Hurricane Katrina

[Rex Kickass]

The sheer desperation of all this is incredible.

[southsider2k5]

Those people shooting at medical workers and other helpers deserve to be thrown in jail for life.  My father went down there yesterday to help as a doctor on an emergency response team, and he said it's just an absolute war zone.

 

Shoot to kill at that point. If anyone even points a gun at anyone, they need to take action to protect people. Its the only way that law and order will be restored.

[fathom]

Shoot to kill at that point.  If anyone even points a gun at anyone, they need to take action to protect people.  Its the only way that law and order will be restored.

 

Exactly, and you know they'll start saying it's a racial thing. At this point, like you said, they need to do everything they can to protect these people.

[The Ginger Kid]

The sheer desperation of all this is incredible.

 

Can't we just "invade" NO, bring a bunch of trucks and ships in and just get those people out of there? Set up emergency relief centers at accessible locations around the city and drop in medics and supplies? Like...NOW?! It's been 4 days!!

[Steff]

Can't we just "invade" NO, bring a bunch of trucks and ships in and just get those people out of there? Set up emergency relief centers at accessible locations around the city and drop in medics and supplies? Like...NOW?! It's been 4 days!!

 

 

 

Exactly. Those buses that are coming to take the people out... fill them up with food and water. Give that out as you evacuate. I don't understand the lack of common sense here. :headshake

[southsider2k5]

Can't we just "invade" NO, bring a bunch of trucks and ships in and just get those people out of there? Set up emergency relief centers at accessible locations around the city and drop in medics and supplies? Like...NOW?! It's been 4 days!!

 

You can't bring trucks into places that don't have roads and bridges. Ships can't make it in because there is no where to empty them.

[fathom]

In theory, bringing in all that equipment sounds good. The problem is that there's just so many assholes there that are trying to make things miserable and impossible for everyone else.

[Steff]

You can't bring trucks into places that don't have roads and bridges.  Ships can't make it in because there is no where to empty them.

 

 

 

The buses made it in there.

[Rex Hudler]

All of this just makes me want to puke............

 

All emotion aside, let's make sure we all understand a few things.

 

1. The storm, less than a week before was only a Tropical Storm headed for Southern Florida. At the time, it was expected to perhaps restrengthen into a hurricane into the Gulf at a Category 1 or 2 level. At that same time, it was expected to turn toward the coast and head into Georgia crossing over the Florida panhandle.

 

2. Hurricanes are not very predictable. Even 2-3 days before when it was tracking toward New Orleans, no one knew for sure if it would go to New Orleans, jog east toward MS/AL or go further west.

 

3. It wasn't a Category 4 hurricane (I believe) until 2 days before it hit and then a Cat 5 the day before (I may be off one day on that). Keep in mind that many hurricanes weaken before they hit land and drop a Category or two.

 

4. So once it was determined that it was nearly inevitable, the evacuation order was executed. If they "planned" better and ordered the evacuation earlier, it would have had to cover the whole gulf coast because there was no way to tell for sure where the hurricane would strike land.

 

5. Evacuating almost a million people in the New Orleans metro area cannot be done in 2 days. They opened up south bound lanes of highways going into NO and made them northbound only. They asked people to leave.

 

6. Going neighborhood to neighborhood isn't feasible. The city is way to big for one, and two it would be nearly impossible to organize such a task that quickly. Keep in mind that the same people you want to do that, are ones that have to take care of their own families and safetey and getting them out of town.

 

7. When you factor in the poor, the sick, the elderly and the stubborn/stupid logistically it just isn't possible.

 

So while it is easy to see in hindsight that more should have been done, I urge you to think about the situation and how it was practically impossible to do much more than they did. Sure relief efforts could be more organized, but let's also keep in mind that they are dealing with damage and/or deaths from three states, not just New Orleans.

 

This is all very sad, but tossing around the blame right now to me, isn't very productive or fair.

[Gene Honda Civic]

Thank you Rex.

[southsider2k5]

The buses made it in there. 

 

To that one particular part of the city. Not everyone is there. You are talking about trying to track down a couple of hundred thousand people spread out all over all kinds of flooded areas, trapped in places, and not even mentioning the safety of the people who would be trying to get this stuff there in the first place. Can you imagine them driving a semi-tracker full of food and medicine into some of those areas, and a group of armed vigilantes killing the aid workers and hi-jacking the truck? A couple of days ago I couldn't have imagined it, today it wouldn't surprise me. The very first thing they have to do is restore law and order. Until they do that, they can't rescue people, they can help people, and they can organize the safe distribution of good and services to the masses.

[The Ginger Kid]

This is all very sad, but tossing around the blame right now to me, isn't very productive or fair.

 

Understanding how a major American city could be thrown into chaos and destruction in a natural disaster is not only productive and fair, but mandatory in my opinion. While no one's blaming the federal government for a hurricane, I do hold them accountable for their response to this tragedy. I will scrutinize it, as we all should. After four days we can't get fresh water in there. You make your own judgements of that, I'll make mine.

[The Ginger Kid]

To that one particular part of the city.  Not everyone is there.  You are talking about trying to track down a couple of hundred thousand people spread out all over all kinds of flooded areas, trapped in places, and not even mentioning the safety of the people who would be trying to get this stuff there in the first place.  Can you imagine them driving a semi-tracker full of food and medicine into some of those areas, and a group of armed vigilantes killing the aid workers and hi-jacking the truck?  A couple of days ago I couldn't have imagined it, today it wouldn't surprise me.  The very first thing they have to do is restore law and order.  Until they do that, they can't rescue people, they can help people, and they can organize the safe distribution of good and services to the masses.

