NFL Rankings

[DBAHO]

Remember where the power polls ranked the sox before April. They fooled all the writers. The bulls fooled EVERYBODY.  I like our D. If baltimore won it all with a young D, Trent Dilfer, and a rookie Running Back in 00-01.  I don't see why we can't go 9-7, 10-6  ect.  With the additions, new coordinator, favorable schedule,  and a f***ing D I am in love with so much, that  I will just post their names right now.

Adewale , A Brown , Tommie Harris , Michael Haynes, Tank, Ian scott, Briggs , Lacher , Hillen, Mike Brown , Mike Green , Zoom , Vasher , Peanut

 

We will be just fine. 

Jamal Lewis >>>> a holded out Benson and Thomas Jones.

Ravens O-Line >>>> Bears O-Line

Ravens D >>>> Bears D.

 

A very good defense the Bears may have, but they may be on the field so much in games, they'll be stuffed by the 4th quarter, and teams could just run over them. That's why it's so important, the offense can at least control the football.

[rangercal]

Jamal Lewis >>>> a holded out Benson and Thomas Jones.

Ravens O-Line >>>> Bears O-Line

Ravens D >>>> Bears D.

 

A very good defense the Bears may have, but they may be on the field so much in games, they'll be stuffed by the 4th quarter, and teams could just run over them. That's why it's so important, the offense can at least control the football.

 

 

I did not say the bears would be able to match Baltimores superbowl season, did I?

 

 

If baltimore won it all with a young D, Trent Dilfer, and a rookie Running Back in 00-01. I don't see why we can't go 9-7, 10-6 ect.

 

Obviously 2001 Baltimore >>>>>>>> 2005 Bears.

Edited August 31, 2005 by rangercal

[DBAHO]

I did  not say the bears would be able to match Baltimores superbowl season, did I? 

Obviously 2001  Baltimore >>>>>>>>  2005 Bears.

Nope, but the point is, a great defense isn't the only element that's going to make you an elite team. Kind of reminds me of the Dallas Cowboys 2 seasons ago, when they went 10-6, but then got smoked out of the playoffs by the Panthers, and then last year well just didn't do that good.

 

Defenses can fluctuate. Dallas had a great one 2 years ago, last year they sucked. The challenge is for the Bears to prove they can be like the Patriots and continually put up top 5 like stats in defense. You could say they may be a little subsceptive against the run, are they big enough up front with the likes of Brown and Harris? What if one of the CB's goes down again like Tillman, do they have adequate cover on the nickel formation?

 

Coupled that with a rookie QB, which well never really bodes well (just have a look at the teams besides Pittsburgh over the past few years who have started rookie QB's), I think the Bears will be extremely happy if they can go 8-8.

[rangercal]

Nope, but the point is, a great defense isn't the only element that's going to make you an elite team. Kind of reminds me of the Dallas Cowboys 2 seasons ago, when they went 10-6, but then got smoked out of the playoffs by the Panthers, and then last year well just didn't do that good.

 

Defenses can fluctuate. Dallas had a great one 2 years ago, last year they sucked. The challenge is for the Bears to prove they can be like the Patriots and continually put up top 5 like stats in defense. You could say they may be a little subsceptive against the run, are they big enough up front with the likes of Brown and Harris? What if one of the CB's goes down again like Tillman, do they have adequate cover on the nickel formation?

 

Coupled that with a rookie QB, which well never really bodes well (just have a look at the teams besides Pittsburgh over the past few years who have started rookie QB's), I think the Bears will be extremely happy if they can go 8-8.

 

Nope, but the point is, a great defense isn't the only element that's going to make you an elite team.

well I never said elite team did I?

 

Kind of reminds me of the Dallas Cowboys 2 seasons ago, when they went 10-6, but then got smoked out of the playoffs by the Panthers, and then last year well just didn't do that good.

10-6 is exactly the type of record I was posting the bears can achieve. I didn't say anything about how they would fair in the playoffs If they made it.

