how we learned to stop worrying and love fathom

[Kalapse]

Just to add to this thread, I love fathom too   

 

And, I don't know if this even means anything at all, but why the hell not...

 

2004 White Sox

August - 12-17

Sept/Oct - 19-13

Ross Gload hit .403 with 4 HRs and a 1.133 OPS in 67 ABs last September. He could be SO huge for this team down the stretch, it's not even funny.

[witesoxfan]

Ross Gload hit .403 with 4 HRs and a 1.133 OPS in 67 ABs last September. He could be SO huge for this team down the stretch, it's not even funny.

 

People want to add a bat...maybe KW already thinks the bat is in house. Podsednik off the DL perhaps, or maybe, just maybe, it is Gload.

 

The 40-man comes into play, so Gload should come up. It's a matter of Ozzie playing him. Meaning the only time, absolutely ONLY time Geoff Blum should play is when he is backing up the guys at 2B and 3B.

[fathom]

People want to add a bat...maybe KW already thinks the bat is in house.  Podsednik off the DL perhaps, or maybe, just maybe, it is Gload.

 

The 40-man comes into play, so Gload should come up.  It's a matter of Ozzie playing him.  Meaning the only time, absolutely ONLY time Geoff Blum should play is when he is backing up the guys at 2B and 3B.

 

If KW thought Gload was the offensive answer, you can bet your ass he would have been on the MLB roster during the last few weeks. Also, since when did Blum become the whipping boy? How quick we all forget how poorly Crede was playing in August.

[Capn12]

I admittedly didn't read all of this, but I'm not exactly understanding why Blum has become the poster child for all the Sox faults right now...

[Spiff]

"how everyone learned to keep ripping me off and not come up with an original title."

[SoxFan562004]

People want to add a bat...maybe KW already thinks the bat is in house.  Podsednik off the DL perhaps, or maybe, just maybe, it is Gload.

I think KW wanted to add a bat, but with the complete lack of moves it seems there was no market this year.

[witesoxfan]

If KW thought Gload was the offensive answer, you can bet your ass he would have been on the MLB roster during the last few weeks.  Also, since when did Blum become the whipping boy?  How quick we all forget how poorly Crede was playing in August.

 

I just keep forgetting Crede's injured, quite honestly. Don't ask why.

 

However, I'm not sure about you, but I'd much rather see Ozuna at SS with Uribe at 3B than Uribe at SS and Blum at 3B. Ozuna is a relatively weak hitter who is mainly singles with the occasional double, but he atleast gives the Sox a somewhat reliable bat.

 

And about Gload...maybe KW views him as Plan AA? With every other option exhausted, (KW not being able to make a move, and now the trade deadline passed), perhaps he intends on having Gload come up.

 

One other factor I see in KW not being able to bring Gload up is his lack of versatility. He is above average defensively at 1B, and weak everywhere else(everywhere being OF, because he obviously can't play C, 2B, SS, or 3B). He could have DH'ed, but at that point, who do you send down to make room for Gload? You can't send down Ozuna, because Blum really can't play SS; you can't send down Blum, because then you basically have no 3Bman(which I keep forgetting about for some reason...I also say basically, because as stated, Uribe can play 3B...he is about the only one on the roster who can play an adequate 3B...I didn't see much of the Widger game, so I can't really comment on how he looked at 3B), and there is about no one else that could have realistically been sent down. Adkins perhaps, but then there is no inning eater when we need one.

 

Just MHO, but it's kind of how I look at it.

[witesoxfan]

I think KW wanted to add a bat, but with the complete lack of moves it seems there was no market this year.

 

I don't buy that. If he wanted to make a move bad enough, he could have made a move. Lawton went for nothing...why did he not try and get Lawton either time?

[SoxFanForever]

"how everyone learned to keep ripping me off and not come up with an original title."

By you using that wouldn't that make you unoriginal as well Spiff?

[SleepyWhiteSox]

"how everyone learned to keep ripping me off and not come up with an original title."

 

You're supposed to give credit to the movie...

[southsider2k5]

Welcome aboard.   

 

Let me warn you immediately--you're not going to make friends easily with this post. 

 

Williams will (I'm positive) hold blame for any scenario regarding this team which doesn't involve, at the least, an ALCS appearance. Best record in baseball at midseason, Williams failed to upgrade our offense. Excuses ranged from "Two to Tango" Philosophy (overzelous sellers asking too much) to "Lack of Moves" philosophy (no one else did anything!). Both are wrong and shouldn't apply to a team which, if the correct move was made, put itself in a tremendous opportunity to build on it's success and upgrade a suspect offense.

 

Point which irritates regarding Williams is he's been more than willing to hand out prospects for midseason trades in the past when our team was 7 games out of first. But when we're 15 games up on the second place team and almost guaranteed a playoff roster he does absolutely s***. Give up prospects if necessary; offer to pay the remainder of a salary--future success isn't guaranteed with any team. This may be our window to contend for a World Series. Tigers and Indians can no longer be expected to lay down for us every year. Williams should concern himself with winning now--because we may not be in a position like we are now for another 5 years. He certaintly won't be around to see if his team collapses or falls flat in the first round.

