The Ginger Kid Posted October 13, 2005 Share Posted October 13, 2005 Had "the call" not happened in the 9th which led to the win, and had the Sox lost in extra innings, is there any doubt that Joey Cora would be the new Wendell Kim in Chicago? No outs and he sends the runner from third after he just ran his ass off and slid into 3rd? As was pointed out on the radio, unless you're 99.9% sure, you don't send a runner from 3rd with no outs. I think Cora dodged a bullet - AJ, Pablo and Crede saved him some serious grief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted October 13, 2005 Share Posted October 13, 2005 No doubt. With 2 outs you send him there but that's the only case, Joey's worst move since being here imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg The Bull Luzinski Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 In seems somewhat ironic that Joe Crede who often the goat on this board bailed out the true goat of game 2, Joey Cora. Before Game 3, they should duct tape Joey's arms to his sides. It is nearly 24 hours later and I am still pissed about it. I wonder if the clubs that were pursuing him for a manager position like the Mets did last year are counting their blessing. I sure hope somebody hires him as a manager this winter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 He sure as hell got lucky. If I were the manager, I might've fired him right after the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzie Montana Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 (edited) Maybe we should duct tape his arms to his sides. Edited October 14, 2005 by Ozzie Montana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AddisonStSox Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 (edited) Yup. But, thinking back, I can probably only count Cora's colossal screw-ups on one hand this season. I suppose it could be worse. ...maybe I just still have a soft spot for one of my favorite double-play tandums. Edited October 14, 2005 by AddisonStSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 It was pretty disturbing, but the idea is- I guess - Be aggressive, but jeepers creepers there were no outs. Hold the guy at third and get the run in with a grounder, fly ball, etc. It was close though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mplssoxfan Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 If your credo all year is to be aggressive, that's the play you make. It took a great slide to the ball, a great pick-up and a near-perfect throw by Robb Quinlan to get Aaron. Two feet to Molina's right, he doesn't make the tag. Two feet to Molina's left, it hits Aaron. I, too was upset that we were run out of the inning, but it's a classic second-guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUKE_CLEVELAND Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 QUOTE(The Ginger Kid @ Oct 13, 2005 -> 05:58 PM) Had "the call" not happened in the 9th which led to the win, and had the Sox lost in extra innings, is there any doubt that Joey Cora would be the new Wendell Kim in Chicago? No outs and he sends the runner from third after he just ran his ass off and slid into 3rd? As was pointed out on the radio, unless you're 99.9% sure, you don't send a runner from 3rd with no outs. I think Cora dodged a bullet - AJ, Pablo and Crede saved him some serious grief. Just because we got by with it doesn't mean that Cora wasn't a total jackass there. There was no reason for AROW to have slid there and DEFENITELY no reason to have sent him afterward. If Cora had watched the throw come in from right and seen how off line it was and was waving all the way AROW would have made it easily. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 There is being aggressive and than being stupid.... A lot of times this year Cora has been stupid.... last season he was aggressive but he wasnt crazy aggressive.... this season he sends guys no matter what and it has cost us runs during the season a lot..... If he wasnt close friends with Ozzie his job probably would be on the line right now after that play and after this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illinilaw08 Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 QUOTE(Mplssoxfan @ Oct 13, 2005 -> 08:52 PM) If your credo all year is to be aggressive, that's the play you make. It took a great slide to the ball, a great pick-up and a near-perfect throw by Robb Quinlan to get Aaron. Two feet to Molina's right, he doesn't make the tag. Two feet to Molina's left, it hits Aaron. I, too was upset that we were run out of the inning, but it's a classic second-guess. When I'm yelling "NOOOOOO" as Cora sends him, that isnt a second guess. Yes it took an excellent play by Quinlan to get Arow, but with no one out, sending him was not the right decision... and that is not just hindsight talking. Glad it didnt come back to haunt us and hopefully Cora learned his lesson there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AirScott Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Oct 13, 2005 -> 07:38 PM) He sure as hell got lucky. If I were the manager, I might've fired him right after the game. and another reason you're not a manager. but I do think it was a terrible decision by Cora, he should have held Rowand with none out after he slid. if Rowand hadn't slid or Cora saw that play developing, he would be the hero of Game 2. and yes, the decision he made was one of those first-guess calls, where I was yelling at the TV once he sent Rowand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 QUOTE(AirScott @ Oct 14, 2005 -> 03:07 AM) and another reason you're not a manager. but I do think it was a terrible decision by Cora, he should have held Rowand with none out after he slid. if Rowand hadn't slid or Cora saw that play developing, he would be the hero of Game 2. and yes, the decision he made was one of those first-guess calls, where I was yelling at the TV once he sent Rowand. Actually after the season he had I think a lot of managers would think of firing Cora.... a course if we win a WS all is forgotten and everything and I wouldnt fire him during the season or playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sayitaintso Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ Oct 13, 2005 -> 06:35 PM) In seems somewhat ironic that Joe Crede who often the goat on this board bailed out the true goat of game 2, Joey Cora. Before Game 3, they should duct tape Joey's arms to his sides. It is nearly 24 hours later and I am still pissed about it. I wonder if the clubs that were pursuing him for a manager position like the Mets did last year are counting their blessing. I sure hope somebody hires him as a manager this winter. The D-Rays are looking for a manager and they got a lot of fast guys. Joey would have a field day cause he would never have to stop waving his arm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mplssoxfan Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 QUOTE(NUKE_CLEVELAND @ Oct 13, 2005 -> 09:59 PM) Just because we got by with it doesn't mean that Cora wasn't a total jackass there. There was no reason for AROW to have slid there and DEFENITELY no reason to have sent him afterward. If Cora had watched the throw come in from right and seen how off line it was and was waving all the way AROW would have made it easily. Excellent point. But I'm not certain how close Aaron was to third when Cora realized the throw was going to miss both middle infielders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanne Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 Another thing is...you'd think a 3rd base coach, who's seen this guy for about 200 games since March could see he almost had a stroke rounding second base. That was probably my biggest b**** about it...besides risking making the first out at home. Have a stroke....Hit the Dirt...Get Up and Go Home!!!...Jesus Christ Joey! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridgeport Sox Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 I don't care..I still think he's a horrible coach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Chappas Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 I think more than anything it changed the momentum of the game. Buerhle was able to overcome it but I think the hitting did not. The problem I have is that the coaching staff in general does not prepare the team to take what the opposition gives them. With no outs why send him????? Take risks when the odds are against you. With 2 outs, send him. With no outs hold him and let Crede or Uribe bring him in. I get the feeling Cora does not see the big picture. This was the situation Uribe and Crede thrive in and could have really opened the game. Our baserunning has become embarassingly bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaSoxxJim Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 (edited) QUOTE(Bridgeport Sox @ Oct 14, 2005 -> 01:24 AM) I don't care..I still think he's a horrible coach But it's kinda cool that he looks like a Ferengi. Not to the degree that Reggie Miller looks like a Ferengi, of course. Quick, Find the Ferengi! See? Not so easy, is it? Edited October 14, 2005 by FlaSoxxJim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 QUOTE(NUKE_CLEVELAND @ Oct 13, 2005 -> 09:59 PM) Just because we got by with it doesn't mean that Cora wasn't a total jackass there. There was no reason for AROW to have slid there and DEFENITELY no reason to have sent him afterward. If Cora had watched the throw come in from right and seen how off line it was and was waving all the way AROW would have made it easily. Cora told him to get down because Vlad missed the cutoff man and the throw was coming through. I think this was the biggest detractor of the play, Aaron had no momentum after sliding, and was spent from running out a triple, then he had to steam down the line. Just a really bad judgement call from Cora. He should have known better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 First of all a major league player, especially an outfielder better be in good enough shape to sprint the bases, so I have a hard time accepting he was tired when he reached third. I'd be interested in seeing if Cora looked at the left fielder's position before sending him. With it being an out, it's easier to say it was the wrong call. I'm guessing the bigger mistake was not seeing the left fielder being in position to quickly pick up the ball and make the throw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 QUOTE(Texsox @ Oct 14, 2005 -> 08:23 AM) First of all a major league player, especially an outfielder better be in good enough shape to sprint the bases, so I have a hard time accepting he was tired when he reached third. I'd be interested in seeing if Cora looked at the left fielder's position before sending him. With it being an out, it's easier to say it was the wrong call. I'm guessing the bigger mistake was not seeing the left fielder being in position to quickly pick up the ball and make the throw. Quinlann was the 3rd baseman at the time, not the left fielder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 QUOTE(kyyle23 @ Oct 14, 2005 -> 08:12 AM) Quinlann was the 3rd baseman at the time, not the left fielder. Correct, it's just a bad call cause you don't send him with 0 outs, period. Two outs I would have loved Joey trying to score him cause you have to in that situation. With 0 and 1 outs there is no way you can attempt to score a guy when it's going to be that close of a play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty Of Love Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 Quinlann made a helluva play, and this team got where it is by being aggressive. Sometimes they got too aggressive, like the play we're talking about...however, over the long haul and in the playoffs, it's gonna pay off erring on the side of being too aggressive rather than too conservative. Joey still made a mistake because there were no outs, but please, the guy doesn't need to be FIRED for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridgeport Sox Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 QUOTE(FlaSoxxJim @ Oct 14, 2005 -> 07:01 AM) But it's kinda cool that he looks like a Ferengi. Not to the degree that Reggie Miller looks like a Ferengi, of course. Quick, Find the Ferengi! See? Not so easy, is it? LOL He's not that bad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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