greg775 Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 “Paul lives in Arizona and probably would prefer something near there but he wants to play on a good, contending team, for a manager he likes and in a city he likes, plus he wants a deal for as much length as possible, like five, six or seven years,” agent Craig Landis said yesterday. I take this as "he gawn." We won't give him as many years as the Angels or BoSox. That comment by Melton is awesome. That truly is the case. The agents and players union can't have players taking less to stay in a city they like. It's not been done much and Paulie will take the best offer like they all do IMO. Whatever ... he was a god and I'll always like him but I betcha we lose him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 QUOTE(fathom @ Oct 29, 2005 -> 04:15 PM) That doesn't sound promising at all. PK is basically stating that it's likely he's going to take the highest offer. If we're going to have to give PK like 15 mil a year, I'd rather he just go elsewhere. What sounded promising was the fact PK knows the political ramifications and pressures of trying to get the most money as a free agent so the market can go higher. PK seems like an intelligent, proud, upfront kind of guy, and a team player. If he's getting pressure to sign with the highest bidder, regardless of its a good fit for him personally, is he going to listen to some idiots he's never heard from before, telling him he's got to sign so the market can go up? IMO, he's more likely to tell the players union poeple to 'piss off, I'm doing what's best for me and my family, as well as the league'. If the sox offer is real close--which it could and should be [other teams are going to be looking at the Carlos Beltran factor too, and see that one great postseason does not warrant breaking the bank for a guy who probably cannot carry a team w/o help], Pk will be back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bighurt2719 Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 QUOTE(Kalapse @ Oct 29, 2005 -> 02:28 PM) See: Carlos Beltran a little insulting to PK to compare him to Beltran, don't you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin57 Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 Konerko will get the 5 years instead of 4 that it is reported the Sox are offering. But PK will not get Beltran money. Also, Sox will not "Ordóñez" his contract with lots of deferred $$$. I predict he'll return. He'll turn down (somewhat) better financial incentives in other markets because he'll realize that he's a good fit for here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 (edited) QUOTE(bighurt2719 @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 12:32 PM) a little insulting to PK to compare him to Beltran, don't you think? I think the comparisons are valid. Both had very good postseasons. Both went into free agency looking to capitalize on their performances. Both could be looking at money that their stats say they didn't deserve. PK's a career .279/.349/.488 hitter. The money and yrs being talked about PK getting seem in line with Beltran. IMO, teams will make the Beltran comparison w/ Konerko when deciding what to offer him. And, Beltran isn't exactly a slug. He's very good player who got great great money Edited October 30, 2005 by beck72 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 QUOTE(bighurt2719 @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 12:32 PM) a little insulting to PK to compare him to Beltran, don't you think? Not in the slightest. If anything, it's a compliment. Beltran will rebound next season, as he was injured most of this year. Beltran got a huge deal not only for what he did in the postseason, because people expected him to be in his peak years during the length of the contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 I don't know if anyone has said this elsewhere, but the Sun-Times thought we're going to offer him 4/48 next week. If that's the case......time to find a new 1B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 QUOTE(bighurt2719 @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 07:32 AM) a little insulting to PK to compare him to Beltran, don't you think? Beltran is a better all around player than PK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bighurt2719 Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 11:53 AM) Beltran is a better all around player than PK BS. beltran's an outfeilder, PK's an infeilder. PK's performance this year in general has shown that he's way more valuable than beltran. i'll wager that you were one of those people who at the all star break was screaming that we should trade joe crede for vinny castilla or randa. dont take offense, im not trying to insult you. just my inclination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3E8 Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 QUOTE(fathom @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 11:52 AM) I don't know if anyone has said this elsewhere, but the Sun-Times thought we're going to offer him 4/48 next week. If that's the case......time to find a new 1B. Are you saying that because you think it's too much money for PK, or because that's not competitive enough with what other teams will offer? I would be happy if PK accepted that, just as long as there isn't a no-trade clause included. Structure the contract something like 10.5/11.5/12.5/13.5, and spin him for something else after the 2nd year of the deal, which is right before he becomes a 10-5 player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan99 Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 (edited) QUOTE(bighurt2719 @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 11:57 AM) BS. beltran's an outfeilder, PK's an infeilder. PK's performance this year in general has shown that he's way more valuable than beltran. This year Konerko was more valuable than Beltran, career wise that just isn't the case. Their career numbers at the plate are similar Beltran is .282/.350/.479 and Konerko is .279/.349/.488 however, Beltran is also a terrific centerfielder and is great on the base paths. Konerko is a good 1B and one of the slowest players in baseball. I fail to see how Konerko is way more valuable than Beltran Edit: I do think we need to bring Konerko back if possible Edited October 30, 2005 by whitesoxfan99 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 QUOTE(3E8 @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 05:59 PM) Are you saying that because you think it's too much money for PK, or because that's not competitive enough with what other teams will offer? I would be happy if PK accepted that, just as long as there isn't a no-trade clause included. Structure the contract something like 10.5/11.5/12.5/13.5, and spin him for something else after the 2nd year of the deal, which is right before he becomes a 10-5 player. He'll get more money/years than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 Beltran is better than Konerko. