Good to be the King

[Rex Kickass]

The UN is a corrupt, self-serving, bloated, failing organization.  Sending Bolton or Jesus Christ himself up there isn't going to make one bit of difference.

 

So that means we should reward incompetence in the US government because the UN is corrupt?

[EvilMonkey]

It's been alleged repeatedly in several different places where he served that he harassed underlings. 

 

Key points in that story,

Townsel says she is a "vocal, outspoken Democrat," the mother of a 5-year-old daughter and a member of Mothers Opposing Bush, a national group that opposed President Bush's re-election. Townsel says she was not active in politics prior to the election and spent more than a decade working overseas, from 1987 to 1999. She said she sent the letter to the committee on April 8 "at the urging of friends."

and

She alleged

She wouldn't make things up, would she?

[FlaSoxxJim]

BOLTON!!

 

It sounds so much like a cool giant robot Japanese monster hero name I say let him in the UN. Otherwise he will slag you with his Lazer Heat Vision.

 

 

In this AP file photo, BOLTON(!!) is seen using his awesome powers to set Senator Chris Dodd's toupee on fire.

 

Don't f*ck with BOLTON!

[southsider2k5]

I don't see a problem with anything you've said there.  Why not let Bush send up a conservative guy who thinks the UN is doing it all wrong?  Can't hurt to try.

 

But Bolton is not just a guy who thinks the UN is doing it all wrong, he also seems to be a terrible person.

 

So what your telling me is the movement that had wanted Bill Clinton to be the UN ambassador was wrong too, because how great of a person is he? He publicly cheated on his wife and lied about it to the world and congress, (not to mention illegal fund raising with enemy forgein nationals, insider trading, influence peddling at the white house, selling of pardons, multi-affairs/sexual harrassment) should he never serve in the UN again? Crap, we put him in charge of tsunami relief for the UN. Where was everyone crying when he was put in charge of that based on Clinton's dubious history???

 

And before you say it, I know, I know... it's different, it's always different.

[Rex Kickass]

I'd say advocating blowing up the UN building would be different, yes.

[southsider2k5]

I'd say advocating blowing up the UN building would be different, yes.

 

Not that what he said was a metophor for the leadership of the UN being worthless or anything...

[EvilMonkey]

Not that what he said was a metophor for the leadership of the UN being worthless or anything...

 

You seem to forget, ss2k, that what Republican/conservatives say is always taken literally, while what Democrat/liberals say is ALWAYS full of nuanced multiple meanings, sure to be misinterpreted by any and all Republican/conservatives.

[Rex Kickass]

In diplomacy, there are useful euphemisms. And unuseful euphemisms.

[southsider2k5]

In diplomacy, there are useful euphemisms. And unuseful euphemisms.

 

You're right. According to France genocide is too strong of a word for the ethnic slaughters going on in Sudan, so maybe Bolton should revise his language to some kind of diplo-speak so that he will fit in better. I hope his bribetaking skills are up to date also.

[Texsox]

I am quickly becoming more and more critical of the UN. I embrace the idea of a "all nations" gathering, but I am beginning to believe it may be time to shut this one down and start over. When Rush starts making sense to me on any topic, I'm frightened, but I'm starting to lean towards his kernal of truth, but not the hyperbole.

[Yossarian]

True, I did forget.  In my world 51% still gets you an "F". 

The highest percentage of the popular vote any elected President ever got was LBJ with 61.05% of the vote in 1964. Did he get a "D"? Seriously though, quit crying about a recess appointment. They are quite common, even the great Bill Clinton used them a "time or two." The poisonous partisan atmosphere in politics today is to blame for a lack of an up or down vote on Bolton. Bush may be wrong about a number of things. Bolton may be a bully in the workplace. The UN is still a corrupt virtually worthless organization and recess appointments of all types are a regular part of American Presidential history. Edited August 3, 2005 by Yossarian

[southsider2k5]

The highest percentage of the popular vote any elected President ever got was LBJ with 61.05% of the vote in 1964. Did he get a "D"? Seriously though, quit crying about a recess appointment. They are quite common, even the great  Bill Clinton used them a "time or two." The poisonous partisan atmosphere in politics today is to blame for a lack of an up or down vote on Bolton. Bush may  be wrong about a number of things. Bolton may be a bully in the workplace. The UN is still a corrupt virtually worthless organization and recess appointments of all types are a regular part of American Presidential history. Eisenhower even made at least one of his Supreme Court nominees a "recess" appointment IIRC.