 

Defenses can fluctuate. Dallas had a great one 2 years ago, last year they sucked.

It usually flucuates when you have injuries and lose FAs, not when you GAIN all your players back from injury.

 

The challenge is for the Bears to prove they can be like the Patriots and continually put up top 5 like stats in defense.

 

No, they don't have to live up to that challenge to win 10 games.

 

You could say they may be a little subsceptive against the run, are they big enough up front with the likes of Brown and Harris?

 

I can only go by what I have seen this year. Ask Willis Mcgahee if they seemed small.

 

What if one of the CB's goes down again like Tillman, do they have adequate cover on the nickel formation?

 

Nathan Vasher would start for more than half the teams in the NFL, I think they will be fine in that area. how can you ask a "what if" question anyway? What if Tom Brady is out for the season? Michael Vick? Ray Lewis? The resppective teams they play for are f***ED.

 

Coupled that with a rookie QB, which well never really bodes well (just have a look at the teams besides Pittsburgh over the past few years who have started rookie QB's),

 

This is the biggest concern obviously. But, going into the season, most of the offense was planned on the running attack anyway. Even if Benson does not play to capabilities, Jones has an Improved line that he was not used to last year. You don't think it was a huge difference getting Miller? Why is that move HUGE? Tait can play at his natural position now. Kruetz has a chip on his shoulder, Im sure he will bounce back this year. Orton will probably attempt 20-25 passes a game AT THE VERY MOST. The rest will be running. Running out the clock. Keeping the D rested. Shoop is gone. Shea is gone. We have a coordinator who found success with Erik Kramer , Raymont Harris, and Jeff Graham . Turner will mix up the plays. No more running up the middle 3 and outs. That will make a difference.

 

I think the Bears will be extremely happy if they can go 8-8.

 

I think based on the schedule, the 2 upgraded receivers, upgraded line, the injured players returning, the new O Coordinator and the fact that they are a young team (young teams tend to only get better) . 8-8 would be a disapointment.

[DBAHO]

well I never said elite team did I?

10-6 is exactly the type of record I was posting the bears can achieve. I didn't say anything about how they would fair in the playoffs If they made it.

It usually flucuates when you have injuries and lose FAs,  not when you GAIN all your players back from injury.

No, they don't have to live up to that challenge to win 10 games.

I can only go by what I have seen this year. Ask Willis Mcgahee if they seemed small.

Nathan Vasher would start for more than half the teams in the NFL, I think they will be fine in that area.      how can you ask a "what if" question anyway?  What if Tom Brady is out for the season? Michael Vick? Ray Lewis?  The resppective teams they play for are f***ED.

This is the biggest concern obviously. But, going into the season, most of the offense was planned on the running attack anyway. Even if Benson does not play to capabilities,  Jones has an Improved line that he was not used to last year. You don't think it was a huge difference getting Miller? Why is that move HUGE? Tait can play at his natural position now. Kruetz has a chip on his shoulder, Im sure he will bounce back this year.  Orton will probably attempt 20-25 passes a game AT THE VERY MOST.  The rest will be running. Running out the clock. Keeping the D rested. Shoop is gone. Shea is gone. We have a coordinator who found success with Erik Kramer , Raymont Harris, and Jeff Graham .  Turner will mix up the plays. No more running up the middle 3 and outs.  That will make a difference.

I think based on the schedule, the 2 upgraded receivers, upgraded line, the injured players returning, the new O Coordinator  and the fact that they are a young team (young teams tend to only get better) . 8-8 would be a disapointment.

1) Nope you never said elite, I was just comparing from your 1st post the Ravens who were an elite team, to the Bears who are not.

2) Once again 10-6 to me is out of their reach, without a capable 2nd WR, and O-Line that will need time to gel and isn't in the top half in the league, and a new offensive system for the 2nd year in a row.

