Official NFL General Discussion Thread

[Balta1701]

I was just saying, the Bears didn't exactly move the ball that last game like the '01 Rams.  Their only TD came on a 3 yard drive.  Now, the Panthers didnt really move it either, but all this means is whatever team makes less mistakes is gonna win when everyone seems to think it'll just be the same game all over again.

The Bears didn't move the ball, but they also had Orton at QB. Grossman might not throw for more yards, but even if he just makes 1-2 better decisions on 3rd down and converts them, and creates a better possibility of a deep ball so that the safeties can't cheat up to stop the run, their offense will be in vastly better shape.

[Chisoxfn]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?i...ce=NCFHeadlines

 

About F'n time!

Heck ya. I was thrilled when I saw this at the beginning of Cold Pizza. I was so worried he was going to take an NFL job this year. Really glad to have him back in Iowa City.

[hammerhead johnson]

I was just saying, the Bears didn't exactly move the ball that last game like the '01 Rams.  Their only TD came on a 3 yard drive.  Now, the Panthers didnt really move it either, but all this means is whatever team makes less mistakes is gonna win when everyone seems to think it'll just be the same game all over again.

 

Well, two things:

 

1) It should have been a 13-0 shutout. The Panthers were lucky to even get a field goal in the 4th quarter. On seemingly every play, the Bears D-Line was in Delhomme's face. 8 sacks, countless batted balls, etc. The D-Line pressure was overwhelming. That's why Vasher got those picks.

 

2) The difference between Orton and Grossman is like the difference between Weinke and Delhomme.

 

Like I said in a previous post, unless Carolina has Alan Faneca and Walter Jones on their team for this game, it should be more of the same. While I wouldn't be surpirsed if Carolina happened to edge out a victory, I'm still expecting the Bears to demoralize Delhomme once again.

[Spiff]

Well, two things:

 

1) It should have been a 13-0 shutout.  The Panthers were lucky to even get a field goal in the 4th quarter.  On seemingly every play, the Bears D-Line was in Delhomme's face.  8 sacks, countless batted balls, etc.  The D-Line pressure was overwhelming.  That's why Vasher got those picks. 

 

2) The difference between Orton and Grossman is like the difference between Weinke and Delhomme. 

 

1)ok, so 13-0. whoopdee-goddamn-doo. do you really think the panthers are going to run the same game plan with the same blocking schemes? really?

 

2)no way, no way, no way, no way no way. god, grossman plays a game and a half and everyone is ready to anoint him the savior. 51.3% passing, 1 TD and 2 INT, 59.7 rating (same as kyle orton), and they didn't even play him against minnesota for some stupid reason. the panthers shut down a good giants offense, they can shut down a bad bears offense.

 

Delhomme's career rating is 84.5 (80, 87 and 88 as a Panther), weinke's is 60.4. grossman career - 68.8; orton 59.7. ridiculous comparison.

[hammerhead johnson]

1)ok, so 13-0.  whoopdee-goddamn-doo.  do you really think the panthers are going to run the same game plan with the same blocking schemes?  really?

 

2)no way, no way, no way, no way no way.  god, grossman plays a game and a half and everyone is ready to anoint him the savior.  51.3% passing, 1 TD and 2 INT, 59.7 rating (same as kyle orton), and they didn't even play him against minnesota for some stupid reason.  the panthers shut down a good giants offense, they can shut down a bad bears offense.

 

Delhomme's career rating is 84.5 (80, 87 and 88 as a Panther), weinke's is 60.4.  grossman career - 68.8; orton 59.7. ridiculous comparison.

 

1) Yeah, I'd say that a shutout is pretty damn impressive, especially against a Carolina team that had been averaging 27 points per game going into that contest? It doesn't matter what type of blocking schemes they run. Carolina just doesn't have the OL personnel to contain the pro bowl caliber trio of Harris, Brown, and Ogunleye. While the Carolina O-Line is respectable, the Bears D-Lien is perhaps the best in the NFL. Once those guys get going, it's a thing of beauty.

