New info on Raffy

[fathom]

ESPNews just said that an article coming out tomorrow says Palmeiro tested positived for stanozolol, which is a very potent anabolic steroid. It's the same stuff sprinter Ben Johnson got in trouble for. According to the article, the steroid doesn't come in any dietary supplement. Raffy.....YOU'RE f***ED!

[Kalapse]

If this is true then his 1st ballot status now stands at 0%.

[greasywheels121]

As he should be.

[Benchwarmerjim]

wow!

 

 

this actually surprises me

 

If this is true then his 1st ballot status now stands at 0%.

 

I totally agree

[AddisonStSox]

Begs the question:

 

How the hell would anyone know what he tested positive for?

 

Unless the Palmero camp came out and said what it was, I don't understand how that information would become public.

[wsox08]

SCREWED.... wow Baltimore has two steroid users hah.... Bye bye!!

[greasywheels121]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2123113

 

Source: Palmeiro tested positive for stanozolol

ESPN.com news services

Rafael Palmeiro tested positive for the potent anabolic steroid stanozolol, the same substance Olympic sprinter Ben Johnson of Canada took in 1988, The New York Times reported on its Web site Tuesday night.

 

Johnson was stripped of a gold medal in 1988 after testing positive for that steroid.

 

According to a source with direct knowledge of baseball's drug-testing program, Stanozolol, known by its brand name, Winstrol, was detected in the Baltimore Orioles first baseman.

 

"It's a mildly strong to strong steroid," Dr. Gary Wadler, a professor at New York University and an expert in sports doping, told The New York Times. "Potent is the word I would use."

 

On Monday, the 40-year-old Palmeiro was suspended for 10 days under the toughened major-league policy that took effect in March. Tuesday, Seattle Mariners pitcher Ryan Franklin was the eighth major-leaguer to be suspended under the new steroids testing.

 

Palmeiro's suspension came five months after the player appeared before a congressional panel to dramatically deny he had ever used steroids.

 

While he didn't deny testing positive for the drugs, he insisted Monday that ingesting them was an accident.

 

"When I testified in front of Congress, I know that I was testifying under oath and I told the truth," he said during a telephone conference call. "Today I am telling the truth again that I did not do this intentionally or knowingly."

 

Without giving specifics, the four-time All-Star left the impression that the banned substance was contained in a supplement that was not prescribed. He said it was an "embarrassing situation" and still did not know what caused the positive test.

 

"Why would I do this in a year when I went in front of Congress and I testified and I told the truth?" he said. "Why would I do this during a season where I was going to get to 3,000 hits? It just makes no sense. … I'm not a crazy person."

 

On July 15, Palmeiro joined Hank Aaron, Willie Mays and Eddie Murray as the only players with 3,000 hits and 500 homers.

[kev211]

I now take back everything i have said in the Raffy to the HOF thread

[WilliamTell]

I've always tried and tried to like the guy, but I never could. He's ruined his shot at me liking him ever again. It's unfortunate to see because he does have Hall of Fame numbers, but with help of steriods, he doesn't deserve to be in it.

[kev211]

I dont get it though why would he take them if he knew he was going to to get caught?

[redandwhite]

Stanozolol is Winstrol and is nearly useless for most without stacking with Dianabol or Danatrol. However:

 

Short term stanozolol use can promote drastic strength, a feat often employed early in a bulking cycle (although d-bol would be more suited in that case) or late in a cutting cycle to prevent a decrease in performance. This combined with the red blood cell count-stimulating properties of its androgen affinity make it popular among track athletes as well in order to beget better results. As many, including Ben Johnson, did not take into account it can be detected for quite some time after last use so its not advisable for drug tested athletes. Many have assumed otherwise due to the short half-life, but apparently some inactive metabolites are easily esterified, so they can be found up to 5 months after the last injection.

More:

Some have solved this problem by simply drinking the Winny injections. It's the same substance, also methylated to withstand the liver, the availability and price are better and its contained in water. So there really aren't many objections to this.

So it could very well be that he took the drugs before the season/testing started or he could be telling the truth that he unknowingly took them in liquid form with water, which even though unlikely could very well be the case. There are many options but a personal trainer could have placed some Winny in his water during a workout, or anywhere for that matter. Or he could have said "here drink this, this stuff is great" and Raffy unknowingly took it.