3) Brown and Ogunleye are both around 260LBS, and are known more for their pass rushing abilities than stopping the run. Opponents rushed for 128.1 yards a game against them last season. Just saying they don't have a Washington or Traylor in the middle anymore to clog the run.

4) No Vasher wouldn't start for half the teams in the NFL, outlined below. He was a 4th round pick last season;

Dallas - Newman, Henry.

Philadelphia - Brown, Sheppard.

Giants - Allan, Peterson.

Washington - Rogers, Springs.

Minnesota - Smoot, Winfield.

Carolina - Gamble, Lucas.

Seattle - Trufant, Dyson

Patriots - Starks, Wilson

Jaguars - Mathis, Cousin

Bucs - Barber, Kelly

Falcons - Hall, Webster

Browns - Baxter, McCutchon

Ravens - McAlister, Rolle

Texans - Robinson, Buchanon

Chargers - Jammer, Davis

5) I'm not that convinced Miller is as good as what most people expect, but we'll have to wait and see. Kreutz will need to get back to all pro form as well, the interior of the line will be very important with that power running game.

6) Turner's a wild - card. This time last year, people who probably saying how good Terry Shea was, and how he was going to open up the offense. Let's see how the Bears offense goes in a few games 1st, the pre-season has hardly been promising in that regard.

7) The schedule is good, but the Bears will have to win the games they're expected too. I only think Muhammed is an upgrade for the moment, doubt Bradley will make any impact until next season unless he's starting. They really need a good catching tight - end, that makes a big difference to a QB, just ask Drew Bledsoe with Jason Witten and Ben Coates. Desmond Clark doesn't cut it on that regard. A lot of teams in the division are probably going to be around the 8-8 mark, I don't think the Bears will win it or make the playoffs however, but ya never know.

[SoxFanForever]

How the hell did we get worse then last year? We almost won 6 games last year and we had freakin Hutchinson starting..We added a Pro Bowl WR, another OL so to make the line better, our running game should be good and we have the best D in that freakin div..Anybody see that Lions game? This is the team that's better then us? Green bay lost just about all the O line and that D is pathetic..The Vikes should be good, but am i missin something..am I not being objective here..

A team that is that good on D can't possibly be ranked last in the NFL..

 

But hey, what the hell do i know..they're the "experts"

 

Losing 2 guards is losing all of your O-Line? They kept their two great tackles and get their pro bowl center back from injury. However, I guess 2 guys make an offensive line these days?

 

As far as defense, I think that the Pack D will be much improved this year. They will be a bend but don't break type of D. I really think Jim Bates can help turn them around. From what I have seen in the pre-season they have had much more sure tackling, played more physically and looked more organized overall. They have not given up a big play pretty much the whole pre-season. I think most Dolphin fans can attest to how good Bates is and how much is coaching and preparation can help turn a D around.

 

However, that is just my opinion.

[Spiff]

Losing 2 guards is losing all of your O-Line?  They kept their two great tackles and get their pro bowl center back from injury.  However, I guess 2 guys make an offensive line these days?

 

As far as defense, I think that the Pack D will be much improved this year.  They will be a bend but don't break type of D.  I really think Jim Bates can help turn them around.  From what I have seen in the pre-season they have had much more sure tackling, played more physically and looked more organized overall.  They have not given up a big play pretty much the whole pre-season.  I think most Dolphin fans can attest to how good Bates is and how much is coaching and preparation can help turn a D around.

 

However, that is just my opinion.

 

They just got b****-slapped by the Patriots in all facets of the game, and they have been outscored 54-10 the last two preseason games. I wouldn't exactly call that encouraging.

[SoxFanForever]

They just got b****-slapped by the Patriots in all facets of the game, and they have been outscored 54-10 the last two preseason games.  I wouldn't exactly call that encouraging.

I feel that the offense and special teams have played much worse than the D has the last two games. The D hasn't been put in much position to succeed with the turnovers and sloppy ST play. A post I read on another board sums up perfectly what I feel about their D...

