With Indian Mascots going...

[knightni]

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...,3448367.column

 

No blarney: Leprechaun must go

 

August 7, 2005

 

 

I want that leprechaun put to sleep.

 

Do you hear me, NCAA? I don't want to see that darn leprechaun at Notre Dame's games anymore. No more of that goofy green suit. No more of that hokey hat. Most of all, no more of that offensive, insensitive, insulting, dehumanizing dance.

 

 

As a proud Irish-American, I demand that you make the Fighting Irish of Notre Dame get rid of that stupefying, stereotypical mascot of theirs. And that little jig of his. And I mean pronto, if you'll excuse my use of Indian lingo.

 

Ladies and gentlemen of the NCAA, I implore you. Do that thing you do. Do what you did Friday, when your executive committee announced that it no longer would tolerate any "hostile and abusive racial/ethnic/national origin mascots, nicknames or imagery."

 

A leprechaun is all that.

 

He is mischievous by nature. He is up to no good. He clearly is abusive. Have you ever seen him treat Notre Dame's enemies with any kindness?

 

And what of that big, crooked stick in his hand? He doesn't carry that cudgel because he is lame. It isn't a cane. A leprechaun doesn't limp. Look at that little fool do his dance. He moves fine. No, a shillelagh looks like a weapon to me. You wouldn't let a Seminole or an Illini walk around a football stadium with a bow and arrow, would you?

 

I can guess what you are thinking. You're thinking an Irish-American is not an oppressed minority. Or hasn't been one.

 

Well, you couldn't be more wrong. Irish immigrants were given a very bad time in America when they first came here. They were treated as suspicious foreigners. Their ancestry and accents were mocked. They were maligned as "Micks" and stigmatized as brawling drunks.

 

Therefore, I would like you righteous brothers and sisters at the NCAA to put an end to the degradation of this "Fighting Irish" slur once and for all. A lot of us don't fight. I don't fight. Well, I did toss a guy out of a bar in Greece last summer, but he was drunker than I was.

 

The NCAA has made a good start. The actions it took Friday gave notice to the Bradley Braves and Central Michigan Chippewas and Utah Utes that they had better take all of their Native American garb, arrowheads, weapons and war paint and dump the whole pile into a Dumpster.

 

If these people want to host a postseason competition ever again, they will have to abide by the NCAA's rules and lose the Indian theme.

 

You, noble warlords of the NCAA, are taking no prisoners. University of North Dakota Fighting Sioux? What do you care if there are Sioux who don't care? So what if there are remaining members of the Sioux tribe who are honored by this legacy? Your edict has come down. You have spoken. The next time North Dakota plays for a national championship, its mascot had better be Buffalo Bill.

 

OK, so a lot of us happen to believe that tribal names are not unto themselves offensive. Illini, Seminole, Chippewa, Choctaw … these don't seem so bad to us. They have history and dignity. We have entire states named for Indian tribes, for heaven's sake. What do you think the word "Illinois" is, anyway … French? Its origin is Algonquin.

 

What some of us do resent is the way Caucasians paint their faces red and wear buckskin and feathers and go hey-yo-yo-yo and woo-woo-woo. It doesn't matter if there are some Indians who take no umbrage at this, not until you have taken a vote from every last one of them in this land that their ancestors founded.

 

Jimmy Carter was as humane and decent a president as this nation has had in this last half-century. So it was appalling to see him at Atlanta Braves baseball games, chanting and chopping a make-believe tomahawk. There are ways to support a favorite team without making a mockery of an entire culture and race.

 

Somebody should take those Cleveland Indians caps with the grinning red-faced Indian and fling them into Ohio's largest incinerator. Somebody should go up to an African-American athlete on the Washington Redskins and ask him how he would like it if his team were known as the Washington … uh, you know.

 

I don't mind a team being called the Irish, I really don't. I take pride in my heritage. I wish we could live in a world in which a university's teams could be called the Fighting Italians, the Fighting Mexicans, the Fighting Japanese or the Fighting Germans.