 

Just curious are you telling me that you would have been willing to give up something like Contreras, Marte, McCarthy and a prospect to get a bat? Because that is what the asking prices were for these kind of players. The deals weren't just prospects, go back and read what Kenny said at the deadline, they were asking for guys like Buehrle, Garland, and Garcia, were you willing to trade those guys to get a bat? It wasn't just "prospects" that were being asked for. Like I said, go back and read what GMs said at the break, and the names that were being floated. It wasn't as easy as sending Brian Anderson to get someone like it has been in years past. We would have had to put multiple holes in the starting line ups, in order to do what you are saying.

[southsider2k5]

For you to blame KW is just unbelievably STUPID on your part.  Who do you think put together the team as it currently is?  If you can't be thankful or grateful enough, get the hell out of this bandwagon AND STAY OFF!

 

BTW this is exactly what we are talking about in the personal attacks department, and it is being taken care of.

[southsider2k5]

Just curious are you telling me that you would have been willing to give up something like Contreras, Marte, McCarthy and a prospect to get a bat?  Because that is what the asking prices were for these kind of players.  The deals weren't just prospects, go back and read what Kenny said at the deadline, they were asking for guys like Buehrle, Garland, and Garcia, were you willing to trade those guys to get a bat?  It wasn't just "prospects" that were being asked for.  Like I said, go back and read what GMs said at the break, and the names that were being floated.  It wasn't as easy as sending Brian Anderson to get someone like it has been in years past.  We would have had to put multiple holes in the starting line ups, in order to do what you are saying.

 

No one wanted to take this on? Who would have been willing to pay the asking price of one of our good starters, one of our good relievers, McCarthy, and a prosepect for a good hitter?

[Flash Tizzle]

No one wanted to take this on? 

 

My response to this topic on the Mariotti thread:

 

http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index.php?sh...pic=39395&st=50

 

Whining about the nature of this market needs to end. What Williams did last offseason should not blind any of you to the problems which exist.

 

I don't know how to put it any clearer than this: the position we're at with this team--our record and position in the standings, was not a justification for merely acquiring Blum. And neither is indicating the lack of moves other American League teams made is a positive for us. Sox fans shouldn't be kindergarden teachers responsible for handing out stickers to young children (this instance Williams) who TWWIIIEEED, but couldn't succeed. He failed to upgrade the offense, and now because of it, it's ALL coming on him for anything less than a pitching collapse (which he couldn't have predicted) or a ALCS birth.

 

Ask yourselves if future success is guaranteed with this club? With the resurgence of the Indians/Tigers, can anyone even guess whether or not we'll be in a position of a commanding lead for another 5 years? We can promote 6 contributing prospects with McCarthy leading the rotation and still find ourselves contending for 3rd place. 2005 could be our year--our window to take advantage of a stellar pitching staff and ride it through October. Now, I anticipate someone asking "you can't predict whether or not this team is guaranteed to win if a bat is acquired either!!!" Yes, but at this point, with our 4 automatic outs per evening, what we have doesn't convince me change (even at the slightest) wasn't absolutely necessary.

 

I've read complaints relating to the prospects we may have had to give up. McCarthy, at this juncture, was the only untouchable. For an organization unable to produce pitching talent we need to hold onto those whch succeed. The remaining prospects can all be shipped for Raul Ibanez himself for all I care. Is Chris Young guaranteed to mimmick the outstanding production he's put together? Are Sweeney, Anderson, Owens and Young going to substitute for each other in the remaining OF position (RF)?

 

If Young/Sweeney/Gonzalez were traded for f***ing Raul Ibanez I'd still consider it a justifiable move because the goal of baseball is to win championships. Neither of the aforementioned players have done anything to put our club in the position to strengthen itself this season. I understand the need to develop minor leaguers in order to keep a stream of cheap talent flowing. However, we're in need of help. Since no one can provide a Jeff Francouer boast we'll need help outside the organization. Even if top prospects were traded for Ibanez, and all made out to be quality major leaguers, it was worthwhile. Just think back to 2000--would any of you have overpaid for pitching if it meant trading our supposed talent? Probably not. We'd be having the same discussion.

 

SS2k5 asked me in another thread whether or not I'd be willing to give up several starting pitchers/outfielders for slight upgrades. No, because I doubt those were the true asking prices near the deadline. I don't recall San Diego or Boston giving up an arm and a leg for Randa or Graffanino. Or Braves/New York handing over the farm for Hollandsworth/Lawton.

 

Ultimately, our pitiful offense was in dire need of an upgrade. This was known prior to the passing of both trading deadlines. While Reds management blocked the KGJ prior to July 31, it was Williams duty to offer whatever possible to acquire Griffey. If Reds were unwilling to budge, it would have been within his best interests to move on. I intend to believe the Southtown article posted yesterday which claims money, not talent, was the true negotiating factor between the two clubs. Reinsdorf probably wouldn't budge on a set standard of contract he'd take on.

 

No one can convince me of all the teams in this league, there was not ONE bat which could be acquired to help this club. Defend Williams now and hope this offense can win games, because if we're choking down the stretch or embarrassing ourselves in the playoffs you'll all have to repeat your Williams defense several hundred times to justify it.

[nitetrain8601]

I don't buy that.  If he wanted to make a move bad enough, he could have made a move.  Lawton went for nothing...why did he not try and get Lawton either time?

 

Very true.