Let the Mariotti Bashing Begin

[wsox08]

haha Mariotti on PTI, he is going crazy and is a f***ing idiot.. The White Sox would have to stop playing to not win this division. It's a new month and the schedule gets much easier..

[nitetrain8601]

Jason Whitlock(I think) on PTI said that he thinks Mariotti is overreacting. I think Jay is right to an extent, but Jason needs to watch more Chicago baseball.

[wsox08]

Jason Whitlock(I think) on PTI said that he thinks Mariotti is overreacting. I think Jay is right to an extent, but Jason needs to watch more Chicago baseball.

I think Mariotti is overreacting.. I agree w/ Jason

[Texsox]

He's a bandwagon jumper.  No way around it.  He slurps Chicago teams when they're winning, and when things aren't going so well, he writes an article similar to today's.

 

I don't get the whole bandwagon thing. He isn't a fan, he's a columnist. Are y'all saying he should always rah rah the team, through thick and thin? Or should he always find fault? If he reports accurately, there will be positive and negative articles. And look at the team since the can't choke was written. Thomas out for the season, Crede injured, Hermanson nursing a sore back, Pods on the DH. Only an idiot would say that none of that would change an opinion.

 

I am always amazed that y'all think columnists should slurp the hometown BS. Mariotti has been a lot more generous than most of the out of town press. Y'all would be fitted for strait jackets if you had to read what the rest of the world thinks of the teams chances.

[BFirebird]

I think Mariotti is overreacting.. I agree w/ Jason

 

 

wait...moronatti overreact? cover his ass on both sides to always be right?

 

never

[nitetrain8601]

I don't get the whole bandwagon thing. He isn't a fan, he's a columnist. Are y'all saying he should always rah rah the team, through thick and thin? Or should he always find fault? If he reports accurately, there will be positive and negative articles. And look at the team since the can't choke was written. Thomas out for the season, Crede injured, Hermanson nursing a sore back, Pods on the DH. Only an idiot would say that none of that would change an opinion.

 

I am always amazed that y'all think columnists should slurp the hometown BS. Mariotti has been a lot more generous than most of the out of town press. Y'all would be fitted for strait jackets if you had to read what the rest of the world thinks of the teams chances.

 

Great post.

[greg775]

This man is certifiably insane!!!! With this line

At the risk of being called an ax murderer by Hawk Harrelson, I'll go so far to acknowledge the Indians are a better club than the Sox

Give me a xxxkxkxxkxkx break!

That is bulls***.

 

Mariotti realizes sports fans have short memories (except we astute Sox fans).

Check out his column when we were at our best.

He pretty much said this was the magical year, on and on, World Series bound.

Now he has a chance to do what he does best again, rip and question.

He's talented and has it made because he doesnt

have to have any perspective in his writings.

He just overreacts to what is going on on a particular day.

[greg775]

If the Sox win the division handily and Cleveland has a so so to s*** September, Mariotti should always be reminded of his comment that Cleve. has a better team than the Sox.

If Cleveland proves him right, I'll give him my praise.

Otherwise ... what a loser.

[daa84]

this is what i emailed him

Mr. Mariotti,

Please stop trying to shake things up in this city. Everyone knows your recent article on how the white sox could blow it is simply to get everyone peeved. Remember that "Sox won't choke" article you wrote? Well your article today not only proves Hawk Harrelson is right when he says you're a hypocrite, but you keep personally attacking him in your columns. To be honest, the arguement you and him have over the broadcast and through your columns couldn't be more Junior high, both parties included. You guys both bicker back and forth taking whatever jabs at the other you can like two 8th grade girls fighting over a boy. Please, all I urge is that you stop trying to make the last page of the suntimes a breeding ground for controversy in this town. Oh and quit doing the point finger thing on Around the horn when you score a point. we know you scored, congrats you beat woody paige, HUGE accomplishment.

so yeah heres how mariotti responded.....direct quote....maybe hes the one who should take some grammar courses

 

Um, why are so angry?

[DBAHO]

Whining about the nature of this market needs to end. What Williams did last offseason should not blind any of you to the problems which exist.

 

I don't know how to put it any clearer than this: the position we're at with this team--our record and position in the standings, was not a justification for merely acquiring Blum. And neither is indicating the lack of moves other American League teams made is a positive for us. Sox fans shouldn't be kindergarden teachers responsible for handing out stickers to young children (this instance Williams) who TWWIIIEEED, but couldn't succeed. He failed to upgrade the offense, and now because of it, it's ALL coming on him for anything less than a pitching collapse (which he couldn't have predicted) or a ALCS birth.