 

Yet if we get rid of some, mustn't we get rid of all? Can a school really get away with calling itself the Fighting Irish in the wake of this NCAA posse's vigilant PC crackdown? Doesn't this scurrilous nickname need to go? Isn't it time for the leprechaun to sleep with the fishes?

 

We have come to a seminal moment in the history of America's collegiate athletics, and I do not mean the team names at Florida State.

 

Call em the Notre Dame Leprechauns or the Notre Dame Shamrocks or something...

 

Being Irish myself, I could give a damn whether ND is called the "Fighting Irish" or not.

[SoxFan1]

You have got to be kidding me. "And so continues the pussification of America..."

[nitetrain8601]

You have got to be kidding me. "And so continues the pussification of America..."

 

I heard the Bulls are going to have to change their name because the term "Bulls" hurts the actual animals' feelings

[innersanctum]

Indians are real...

 

Leprechauns are not...

 

There is nothing wrong with the ND mascot.

[SoxFan1]

I heard the Bulls are going to have to change their name because the term "Bulls" hurts the actual animals' feelings

 

It all started with the Bullets to Wizards move, IMO.

[knightni]

Indians are real...

 

Leprechauns are not...

 

There is nothing wrong with the ND mascot.

Yes, but there are real "Fighting Irish".

 

I think that was his point.

[UofIChiSox]

Ladies and gentlemen of the NCAA, I implore you. Do that thing you do. Do what you did Friday, when your executive committee announced that it no longer would tolerate any "hostile and abusive racial/ethnic/national origin mascots, nicknames or imagery."

 

The point is where do you draw the line? The NCAAs exact words, quoted above, would certainly include abolishing the Fighting Irish nickname. Personally, I think all of this mascot debate rises out of people with nothing better to do that want to get on the news, so they b**** about something that they have no personal connections with.

[Cerbaho-WG]

Someone posted this in another thread, and the Irish community could give two s***s about ND's little green dude. He isn't drinking heavily, beating up people and randomly pissing on blarney stones. He's not stereotypical at all.

 

What Downey fails to realize here is that while some of the Indian mascots perform religious rituals, the ND leprechaun isn't doing anything. He's not praying in a church or eating the sacrement. He's holding up a sign that says "Let's Go Irish."

[Pauly8509CWS]

Wait till the PETA people chime in.

[knightni]

Wait till the PETA people chime in.

All animals that are mascots are being degraded.

The buffalo at Colorado, the Auburn tiger and eagle, the bulldog at Georgia and the Texas longhorn steer and others, are ALL being tormented.

Edited August 8, 2005 by knightni

[black jack]

Most Irish are proud of Notre Dame.

I know I am.

Their nickname is the sole reason I became a fan in the first place...We're Irish.

[black jack]

bty- i think the author is being sarcastic implying the Indian mascot ban is stupid.

[SnB]

the point is that if you ban indian things, why aren't other logos being banned that have something to do with culture?

[Soxbadger]

The Bullets changing to Wizards happened way after the Colt 45's (Astros).

 

 

SB

Edited August 8, 2005 by Soxbadger

[Heads22]

It's great to be an Iowa State fan, represented by something that isn't even really there.

 

 

 

Kinda like our football team the majority of the past 90 years.

[SleepyWhiteSox]

Someone posted this in another thread, and the Irish community could give two s***s about ND's little green dude. He isn't drinking heavily, beating up people and randomly pissing on blarney stones. He's not stereotypical at all.

 

What Downey fails to realize here is that while some of the Indian mascots perform religious rituals, the ND leprechaun isn't doing anything. He's not praying in a church or eating the sacrement. He's holding up a sign that says "Let's Go Irish."

 

But have you seen just how ridiculous he looks?

 

I can see where you're going with the religious rituals idea, but that isn't really the case with most of the mascots that are being banned.