I mentioned this somewhere earlier, but it was 3 Supreme Court Justices, including a Chief Justice.

[Yossarian]

I mentioned this somewhere earlier, but it was 3 Supreme Court Justices, including a Chief Justice.

My apologies, I should have read the entire thread but of course time is of the essence and I don't always have it. If you like I'll delete.

 

Edit: I excised the last sentence about Eisenhower.

Edited August 3, 2005 by Yossarian

[FlaSoxxJim]

The highest percentage of the popular vote any elected President ever got was LBJ with 61.05% of the vote in 1964. Did he get a "D"? Seriously though, quit crying about a recess appointment. They are quite common, even the great  Bill Clinton used them a "time or two." The poisonous partisan atmosphere in politics today is to blame for a lack of an up or down vote on Bolton. Bush may  be wrong about a number of things. Bolton may be a bully in the workplace. The UN is still a corrupt virtually worthless organization and recess appointments of all types are a regular part of American Presidential history. Eisenhower even made at least one of his Supreme Court nominees a "recess" appointment IIRC.

I'm less concerned with the actual fact of the recess appointment than I am with the official administration posturing that it was done as a consequence of the Senate not granting a vote on the floor. The Senate's role of "advise and consent" was critically hampered by the decision of the White House not to release the relevant documents or Bush would have got the floor vote he said he wanted.

 

And Bolton would have been voted down.

 

So, no, this is not in the least bit mysterious.

[southsider2k5]

My apologies, I should have read the entire thread but of course time is of the essence and I don't always have it. If you like I'll delete.

 

No biggie, I understand. Me, I have nothing but time

[LowerCaseRepublican]

The highest percentage of the popular vote any elected President ever got was LBJ with 61.05% of the vote in 1964. Did he get a "D"? Seriously though, quit crying about a recess appointment. They are quite common, even the great  Bill Clinton used them a "time or two." The poisonous partisan atmosphere in politics today is to blame for a lack of an up or down vote on Bolton. Bush may  be wrong about a number of things. Bolton may be a bully in the workplace. The UN is still a corrupt virtually worthless organization and recess appointments of all types are a regular part of American Presidential history.

I think the comment about the popular vote is pretty sad and I would consider it a failure that American society has come to such a position. I mean we have 1/2 the voting age population that doesn't even vote anymore. And then the winning candidate gets one half of that remaining 50%. What a mandate! It is detrimental to the democratic Republic that so many people here don't vote especially in a time where people are being run over by tanks etc. simply to get the right to go and cast a meaningful ballot.

 

And all the posturing about Bolton...I think we can all breathe a sigh of relief that John Negroponte is no longer our representative. From Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Negroponte Negroponte supervised the construction of the El Aguacate air base where Nicaraguan Contras were trained by the U.S., and which some critics say was used as a secret detention and torture center during the 1980s. In August 2001, excavations at the base discovered 185 corpses, including two Americans, who are thought to have been killed and buried at the site.

 

Records also show that a special intelligence unit (commonly referred to as a "death squad") of the Honduran armed forces, Battalion 3-16, trained by the CIA and the Argentine military, kidnapped, tortured and killed hundreds of people, including U.S. missionaries. Critics charge that Negroponte knew about these human rights violations and yet continued to collaborate with the Honduran military while lying to Congress.

