fading into mediocrity as his velocity has dropped. Not a good sign from a 32 year old. Meanwhile, Burnett is entering into the best years of his career, has put up the stat line of an ace over the past year (go back 13 or so pages and look at my post about it if you don't believe me), and he's throwing 100 MPH. If you're going to give a huge package away, that would be the guy to get in return.

 

Jesus Christ.

 

When did he become available?

Edited June 29, 2005 by Dam8610

[Kyyle23]

He is hurt also. They moved Cuddyer over to 2b.

 

thier whole infield is a mess. Punto was hurt, Rivas was hurt, Cuddyer is hurt, Williams is hurt, Tiffie has been moved back and forth, Bartlett was already sent down. They need to make some sort of move.

 

But that aint my problem!!!!!!!!

[southsideirish71]

I'd really like to know why everyone seems to be so in love with a struggling 32 year old with velocity problems.

This is precisely why the Sox should go after Burnett. With Schmidt's past couple of years, the Giants are going to want a HUGE package for Schmidt, who may or may not be fading into mediocrity as his velocity has dropped. Not a good sign from a 32 year old. Meanwhile, Burnett is entering into the best years of his career, has put up the stat line of an ace over the past year (go back 13 or so pages and look at my post about it if you don't believe me), and he's throwing 100 MPH. If you're going to give a huge package away, that would be the guy to get in return.

When did he become available?

 

AJ Burnett would be great. You cant argue with 100mph from a starter.

 

Schmidt would be good as a plan B.

 

 

Lilly should be a plan NO.

[southsideirish71]

thier whole infield is a mess. Punto was hurt, Rivas was hurt, Cuddyer is hurt, Williams is hurt, Tiffie has been moved back and forth, Bartlett was already sent down. They need to make some sort of move.

 

But that aint my problem!!!!!!!!

 

 

Well it does if they take Randa who they have been scouting over the last week or so.

[southsideirish]

In his last three starts, all wins, Schmidt has a 1.23 ERA to go along with a 1.23 WHIP and 21 Ks over 22 innings.

 

Last 3 starts were at Detroit, at home against AZ, and at AZ. Not exactly awful hitting teams. Detroit is 13th in team batting average, while Arizona is 15th.

Edited June 29, 2005 by southsideirish

[VAfan]

I gotta go for now, so I'm going to make this really simple. Jason Schmidt's ERA this season is 4.81. He's had only 4 good starts and loads of other mediocre to poor starts. Until he drops that number quite a bit or can string together 3-4 more good starts, I don't even want to consider giving up our top two prospects and eating a bunch of money to acquire him based on the CHANCE that he could pitch like the Schmidt of old and get us to the Series. Until I see some indication that he can consistently pitch like Garland or Garcia, I don't want to give up that much for him.

 

The time to strike for Jason Schmidt is while there is some risk involved. If he completely returns to form, the price will get too high or SF will decide to keep him.

 

You just have to ask yourself whether Schmidt/Vizquel are a much better postseason bet than Contreras/Uribe. To me that is a no brainer even though Contreras has "stuff" as good as anyone. He's a head case that is easy to steal on who is likely to melt down in a high pressure game. (Frankly, El Duque, if healthy, would be a much less risky starter.) Schmidt, even if his velocity remains off a bit, is going to give his best effort and battle to keep the Sox in any game he pitches. And we aren't going to need him to be the ACE and beat the other team's ACE.

 

Plus, if SF takes Contreras/Uribe, the cost to the Sox will be minimal. Perhaps some combo of Anderson, plus Takatsu, Vizcaino or Bajenaru, plus Gload, Munoz, Diaz, or Borchard. None of those players are likely to help us this year in the postseason.

[qwerty]

We got $3 mil with Contreras, he's making $8.5 mil this yr and next. The $3 mil was to offset the rest of '04(500k) and this yr to bring his salary down to $6 mil($2.5 mil). We are on the hook for all of '06 for $8.5 mil.

 

This btw was KW's 2nd worst trade.

 

He was scheduled to make seven million this year, they are paying one million of it this year therefore the sox are paying six million

 

He is scheduled to make eight million is 2006 but the yankees are paying two million of it, therefore only six million for the white sox.

[DBAHO]

AJ Burnett would be great.  You cant argue with 100mph from a starter. 

 

Schmidt would be good as a plan B. 

Lilly should be a plan NO.

Don't trade for Burnett UNLESS you can work out a long - term deal with him.

 

Jason Schmidt will struggle at the Cell, and is not worth giving up someone like Brian Anderson or Brandon McCarthy.

 

Once again, I throw forward this name, as a starter / closer. Miguel Batista. 4-0, 2.29 ERA.

[DBAHO]

In his last three starts, all wins, Schmidt has a 1.23 ERA to go along with a 1.23 WHIP and 21 Ks over 22 innings.

 

Last 3 starts were at Detroit, at home against AZ, and at AZ.  Not exactly awful hitting teams. Detroit is 13th in team batting average, while Arizona is 15th.

Jason Schmidt pitched six innings and allowed three runs tonight in a win over the Diamondbacks.

All three runs scored in the third on Craig Counsell's homer and Troy Glaus' two-run double, but Schmidt was hardly dominant the rest of the way, giving up nine hits and walking three. He's still moving in the right direction, but he's not all the way back.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jun 29, 2005 -> 09:30 PM)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Sounds positive to me.

[DBAHO]

Sounds positive to me.

If you watched him pitch last night, you wouldn't have thought that was the case. Like I said before, control was off, velocity still not back.

[southsideirish71]

Don't trade for Burnett UNLESS you can work out a long - term deal with him.

