YASNY Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 (edited) On Soxtalk, White Sox manager Ozzie Guillen has been the recipient of numerous barbs, criticisms and personal attacks on his intelligence, sexual preferences and integrity. Guillen has been accused of being just plain stupid. He's been accused of being the dominant partner in homosexual B&D relationships with various players, the logic being that was way this or that particular player could possibly get any playing time. His integrity has been questioned with accusations of racism due to the perception by some that Guillen has been showing favoritism to Latino players. He's also been accused of being crazy. Ozzie Guillen may be crazy, but he's crazy like a fox. While all the Soxtalk experts b****ing, moaning, ranting and raving, Ozzie Guillen was guiding a team that was picked by preseason prognosticators to finish in third or fourth place in the A. L. Central division to a division championship. Not only did the White Sox win the division, but they were never headed as they were on top of the division from the first game to the last. He accomplished this while having to reshuffle his bullpen throughout the course of the season. To begin that season, the southside cult hero from Japan, Shingo Takatsu, was the closer. Due to ineffectiveness, Takatsu was demoted from the closer role and eventually given his unconditional release. Bring on wily veteran Dustin Hermanson to assume the closer's role. Hermanson stepped into the role and filled it admirably. Of course, there were residual effects to this move as others would have to step up and fill the setup roles. Generally, a change like this would weaken the overall effectiveness of the bullpen. Not in this case, however. Guillen had prepared for just this situation, by putting pitchers into crucial game situations that he believed the pitcher had a good chance of being successful. In other words, he game these pitchers the opportunity to step up and perform. If they failed, Guillen took the critcism and then gave that particular pitcher another opportunity to perform. He didn't rotate them to the end of the bullpen bench. He showed confidence in them, yet he demanded success from them. Guillen, never one to pull a proverbial punch, would tell these pitchers exactly what kind of approach he expected of them. He was not concerned with today's results as much as he was concerned with the long term results. More problems arose, however, as newly annointed closer Hermanson started have problems with his back. Into the picture steps 24 year old Bobby Jenks. He of the 100 mph heater, half of a season closing at AA Birmingham and a past history of arm problems along with binge drinking. Once again, Guillen took this very questionable young pitcher and groomed him by giving him the opportunity to succeed before throwing him into high pressure situations. When the need for Jenks to stap into the closer's role was there, the third closer of the season, he was ready to assume the role. The starting rotation was anchored by inning eating horses Mark Buehrle and Freddie Garcia followed by three question marks heading into the season. Buehrle and Garcia could be counted on to take the ball every fifth game, pitch 200 plus innings and each put up a victory total somehwere in the "teens". After these two, there was the inconsistant Jon Garland, the perplexing Jose Contreras and the aging Orlando Hernandez. Garland had been a sometimes dominant, other times maddingly ineffective .500 pitcher with an ERA about 5.00. Not good, not bad, but not enough. Garland came through with 18 wins and an all-star gaqme appearance. The seeds for his turn around were sown in 2004 when Guillen gave him the opportunity to learn how to win by allowing to the opportunity to succeed or fail. Contreras was an classic example of an enigma. The man had a wealth of talent, but didn't have the know how or the confidence to put it to use. It took Guillen and pitching coach Don Cooper about a year, from the time he was acquired for former Cy Young candidate Estaban Loaiza on July 31, 2004, get Contreras to believe in his fastball and his abilities. In the second half of the 2005 season, Contreras went from shaky number 4 starter and potential trade bait to the staff ace. Things didn't work out so well with the againg Hernandez. "El Duque" broke down over the course of the season. He went through a period on the disabled list, but was still ineffective upon his return. Fortunately, young Brandon McCarthy had found his groove in AAA Charlotte and stepped into Hernandez' spot in the rotation and help keep the wolves, I mean the Indians, at bay. All in all, not bad for a manager who has no clue on how to handle a pitching staff, according to many of the self-proclaimed experts on Soxtalk. Of course, Guillen also had no clue as to how and when to use his bench and rest his starting position players. His "Sunday lineup" was the source of much derision and teeth gnashing from the highly qualified experts on Soxtalk. Ozzie was an idiot for resting catcher A. J. Piersynski during a day game after a night game, usually before "getaway day" with independant league retread backup Chris Widger. But wait, slowly, gradually, it dawned on some of the experts that Widger was a pretty solid ballplayer in his own right. Guillen tried to keep fresh the legs of leadoff man and basestealer Scott Podsednik by playing Timo Perez in his place. He'd put Perez in the leadoff spot, much to the chagrin of those experts. Was Perez your prototypical leadoff man? Of course, not. But, the rest of the guys were in there accustomed spots in the lineup and not shuffled around. Of course, these same experts used to criticize former manager Jerry Manuel for "tinkering" with the lineup in previous years. Whenever RF Jermaine Dye or 2B Tadahito Iguchi were rested, the teeth gnashing would commence, as well. You know what? That dips*** Ozzie led his team to 99 wins and a division championship. Next, of