levine on 1000 earlier today

[thelatinoheat_30]

*he was saying that the sox are recruiting burnett by the compliments they are giving him and levine seemed to think the sox will get him eventually.

 

*the interesting part is that he said the sox might again consider using contreras as the closer if they do get burnett. i dunno about that tho cause if he comes into a 1-run games, allows a double, he is so easy to steal off of. if that guy takes third base, and w/ contreras's high amount of wild pitches, i don't think it's a great idea. plus wouldn't it take him longer to warm up since he's used to starting?

 

*silvy said he thinks a bigger need is a bullpen arm(which i agree with), esp. w/ hermanson's back issues and marte's inconsistency. levine countered by saying that every team has A and B relievers. because the sox are in so many tight games, ozzie has to use his A guys a lot. the way levine saw it was if you have 4 starters(the 4th being burnett) that can go 7 or 8, you reduce the number of relievers you use. cause since el duque and contreras usually go 6, you gotta use 3 or 4. i'd still say another bullpen arm, like a guardado, would be better, esp. considering burnett's injury past.

 

*just another note, i was reading a recap of yesterday's marlins game and i found a quote from jack mckeon that caught my attention:

''He pitched a real fine game,'' Marlins manager Jack McKeon said. ''I don't think anything was bothering him.''

http://www.tsn.ca/mlb/news_story.asp?ID=131351

 

i don't know if i'm making too much out of it, but what does mckeon mean by he didn't think anything was bothering burnett?

 

*also another quote from felipe alou referring to burnett

''could be one of the best pitchers in the game and probably will be.''

Edited July 25, 2005 by thelatinoheat_30

[KevHead0881]

i don't know if i'm making too much out of it, but what does mckeon mean by he didn't think anything was bothering burnett?

 

I'm pretty sure he was referring to how Burnett was handling the trade rumors. Basically saying that Burnett wasn't concerned with all the talk.

[nitetrain8601]

*he was saying that the sox are recruiting burnett by the compliments they are giving him and levine seemed to think the sox will get him eventually. 

 

*the interesting part is that he said the sox might again consider using contreras as the closer if they do get burnett.  i dunno about that tho cause if he comes into a 1-run games, allows a double, he is so easy to steal off of.  if that guy takes third base, and w/ contreras's high amount of wild pitches, i don't think it's a great idea.  plus wouldn't it take him longer to warm up since he's used to starting?

 

*silvy said he thinks a bigger need is a bullpen arm(which i agree with), esp. w/ hermanson's back issues and marte's inconsistency.  levine countered by saying that every team has A and B relievers.  because the sox are in so many tight games, ozzie has to use his A guys a lot.  the way levine saw it was if you have 4 starters(the 4th being burnett) that can go 7 or 8, you reduce the number of relievers you use.  cause since el duque and contreras usually go 6, you gotta use 3 or 4. i'd still say another bullpen arm, like a guardado, would be better, esp. considering burnett's injury past.

 

*just another note, i was reading a recap of yesterday's marlins game and i found a quote from jack mckeon that caught my attention:

 

http://www.tsn.ca/mlb/news_story.asp?ID=131351

 

i don't know if i'm making too much out of it, but what does mckeon mean by he didn't think anything was bothering burnett?

 

*also another quote from felipe alou referring to burnett

 

I think you're reading too much into the McKeon quote. He's talking about he's doing good with all the trade rumors going around.

[ChWRoCk2]

i dont want the guy if hes concerned about changing teams, that may cause some sort of clubhouse distraction, I say stick with what we got unless we can trade for a player that will resign for another year

[southsider17]

*the interesting part is that he said the sox might again consider using contreras as the closer if they do get burnett.  i dunno about that tho cause if he comes into a 1-run games, allows a double, he is so easy to steal off of.  if that guy takes third base, and w/ contreras's high amount of wild pitches, i don't think it's a great idea.  plus wouldn't it take him longer to warm up since he's used to starting?

 

 

Thing is, most modern closers are brought in at the beginning of the 9th. I would think Ozzie is smart enough to not bring Contreras in with runners on. Contreras has consistently been at the top of the league in Batting Average Against. If he could stay away from walks he'll be an excellent late inning reliever.

 

And, yes, I realize that's a big "if".

[White Sox Josh]

Thing is, most modern closers are brought in at the beginning of the 9th.  I would think Ozzie is smart enough to not bring Contreras in with runners on.  Contreras has consistently been at the top of the league in Batting Average Against.  If he could stay away from walks he'll be an excellent late inning reliever.

 

And, yes, I realize that's a big "if".

well if you thought Koch made things interesting than you would be in heart attack central with Contreras as your closer.