 

2) No paper arguments here. I never miss Bears games, so I don't even have to look at any statsheets. The difference between Orton and Grossman is drastic. You only have to watch a couple of games to find that out.

 

I'd respect your argument if you actually watched any Bears games. Otherwise, it's kind of difficult to have a conversation about this. Paper is crap. I wipe my ass with it.

[hammerhead johnson]

And remember, I did pick the Panthers to go to the Super Bowl this year.

 

Also, last year I was talking about being able to spot up and coming defensive teams with Man Of Steel, and this is what you said:

 

"Just like Carolina, right?" lol.gif

 

In response to that, I said:

 

"They didn't make it to the Super Bowl on the strength of their good looks, now did they?"

 

And now you're defending them? Hmmm.

[WHarris1]

2) No paper arguments here.  I never miss Bears games, so I don't even have to look at any statsheets.  The difference between Orton and Grossman is drastic.  You only have to watch a couple of games to find that out.   

And this is what everyone fails to realize.

[hammerhead johnson]

And this is what everyone fails to realize.

 

Yeah, tell me about it.

[WHarris1]

Yeah, tell me about it.

I'm so sick of the "their QB ratings are the same" comments. I mean s*** just watch the Atlanta game 1st half vs. 2nd half. Night and day.

Edited January 12, 2006 by WHarris1

[Spiff]

Actually I did watch both games with Grossman. The difference between he and Orton isn't Weinke-Delhomme. Grossman moves the ball slightly better, but, one touchdown!

 

As for the defense thing, I don't know I need to see more of the conversation than that.

[hammerhead johnson]

Actually I did watch both games with Grossman. The difference between he and Orton isn't Weinke-Delhomme.  Grossman moves the ball slightly better, but, one touchdown!

 

Yeah, but he was rusty as s***. Fact is, he has a much better arm than Orton and his decision-making ability just trumps that of Orton. Carolina will actually have to respect our passing game this Sunday, unlike the last time we matched up.

[Spiff]

And he won't be rusty this weekend when he plays for the first time in...3 weeks? His decision making isn't that great, I saw him force the ball in the red zone against Atlanta and give up a pick, then get lucky when Carpenter fumbled. Then he just threw up a wounded duck against the Packers that got plucked easily.

[Balta1701]

And he won't be rusty this weekend when he plays for the first time in...3 weeks?  His decision making isn't that great, I saw him force the ball in the red zone against Atlanta and give up a pick, then get lucky when Carpenter fumbled.  Then he just threw up a wounded duck against the Packers that got plucked easily.

I agree with you on that one...I thought it would have been a good idea to give him at least a quarter against the Vikings to try to keep building a rhythm.

 

I think the key to Grossman isn't Grossman himself, it's knocking a Safety or two farther away from the like to guard against the threat of a deep ball. If all you do is push back the safeties, and maybe get the linebackers thinking pass every so often, it'll massively increase the holes for Jones et al. Grossman can do that. This team isn't going to beat anyone on offense, but the Ravens and Bucs didn't beat anyone on offense the years they won the super bowl either.

[hammerhead johnson]

And he won't be rusty this weekend when he plays for the first time in...3 weeks?  His decision making isn't that great, I saw him force the ball in the red zone against Atlanta and give up a pick, then get lucky when Carpenter fumbled.  Then he just threw up a wounded duck against the Packers that got plucked easily.

 

A rusty Grossman is a s***load better than Orton, and that's the point here.

 

Grossman threw the ball well in both the Atlanta and Green Bay games. I'm not at all saying that he's a pro bowl caliber QB, but Orton makes him look like one. Put it that way.

[WHarris1]

1 quarter and maybe 5-7 passes in 3 weeks vs. 0 quarters in 3 weeks really will not make too much of a difference on his rust factor this weekend.

 

Damn this week is going by so slow, it needs to be Sunday.