 

Jason Schmidt will struggle at the Cell, and is not worth giving up someone like Brian Anderson or Brandon McCarthy.

 

Once again, I throw forward this name, as a starter / closer. Miguel Batista. 4-0, 2.29 ERA.

 

 

He is not stretched out to be a starter.

 

As a reliever I would be for it, as a starter NO.

 

 

This also sounds real promising. Sounds a bit like the Count.

 

Pitching

 

No pitcher shook off Blue Jays catchers more than Batista, who throughout his career has alternated between falling too much in love with his fastball and cut fastball and not using them enough. Batista can hit 95 MPH with his four-seam fastball and has a wide repertoire, but his sinking fastball and cutter should be his bread and butter. Ultimately, his success as a closer will depend on his ability to decide which offspeed pitch he best throws and then sticking with it.

[southsideirish]

Has anyone mentioned the Dodgers yet? Are they sellers? 6.5 out of the divison in third place and 7 out of the wild card. KW seemed to always like Odalis Perez and with him coming back next week, would this be something we would be interested in?

 

Just throwing it out there as a speculation. I don't know what his situation is or if the Dodgers like him too much not to give him up.

[Milkman delivers]

Has anyone mentioned the Dodgers yet? Are they sellers? 6.5 out of the divison in third place and 7 out of the wild card. KW seemed to always like Odalis Perez and with him coming back next week, would this be something we would be interested in?

 

Just throwing it out there as a speculation. I don't know what his situation is or if the Dodgers like him too much not to give him up.

 

Perez just signed like a 3-year deal. Doubt he's going anywhere.

 

I know, let's get Eric Gagne! Oh, wait...

[CWSGuy406]

Hey, I posted this exact point in response to the same post before I saw what you wrote.

 

And both of you are wrong.

 

You're using RF and ZR from this year -- a half season's worth of data, not much. 3E8 showed the past years with Uribe being much, much better. And even if you're gonna use defense as a standard using this years numbers, Uribe has almost two more Win Shares than Vizquel has defensively.

 

Other than errors, which mean very little in the grand scheme of things, Uribe is much better than Vizquel defensively.

 

A 19 game loser two years ago I believe?? One thing I will say is Bonderman's stuff is definitely much better then Brandon's, however Bmac has much better control and a better mentality then Bonoderman, he just has to harnass his nerves and throw strikes like we all know he can do.

 

A better mentality? What the heck?

 

Young isn't even close. The guys hitting .254 and striking out a ton. Sweeney isn't even that close yet. He's hitting .273 at AA, but he has NO HOMERS! That tells me he still has to develop some power before we even consider it.

 

Have you checked his OPS? And his walks? I'm more excited about Young than I am about Sweeney or Anderson...

Edited June 29, 2005 by CWSGuy406

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jun 29, 2005 -> 09:45 PM)

Perez just signed like a 3-year deal.  Doubt he's going anywhere.

 

I know, let's get Eric Gagne!  Oh, wait...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

As I said, it was just speculation. I also said I didn't know his situation. It was just a thought.

[DBAHO]

Seattle could be a good trading partner. J.J Putz, Julio Mateo and Ron Villone some bullpen guys to look at who are having good seasons.

 

Kent Mercker from the Reds as well, there's a few lefty relievers and LOOGY's out there who could help us.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jun 29, 2005 -> 09:49 PM)

Seattle could be a good trading partner. J.J Putz, Julio Mateo and Ron Villone some bullpen guys to look at who are having good seasons.

 

Kent Mercker from the Reds as well, there's a few lefty relievers and LOOGY's out there who could help us.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

I would love to have Putz. He is very good. No thank you on Mercker. What LOOGYs are out there? I know we aren't getting Wunsch back. Steve Kline?

Edited June 29, 2005 by southsideirish

[Balta1701]

Has anyone mentioned the Dodgers yet? Are they sellers? 6.5 out of the divison in third place and 7 out of the wild card. KW seemed to always like Odalis Perez and with him coming back next week, would this be something we would be interested in?

 

Just throwing it out there as a speculation. I don't know what his situation is or if the Dodgers like him too much not to give him up.

As a person who gets the LA Times every day, and who usuall flips to either Dodgers or Angels games after the Sox game ends in the Central time zone, let me just say this;

 

There is not a single person on the Dodgers' roster who I want the Sox to pick up, aside from Wunsch.

 

They have a couple of decent guys, but I wouldn't go anywhere near the contracts on those guys. The guys who are of decent value are either hurt a lot or are terrible additions to a club house or are not big upgrades over what we already have.

 

On top of that, I still expect Depodesta to be a buyer this year..

Edited June 29, 2005 by Balta1701

[DBAHO]

I would love to have Putz. He is very good. No thank you on Mercker. What LOOGYs are out there? I know we aren't getting Wunsch back. Steve Kline?

Here's a list of names that I put forward on a Lefties LOOGY's thread I made a month or 2 back;

 

John Grabow - Pittsburgh

Casey Fossum - Tampa Bay

Joey Eischen - Washington (currently on 60 day DL)

Kent Mercker - Cincinatti

Jorge De La Rosa - Milwaulkee

Ricardo Rincon - Oakland

Aaron Fultz - Philadelphia

Ron Villone - Seattle

John Foster - Atlanta

Trevor Miller - Tampa Bay

Cerda - Kansas City

[nitetrain8601]

AJ Burnett would be great.  You cant argue with 100mph from a starter. 

 

Schmidt would be good as a plan B. 

Lilly should be a plan NO.

 

If we're going after starting pitching, that would be my order of attack.