[southsider17]

Yeah but Contreras didn't just get off the juice.

[RockRaines]

well if you thought Koch made things interesting than you would be in heart attack central with Contreras as your closer.

Wow, night and day arms on those two pitchers. Comparing their stuff is not even close.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(ChWRoCk2 @ Jul 25, 2005 -> 05:11 PM)

i dont want the guy if hes concerned about changing teams, that may cause some sort of clubhouse distraction, I say stick with what we got unless we can trade for a player that will resign for another year

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think everyone and anyone would be concerned. Not knowing where your going to be tomorrow or who your going to play for. Starting a new job is a lot of stress for people. It is pretty much the same thing and he seems to be doing quite well with it. I say upgrade anything you can.

[White Sox Josh]

Yeah but Contreras didn't just get off the juice.

he was never on steroids. He was overworked by Oakland and than traded. He was totally abused by them and thats why he lost the velocity on his fastball.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(southsider17 @ Jul 25, 2005 -> 05:18 PM)

Yeah but Contreras didn't just get off the juice.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Where is the proof of this? I can't stand people that throw names out there with no proof of anything. That is an ugly thing to say about someone and he never fit into that whole thing. Show me some evidence or proof of this.

[KevHead0881]

All I know is that Contreras has troubles with the strike zone. That's usually not a very good sign for a closer. Think of how irritating it was watching Marte walk two guys in the 9th yesterday.

 

I'd rather save Contreras for long relief.

[Kyyle23]

Where is the proof of this? I can't stand people that throw names out there with no proof of anything. That is an ugly thing to say about someone and he never fit into that whole thing. Show me some evidence or proof of this.

 

b-b-b-b-but he played in Oakland, very close to Balco! The connection is there! You just have to be imaginative!

 

I always thought that Koch benefited from the immediate results of Tommy John, in which many pitchers gain a little velocity(maybe from the tightness of the new ligaments) and then surely drop to where they were before(some get worse). Its too bad the White Sox had to realize that he was done after everyone else did, but oh well, whats done is done.

[southsider17]

Where is the proof of this? I can't stand people that throw names out there with no proof of anything. That is an ugly thing to say about someone and he never fit into that whole thing. Show me some evidence or proof of this.

 

 

That was said tongue-in-check and it hurts no one since that "rumor" is already out there.

[103 mph screwball]

i dont want the guy if hes concerned about changing teams, that may cause some sort of clubhouse distraction, I say stick with what we got unless we can trade for a player that will resign for another year

 

Freddie said that he wanted to stay in Seattle. Personally, I don't trust players who demand trades.

 

Also, the way I interpret AJ's comments is that he would consider an in season extension to the right team. He want to test his value on the free agent market. The Sox may be one of those right teams. Has he said that I do not want to play for the White Sox and there is no way I will sign with them if I'm forced to go there? No, at least I don't think so.

 

I agree with you if he will not sign long term, BMac is a pretty big price for a rent a player. Reluctantly, I'd bite the bullet and go for it. If the Sox win it all, I can deal with BMac winning Cy Youngs for another team. BMac may be back someday if this is handled correctly. After all, he is a big Sox fan and will eventually be a free agent.

[SoxFan1]

Where is the proof of this? I can't stand people that throw names out there with no proof of anything. That is an ugly thing to say about someone and he never fit into that whole thing. Show me some evidence or proof of this.

I agree. For some reason, people here love throwing out names and players associated with steroids with absolutely NO proof or evidence or vindication.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(southsider17 @ Jul 25, 2005 -> 05:28 PM)

That was said tongue-in-check and it hurts no one since that "rumor" is already out there.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

I have never seen that rumor. If it is tounge in cheek then put it in green. Don't state it as if it is fact because it is far from it.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(kyyle23 @ Jul 25, 2005 -> 05:27 PM)

b-b-b-b-but he played in Oakland, very close to Balco!  The connection is there!  You just have to be imaginative!

 

I always thought that Koch benefited from the immediate results of Tommy John, in which many pitchers gain a little velocity(maybe from the tightness of the new ligaments) and then surely drop to where they were before(some get worse).  Its too bad the White Sox had to realize that he was done after everyone else did, but oh well, whats done is done.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

He was throwing near 100 with Toronto. When was his Tommy John surgery?

 

He seemed like an awesome guy, a standup guy, and a great teammate. It sucks that you have some people, not you kyyle23, making statements and speculations that he would ever be on steroids.

[103 mph screwball]

It sucks that you have some people, not you kyyle23, making statements and speculations that he would ever be on steroids.

 

That does suck. It sucks bigtime. Don't blame the people speculating, blame the MLB and their previous steroid policy.