Edited January 12, 2006 by WHarris1

[hammerhead johnson]

I think the key to Grossman isn't Grossman himself, it's knocking a Safety or two farther away from the like to guard against the threat of a deep ball.  If all you do is push back the safeties, and maybe get the linebackers thinking pass every so often, it'll massively increase the holes for Jones et al.  Grossman can do that. 

 

Right, and that's the point. Carolina will actually have to respect our passing game this time around.

[Pierzynski 12]

Mularkey out as Bills coach

 

Sources close to the situation indicate Mularkey actually made the decision Wednesday, and the team will make it official at an 11 a.m. ET press conference Friday.

The leading candidate to replace him is ex-Saints coach Jim Haslett.

 

The Bills become the 10th team who will have a new coach heading into next season.

 

Mularkey, who had three years left on his contract, was originally retained despite struggling in his second season in Buffalo. He went 5-11 this season after a 9-7 debut a season ago.

 

Mularkey's resignation announcement came a week after the Bills hired Hall of Fame coach Marv Levy to take over as general manager. Levy replaced team president and GM Tom Donahoe, who was fired last week.

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/5242550

[Palehosefan]

Some team should be drooling who needs an OC. As long as Mularkey's family situation, whatever it may be, allows him to coach again, he will be a hell of an OC like he was in Pittsburgh. That was the most fun I have had watching NFL games, was when he was our OC, never knew what crazy play was next.

[Pierzynski 12]

Doctor: Palmer knee injury 'potentially career-ending'

 

CINCINNATI -- Carson Palmer's knee injury was "devastating and potentially career-ending," involving numerous ligament tears, a shredded ligament, damaged cartilage and a dislocated kneecap, his surgeon said Thursday.

 

The Cincinnati Bengals quarterback tore ligaments in his left knee when he was hit by Pittsburgh's Kimo von Oelhoffen on his first pass during the Steelers' 31-17 playoff victory Sunday.

 

The team announced that he had torn the anterior cruciate and medial collateral ligaments. The damage was much more extensive and severe, but Dr. Lonnie Paulos said surgery went well and Palmer could be back for the start of the season.

 

Palmer had surgery Tuesday in Houston. Doctors used grafts from other parts of his body and donated tissue to fix the damage during an operation that lasted more than two hours. Palmer headed back to California on Thursday to do his rehabilitation.

 

"It's not just like it was a torn ACL," Paulos said Thursday, in a phone interview from Houston. "It's a magnitude more difficult to recover from and repair. It can and has ended careers, without a doubt.

 

"However, I feel very comfortable with Carson as an athlete and the heart that he's got. In the end, that's the bottom line. I can see the look in his eye already. He's ready to get going," he said.

 

Paulos, an orthopedic surgeon who has worked with the U.S. Ski Team since 1983, replaced the anterior cruciate ligament, which runs through the middle of the knee and provides stability. He said the medial collateral ligament, which runs along the side of the knee, was damaged "real bad."

 

"On a scale of one to three, it was a four," he said. "It was off the chart. It was pretty badly damaged -- shredded is the better term."

 

The kneecap dislocated when Palmer was hit, damaging tissue around it. There was also some cartilage damage, he said.

 

Paulos was able to repair the knee without removing pieces of cartilage or soft tissue, a good sign.

 

"The things that were torn could be repaired," he said. "They were not torn beyond repair. So he's got all his parts in there, which is good. We're optimistic, actually."

 

If rehabilitation goes well, Palmer could be running in a couple months and might be able to play in the first regular-season game, Paulos said. The 2006 schedule hasn't been set.

 

Palmer has worn a protective brace on the left knee since he sprained it near the end of the 2004 season. The knee bowed inward on von Oelhoffen's hit even though Palmer was wearing the brace.

 

"The brace didn't function well in this environment and should have done better than it did, frankly," Paulos said.

 

The plan is for Palmer to wear more substantial braces on both knees when he returns.