 

Ask yourselves if future success is guaranteed with this club? With the resurgence of the Indians/Tigers, can anyone even guess whether or not we'll be in a position of a commanding lead for another 5 years? We can promote 6 contributing prospects with McCarthy leading the rotation and still find ourselves contending for 3rd place. 2005 could be our year--our window to take advantage of a stellar pitching staff and ride it through October. Now, I anticipate someone asking "you can't predict whether or not this team is guaranteed to win if a bat is acquired either!!!" Yes, but at this point, with our 4 automatic outs per evening, what we have doesn't convince me change (even at the slightest) wasn't absolutely necessary.

 

I've read complaints relating to the prospects we may have had to give up. McCarthy, at this juncture, was the only untouchable. For an organization unable to produce pitching talent we need to hold onto those whch succeed. The remaining prospects can all be shipped for Raul Ibanez himself for all I care. Is Chris Young guaranteed to mimmick the outstanding production he's put together? Are Sweeney, Anderson, Owens and Young going to substitute for each other in the remaining OF position (RF)?

 

If Young/Sweeney/Gonzalez were traded for f***ing Raul Ibanez I'd still consider it a justifiable move because the goal of baseball is to win championships. Neither of the aforementioned players have done anything to put our club in the position to strengthen itself this season. I understand the need to develop minor leaguers in order to keep a stream of cheap talent flowing. However, we're in need of help. Since no one can provide a Jeff Francouer boast we'll need help outside the organization. Even if top prospects were traded for Ibanez, and all made out to be quality major leaguers, it was worthwhile. Just think back to 2000--would any of you have overpaid for pitching if it meant trading our supposed talent? Probably not. We'd be having the same discussion.

 

SS2k5 asked me in another thread whether or not I'd be willing to give up several starting pitchers/outfielders for slight upgrades. No, because I doubt those were the true asking prices near the deadline. I don't recall San Diego or Boston giving up an arm and a leg for Randa or Graffanino. Or Braves/New York handing over the farm for Hollandsworth/Lawton.

 

Ultimately, our pitiful offense was in dire need of an upgrade. This was known prior to the passing of both trading deadlines. While Reds management blocked the KGJ prior to July 31, it was Williams duty to offer whatever possible to acquire Griffey. If Reds were unwilling to budge, it would have been within his best interests to move on. I intend to believe the Southtown article posted yesterday which claims money, not talent, was the true negotiating factor between the two clubs. Reinsdorf probably wouldn't budge on a set standard of contract he'd take on.

 

No one can convince me of all the teams in this league, there was not ONE bat which could be acquired to help this club. Defend Williams now and hope this offense can win games, because if we're choking down the stretch or embarrassing ourselves in the playoffs you'll all have to repeat your Williams defense several hundred times to justify it.

The point is on Ibanez is this. Say you give up Sweeney, Gonzalez and Young for him. The Sox don't win the world series, heck they don't even make it out of the divisional playoffs. Is it a worthwhile trade then? No. We can't put all of our eggs into one basket, because when the likes of Young and Gio could be very good players on the major league level, then we will regret it.

 

Like I said before the Angels needed a bat, besides Vlad, Garret Anderson, and Chone Figgins, the rest of their offense has hardly been stellar. They wanted Mike Sweeney. Did they get him? No. Why? Because they weren't willing to give up some top prospects and take on the rest of Sweeney's $30M contract.

 

It's really not fair to bring say Boston into this, because all they got was Tony G. We got Geoff Blum, is there a great difference b/w the 2? No, not at all, Blum's a better fielder (which fits into the Ozzie mold more), while Graff has a bit of a better stick.

 

Has Joe Randa made a big difference to the Padres? No, in fact in July and August he's only hit .239 and .245.

 

Don't forget Minny and Cleveland are going to really good in the next 5 years, think 90+ games they should be winning. Add Detroit with an owner that is willing to spend heaps to win now, the Sox need to remain competitive over that time, and having good young players that will give you payroll flexibility is an excellent way to go about it.

[DBAHO]

I agree that is what i said since trade deadline, reality is all these prospects we CANNOT give up by some will never be more than roster filler, odds say so If Sox had to overpay for someone so what, worry about 2005 not 2007.

How will our prospects be nothing more than roster filler? Do you think Brandon McCarthy is just going to be a 5th starter for the rest of his career? Is Brian Anderson only going to be a 4th OF?

