Jayson Stark

[Y2HH]

Every year KW makes big trades and I hear words like "mortgages the future by selling out the farm", being tossed around...yet we always seem to have more prospects...who we RARELY ever see in the majors.

 

I thought we sold the farm in 2001. And in 2002.

 

I thought we mortgaged the future in 2003.

 

Again in 2004?

 

Wait...now it's 2005 and we have a REAL team, balanced, can pitch, etc...

 

Prospects = overrated.

 

Trade them all.

 

Mortgaging the future...listen to yourselves...WHAT FUTURE...WE HAVEN'T WON ANYTHING SINCE 1917!#$!#@#! If it's more of THAT future you speak of, you can take the future and stick it!

[daa84]

Every year KW makes big trades and I hear words like "mortgages the future by selling out the farm", being tossed around...yet we always seem to have more prospects...who we RARELY ever see in the majors.

 

I thought we sold the farm in 2001.  And in 2002.

 

I thought we mortgaged the future in 2003.

 

Again in 2004?

 

Wait...now it's 2005 and we have a REAL team, balanced, can pitch, etc...

 

Prospects = overrated.

 

Trade them all.

 

Mortgaging the future...listen to yourselves...WHAT FUTURE...WE HAVEN'T WON ANYTHING SINCE 1917!#$!#@#!  If it's more of THAT future you speak of, you can take the future and stick it!

 

i agree. in my opinion the only prospects who are ever untouchable are sure fire guys. the guys like delmon young, and felix hernandez. i mean i remember when people threw a fit that we traded anthony webster to texas. tell me what these guys have amounted to? the only ones who have contributed are gary majewski, kip wells and josh fogg. fogg has been just plain bad, wells has been ok. but even i will say that the ritchie deal was abysmal. but what about webster? rupe? frankie francisco had 1 good year then went nuts and hurt himself. olivo is a huge bust. reed will be a decent OFer, but in our system would still be ranked behind anderson and young IMO. rauch hasnt amounted to anything. reed, majewski and morse are the only ones who look like htey might be solid major leaguers, and lets face it majewski 1.) isnt as good as his numbers this year, and 2.) nobody shed a tear when he left. morse.....1.) the sox wanted to get rid because of personal issues, and 2.) also isnt really as good as he has done this year. if he was the mariners wouldnt have started wilson valdez at the beginning of the year

 

now look at who we got in trades like those.....garcia, everett (2nd in RBIs on this team playin in fewer games than most). those two alone are a huge reason why we are in 1st. yes alomar and ritchie sucked, but the guys we have gotten have had a bigger impact than the guys we gave up. so if KW wants to deal bmac, young, anderson etc......go for it. i want to see our guys with a ring

[southsider2k5]

I guarantee you that if Damon doesn't resign with the Red Sox, they'll trade for Baldelli.  Young and Crawford are the only guaranteed members of their offense.  Gomes is more of a DH.  Tampa doesn't have the money to go out and sign a FA starting pitcher.  They need to have prospects to trade in order to get the starter, and they'll have no problem bringing in more outfielders.

 

Rocco Baldelli will not be a Red Sox. He is 180 degrees from what they are looking for with the Bill James philosophy on OBP. He only took 30 walks last year and had an OBP of only .326. It will never happen.

Edited July 27, 2005 by southsider2k5

[daa84]

Rocco Baldelli will not be a Red Sox.  He is 180 degrees from what they are looking for with the Bill James philosophy on OBP. He only took 30 walks last year and had an OBP of only .326.  It will never happen.

bill james also said its absurd to ever draft a high school pitcher, yet they took teh kid from waubansie valley in the supp 1st round

[Ozzie Montana]

Im rather high on Overbay and Huff is a good 2nd half player. I'd choose Overbay because he has a decent amount of HRs and is a doubles hitter which fits our team. I think Huff is having a down year and maybe 7.5 mil. is too much of a chance. Baez would be dependable if Hermanson was to miss some time on the DL. No telling what Lamarr would be asking for. No new progress with Burnet tso i dont know the situation over there.

