Good to be the King

[FlaSoxxJim]

If this isn't playing both ends against the middle I don't know what it is. The administration stonewalls for weeks by refusing to disclose requested documents that the Senate deems highly relevant to the Bolton nomination, and then cites the Senate's inaction as the reason to make the recess appointment.

 

If they really wanted the up or down vote why didn't they make the requested documents available for review?

 

Story:

 

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=997156

[Soxy]

Yes, but, see, the last election was a mandate that he can do whatever he wants. Perhpas you've forgotten?

[FlaSoxxJim]

Yes, but, see, the last election was a mandate that he can do whatever he wants. Perhpas you've forgotten? 

True, I did forget. In my world 51% still gets you an "F".

[Rex Kickass]

They didn't filibuster because they didn't want him. They wanted the vote - but there were allegations that Democrats thought warranted an investigation.

 

The President chose NOT to release requested documents. Just like the President is choosing NOT to release documents relating to the Supreme Court Justice nomination. If you won't play ball by the rules you expect everyone else to play by, you don't belong in the game.

[FlaSoxxJim]

The President chose NOT to release requested documents. Just like the President is choosing NOT to release documents relating to the Supreme Court Justice nomination. If you won't play ball by the rules you expect everyone else to play by, you don't belong in the game.

 

[southsider2k5]

To be honest with the vilification of Bush I never realized how many President's used this tool, and to the huge extent that some President's used it, even so far as one President using it to put 3 Supreme Court justices on the bench, including a Head Justice.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...0100476_pf.html

[LowerCaseRepublican]

Eisenhower isn't all bad..."Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history. There is a tiny splinter group, of course, that believes that you can do these things. Among them are a few Texas oil millionaires, and an occasional politician or businessman from other areas. Their number is negligible and they are stupid."

 

http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/ike.asp

[Rex Kickass]

To be honest with the vilification of Bush I never realized how many President's used this tool, and to the huge extent that some President's used it, even so far as one President using it to put 3 Supreme Court justices on the bench, including a Head Justice.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...0100476_pf.html

 

There are times when its warranted. This is not one of those times.

[EvilMonkey]

There are times when its warranted. This is not one of those times.

 

In your opinion. Apparently Georgie thinks it is.

[LowerCaseRepublican]

In your opinion.  Apparently Georgie thinks it is.

Well Georgie also thought Iraq had WMD. And we know how that turned out.

[CubKilla]

Well Georgie also thought Iraq had WMD.  And we know how that turned out.

 

So did most of the world..... including Clinton and Gore.

 

God..... you libs are like a broken record.

Edited August 2, 2005 by CubKilla

[KipWellsFan]

So did most of the world..... including Clinton and Gore.

 

God..... you libs are like a broken record.

 

Alright, then Bush also thought it was a good idea to rush into Iraq with little thought on what to do after initial victory and what the consequences of an invasion would be. And we know how that's turning out, or at least most libs do.

Edited August 2, 2005 by KipWellsFan

[KipWellsFan]

Wow I'd never seen this video before.

 

http://movies.crooksandliars.com/UNbelievable.mov

 

John Bolton is the definition of a neo-conservative and for that reason there is no reason for anyone outside the United States to like this appointment, especially considering his short term would never be long enough to evoke great reform in such a large bureaucracy.

Edited August 2, 2005 by KipWellsFan

[KipWellsFan]

It's an embarrassment to Bolton that the U.S. Senate wouldn't or couldn't approve him because Democrats had decided the only way to hurt Bush was to stand in the way of his appointments.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,164440,00.html

 

Thank the lord we have John Gibson reporting for Fox News exactly why the democrats opposed the Bolton nomination. What a joke.

[Rex Kickass]

In your opinion.  Apparently Georgie thinks it is.

 

If he had provided documentation three months ago, Bolton would have already been confirmed.

 

Instead, our President stonewalled and installed someone in the position who couldn't even win an up or down vote in committee.