[Flash Tizzle]

Begs the question:

 

How the hell would anyone know what he tested positive for?

 

Unless the Palmero camp came out and said what it was, I don't understand how that information would become public.

 

ESPN articles indicates a 'source' disclosed the steroid. Safe to assume someone leaked the information.

 

Palmeiro really f***ed the pooch here. If it were up to me, he wouldn't even be in the discussion for HOF. Someone needs to be made an example of. However, I know baseball wouldn't dare take a stance such as mine.

 

Only lenience I'd give him is if he openly admitted to steroid use. No more bulls*** with pointing your finger or defiantly saying "NEVER" and "PERIOD" a few times during a speech. Fess up, be a man, and take your punishment.

[jamslam]

Sosa is next

[YASNY]

This is a prime example of why a 10 game suspension is not sufficient.

[redandwhite]

QUOTE(YASNY @ Aug 3, 2005 -> 07:58 AM)

This is a prime example of why a 10 game suspension is not sufficient.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Why is that?

[YASNY]

Why is that?

 

He's taking a strong, known steroid that can't be found in any over the counter supplements. He knew exactly what he was doing and 10 games is a joke.

[Steff]

He's taking a strong, known steroid that can't be found in any over the counter supplements.  He knew exactly what he was doing and 10 games is a joke.

 

 

 

Agree. And he should be gone after for perjury also, IMO.

[Rowand44]

Agree. And he should be gone after for perjury also, IMO.

This is an interesting point. Is there anyway they'd be able to prove that before the hearing he was on roids? Cause if they can't prove that he was on roids before the hearing then it wouldn't be perjury, correct?

[Kalapse]

This is an interesting point.  Is there anyway they'd be able to prove that before the hearing he was on roids?  Cause if they can't prove that he was on roids before the hearing then it wouldn't be perjury, correct?

You would be correct.

[YASNY]

This is an interesting point.  Is there anyway they'd be able to prove that before the hearing he was on roids?  Cause if they can't prove that he was on roids before the hearing then it wouldn't be perjury, correct?

 

There is one player who could testify under oath that he personally injected Palmeiro with steroids, if his book is to be believed.

[kapkomet]

I think this is THE reason why Barry Bonds won't be back this year, is to give his system time to clean itself out... since these can be detected long after you take them.

[Steff]

I think this is THE reason why Barry Bonds won't be back this year, is to give his system time to clean itself out... since these can be detected long after you take them.

 

 

Barry is subject to testing and MLB can ask him to pee, if they have not already, at any time. Taking the season off does not exclude him from being caught if he's using.

[southsider2k5]

Here is the Trib's version of the story. A few things jump out, #1 a MLB official leaked the product that Raffy tested positive for. #2 the process took 2 1/2 months to get a suspension done. #3 each sample is divided into two parts so if one come backs positive, then they test the other sample to make sure there are no false positives.

 

Who would have known when Rafael Palmeiro rapped his historic 3,000th hit in mid-July that he might well be remembered for a failed drug test and not a hugely successful career?

 

Well, Palmeiro for one. But few others.

 

Due to the secrecy and intricacies of Major League Baseball's drug-testing protocol--from multiple testing to a lengthy appeal process--about 2 1/2 months passed between Palmeiro's positive test and his suspension, allowing the Orioles slugger to bask in the spotlight rather than feel the heat.

 

Palmeiro tested positive for the potent anabolic steroid Stanozolol, the New York Times reported, citing a person in baseball with direct knowledge of the sport's drug-testing program.

 

Stanozolol, known by its brand name, Winstrol, was most notably linked to the Olympic sprinter Ben Johnson, who was stripped of a gold medal in 1988.

 

Palmeiro said Monday that he had never intentionally taken steroids, but Stanozolol does not come in dietary supplements and is among the most popular steroid on the market. It can be ingested or injected and usually remains in a person's system for at least a month, the New York Times reported.

 

And now members of Congress, embarrassed and angered by Palmeiro's indignant denials of steroid use at a March hearing, want to know an exact timeline.

 

According to an industry source, Palmeiro tested positive for the steroid in May and appealed the ruling in secret arbitration proceedings in June.

 

He then had to wait for an arbitration decision as he neared the 3,000-hit plateau, which he reached with a fifth-inning double in Seattle July 15.