[SpringfieldFan]

i agree. in my opinion the only prospects who are ever untouchable are sure fire guys. the guys like delmon young, and felix hernandez. i mean i remember when people threw a fit that we traded anthony webster to texas. tell me what these guys have amounted to? the only ones who have contributed are gary majewski, kip wells and josh fogg. fogg has been just plain bad, wells has been ok. but even i will say that the ritchie deal was abysmal. but what about webster? rupe? frankie francisco had 1 good year then went nuts and hurt himself. olivo is a huge bust. reed will be a decent OFer, but in our system would still be  ranked behind anderson and young IMO. rauch hasnt amounted to anything. reed, majewski and morse are the only ones who look like htey might be solid major leaguers, and lets face it majewski 1.) isnt as good as his numbers this year, and 2.) nobody shed a tear when he left. morse.....1.) the sox wanted to get rid because of personal issues, and 2.) also isnt really as good as he has done this year. if he was the mariners wouldnt have started wilson valdez at the beginning of the year

 

now look at who we got in trades like those.....garcia, everett (2nd in RBIs on this team playin in fewer games than most). those two alone are a huge reason why we are in 1st. yes alomar and ritchie sucked, but the guys we have gotten have had a bigger impact than the guys we gave up. so if KW wants to deal bmac, young, anderson etc......go for it. i want to see our guys with a ring

 

Webster, lol! I had forgotten about him!

[Kyyle23]

Baez would be a minimal improvement on the team and would have a minimal impact in the playoffs.

 

 

Baez is getting the job done on a pretty bad team, that has to be taken into some sort of measure.

 

45.1 innings, 3.18 ERA, 36 K, 21 BB, 19 Sv, 42 H, 5 HR, OPP BA .244

 

compared to the guy we all know aint getting it done, Luis Vizcaino

 

49 innings, 3.86 ERA, 27 K, 22 BB, 0 Sv, 51 H, 6 HR, OPP BA .270

[knightni]

Baez is getting the job done on a pretty bad team, that has to be taken into some sort of measure.

 

45.1 innings, 3.18 ERA, 36 K, 21 BB, 19 Sv, 42 H, 5 HR, OPP BA .244

 

compared to the guy we all know aint getting it done, Luis Vizcaino

 

49 innings, 3.86 ERA, 27 K, 22 BB, 0 Sv, 51 H, 6 HR, OPP BA .270

The numbers are closer than they appear.

 

Walks are close, as are hits & HRs. BA is in the same ballpark, Ks are decently close, and Viz has his ERA under 4 now.

 

He's perfect trade bait while it stays under 4.00.

[DBAHO]

The numbers are closer than they appear.

 

Walks are close, as are hits & HRs. BA is in the same ballpark, Ks are decently close, and Viz has his ERA under 4 now.

 

He's perfect trade bait while it stays under 4.00.

Baez has to pitch a lot of 2 inning saves / appearances though, that increases his ERA. He's been better than the stats indicate.

[thedoctor]

this is what start had to say about burnett and the sox in espninsider. if posting this is a no-no i apologize in advance:

 

The transactions column may not be heating up much as the trade deadline approaches. But at least the GM poker games are getting better. In one corner, you find the Marlins -- trying to up the ante on Burnett by spreading word everywhere that they may just keep him if they can't get what they want. And now, in another corner, you have their No. 1 dance partner, the White Sox -- turning their attention away from Burnett and toward other areas where they might be able to deal for an impact player or two. The White Sox may not have gotten too far in their furious charges in the direction of Jason Schmidt or Barry Zito. But there were indications Tuesday that they have been working on a potential whopper of a deal with Tampa Bay that could bring them both Danys Baez and Aubrey Huff. And to get them, the White Sox would have to give up at least some of the pitchers they've been speaking to Florida about -- particularly relievers Damaso Marte, Cliff Politte and/or Neal Cotts -- plus other prospects. The White Sox are all about positioning themselves to win the World Series now. And if they can't get a dominating starter, they wouldn't mind adding a power closer. "I know Dustan Hermanson has done a great job," says an official of one team that has been talking with the White Sox. "But he's not striking anybody out. He's getting guys out with a lot of back-door sliders. And if you're a playoff team, he's not a guy you want closing games for you in October." Huff, who has hit better than .300 and slugged over .550 the last four weeks, could be a fit for the White Sox at third base, first base, DH or right field. But even if the White Sox can make this deal, there are indications they are still trying to figure out how they can do it and also trade for Burnett. One executive who has been in contact with the White Sox says they've made it clear that they would only deal their best starting-pitching prospect, Brandon McCarthy, for Burnett or some other top-of-the-rotation starter. McCarthy would still loom as the centerpiece of any trade with Florida. But is he enough? An official of one team that spoke with the Marlins on Tuesday reported that they continue to tell other clubs they've decided not to deal Burnett "unless it's the deal THEY want to make, for the pieces THEY want back." And it seems clear now that the deal they want to make with the White Sox would include both Marte and McCarthy. But the White Sox are reluctant to trade Marte. And even if they did, that package would be hard for Florida to accept unless it can make a separate deal for a veteran starter, such as Pittsburgh's Mark Redman. So as all this percolates, the Red Sox are still expressing interest in Burnett. And one baseball man now rates the Tigers as a dark horse -- if only because the Tigers think they can sign Burnett, either this month or this winter. Among the players it's believed Florida has targeted with Detroit are pitcher Mike Maroth and good-looking rookie outfielder Curtis Granderson (hitting .357 since his July 22 call-up). OK, got all that? We'd still bet on Burnett landing in Chicago this week. But right now, just about anything is possible.