[EvilMonkey]

Wow I'd never seen this video before.

 

http://movies.crooksandliars.com/UNbelievable.mov

 

... there is no reason for anyone outside the United States to like this appointment....

 

YOU ARE RIGHT! They are not SUPPOSED to like it, just deal with it.

[EvilMonkey]

Alright, then Bush also thought it was a good idea to rush into Iraq

Rush? How many years has he been shooting at our jets patrolling the no-fly zone? We should have bombed him back to the Ottoman Empire long before this for all that crap. And c'mon, the whole f***ing WORLD knew we were going to invade, we had been practically warning him for months!

[EvilMonkey]

If he had provided documentation three months ago, Bolton would have already been confirmed.

 

Instead, our President stonewalled and installed someone in the position who couldn't even win an up or down vote in committee.

 

And just what 'documents' does the Senate want? What documents does the Senate deem 'highly relevant to the Bolton nomination'? Memos that show he yelled at employees? Proof that he was 'mean'? Enough on this already. This is a guy that will fight tooth and nail for the interests of the United States, not some limp-wristed weenie that wants everyone to like him. I don't care if the world hates him, as long as he gets the job done. I heard Teddy 'Chappaquiddick' Kennedy on the radio yesterday crying about how Bolton was 'abusing to his subordinates, and used his position to get what he wanted'. Hello kettle, meet the pot! You don't think Teddie yells at his aides? You don't think Teddie uses his influence to get what he wants? Just another case of do what I say, not what I do.

 

Interesting quote, from Gay Today, of all places.

"The Senate's role in the confirmation process is to advise and consent. The framers of the Constitution never saw the process as a means in which to derail qualified nominees based on prejudice. Furthermore, Senator Inhofe does not seem to understand that there isn't a Constitutional right to place a hold on nominations." Now, this was from back in 1997, when Clinton used a recess appointment to appoint an openly gay James Hormel as ambassador to Luxembourg, and a few religious folks got their panties in a bunch. But it sure sounds like it could apply to today.

Edited August 2, 2005 by EvilMonkey

[EvilMonkey]

Some background on appointments.

 

 

http://www.newsobserver.com/politics/story...p-9036590c.html

 

Envoy positions can be rewards

Some fund-raisers reap posts abroad

 

By ROB CHRISTENSEN, Staff Writer

 

Mark Erwin spent his 50th birthday watching the movie "Four Weddings and a Funeral" with Bill Clinton in the White House. Jeanette Hyde helped "discover" Al Gore. Bonnie McElveen-Hunter wanted to make Elizabeth Dole president.

Although they took different routes into big-time politics, those three North Carolinians had two things in common -- they became major political fund-raisers and were rewarded with appointments as U.S. ambassadors.

 

When he named Raleigh lawyer Jim Cain as U.S. ambassador to Denmark last month, President Bush was following a deeply ingrained American tradition of repaying political backers by dispatching them to foreign capitals to head U.S. embassies.

 

Cain, former president of the Carolina Hurricanes hockey team, is the sixth political fund-raiser from North Carolina to be named an ambassador in a little more than a decade. His Senate confirmation hearing is scheduled for Monday.

 

 

Six politically connected North Carolinians have been named as U.S. ambassadors in a little more than a decade.

 

* Jim Cain, Raleigh lawyer. Nominated by President Bush to be ambassador to Denmark. Awaiting U.S. Senate confirmation.

 

* Mark Erwin, Charlotte developer and investor. Ambassador to Mauritius, Seychelles and Comoros islands in the Indian Ocean, 1999-2001. Appointed by President Clinton.

 

* Jeanette Hyde, Raleigh civic leader. Ambassador to Barbados and the eastern Caribbean nations of Dominica, St. Lucia, St. Vincent and the Grenadines, Antigua, St. Kitts and Nevis, and Grenada, 1994-98. Appointed by President Clinton.