course, comes the post season. I could go into the debate that raged here when Guillen decided to add the old, broken down Orlando Hernandez over young gun Brandon McCarthy to the post season roster. But, we all know Ozzie's reasons, now, for doing so and how that worked out in the ALDS. Would McCarthy have done as well? We'll never know. What we do know, however, is that the defending world champs have been swept aside and the White Sox are moving on to the ALCS. El Duque played a big part in that accomplishment. Now we have situation of Damaso Marte. Guillen has decided to keep Marte on the roster after his meltdown in Boston. Is the right decision? Will this come back to bite the Sox on the ass? I don't know. You don't know. Ozzie doesn't know. However, Ozzie does seem to have a knack for making the right decisions in these kinds of situations. It may not work out for the Sox, but I'm going to put my trust in Ozzie, Coop and KW. They've led this team farther than any other combination of managers, pitching coaches and GM's have done in my 4+ decades of being a Sox fan. Edited to eliminate double spacing. Edited October 10, 2005 by YASNY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S720 Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Great post! That's what I've been believing all season long. Put your trust and faith in Ozzie, your White Sox manager. There's a reason why he's out there, and all of us manager wannabes are managing in front of our computer. Of course, Ozzie is not perfect. There is absolutely not a single manager out there currently or in the history of baseball who is perfect. They all make mistakes like all of us have. What Ozzie gives to the team is what I feel utmost important. Gut, Believe in themselves, Challenge his players, Make them rise to the occasion, Never-give-up mentality and finally, Make the players believe in him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LDF Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 QUOTE(YASNY @ Oct 10, 2005 -> 01:45 PM) this was the longest post i have ever seen you post. are you ok?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 10, 2005 Author Share Posted October 10, 2005 QUOTE(LDF @ Oct 10, 2005 -> 09:22 AM) this was the longest post i have ever seen you post. are you ok?? Couldn't be better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chisox72 Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Great post! And I agree, there have been lots of moments that I found myself questioning his logic (or in my mind, lack there-of) only to find myself being the wrong one. I am not saying he is right 100% of the time, but a little blind faith in this guy will not hurt anyone. For us, its just time to sit back, relax (as-if that will happen ) and enjoy this ride, because I think its FAR from over..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Critic Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 QUOTE(LDF @ Oct 10, 2005 -> 08:22 AM) this was the longest post i have ever seen you post. are you ok?? Ahhhh, it only seemed longer cuz it was double- spaced . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 I wonder about the reaction this would have gotten in the midst of our "losing" streak against teams like the Royals. But that was a great post YAS, how long did you spend workin on it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 10, 2005 Author Share Posted October 10, 2005 QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Oct 10, 2005 -> 09:45 AM) I wonder about the reaction this would have gotten in the midst of our "losing" streak against teams like the Royals. But that was a great post YAS, how long did you spend workin on it? About 20 minutes. I composed it on MS Notepad, so I apologize about the couble spacing. I wasn't anticipating that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wedge Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 QUOTE(chisox72 @ Oct 10, 2005 -> 08:36 AM) For us, its just time to sit back, relax (as-if that will happen ) and enjoy this ride, because I think its FAR from over..... I think you mean that we should sit back, relax, and strap it down. Oh, and I agree entirely with this post. Awesome job! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoIL Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Very nice. Lets get 8 more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeBatterz Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Great post! Winning cures all, let's keep it up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyho7476 Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Great Post...I didn't buy a Guillen jersey for nothing. I love this guy and want him to be Chicago's next Ditka. Not that he can be Ditka, but he could do something no manager has done in 88 years. Get her done Ozzie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyWhiteSox Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 Solid post. Ozzie just keeps proving the haters wrong...and some people just luv to b****. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 I still don't think I am wrong for disliking Ozzie Guillen as an in-game manager. Bad managers have had seasons of over 90 wins in the past, great managers have had seasons where they didn't reach 70 wins. I attribute much more of our success to KW. It's pretty amazing when you think of the new contributing players he added to this team in one year's time. Podsednik, Dye, Iguchi, Pierzynski, Ozuna, Widger, Garcia, Contreras, Hernandez, Hermanson, Vizcaino, Jenks. However, I do like the fact that all the players seem to love playing for Guillen (except Marte?) This kept our team in good spirits throughout the season and obviously had some effect on the players KW was able to sign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S720 Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 QUOTE(3E8 @ Oct 10, 2005 -> 12:11 PM) I still don't think I am wrong for disliking Ozzie Guillen as an in-game manager. Bad