 

"No brace is perfect," Paulos said. "No brace can prevent every injury, but they do help."

 

Paulos saw the replay of the injury and wasn't surprised at the extent of the damage it caused. Palmer has absolved von Oelhoffen, saying he didn't think the lineman was trying to hurt him. The lineman said he was trying to sack Palmer, not injure him. He wasn't penalized for the hit.

 

Palmer made the Pro Bowl in only his second season as a starter, throwing an NFL-leading 32 touchdown passes. The club extended his contract through the 2014 season.

 

Jon Kitna, who has been Palmer's backup and mentor the last two years, can become a free agent. Palmer's injury will force the Bengals to make sure they have another reliable quarterback on board.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2290239

[Balta1701]

Some team should be drooling who needs an OC. As long as Mularkey's family situation, whatever it may be, allows him to coach again, he will be a hell of an OC like he was in Pittsburgh. That was the most fun I have had watching NFL games, was when he was our OC, never knew what crazy play was next.

I'm finding it very odd that the Bills' last 3 coaches were all very good coordinators, and at least the last 2 have gone on to be very good coordinators somewhere else after being fired.

[witesoxfan]

So WTF does Buffalo do now? Call up Marv again?

[DBAHO]

Some team should be drooling who needs an OC. As long as Mularkey's family situation, whatever it may be, allows him to coach again, he will be a hell of an OC like he was in Pittsburgh. That was the most fun I have had watching NFL games, was when he was our OC, never knew what crazy play was next.

I think he would be a pretty good damn fit in Dallas actually, since Sean Payton's likely headed to the Saints. But I've heard Parcells is just going to promote Todd Haley the WR coach, and call the plays himself.

[DBAHO]

So WTF does Buffalo do now?  Call up Marv again? 

Wite, if Drew Bledsoe was the QB of the Bills in 2005, do you think Mularkey would still have a job today? He probably wouldn't, but going with Losman who was totally unproven was the straw that broke the camel's back I guess.

 

A guy like Rivera probably makes sense here.

[Balta1701]

Wite, if Drew Bledsoe was the QB of the Bills in 2005, do you think Mularkey would still have a job today? He probably wouldn't, but going with Losman who was totally unproven was the straw that broke the camel's back I guess.

 

A guy like Rivera probably makes sense here.

Drew Bledsoe would have done horrible as QB of the Bills in 2005. Buffalo gave up 43 sacks last year with 2 quarterbacks, one who is significantly more mobile than Bledsoe and one who is somewhat more mobile than Bledsoe. Dallas gave up 50 sacks, and I think they have a better O-Line than the Bills by quite a bit. Bledsoe would have spent half the game on the ground if he was still in Buffalo, just like he did the year before.

 

Going with Losman was the right decision. Quarterbacks take time to develop, and when you first put them into a game, they're going to struggle. Some more than others. That team had a decent shot to do what the Bears did last year, but their defense fell apart, which was the real problem. They went from being one of the top defenses in the league to one of the worst defenses in the league in 1 year.

[witesoxfan]

Drew Bledsoe would have done horrible as QB of the Bills in 2005.  Buffalo gave up 43 sacks last year with 2 quarterbacks, one who is significantly more mobile than Bledsoe and one who is somewhat more mobile than Bledsoe.  Dallas gave up 50 sacks, and I think they have a better O-Line than the Bills by quite a bit.  Bledsoe would have spent half the game on the ground if he was still in Buffalo, just like he did the year before.

 

Going with Losman was the right decision.  Quarterbacks take time to develop, and when you first put them into a game, they're going to struggle.  Some more than others.  That team had a decent shot to do what the Bears did last year, but their defense fell apart, which was the real problem.  They went from being one of the top defenses in the league to one of the worst defenses in the league in 1 year.

 

Pretty much this.

 

Losing Pat Williams was big, and then losing Spikes very early in the season was a huge loss for the Bills too.