 

Look at what the Packers starting D (without Jackson and Hunt) have done to our opponents starting offense:

 

QB's

 

Brees: Longest pass from scrimmage: 19 yards/QB rating: 18.3

 

Losman: Longest pass: 15 yards/QB rating: 61.3

 

Brady: Longest pass: 20 yards/QB rating 90.8

 

RB's

 

I won't count the Charger game because I'll just get bashed by trolls that Tomlinson wasn't playing.

 

McGahee: Longest run: 13 yards

Dillon: Longest run: 14 yards

 

Are we giving up yards? Yes. We have yet to give up a big play by our starting defense even without our two starting tackles. Our defense this year is not going to be great but they will be above average possibly even good. Compare that to last years "horrible" and anything is possible.

 

There are so many new bright spots on this years team...Collins, Hawkins, Manning, Thompson. The players from last season appear to be stepping up their game...Roman yes Roman has played like a man on a mission this preseason. Carroll has stepped up and played probably the best I have ever seen him play against the Patriots. The Linebackers are tackling and tackling with authority believe it or not. It's like they learned how to play football again under Bates.

 

We have given up a average of I believe 21 points/game this preseason the biggest reason is turnovers. We have got to stop turning the ball over on offense. Our defense can't do a whole lot when they are constantly having to defend a short field. If our offense can protect the ball we will have a top 15 defense this season. Pin it to the top bash me all you want.... wait and see the Packers D will prove all you naysayers wrong.

[hammerhead johnson]

Losing 2 guards is losing all of your O-Line?  They kept their two great tackles and get their pro bowl center back from injury.  However, I guess 2 guys make an offensive line these days?

 

Mike Wahle is one of the best guards in the business, and Marco Rivera is damn good. You could argue that they'd both make a Top 20 Guards list in the NFL. You can't just replace those guys with adequate (or worse) players and hope that they'll still have a Top 10 O-Line. They won't.

 

Clifton and Tauscher are good tackles, but they're not exactly elite. Flanagan is still one of the best centers in the business, though.

 

As far as defense, I think that the Pack D will be much improved this year.  They will be a bend but don't break type of D.  I really think Jim Bates can help turn them around.  From what I have seen in the pre-season they have had much more sure tackling, played more physically and looked more organized overall.  They have not given up a big play pretty much the whole pre-season.  I think most Dolphin fans can attest to how good Bates is and how much is coaching and preparation can help turn a D around.

 

I think that the Packers will have the worst defense in the entire NFL outside of maybe the Saints and 49ers this year.

 

HOLES = Adequate players, or worse

Solid = Above average NFL player

 

CB: HOLE

FS: HOLE

SS: HOLE

CB: Al Harris (Solid)

OLB: Nail Diggs (Solid)

MLB: Nick Barnett (All-Pro Caliber)

OLB: HOLE

DE: Aaron Kampman (Solid)

DT: Grady Jackson (Solid)

DT: HOLE

DE: Kabaar Biamila (Solid)

 

That is what I would call swiss cheese. I'm sure that a player or two will step up, but it would be tough to find a team that has less depth on defense than the Packers. I guess that an optimistic outlook is all one could have during preseason, but the honest-to-god truth is that this defense really sucks.

 

Just to clarify, Biamila is all-pro caliber against the pass, but he can't do much against the run, and therefore, I have him down as a solid overall player. Some might disagree.

 

So, you're a Packers fan, huh?

[SoxFanForever]

Mike Wahle is one of the best guards in the business, and Marco Rivera is damn good.  You could argue that they'd both make a Top 20 Guards list in the NFL.  You can't just replace those guys with adequate (or worse) players and hope that they'll still have a Top 10 O-Line.  They won't. 

 

Clifton and Tauscher are good tackles, but they're not exactly elite. Flanagan is still one of the best centers in the business, though.

I think that the Packers will have the worst defense in the entire NFL outside of maybe the Saints and 49ers this year. 