[thelatinoheat_30]

Baez has to pitch a lot of 2 inning saves / appearances though, that increases his ERA. He's been better than the stats indicate.

 

that's true, but when viz is good(like currently), he's better than baez.

[Jordan4life_2007]

this is what start had to say about burnett and the sox in espninsider. if posting this is a no-no i apologize in advance:

 

 

Pretty much what we already knew. I'm now starting to suspect we won't do anything major.

[SoxFan1]

I am starting to believe that KW will not make any trades at all. It is just not his style to have everything out in the open....

[Jordan4life_2007]

I am starting to believe that KW will not make any trades at all. It is just not his style to have everything out in the open....

 

 

It's not Kenny. It's everybody else. Kenny hasn't said anything about any trades.

[SoxFan1]

It's not Kenny.  It's everybody else.  Kenny hasn't said anything about any trades.

This is true but did we know ANYTHING about Carl Everett? Did we know ANYTHING about Robbie Alomar. All this was kept under-wraps and was a surprise to everyone. KW's style is not to have anything known. Trust me, he watches TV and listens to the Radio too.

[Frank the Tank 35]

that's true, but when viz is good(like currently), he's better than baez.

 

Baez is closing though... something that can wear on the mentality of a pitcher (ie Hawkins, Politte was horrible as a closer in Toronto). I have a feeling if Viz was closing games, it would be much worse. He just doesn't seem to have the right mentality, concentration, etc.

 

Someone mentioned Huff's salary: this year $2.7 mil (we'd only owe him around $1 mil?) next year $5 mil

 

I like Huff and Overbay, but I think Huff could be that big stick w/ high average in the middle of the lineup we've been looking for, not to mention the fact he's bats lefty. He's not a logjam on the basepaths as he has 8 steals. He's hitting .314 in July with .968 OPS. Last year he hit .385 in August and .310 in Sept. Two years ago he hit .359 in August and .302 in Sept. Lifetime he's a .313 hitter after the all star break with August being his best month and September a close 3rd... significantly more homers and rbi's in less games played too.

[Rowand44]

This is true but did we know ANYTHING about Carl Everett? Did we know ANYTHING about Robbie Alomar. All this was kept under-wraps and was a surprise to everyone. KW's style is not to have anything known. Trust me, he watches TV and listens to the Radio too.

Everyone knew the Sox were going after Alomar in 03, the Everett trade however kind of came out of no where. Last year there was a ton of speculation about Carl and everyone knew we were after Freddy as well. Some times you can keep things quiet but some times you just can't. Anyways it seems to be more quiet today then it has the past 3-4 days, who knows maybe something's brewing.

[YASNY]

And to get them, the White Sox would have to give up at least some of the pitchers they've been speaking to Florida about -- particularly relievers Damaso Marte, Cliff Politte and/or Neal Cotts -- plus other prospects. The White Sox are all about positioning themselves to win the World Series now.

 

Does anybody take this seriously? Decimating the bullpen and positioning themselves to win the WS is an oxymoron if I ever heard one.

[VAfan]

Please don't trade for Danys "Blown Save" Baez. I wouldn't give up anyone to get that guy. 6 blown saves so far this year, on his way to topping his 10 blown saves in 2003.

 

Do you know where we would be right now if our bullpen had blown 6 more games?? We'd be in the thick of a race for the AL Central, and if we lost that, we'd be hard pressed to win the Wild Card against the resurgent A's.

 

The more I hear the trade options, the more I want us to stand pat and do nothing. Deals that once might have been fair, seem ever more tilted against us as the deadline draws close.

 

I'd be ready to face the Yankees or BoSox with what we, and they, have. I think the bigger threats are the A's and Angels, but I'm willing to go against them too if we rest Frank until September.

[nitetrain8601]

I don't see us trading anyone but Marte in the bullpen. Anything after that is asking for trouble.