Official ruling

[TLAK]

Great thread. My take is AJ disproved Jimmy Dykes and did steal first base. The ump was in an awful fix, there is no way he could have seen if the ball was caught or bounced as he was blocked by the catcher and the mitt itself. He called the swinging strike because he saw it and I think he was hoping everyone would just go back to the dugouts. Eddings was in a terrible situation, how can you honestly call something you didn’t see? So he called nothing, AJ deked like he was going to the dugout and Josh Paul did the rest.

[YASNY]

I'm not going to put any words into anyone's mouths, but i'll leave you this to ponder. Throughout this thread, Rex and I (and a few others) have thrown around some great observations and reasons for our lines of thinking. Now - reverse the teams. This EXACT same thing happens to us, and we lose because of it. What do people honestly think? My posts would stay the exact same as would Rex's, and some others.

 

 

Let me put my take on this in perspective for you. To begin, I didn't just jump on Soxtalk after the play and post my opinion. I was watching the game at home and heard the tools at FOX give their pov's. Then I switched to ESPN and heard what BBTN and SC crews had to say. I then listened to ESPN radio on my way work. Once arriving at work, I read everything I could find on the Trib's website.

 

Having had all this input and after seeing the replay numerous times, I was of the opinion that the ball hit the dirt. Yet, I took into account the possibility that the ball could have hit the webbing. In Eddings mind, the ball was not caught. The other umps could have straightened that out if they had a definitive view, but they did not. So, it is Edding's opinion that counts here. Given the fact that no one will ever really know exactly what happened there, it comes down to one question. Did Eddings call AJ out or not? Based on the fact that he utilized the same "mechanics" on strike one and two calls, the fact that AJ stated he never heard an out call and Paul's never mentioning that he did hear him called out, I have to believe that Eddings pump to signal the strike and never called AJ out. If this is the case, then play resulted as it should have. I am not taking this stance because I'm a Sox fan. I'm nearly 48 years old and I have seen a lot of different scenarios develop in the game of baseball and I feel like I judge these things fairly. For example, while watching the replay of Crede's dive back into second base, I jerked my arm in an upward motion signifying "out". It was very close, but I thought he was out, and said as much.

 

Still, this has been a great thread.

[YASNY]

The butt with the pimple speaks:

 

Harry Wendelstedt's opinion

[Iwritecode]

the fact that AJ stated he never heard an out call and Paul's never mentioning that he did hear him called out, I have to believe that Eddings pump to signal the strike and never called AJ out.

 

I believe it's that fact that makes this whole discussion moot.

 

Two little words that were never said:

 

"He's out".

Edited October 14, 2005 by Iwritecode

[Middle Buffalo]

I believe it's that fact that makes this whole discussion moot.

 

Two little words that were never said:

 

"He's out".

I agree with this. AJ had caught the entire game, and it kind of seems like, as he was walking back to his dugout, he realized that he didn't hear an out call (unlike what he had heard the entire game on strikeouts). He turned, took a couple of uncertain steps, the took off running.

 

Paul had just entered the game, so he wouldn't be as familiar with this particular ump's out call. He assumed that the ump called the batter out when he raised his arm, but didn't realize the lack of a verbal out call meant the play was still alive. Anyway, just a thought.

 

I'll bet the Angels will be looking for the full Frank Drebbin strikeout call for the rest of the series.

[jackie hayes]

I don't think this has been posted yet, apologies if so. Foxsports has an article w/ some quotes from Eddings, also this:

Plate umpires are trained to shout "No catch!" or indicate that the ball is in play after a swinging strike; Eddings, who has maintained that he was right in saying the ball hit the dirt before Paul gloved it, was silent.

 

Mike Port, baseball's vice president of umpiring, told The Associated Press on Thursday that Eddings did nothing wrong and that umpires are not required to audibly call "No catch."

Take it fwiw. So apparently, he should call out "No catch", but isn't required to.

 

There's not much else in the article. Eddings says he only wishes he had "sold it" better. And he's got police escorts. Tonight's gonna be pretty interesting.

 

Edit: Linky, if interested.

Edited October 14, 2005 by jackie hayes

[Reddy]

Paul had just entered the game, so he wouldn't be as familiar with this particular ump's out call.  He assumed that the ump called the batter out when he raised his arm, but didn't realize the lack of a verbal out call meant the play was still alive.  Anyway, just a thought.

 

 

actually Paul didnt even SEE the ump raise his arm. He just ASSUMED it was a strike three - rolled it in and left.

 

all the blame should be on Paul - he f***ed up big

[Iwritecode]

actually Paul didnt even SEE the ump raise his arm.  He just ASSUMED it was a strike three - rolled it in and left.

 

all the blame should be on Paul - he f***ed up big

 

That's one more piece of damning evidence against JP.

 

Had the umpire used a different "mechanic" to call that third strike I'm pretty sure he still would have rolled that ball towards the mound and went jogging towards the dugout.

[Reddy]

That's one more piece of damning evidence against JP.

 

Had the umpire used a different "mechanic" to call that third strike I'm pretty sure he still would have rolled that ball towards the mound and went jogging towards the dugout.

 

i just sat here for like a good 30 seconds looking at your sig and trying to figure it out. f***er. haha it reminded me of "The Labyrinth"

[WinningUgly85]

 

http://www.vnvo.com/specials/sox%5Fangels%5F10%2D12%2D05/

Edited October 14, 2005 by WinningUgly85