 

HOLES = Adequate players, or worse

Solid = Above average NFL player

 

CB: HOLE

FS: HOLE

SS: HOLE

CB: Al Harris (Solid)

OLB: Nail Diggs (Solid)

MLB: Nick Barnett (All-Pro Caliber)

OLB: HOLE

DE: Aaron Kampman (Solid)

DT: Grady Jackson (Solid)

DT: HOLE

DE: Kabaar Biamila (Solid)

 

That is what I would call swiss cheese.  I'm sure that a player or two will step up, but it would be tough to find a team that has less depth on defense than the Packers.  I guess that an optimistic outlook is all one could have during preseason, but the honest-to-god truth is that this defense really sucks.

 

Just to clarify, Biamila is all-pro caliber against the pass, but he can't do much against the run, and therefore, I have him down as a solid overall player.  Some might disagree.

So, you're a Packers fan, huh?

What would give you that idea?

[hammerhead johnson]

Nathan Vasher would start for more than half the teams in the NFL, I think they will be fine in that area.     

 

Vasher shouldn't be starting for anybody. He's good against the run, but god damn, from everything that I have witnessed, he can't cover for s***.

 

Yep, the Bears have major holes in terms of depth at CB and LB.

 

And that's why they're not in my elite 4:

 

New England

Jacksonville

Buffalo

Carolina

 

Teams like the Eagles, Ravens, Bears, Jets, etc have some serious star power in their starting units, but if numerous guys get injured, well, you know how it goes. Depth prevails.

[GoodAsGould]

I wouldnt even call Al Harris solid for the packers... maybe as a number 2 CB but he is their number 1.....And he is one guy id consider having vasher start over....

[WHarris1]

Not lookin too good on that Bears vs. Cowboys bet right now.

Ya I fear those mighty Cowboys. HAHAHAHA

[WHarris1]

Of course injuries could happen again this year, and it's not like Urlacher missed the whole season. Is Bradley going to be a difference maker straight away? These are the type of questions the Bears need to answer.

You're right the Bears didn't get better they are 2 games worse than last year. What could I be thinking.

[SoxFan1]

Vasher shouldn't be starting for anybody.  He's good against the run, but god damn, from everything that I have witnessed, he can't cover for s***.

 

Yep, the Bears have major holes in terms of depth at CB and LB.

 

And that's why they're not in my elite 4:

 

New England

Jacksonville

Buffalo

Carolina

 

Teams like the Eagles, Ravens, Bears, Jets, etc have some serious star power in their starting units, but if numerous guys get injured, well, you know how it goes.  Depth prevails.

Not deep at LB huh? How about Urlacher, Briggs, Odom, Hillenmeyer, Ayanbadejo, and Woods?

 

Cornerback is out maine problem at D...Tillman is proven IMO. Azumah is a good CB. Vasher is a solid nickel-back who has an eye for the game. He seems to always be involved in plays when there is a fumble or a pick. Between Pippens, Davis, McMillon, and Marshall...its a toss-up.

 

DE: Ogunleye = All-Pro

DT: Harris = All-Pro Caliber

DT: Scott = Solid

DE: Brown = All-Pro Caliber

LB: Hillenmeyer = Solid

LB: Urlacher = All-Pro

LB: Briggs = All-Pro Caliber

CB: Tillman = All-Pro Caliber

CB: Azumah = Solid

FS: Green = Solid

SS: Brown = All-Pro

 

I see no holes outside of POSSIBLY Hillenmeyers position and Azumahs position.

[SoxFan1]

Mike Wahle is one of the best guards in the business, and Marco Rivera is damn good.  You could argue that they'd both make a Top 20 Guards list in the NFL.  You can't just replace those guys with adequate (or worse) players and hope that they'll still have a Top 10 O-Line.  They won't. 

 

Clifton and Tauscher are good tackles, but they're not exactly elite. Flanagan is still one of the best centers in the business, though.

I think that the Packers will have the worst defense in the entire NFL outside of maybe the Saints and 49ers this year. 

