what is Joe Morgan's problem??

[bjm676]

Never Heard that, but I know a couple of Cub players were banging Sandbergs Ex-wife

 

 

Rafael Palmeiro was one of them. That's one of the reasons he was traded.

[jamslam]

You are exactly right Robin!

[White Sox Josh]

You are exactly right Robin!

was he using viagra at the time?

[Rex Hudler]

Sandberg is a good player but I wouldnt really call him HOF material..... sure his fielding percantage was awesome but if you play such a small range it should be damn good.

 

For a guy with such small range, I certainly remember him making plays up the middle and in short RF all the time. He could go get a ball behind second base and throw to 1B while fading away quite well. He never, ever dove for a ball and that bugged me about him, but I wouldn't say his range was terrible by any means. Might not have been the best, but he was definitely a 2B you would want playing on your team.

 

Sandberg was a great player and one of the best of his era. He is definitely HOF material.

[ZoomSlowik]

Frankly Joe Morgan doesn't impress me a whole lot as a player. He had some good years, but isn't it interesting how much better his batting numbers got once he became a Red? My personal vote is if he didn't play on the Big Red Machine, one of the best offenses ever, he isn't a HOF'er, or at the very least borderline. Sandberg performed even though he was on some awful teams.

Edited August 1, 2005 by ZoomSlowik

[hammerhead johnson]

Frankly Joe Morgan doesn't impress me a whole lot as a player. He had some good years, but isn't it interesting how much better his batting numbers got once he became a Red? My personal vote is if he didn't play on the Big Red Machine, one of the best offenses ever, he isn't a HOF'er, or at the very least borderline. Sandberg performed even though he was on some awful teams.

 

That is very interesting, although he was just entering his prime when he became a Red. For 6 straight years, he was an absolute monster and an extremely valuable championship piece.

 

1972

Led the league in OBP (.417)

Led the league in runs (122)

Second in the league in SB (58)

 

1973

Gold Glove

Second in the league in runs (116)

Second in the league in SB (67)

 

1974

Gold Glove

Led the league in OBP (.427)

Third in the league in OPS (.921)

Third in the league in SB (58)

 

1975

MVP Award

Gold Glove

Led the league in OPS (.974)

Led the league in OBP (.466)

Second in the league in SB (67)

 

1976

MVP AWARD

Gold Glove

Led the league in OPS (1.020)

Led the league in OBP (.444)

Led the league in SLG (.576)

Second in the league in SB (60)

Second in the league in runs (113)

 

1977

Gold Glove

Second in the league in OBP (.417)

 

Morgan turned 34 in 1978, and his skills had deteriorated big time. He went from hitting .288 in 1977 to .236 in 1978, and he fell out of the Top 10 in SB for the first time since 1969.

 

Still though, he was easily the best second baseman of his era, and a Top 10 second baseman in baseball history.

 

BTW, my Top 10:

 

1. Rogers Hornsby

2. Nap Lajoie

3. Jackie Robinson

4. Charlie Gehringer

5. Roberto Alomar

6. Eddie Collins

7. Bobby Doerr

8. Joe Morgan

9. Ryne Sandberg

10. Bill Mazeroski

[whitesox91403]

Never Heard that, but I know a couple of Cub players were banging Sandbergs Ex-wife

 

yes, former White Sox OF Dave Martinez was another, that's why he got traded.

[Kid Gleason]

I thought that basically all of the MLB was banging his wife.

 

As for Morgan being racist, he and Miller seem to get along fine, and I am not so sure there is a whiter man out there than Miller.

[YASNY]

I thought that basically all of the MLB was banging his wife. 

 

As for Morgan being racist, he and Miller seem to get along fine, and I am not so sure there is a whiter man out there than Miller.

 

Just listen to Morgan talk about player evaluations and comparisons.

[Steff]

As for Morgan being racist, he and Miller seem to get along fine, and I am not so sure there is a whiter man out there than Miller.

 

I agree. I don't think he's racist. Guilty of speaking before thinking at times.. but I don't think he's racist.

[YASNY]

Let me say that my opinion of Joe is not something off the cuff. It has been a long time, accumulative type of thing. I just started noticing things with a comment here, and another one there. So I started listening more closely. It's only an opinion, but it's not one that I will not dismiss lightly or quickly.

 

Edited to add the word "not" in the last sentence.

Edited August 1, 2005 by YASNY

[3E8]

BTW, my Top 10:

 

1. Rogers Hornsby

2. Nap Lajoie

3. Jackie Robinson

4. Charlie Gehringer

5. Roberto Alomar

6. Eddie Collins

7. Bobby Doerr

8. Joe Morgan

9. Ryne Sandberg

10. Bill Mazeroski

I also think Hornsby deserves top honors while most give it to Morgan. My list would include Craig Biggio though.

[hammerhead johnson]

I also think Hornsby deserves top honors while most give it to Morgan.  My list would include Craig Biggio though.

 

If someone says that Morgan gets consideration as a Top 3 second baseman in the history of baseball, then that person just doesn't know their s***. The true sign of a fool is when one takes a definitive stance on something without the benefit of research. Well, actaully, that is one of the many true signs of a fool, but the most relevant to what we're discussing here.