 

Prospects have come through our system and had success. Neal Cotts and Bobby Jenks are the 2 recent ones to come to mind, and there are many more on the way.

[Rowand44]

How will our prospects be nothing more than roster filler? Do you think Brandon McCarthy is just going to be a 5th starter for the rest of his career? Is Brian Anderson only going to be a 4th OF?

 

Prospects have come through our system and had success. Neal Cotts and Bobby Jenks are the 2 recent ones to come to mind, and there are many more on the way.

I am all for trading prospects. I said during the deadline the last spect I wanted to trade was bmac but if you could get an impact player ala Jr or Huff then I'd be all for it. The problem is if we wanted to get a minor player we would have had to give a player or two of the Mccarthy calibur(young, anderson, sweeney, etc). The same people that are complaining now about Kenny not trading away these spects would be the same people complaining a year or two down the road when those guys are having huge impacts and the minor player we traded for just wasn't worth it.

[Rowand44]

Don't forget Minny and Cleveland are going to really good in the next 5 years, think 90+ games they should be winning. Add Detroit with an owner that is willing to spend heaps to win now, the Sox need to remain competitive over that time, and having good young players that will give you payroll flexibility is an excellent way to go about it.

The A.L. central will be the best division in baseball next year, I'm pretty confident in saying so.

[SoxFan1]

The A.L. central will be the best division in baseball next year, I'm pretty confident in saying so.

I can agree with that, definitely. The Sox will be expected to perform. Minnesota needs to imorove and get healthy but will still be in contention...they always seem to be. The Indians have lots of talent but just need to put it all together for a full season. I wont be surprised to see them win the WC. Tigers are in the same boat as the Indians. They just need to put it all together. Kansas City....well.......... yeah.

[fathom]

The AL/NL East will both be good because of the high payrolls in those divisions. If the Orioles and Blue Jays spend a lot of money like they've said they will, the AL East will be damn good. For some reason, I've found myself rooting for the Mets this year. I love the mix of young studs like Wright and Reyes and Pedro/Beltran, etc. They're definitely a fun team to watch.

[DBAHO]

I am all for trading prospects.  I said during the deadline the last spect I wanted to trade was bmac but if you could get an impact player ala Jr or Huff then I'd be all for it.  The problem is if we wanted to get a minor player we would have had to give a player or two of the Mccarthy calibur(young, anderson, sweeney, etc).  The same people that are complaining now about Kenny not trading away these spects would be the same people complaining a year or two down the road when those guys are having huge impacts and the minor player we traded for just wasn't worth it.

See I guess I differ on this philosophy a little, although I'm in the minority. You have a look at the contracts the SP's were getting last off-season, the Russ Ortiz's. You get a Brandon McCarthy, who's under your control for about 6 years, the 1st half very cheaply, and he performs better than those guys who get the big deals, that's huge. It allows you to put your money elsewhere, whether it'd be in the FA market etc.

[DBAHO]

I can agree with that, definitely. The Sox will be expected to perform. Minnesota needs to imorove and get healthy but will still be in contention...they always seem to be. The Indians have lots of talent but just need to put it all together for a full season. I wont be surprised to see them win the WC. Tigers are in the same boat as the Indians. They just need to put it all together. Kansas City....well.......... yeah.

Don't worry about Minnesota next year they're going to be back right up where they were before this season. Francisco Liriano will be joining the rotation, he's basically Johan Santana Jr. and he's going to be a stud for a long, long time. Scott Baker may be joining the rotation too and he's a very good prospect in his own right. Add that to Justin Morneau rebounding, Jason Bartlett coming on etc. they'll be back.

[YASNY]

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...-home-headlines

 

There are some interesting bits and pieces in this article...

 

There are only a few select guys," Williams said. "Actually not a few. Only one, one or two guys out there who could have come in and made a difference. But you can't make a deal with a club that doesn't want to make a deal. And we saw that. I think there were 16 [teams] that still think they had a chance [to go to the playoffs]

 

Emphasis mine.

 

Compounding the problem, Williams said, was that American League Central rivals were unwilling to do anything to help the White Sox, thus narrowing the pool of players available.

 

As a matter of fact, deals I proposed on the board were not very good deals from our perspective. We would have paid too much. This is a special situation. I was willing to offer more than the value was because it was a special situation. Yet we couldn't get anything done.

 

This addresses a few of the most common complaints about the lack of trades. The fact that there were 16 teams with self-percieved playoff shots, leaves 14 realistically possible trade partners. Eliminate the AL Central teams, and we are down to 10. One of those being the Cubs, which is an iffy proposition at best.