 

HOLES = Adequate players, or worse

Solid = Above average NFL player

 

CB: HOLE

FS: HOLE

SS: HOLE

CB: Al Harris (Solid)

OLB: Nail Diggs (Solid)

MLB: Nick Barnett (All-Pro Caliber)

OLB: HOLE

DE: Aaron Kampman (Solid)

DT: Grady Jackson (Solid)

DT: HOLE

DE: Kabaar Biamila (Solid)

 

That is what I would call swiss cheese.  I'm sure that a player or two will step up, but it would be tough to find a team that has less depth on defense than the Packers.  I guess that an optimistic outlook is all one could have during preseason, but the honest-to-god truth is that this defense really sucks.

 

Just to clarify, Biamila is all-pro caliber against the pass, but he can't do much against the run, and therefore, I have him down as a solid overall player.  Some might disagree.

 

So, you're a Packers fan, huh?

But what about LeRoy Butler!?!?!?!?!?!

[GASHWOUND]

Losing 2 guards is losing all of your O-Line?  They kept their two great tackles and get their pro bowl center back from injury.  However, I guess 2 guys make an offensive line these days?

 

As far as defense, I think that the Pack D will be much improved this year.  They will be a bend but don't break type of D.  I really think Jim Bates can help turn them around.  From what I have seen in the pre-season they have had much more sure tackling, played more physically and looked more organized overall.  They have not given up a big play pretty much the whole pre-season.  I think most Dolphin fans can attest to how good Bates is and how much is coaching and preparation can help turn a D around.

 

However, that is just my opinion.

 

Well, their 2 best O-line men and you know how hard it is to find good O-line men in this league..you can't just replace 2 top-of-the-line-men just like that with out gettin worse.

 

and NBC broke down the Pack and what do ya know..same concerns I laid out..picked them 4th

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/8667886/

 

 

Also, finally not a bad breakdown of the bears..he picked us to finsih 2nd or tied for 2nd with the Lions

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/8667961/

[SoxFan1]

Lets reflect on the Bears draft for a second here....

 

Cedric "Holdout" Benson and Mark Bradley

 

or

 

Mike Williams and J.J. Arrington

 

Hmmmmm.

[GASHWOUND]

Lets reflect on the Bears draft for a second here....

 

Cedric "Holdout" Benson and Mark Bradley

 

or

 

Mike Williams and J.J. Arrington

 

Hmmmmm.

 

 

Ok Nostradamus...before you anoint Arrington the better runner I'm gonna let them play a season and decide after that... Plus isn't Arrington more of a match to Thomas Jones then not.. I think they wanted to get a pounder to go along with Jones quickness..no need drafting similar backs.

[SoxFan1]

Ok Nostradamus...before you anoint Arrington the better runner I'm gonna let them play a season and decide after that... Plus isn't Arrington more of a match to Thomas Jones then not.. I think they wanted to get a pounder to go along with Jones quickness..no need drafting similar backs.

Easy there killer. I never said Arrington was better than Benson, I asked which would you rather have right now. I would have rather had a good WR who has the talent to become an All-Pro WR and a good RB than a selfish RB who doesnt want to be compared to Ricky Williams but acts just like him and a WR who was even unproven in College.

 

Of course, we will see how it works out but at this current moment, I'd rather have Williams and Arrington.

[Colorado Sox Fan]

I'm not too excited about this season, but we're not the worst team in the league.

[SoxFan1]

I'm not too excited about this season, but we're not the worst team in the league.

The Bronco's are a good team, I agree.

[Colorado Sox Fan]

Guess I need to change to Colorado Bears Fan. Broncos fans make me :puke

[SoxFan1]

Guess I need to change to Colorado Bears Fan. Broncos fans make me :puke

Haha. Go Bears!

[GoodAsGould]

Hey Soxfan1 this is coming from another Bears fan but has anyone ever called you a bit of a homer b4... if not than I am now