 

I'd put Biggio in the Top 15. He's one of the most underrated players of the last quarter century. There is a good chance that he won't even make it to the HOF.

[Middle Buffalo]

Where would Roberto Alomar fit in on a list of great 2B? Did he ruin his legacy by sticking around when he couldn't play anymore?

[YASNY]

Where would Roberto Alomar fit in on a list of great 2B?  Did he ruin his legacy by sticking around when he couldn't play anymore?

 

Not in my mind. He was one of the greatest 2B's of all time, whether he stuck around too long or not.

[Middle Buffalo]

1. Rogers Hornsby

2. Nap Lajoie

3. Jackie Robinson

4. Charlie Gehringer

5. Roberto Alomar

6. Eddie Collins

7. Bobby Doerr

8. Joe Morgan

9. Ryne Sandberg

10. Bill Mazeroski

Oops. That's it, I'm ordering "Hooked on Phonics."

[ZoomSlowik]

If someone says that Morgan gets consideration as a Top 3 second baseman in the history of baseball, then that person just doesn't know their s***.  The true sign of a fool is when one takes a definitive stance on something without the benefit of research.  Well, actaully, that is one of the many true signs of a fool, but the most relevant to what we're discussing here.

 

I'd put Biggio in the Top 15.  He's one of the most underrated players of the last quarter century.  There is a good chance that he won't even make it to the HOF.

 

Morgan was definitely impressive in his prime, but was not exactly great before/after. He didn't really hit his prime until 29, and kept playing into his early 40's despite the fact that his last several years were pretty bad. I find it hard to believe that He improved that much between 71 and 72, so I'm more inclined to believe that playing with the likes of Rose and Bench really helped him out. His three years before joining the Reds he hit .236, .268, .256. His first three years on the Reds he hit .292, .290, and .293. He always walked a lot and had decent speed, but without those 6 years with the Reds his numbers look pedestrian, somewhat like Luis Aparicio's with more walks, and he got in based on his superior defense and speed.

 

BTW, Hornsby was the man. A qestion about your list: no Rod Carew? He's got quite a few batting titles.

Edited August 1, 2005 by ZoomSlowik

[SouthsideNorthsideFan]

I also think Hornsby deserves top honors while most give it to Morgan.  My list would include Craig Biggio though.

 

Had Alomar had more years of numbers near his prime, he'd be in the top five. Unfortunately for him his dropoff was sharp, and final, dropping him below Morgan or Sandberg, no question.

 

If you're looking at entire careers, BIGGIO >>> Alomar...it's not even close.

BIGGIO >>> Maz for multitudes of reasons.

[Middle Buffalo]

Had Alomar had more years of numbers near his prime, he'd be in the top five.  Unfortunately for him his dropoff was sharp, and final, dropping him below Morgan or Sandberg, no question.

 

If you're looking at entire careers, BIGGIO >>> Alomar...it's not even close.

BIGGIO >>> Maz for multitudes of reasons.

Your avatar stinks.

[SouthsideNorthsideFan]

Your avatar stinks.

 

I know, but yours was already taken.

[hammerhead johnson]

If you're looking at entire careers, BIGGIO >>> Alomar...it's not even close.

BIGGIO >>> Maz for multitudes of reasons.

 

That's crazy talk, dude. Alomar might have been the greatest defensive second baseman of all time. His offensive skills were insane. He's a legend, quite frankly. Biggio shouldn't be in the same paragraph as Alomar, let alone the same sentence.

[3E8]

That's crazy talk, dude.  Alomar might have been the greatest defensive second baseman of all time.  His offensive skills were insane.  He's a legend, quite frankly.  Biggio shouldn't be in the same paragraph as Alomar, let alone the same sentence.

Yep. I'm a huge, huge Biggio fan but Alomar was much better defensively and also better offensively, but not by as wide a margin.

[qwerty]

I think because biggio wasthe only right-handed batter to play a 162-game season without grounding into any double plays that it is... biggio>alomar.

[Kyyle23]

Joe Morgan says, the very integrity of baseball has been affected by steroids. "It's not just the home runs, but stamina, the way the game is played," he said. "Little things don't matter - speed, stealing bases," he added, pointing to this turn as a reason he believes teams no longer actively pursue African American prospects. "It's all tied together. Players are locked onto first base waiting for the home run. They don't need us anymore." Morgan paused. "There's not a big enough asterisk to handle all of this. There has to be some penalty. I just don't know what it is."

 

I used to really like to hear what Morgan had to say, but he just seems to get progressively more racist as he gets older.

[White Sox Josh]

1. Rogers Hornsby

2. Nap Lajoie

3. Jackie Robinson

4. Charlie Gehringer

5. Roberto Alomar

6. Eddie Collins

7. Bobby Doerr

8. Joe Morgan

9. Ryne Sandberg

10. Bill Mazeroski

IMHO RObinson was the best 2B of all time. His numbers were very good and had baseball allowed African Americans earlier he would would've been a 300-300 guy. He had very good and he didn't start playing when he was in his prime.