[Kyyle23]

He was throwing near 100 with Toronto. When was his Tommy John surgery?

 

He seemed like an awesome guy, a standup guy, and a great teammate. It sucks that you have some people, not you kyyle23, making statements and speculations that he would ever be on steroids.

 

If anyone knows of a site that tells you information about injuries to players during their career, and not just current injuries, feel free to let me know about it.

 

SSI, I found this article about Koch and Benson coming out of Clemson together, it doesnt get too specific about everything around his injury, but here you go.

http://cworld.clemson.edu/winter2000/b&b.htm

 

Koch suffered a career-threatening elbow injury in 1997 -- his first minor league season. Pitching in Lakeland, Fla., in only his third game for Class A Dunedin, Koch says, "I threw a pitch and felt a pop in my elbow. That's a pitcher's worst nightmare . . . . The first baseman said I turned ghost white.

"I walked halfway to the catcher and asked the umpire for a new ball. After I threw the old ball back to the catcher, I felt like my hand was dragging on the ground. I fell to my knees and started crying. I felt my career was over."

But his career was saved when Dr. James Andrews of Birmingham, Ala., took a tendon from Koch's right wrist to reconstruct a ligament in his pitching elbow.

Koch sat out the remainder of 1997 and pitched timidly at Dunedin for the first half of 1998. "I was afraid [of re-injuring myself]," he says. "I was pitching at Ft. Myers, Fla., and I gave up two runs in the first inning and went to the clubhouse and destroyed a couple of chairs."

Pitching coach Rick Langford came to the clubhouse and convinced Koch to test his arm fully.

"I had a 5-6 record until that point," Koch says. "From then on I was 9-1. That was pretty much the turning point in my career. If Rick hadn't come in, I don't know if I would have been able to take that step."

Koch finished 14-7. The next season, 1999, he pitched only five games at Triple-A Syracuse. Despite the fact that he had pitched in only 35 minor league regular season games, all as a starter, Toronto called him up to close games in relief.

Koch says his chances of successfully closing games with no relief pitching experience were "slim and none."

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(103 mph screwball @ Jul 25, 2005 -> 06:05 PM)

That does suck.  It sucks bigtime.  Don't blame the people speculating, blame the MLB and their previous steroid policy.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

No, those who speculate and make statements as if they are fact should take the responsibility for it. Don't just start throwing out accusations for no apparent reason. Sosa, Bonds, and McGwire I can see. There is some evidence there to back it up. But Billy Koch? Come on!

[103 mph screwball]

No, those who speculate and make statements as if they are fact should take the responsibility for it. Don't just start throwing out accusations for no apparent reason. Sosa, Bonds, and McGwire I can see. There is some evidence there to back it up. But Billy Koch? Come on!

 

 

I agree with you that making a statement as fact, when it is pure speculation is inappropriate. Speculation itself is reasonable based on the fact that various reports say there were a lot of positive steroid test results that have been kept confidential. How many players have admitted it? Bonds, Giambi kind of, maybe a few others I can't think of. That tells me that there are many more who did it and we do not know who they are. What makes me angry is that now everyone who now has a drop in performance will get grouped into this steroid mess. That is baseball's fault.

 

I don't think Billy Koch did steroids either. I also thing Oakland overused him and when they realized that they traded him to the Sox for Foulke who JM had lost confidence in. Good thing Cotts is working out. However, circumstantial evidence like the fact he was close to Balco when he was good, he lost velocity, he got bad when he went to the Sox who are anti-steroids before that was cool makes some people speculate.

 

Thats what I mean by it sucks and that it is MLB's fault. You are right though. Saying so and so is a roid freak without proof is wrong. I'm not trying to be a jerk or disrespectful so I hope I don't come accross that way.

[Kyyle23]

However, circumstantial evidence like the fact he was close to Balco when he was good, he lost velocity, he got bad when he went to the Sox who are anti-steroids before that was cool makes some people speculate.

 

 

 

That is flat out wrong though! Koch was hitting 100 MPH regularly in Toronto. He started losing velocity when he came to Oakland. The end of his year in Oakland was when things started falling apart for him.

 

For your circumstancial evidence to work, Balco has to have a center in Toronto.

[southsider17]

Alot of seriousness for a baseball internet board.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(kyyle23 @ Jul 25, 2005 -> 07:09 PM)

That is flat out wrong though!  Koch was hitting 100 MPH regularly in Toronto.  He started losing velocity when he came to Oakland.  The end of his year in Oakland was when things started falling apart for him.

 

For your circumstancial evidence to work, Balco has to have a center in Toronto.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Exactly