 

I think it would be less of a problem if the mascots didn't do such ridiculous and idiotic antics. That dance that the illini mascot does is horrible. If using that type of mascot, at least do it a lot more respectfully. There's definitely a difference between that stupid dance and Chief Osceola throwing a flaming spear into the groud while riding a horse before FSU games, in my opinion. I'd rather see a representation of a noble warrior than a dancing idiot.

 

The same can be said about that leprechaun. When do you ever see Irishmen doing pushups while being held up in the air or being tossed back and forth holding up a sign while being held by your legs? Not very honorable, in my opinion.

[SnB]

But have you seen just how ridiculous he looks?   

 

I can see where you're going with the religious rituals idea, but that isn't really the case with most of the mascots that are being banned.

 

I think it would be less of a problem if the mascots didn't do such ridiculous and idiotic antics.  That dance that the illini mascot does is horrible.  If using that type of mascot, at least do it a lot more respectfully.  There's definitely a difference between that stupid dance and Chief Osceola throwing a flaming spear into the groud while riding a horse before FSU games, in my opinion.  I'd rather see a representation of a noble warrior than a dancing idiot.

 

The same can be said about that leprechaun.  When do you ever see Irishmen doing pushups while being held up in the air or being tossed back and forth holding up a sign while being held by your legs?  Not very honorable, in my opinion.

 

the student that plays chief illiniwek goes to an actual reservation and learns the dance from them.

 

still stupid?

[black jack]

I see nothing degrating in this:

 

[SleepyWhiteSox]

the student that plays chief illiniwek goes to an actual reservation and learns the dance from them.

 

still stupid?

 

Yep.

 

We don't need more proof that white people can't dance.

[SnB]

Yep.

 

We don't need more proof that white people can't dance.   

touche

 

But honestly, i'd give up the halftime dance if need be. That's the one thing i could see them getting offended over, especially since it is a WHITE student.

 

But the rest i just think is stupid to raise an issue over.

[knightni]

There are no Illini tribal members that would play the Chief?

[UofIChiSox]

There are no Illini tribal members that would play the Chief?

 

No, and there is no Illini tribe to pay off like the Seminoles in Florida. The Illini tribe, like many of the Illini sports teams, were demolished, killed off, exterminated, etc.

[knightni]

No, and there is no Illini tribe to pay off like the Seminoles in Florida.  The Illini tribe, like many of the Illini sports teams, were demolished, killed off, exterminated, etc.

 

 

But he said:

 

the student that plays chief illiniwek goes to an actual reservation and learns the dance from them.

 

still stupid?

 

 

So, what tribe is he going to?

 

Get one of them to do it.

[CanOfCorn]

I have been saying this about ND since this whole mascot thing started. But on another subject...I understand where people are coming from about the Illini and Chief Illiniwek, BUT, there are no more ILLINI. They are dead and gone, killed off by whitey. But, for those of you that don't know, Illinois...named after the Illini tribe of Native Americans. So, I equate our name to the Tennessee Volunteers, named after the Tennesseeans that went to the Alamo to help. The outfit worn by the chief is a Sioux outfit donated by that tribe. The dance is also Sioux. When dressed as the Chief, he doesn't speak...not to mention, doesn't kiss babies, shake hands, rack other mascots against the goal posts, do push ups, throw t-shirts into the stands, etc. He also speaks at local schools and does charity work around the Champaign-Urbana area.

 

Basically, my point is, considering the plight of the Illini tribe, the University couldn't be any more respectful then they are. If they want to drop the "Fighting" from the name, that would be fine with me.

 

If the NCAA wants to drop the names like Savages, Braves, Indians, Redskins, that makes total sense to me...those are degrading. But since our STATE is named after this tribe of Native Americans...I think they should have a little leniency in this case.

 

/end rant

[SleepyWhiteSox]

So then why even do the dance if it's Sioux and not Illini?

 

And if it is, in fact, true that the Seminole tribe was "paid off," good for them. I hope they're getting a good amount.