 

Someone mentioned we should have acquired Graffanino. See the bold print in the second quote. Unwilling means unwilling, period.

 

Others have said we should have overpaid to get something done. KW agreed with you and made offers accordingly. The only he could have done that he didn't was to put a gun to other guys temple.

 

You may call them excuses. I call it reality. That was the nature of the beast, this year.

[Middle Buffalo]

In the most recent ESPN magazine, Tim Kurkjian says that an AL scout said that teams didn't want to make moves because they don't know how legitimate players numbers are. Are they trading for guys who put up numbers because they were on steroids? Will they get injured because they're not on them anymore?

 

I would have liked to see the sox make a move, but when you consider the price they would have had to pay in the long run, it's probably better off that they go into the playoffs with the team that put up the best record in baseball for the majority of the season. And, let's hope like crazy that they draw Detroit or KC in the first round.

[AirScott]

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...-home-headlines

This addresses a few of the most common complaints about the lack of trades.  The fact that there were 16 teams with self-percieved playoff shots, leaves 14 realistically possible trade partners.  Eliminate the AL Central teams, and we are down to 10.  One of those being the Cubs, which is an iffy proposition at best.

 

Someone mentioned we should have acquired Graffanino.  See the bold print in the second quote.  Unwilling means unwilling, period.

 

Others have said we should have overpaid to get something done.  KW agreed with you and made offers accordingly.  The only he could have done that he didn't was to put a gun to other guys temple.

 

You may call them excuses.  I call it reality.  That was the nature of the beast, this year.

that's the reason I don't blame KW at all for not making a trade. it seems he would have gotten Griffey, but since Lidner is selling something like 40% of the Reds to a group that won't buy if Griffey's not there, the Reds wouldn't part with Griffey. stupid on the Reds' part, because they had a chance to really improve their pitching with this trade for a couple of prospects.

[Dam8610]

You don't want to be looking back at an A.J. Pierzynski for Joe Nathan, Fransisco Liriano, and Boof Bosner type trade in 2 years, or at least I don't, especially if the trade didn't pay off in the short run. That's the problem with overpaying, but Kenny even said he was willing to overpay and still couldn't get a deal done. How much more can you ask of a GM?

[southsider2k5]

You don't want to be looking back at an A.J. Pierzynski for Joe Nathan, Fransisco Liriano, and Boof Bosner type trade in 2 years, or at least I don't, especially if the trade didn't pay off in the short run. That's the problem with overpaying, but Kenny even said he was willing to overpay and still couldn't get a deal done. How much more can you ask of a GM?

 

Or even better two months of Randy Johnson for Freddy Garcia, Carlos Guillen and John Halama.

 

Except in the 2005 trade enviornment, THAT wasn't even enough. Teams wanted established players, plus top prospects in order to get a deal done. It has been well published around the country.

[Greg The Bull Luzinski]

I don't know why Sox fans are so bothered by Moronoti. If you don't like what his says, don't read it. I skip his column daily. I you don't stop worrying so much about what he says, you are going to give yourselves an ulcer.

[TheBigHurt]

I read the article, and IMO in a way he was right. But what he is saying is going to become a cancer if too many of you let it get to you. This season is not over. While I agree the Sox have horrible luck and usually choke, staying in that frame of mind is what's going to cause a demise of the Sox this year if it happens. We've played well in the first half, and then with the departing of Thomas for the season, as well as multiple back injuries and a Scot Podsednik missing for 15 days, yes, things have gone awfully wrong. But that doesn't mean we can't, as Hawk says, cinch it up and hunker down. We can still do this, but we have to stay in a positive, confident frame of mind, not all this "the Sox are gonna blow it like always" s***. And by WE, I not only mean us, the fans, but also the sox. Look at what the offense did last night. As DJ says so often, every one of these guys are capable of doing really well as hitters, that they can use their full potential. All I see is negativity. I think it needs to stop. Now, I WILL agree we should have gotten a good bat, but hey, we do have Gload and a few extra players now. Am I saying they will be pheonominal? No, but we should expect the best to happen, becuase it can. The negativity needs to stop.

[kevin57]

Marrioti as an analyst? His only advice ever is to pay the most money for the highest priced players. Wow! That takes imagination and insight.

 

Marrioti as a predictor of success. All I remember is last year his predicting that the Cubs would sweep the Sox in their first crosstown series. Sox swept. Two weeks later, Marrioti predicted the Sox would sweep the Cubs. Cubs swept.

 

Case closed.