 

In May 1982, a nun, Sister Laetitia Bordes, who had worked for ten years in El Salvador, went on a fact-finding delegation to Honduras to investigate the whereabouts of thirty Salvadoran nuns and women of faith who fled to Honduras in 1981 after Archbishop Óscar Romero's assassination. Negroponte claimed the embassy knew nothing. However, in a 1996 interview with The Baltimore Sun, Negroponte's predecessor, Jack Binns, said that a group of Salvadorans, among whom were the women Bordes had been looking for, were captured on April 22, 1981, and savagely tortured by the DNI, the Honduran Secret Police, and then later thrown out of helicopters alive.

 

In early 1984, two American mercenaries, Thomas Posey and Dana Parker, contacted Negroponte, stating they wanted to supply arms to the Contras after the U.S. Congress had banned further military aid. Documents show that Negroponte brought the two together with a contact in the Honduran armed forces. The operation was exposed nine months later, at which point the Reagan administration denied any U.S. involvement, despite Negroponte's introductions of some of the individuals. Other documents detailed a plan of Negroponte and then-Vice President George H. W. Bush to funnel Contra aid money through the Honduran government.

[mreye]

I think the comment about the popular vote is pretty sad and I would consider it a failure that American society has come to such a position.  I mean we have 1/2 the voting age population that doesn't even vote anymore.  And then the winning candidate gets one half of that remaining 50%.  What a mandate!  It is detrimental to the democratic Republic that so many people here don't vote especially in a time where people are being run over by tanks etc. simply to get the right to go and cast a meaningful ballot.

 

The best thing you've ever said! By my count, that makes 3 times that we've agreed.

[Yossarian]

Not exactly sure what LCR meant. Hey, I'm allowed to be thick if I want to. We are supposed to be a representative Republic, not a democracy. Our rate of participation in all elections is poor, that much is true. However, I'm ever so glad most of those that decline to participate do just that. I don't want to be ruled and lorded over by those folks. Elections and life in general for that matter is so dumbed down these days. Everyone eligible is entitled to register and vote. Not everyone takes the time to do even the most rudimentary research on the issues of he day. I say it again. I don't want to be ruled and lorded over by that crowd. Let them stay home on election day. About the contras. I wonder if anyone knows who coined the phrase "he may be a son of a b**** but he's our son of a b****?" Here's a hint. It wasn't even a Republican. Isolationism went out the window with the Spanish-American war. Pity the poor Spaniards. They probably didn't even blow up the Maine. In any case, TR perfected the art of intervention and no one has been his equal before or since. Hence all this internal domestic strife over contentious foreign policy moves by any number of Presidents. As for me, I shed no tears for Daniel Ortega or the contras. Good riddance. "He may be a son of a b****, but he's our son of a b****." Foreign policy moves are often cutthroat and not at all for the faint of heart. I have my quarrels with many of them. I also do not want to go through on a daily basis what Londoners have endured two days this past July. I would like to commend LCR for his budding journalistic career and hope he stirs debate with his postions, but gets no nasty hate mail. Good luck LCR.

[LowerCaseRepublican]

Yossarian, I was just saying that comparatively -- Bolton is a choir boy compared to our previous UN ambassador who had a lot of blood on his hands. And thanks for the kind words. So far I've only gotten one semi-nasty hate mail but I debated the woman hard and I got the "Well then I guess you just want the US blown up!" comment (which pretty much means that she had no way to debunk the points I had made, haha)

[Balta1701]

Yossarian, I was just saying that comparatively -- Bolton is a choir boy compared to our previous UN ambassador who had a lot of blood on his hands.  And thanks for the kind words.  So far I've only gotten one semi-nasty hate mail but I debated the woman hard and I got the "Well then I guess you just want the US blown up!" comment (which pretty much means that she had no way to debunk the points I had made, haha)

Of course...after that, Negroponte was appointed ambassador to Iraq, and is now serving as national intelligence director - you know, the 1 supposedly key position which was created by the 9/11 commission reforms.

 

Hell, I'd rather have him at the UN - he could do less damage there.

[Balta1701]

Pity the poor Spaniards. They probably didn't even blow up the Maine.

I don't think there's any question about it - it was a coal dust blast.