 

They've estimated 50-100K people remained in the city and many of them in concentrated areas. Fine, many are spread out. But 20K or more are at the convention center alone.

[Steff]

To that one particular part of the city.  Not everyone is there.  You are talking about trying to track down a couple of hundred thousand people spread out all over all kinds of flooded areas, trapped in places, and not even mentioning the safety of the people who would be trying to get this stuff there in the first place.  Can you imagine them driving a semi-tracker full of food and medicine into some of those areas, and a group of armed vigilantes killing the aid workers and hi-jacking the truck?  A couple of days ago I couldn't have imagined it, today it wouldn't surprise me.  The very first thing they have to do is restore law and order.  Until they do that, they can't rescue people, they can help people, and they can organize the safe distribution of good and services to the masses.

 

 

 

I agree with you on the danger, but they need to do something. There are an estimated 60K people at the superdome and convention center, and they are saying they have to evacuate the dome. Order is out the window at this point, IMO. NO will never be the same... if it survives this.

[southsider2k5]

Understanding how a major American city could be thrown into chaos and destruction in a natural disaster is not only productive and fair, but mandatory in my opinion. While no one's blaming the federal government for a hurricane, I do hold them accountable for their response to this tragedy. I will scrutinize it, as we all should. After four days we can't get fresh water in there. You make your own judgements of that, I'll make mine.

 

Provide me with some historical guidence here. When is the last time that a catestophic event has essentially destroyed a major population center in the US? Running with that, how specifically should the federal government have been ready for a disaster of this scale, in this specific city, and how much should they have invested in it, waiting for it to happen one of these days? How much should they have stored, where should they have stored it, how much should they have spent to store it, how many people should have been kept on call for this how many different places in the country should we be preparing for catestrophic events just like this...etc.

 

It is easy to be upset, but the reality is the logistics of what you are suggesting is nearly impossible.

[Steff]

Buses are on the way in the city, there are guards in uniform handing out water, progress seems to be being made.

 

 

Reporter on top of the CC reporting rapes, a mall on fire, dead people, starving people.. unreal.

[The Ginger Kid]

Provide me with some historical guidence here.  When is the last time that a catestophic event has essentially destroyed a major population center in the US?  Running with that, how specifically should the federal government have been ready for a disaster of this scale, in this specific city, and how much should they have invested in it, waiting for it to happen one of these days?  How much should they have stored, where should they have stored it, how much should they have spent to store it, how many people should have been kept on call for this how many different places in the country should we be preparing for catestrophic events just like this...etc.

 

It is easy to be upset, but the reality is the logistics of what you are suggesting is nearly impossible.

 

I haven't suggested anything logistical other than some generalizations on addressing the immediate needs of those stranded in NO. Like water and evactuation (by the way, it can handle war ships). Your basing your argument on the assumption that the goverment is doing all it can. Why do you think we have FEMA in the first place? That's all the historical guidance you need. It was established out of necessity to provide quick response to disaster relief situations and yes, they do have coordinated plans for shipping supplies like water, food and medicine into regions all over the country. They plan and strategize just like the pentagon does for potential disasters. I don't expect miracles but I damn sure don't like watching Americans in a major city living and dying in their own filth for four days without a major relief effort to assist them.

[SnB]

Buses are on the way in the city, there are guards in uniform handing out water, progress seems to be being made.

Reporter on top of the CC reporting rapes, a mall on fire, dead people, starving people.. unreal.

like it's been said, it's hell on earth down there.

 

I couldn't even imagine taking that scene in. It's like straight out of a horror movie

[Steff]

Woah...Mike Brown, the FEMA director, is saying that they didn't know there were people at the covention center until TODAY...??? Do they not watch television..??

 

 

[HighHeat45]

Do they not watch television..??

 

Probably not, I would imagine they have been concentrated on getting people off rooftops and such and arent sitting around watching tv.

 

Not to mention the power is out

[CWSGuy406]

The people going around with guns raping women ought to be arrested and beaten to death.

 

How f***ing sedistic these people are... :headshake

[SnB]

The people going around with guns raping women ought to be arrested and beaten to death.

 

How f***ing sedistic these people are...  :headshake

that's why there is a hell, for people like that.

[Rex Hudler]

I don't expect miracles but I damn sure don't like watching Americans in a major city living and dying in their own filth for four days without a major relief effort to assist them.

 

A major relief effort hasn't been all of the helicopter rescues? All of the efforts to plug the levee breaks? C'mon, get real. It is practically impossible to get down there with few routes in. Trees are down all over the place. Emergency workers from who knows how many states are on their way.

 

Could things be going better? Sure. But my God, this is a once-in-a-lifetime event and no matter how much you prepare for an event like this, you cannot be prepared for everything.

 

They are getting supplies in. They are also getting shot at while doing so. A helicopter had to drop supplies today rather than land because of fear of a riot. There are truckloads of water going to the coast daily from all over, but let's remember you have a whole coastline in another state that cannot just be ignored.

 

Lighten up!

[Soxy]

I wonder what kind of effect this will have on the airline industry. No doubt prices will go up--but I wonder if there will be any other long term consequences.

[Rex Kickass]

Probably not, I would imagine they have been concentrated on getting people off rooftops and such and arent sitting around watching tv.

 

Not to mention the power is out

 

The head of FEMA is in Washington D.C. Michael Chertoff, the head of Homeland Security, denied the existence of the 15,000+ at the convention center as of 4pm today on NPR.