 

* Bonnie McElveen-Hunter, Greensboro publishing executive. Ambassador to Finland, 2001-03. Appointed by President Bush.

 

* Phil Phillips, retired High Point business executive. Ambassador to Barbados and the eastern Caribbean nations of Dominica, St. Lucia, St. Vincent and the Grenadines, Antigua, St. Kitts and Nevis, and Grenada, 2002-03. Appointed by President Bush.

 

* Aldona Wos, Greensboro physician. Ambassador to Estonia in eastern Europe, 2004-present. Appointed by President Bush.

 

 

 

 

 

Bush has named four: Cain; McElveen-Hunter, a Greensboro business executive who served as ambassador to Finland; Phil Phillips, a retired High Point business executive who served as ambassador to Barbados; and Aldona Wos, a Greensboro physician who is ambassador to Estonia.

 

Clinton tapped Hyde, a Raleigh civic leader, to be ambassador to Barbados and several nearby islands. And he chose Erwin, a Charlotte business executive, as ambassador to the Indian Ocean island nations of Mauritius, Seychelles and Comoros.

 

The appointment of so many political fund-raisers is troubling to professional diplomats who say those appointees often have little training in diplomacy and don't know the language or the culture of the countries where they serve. Many have never even been there.

 

Risks and benefits

 

Professional diplomats say that situation is particularly risky at a time of the 24-hour news cycle, where a misstatement can instantly reverberate around the world.

 

"Would a major corporation such as Microsoft or IBM appoint an inexperienced junior person to run their European operations?" asked Tom Switzer, spokesman for the American Foreign Service Association and a retired diplomat with 31 years of experience. "It's preposterous."

 

Others argue that political appointees are most often highly accomplished people who bring new talents and energy to an embassy and provide the political voice of the administration.

 

"There are good ones who are political appointees, and there are bad ones," said McElveen-Hunter, CEO of Pace Communications, which publishes corporate magazines. "There are good foreign service officers, and there are bad service officers. You bring unique talents to the table that are not traditionally part of an embassy team."

 

Road to an embassy

 

In the three decades before World War II, about two-thirds of U.S. ambassadors were political appointees, according to the State Department. Among them was Josephus Daniels, a former publisher of The News & Observer and a major player in Democratic politics. Daniels was appointed by President Franklin Roosevelt as ambassador to Mexico in 1933.

 

In recent decades, roughly two-thirds of ambassadorships have gone to professional diplomats and one-third to political supporters, according to the foreign service association. Bush and Clinton have been about average in their number of political appointments.

 

"Both parties are playing this game," Switzer said. "They are equal-opportunity offenders."

 

In theory, appointing political donors is against the law. The Foreign Service Act of 1980 says "contributions to political campaigns should not be a factor in the appointment of an individual as chief of mission."

 

But the link is long-standing.

 

"After President Bush was first elected, I spent six months answering the question: 'What country are you going to?' " said former state Rep. David Miner of Cary, a major fund-raiser for Bush in 2000.

 

Cain put together a $2.35 million fund-raiser last summer in Raleigh for Bush's re-election campaign. Wos raised at least $200,000 for Bush. Phillips gave $250,000 to the first Bush election effort, while McElveen-Hunter gave more than $100,000 in 2000.

 

It was no different under Clinton; Hyde and Erwin raised significant sums for the Democratic ticket.

 

Steven Weiss, spokesman for the Center for Responsive Politics, a Washington-based nonprofit research group that tracks money in politics, said the practice comes "pretty close" to big donors buying ambassadorships.

 

But being a major fund-raiser is no guarantee of a diplomatic post. And political donors don't always get the countries they want.

 

The ambassadors take different roads to their posts. Hyde was part of a group of power brokers who in 1987 spotted Al Gore, then a 39-year-old U.S. senator from Tennessee, and began boosting him for the White House. Erwin was a Clinton golfing buddy.