 

During that time, only Palmeiro and specific representatives from Major League Baseball and the players' union were privy to his situation, the source said.

 

The failed test was kept confidential during the lengthy appeal process and the source said some close to the situation, including the Orioles organization, did not learn of Palmeiro's failed drug test until Friday.

 

Arbiter Shyam Das contacted the involved parties to inform them he had denied Palmeiro's appeal, but he did not sign off on it until Monday, when it was released by Major League Baseball. That, and not last weekend's Hall of Fame induction, delayed the suspension, the source said.

 

Palmeiro played in all three weekend games and did not appear distracted. He had four hits, including his 18th homer of the season, in 11 at-bats. He batted .299 with six homers and 19 RBIs during July.

 

It has been a long road since Palmeiro first learned of the failed test.

 

As part of baseball's new drug policy, players are randomly tested and the urine is divided into two samples: A and B.

 

The lab first tests part of the `A' sample and if it comes up positive for steroids, the rest of that sample is tested. If that is also positive, Major League Baseball, the players' union and the player are informed.

 

The player has the option to ask for sample `B' to be tested. Also, the player can challenge the test with baseball's four-person Health Policy Advisory Committee, made up of a union representative, a baseball representative and two doctors.

 

If any one of the four decide the challenge has merit, it is then forwarded to a three-person arbitration panel, which consists of a baseball lawyer, a union lawyer and an independent arbiter.

 

Palmeiro challenged, and won the right to plead his case before the panel. He wasn't the only one of the first seven suspended player to challenge, but was the first to receive a hearing. Since then, Seattle Mariners pitcher Ryan Franklin, who was suspended Tuesday for 10 days, also has received a hearing.

 

At the arbiter's hearing, the player can address the panel, which Palmeiro did in June.

 

Ultimately, because of the way the three-person arbitration panel is constructed, only the independent arbiter makes a ruling.

 

It can take several weeks or longer for the arbiter to review the case, which is why Palmeiro's suspension was not announced for months after the original test.

 

Das, the arbiter, refused to comment on the case. Palmeiro's agent, Arn Tellem, did not return phone calls.

 

Meanwhile, members of Congress and their staffs said Tuesday they intend to request more information about the case from Major League Baseball.

 

"There's a lot people don't know," said Robert White, a spokesman for Rep. Tom Davis (R-Va.), chairman of the House Government Reform Committee. "I think what we're doing now is just gathering facts about the matter."

 

White said it was premature to comment further. But another aide familiar with the committee's thinking said the panel wants a detailed timeline of when Palmeiro's test was conducted, analyzed and disclosed to the player and the team.

 

Some committee members also want baseball to reveal exactly what banned substance triggered the positive test.

 

There have been initial contacts between Congress members and baseball officials since Monday's announcement, but the committee does not have all the information it wants.

 

Capitol Hill sources say Palmeiro has been reaching out to the Government Reform Committee -- possibly to offer his version of events.

 

The first baseman or his representatives have tried calling Davis and Rep. Henry Waxman (D-Calif.), the panel's top Democrat. Early attempts to connect failed. Palmeiro and the lawmakers traded calls without reaching each other.

 

Palmeiro testified before the committee on March 17 along with former Cubs and current Orioles teammate Sammy Sosa and a handful of other current and former players and baseball executives. Palmeiro pointedly denied using steroids and offered to be an advocate in educating young people about steroid risks.

 

Palmeiro was summoned to testify largely because of a misunderstanding. Committee staff members, looking for cooperative witnesses, had read a Florida newspaper article suggesting Palmeiro would be happy to appear. It turned out he was anything but. But Palmeiro was subpoenaed and had no choice but to testify.

 

Since Monday's announcement, several House members have said they want to know if Palmeiro lied to Congress.

Edited August 3, 2005 by southsider2k5

[AddisonStSox]

Major League Baseball must be absolutely sick right now. This is the LAST thing they ever wanted to happen.

 

You don't honestly think Selig wasn't aware of steroid use during the "rebirth" of baseball in Sosa and McGwire's race to 61.

 

They knew about it. Fans knew about it. But, the last thing they ever wanted to have happen was to address it in the public forum because they knew it work knock MLB down a few notches.

[SnB]

what an ugly situation for everyone involved.

 

I wonder what it must have been like for raffy to be playing through all this knowing all this was coming soon.