managers have had seasons of over 90 wins in the past, great managers have had seasons where they didn't reach 70 wins. I attribute much more of our success to KW. It's pretty amazing when you think of the new contributing players he added to this team in one year's time. Podsednik, Dye, Iguchi, Pierzynski, Ozuna, Widger, Garcia, Contreras, Hernandez, Hermanson, Vizcaino, Jenks. However, I do like the fact that all the players seem to love playing for Guillen (except Marte?) This kept our team in good spirits throughout the season and obviously had some effect on the players KW was able to sign. Ozzie did have a whole lot of affects in persuading KW to change to "small ball" philosophy. If your players do not believe in you, no matter who you've brought in, it doesn't matter anyway. My question to you is should Manuel still be around, would KW move to "small ball" philosophy? Remember ONLY with the "small ball" philosophy that KW went out and got all of those grinding players. Give that question some time before answer it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 QUOTE(S720 @ Oct 10, 2005 -> 12:38 PM) Ozzie did have a whole lot of affects in persuading KW to change to "small ball" philosophy. If your players do not believe in you, no matter who you've brought in, it doesn't matter anyway. My question to you is should Manuel still be around, would KW move to "small ball" philosophy? Remember ONLY with the "small ball" philosophy that KW went out and got all of those grinding players. Give that question some time before answer it. The biggest factor in our success is our pitching. All the starting rotation and bullpen help has nothing to do with small ball. So cross about half of KW's newly obtained players off the small ball list. AJP is not small ball. Dye is not small ball. Iguchi is sometimes forced to play small ball, but arguably would've had better stats had he not adopted that method. He even said himself several times that he'd rather not play that way. Podsednik and Ozuna are the only small ball acquisitions KW made. One of them is a bench player. Pods is behind at least 10 other players in terms of total production to this team. So as you can see, we are not a small ball team. We hit 200 home runs and scored more runs off the HR than most everyone else. The few players on this team who could be considered small ball only helped a small fraction compared to those players who would not be considered small ball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 11, 2005 Author Share Posted October 11, 2005 QUOTE(3E8 @ Oct 10, 2005 -> 12:11 PM) I still don't think I am wrong for disliking Ozzie Guillen as an in-game manager. Bad managers have had seasons of over 90 wins in the past, great managers have had seasons where they didn't reach 70 wins. I attribute much more of our success to KW. It's pretty amazing when you think of the new contributing players he added to this team in one year's time. Podsednik, Dye, Iguchi, Pierzynski, Ozuna, Widger, Garcia, Contreras, Hernandez, Hermanson, Vizcaino, Jenks. However, I do like the fact that all the players seem to love playing for Guillen (except Marte?) This kept our team in good spirits throughout the season and obviously had some effect on the players KW was able to sign. You are still missing the point. Ozzie's "in game" decisions were not designed to win one game today. They were designed to win several more games later. He has always had to thing beyond "today's game" and look to the long term. When he used Jenks for that 2 inning save against Boston, he was thinking "today's game". He has that luxury now, to a limited extent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 Nice post, Yasny. I won't even pretend that I've never gotten pissed off or questioned some of the moves made by Ozzie this year. I feel I have that right as a fan. That's all. I know I'm no expert. I also realize beyond a shadow of a doubt that Ozzie knows MUCH, MUCH more about the game than I do. But I don't think it's so wrong to give imput as a fan to what Ozzie is or isn't doing. Now as far as the personal attacks on Ozzie, you're totally right. That kinda stuff is just stupid and really uncalled for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted October 11, 2005 Author Share Posted October 11, 2005 QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ Oct 11, 2005 -> 03:14 AM) Nice post, Yasny. I won't even pretend that I've never gotten pissed off or questioned some of the moves made by Ozzie this year. I feel I have that right as a fan. That's all. I know I'm no expert. I also realize beyond a shadow of a doubt that Ozzie knows MUCH, MUCH more about the game than I do. But I don't think it's so wrong to give imput as a fan to what Ozzie is or isn't doing. Now as far as the personal attacks on Ozzie, you're totally right. That kinda stuff is just stupid and really uncalled for. Thanks. And yes, you do have the right to question his moves. No doubt about it. I question some of them at times, as well. However, I generally recognize the fact that Ozzie has much more information about the players and knows infinitely more about the game than I can ever hope to know. I know this much, though. As Ozzie was making some of his "stupid in game decisions" over the course of the season, I would step back and look at the big picture more than just the current situation during the game. I could see what he was trying to do, in a general way. I didn't know if he'd be successful at it, but as that bullpen came together and guys like Cotts and Politte stepped up and produced, his questionable decisions were validated in my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted October 11, 2005 Share Posted October 11, 2005 Great post yasny. Ozzie is a great manager in my book. The sad thing is, even if we were to win it all , all the keyboard managers on soxtalk will still bash Ozzie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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