 

Others developed relationships during campaigns.

 

McElveen-Hunter became involved in politics as finance chairwoman for Elizabeth Dole's 2000 presidential run. When Dole dropped out, McElveen-Hunter was recruited by the Bush campaign. She headed Bush's efforts to raise money from women, in a campaign called "W is for Women" that reportedly raised $1 million.

 

During a White House visit in 2001 to discuss tax policy, McElveen-Hunter was stopped by the president.

 

"As I was leaving, he pulled me over and took my hand," she recalled. " 'Bonnie, would you serve your country as ambassador?' There was a pregnant pause. It was not something I anticipated."

 

McElveen-Hunter said it was not easy leaving her business for a two-year stint in Helsinki. For most political appointees, the diplomatic job is a pay cut from their real job, and they sometimes dip into their own money to pay for extra social events or decorating.

 

Many opportunities

 

Some ambassadors use their post to see the world, Erwin said, but most are conscientious and work hard on issues. Erwin concentrated on trade. McElveen-Hunter promoted business opportunities for women. Hyde focused on stopping drug smuggling.

 

"My husband thought we'd have to learn to identify the pickle fork and the marmalade spoon, but the issues are far more critical," said McElveen-Hunter, who now serves as the Bush-appointed chairwoman of the American Red Cross.

 

But there are perks. Cain will move into Rydhave, the ambassador's 36-room residence in Copenhagen, overlooking the narrow strait of Oresund. McElveen-Hunter got the Finnish equivalent of a knighthood. Erwin, Phillips and Hyde served on beautiful islands. They had bulletproof cars and drivers at their beck and call.

 

"It's a powerful position," Hyde said. "An ambassador is the president's personal representative abroad. He is the face of America."

 

Miner, the former Bush fund-raiser, said there is a mixture of reasons why people want to be ambassadors. Most want to serve their country. And many are looking to cap their careers.

 

"These are men and women who have been extremely successful," Miner said. "They have accomplished all they can in their careers. Now they are looking for an adventure. Being ambassador is sexy."

[Rex Kickass]

You sit there thinking I'm against bench appointments in all cases. I'm not. This is a specific case with very specific details.

 

This is not about whether or not John Bolton yelled at people. This is about whether or not John Bolton attempted to cook the intelligence books before our country entered a war. I don't know what country you live in, but in my book - if its true - that's a crime against this country, and definitely one that warrants investigation.

 

Again, this is a nomination that didn't win in committee. I think its ridiculous for any president to stop progress on something for four months so he doesn't have to face the indignity of a vote for his nominee. Ever thought the reason he didn't turn over the documents was because he was afraid that Bolton wouldn't win a full up or down vote?

[mreye]

You sit there thinking I'm against bench appointments in all cases. I'm not. This is a specific case with very specific details.

 

This is not about whether or not John Bolton yelled at people. This is about whether or not John Bolton attempted to cook the intelligence books before our country entered a war. I don't know what country you live in, but in my book - if its true - that's a crime against this country, and definitely one that warrants investigation.

 

Again, this is a nomination that didn't win in committee. I think its ridiculous for any president to stop progress on something for four months so he doesn't have to face the indignity of a vote for his nominee. Ever thought the reason he didn't turn over the documents was because he was afraid that Bolton wouldn't win a full up or down vote?

 

Yes, specifically, George Bush made the appointment. That's all you needed to know.

[Rex Kickass]

Keep thinking that.

[mreye]

Keep thinking that.

Just making an observation.

[YASNY]

I have to stay out of these threads, or I'd end up getting myself banned. Have fun folks.

[Balta1701]

In the late 90's, the Republicans held up Clinton's nominee for UN Ambassador, Richard Holbrooke, for over a year in the Senate. There was some consideration of giving him a recess appointment, but Holbrooke didn't want it, on the grounds that it would diminish his credibility at the UN.