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 QUOTE(bighurt2719 @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 07:32 AM) a little insulting to PK to compare him to Beltran, don't you think? QUOTE(bighurt2719 @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 12:57 PM) BS. beltran's an outfeilder, PK's an infeilder. PK's performance this year in general has shown that he's way more valuable than beltran. i'll wager that you were one of those people who at the all star break was screaming that we should trade joe crede for vinny castilla or randa. dont take offense, im not trying to insult you. just my inclination. No offense or anything but you know absolutely nothing about baseball if you truely believe this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frahungski Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 QUOTE(bighurt2719 @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 06:32 AM) a little insulting to PK to compare him to Beltran, don't you think? not sure you could insult anyone by comparing their baseball skills to beltran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted October 30, 2005 Share Posted October 30, 2005 QUOTE(bighurt2719 @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 11:57 AM) BS. beltran's an outfeilder, PK's an infeilder. PK's performance this year in general has shown that he's way more valuable than beltran. i'll wager that you were one of those people who at the all star break was screaming that we should trade joe crede for vinny castilla or randa. dont take offense, im not trying to insult you. just my inclination. Um...what. the. f***? Get a clue...thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZoomSlowik Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 I'm sorry, but there's no way I see anyone offerring Paulie more than $14 mil. Just think for a minute before we all panick about teams with other major issues making major finanacial committments to a guy that in most years would not be considered an elite FA. That kind of money is reserved for franchise centerpieces that carry the team. Think Vladimir Guerrero and Carlos Beltran. Paulie just isn't that good. The better comparisions are Richie Sexson and Adrian Beltre, guys that have been pretty good for stretches but have their flaws. The only teams I see making major offers are the Sox, the Angels, the Blue Jays, and the Orioles. I doubt Paulie goes to the latter two because they are fringe contenders at best. While the Angels may make a major offer, I doubt they blow us out of the water. They've already got a lot of money committed to Vlad, Bartolo, and Cabrera among others, and they're going to need to do something with their pitching staff with Washburn and Byrd becoming FA. If we're even close to the same type of money, he'll probably stay. Everyone who has commented on where he will go has stated that he will probably stay with the Sox, while all the stuff saying he'll go elsewhere is merely speculation. This stuff happens with every major FA, that doesn't mean it's true. Let's just relax and see what happens before we start assuming the worst. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankensteiner Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 Resigning Konerko has become more important from a PR standpoint as opposed to an on-the-field standpoint. The Sox would probably like to maintain the momentum of winning the World Series with keeping what looks to be the team's most popular player. I just hope the Sox don't do something insane like sacrifice our starting pitching (short-term or long-term) in an effort to keep Konerko. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 QUOTE(Frankensteiner @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 02:53 AM) Resigning Konerko has become more important from a PR standpoint as opposed to an on-the-field standpoint. The Sox would probably like to maintain the momentum of winning the World Series with keeping what looks to be the team's most popular player. I just hope the Sox don't do something insane like sacrifice our starting pitching (short-term or long-term) in an effort to keep Konerko. Gammons said a few days ago that KW was going to trade a starting pitcher in order to free up payroll to sign PK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZoomSlowik Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 Three things: 1) Gammons never seems to be right about anything. 2) It's highly possible that the "starting pitcher" is Orlando Hernandez, who probably doesn't have a place in the rotation and will cost about $5 mil this year. 3) We don't have a whole lot of financial committments past next season, which should allow us some leeway in long term deals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 Yeah if it doesnt involve Boston I dont care what Gammons says because he doesnt know anything.... also we all know KW and he wont tell anyone what he will do.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gettysburg32 Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 QUOTE(fathom @ Oct 30, 2005 -> 10:55 PM) Gammons said a few days ago that KW was going to trade a starting pitcher in order to free up payroll to sign PK. Would make perfect sense if that pitcher is El Duque. Would make no sense if it was any of the other 4. Would make more sense if someone other than Gammons was the first to say it. Not being able to resign Paulie, and spending $$ elsewhere, would make sense to diehards like us (who at least think) they know all this GM type stuff. However on the PR side, it would be a bad move if Paulie's not resigned and was viewed as being short-changed by Jerry, et al. If Jerry and KW offer him 5yrs/65-70 and he still goes somwhere else for 5 yrs/75, that's the way it goes; but they better make a damn good effort to resign him. And FWIW, I believe KW understands that, and Jerry will really want to do everything possible for Paulie. Does that mean I think it's 100% that Paulie is coming back, no, but I feel pretty good about it. I believe KW sees that this team has all the ability to be as good, or even better, at least for the next two seasons. If there's a time to open up the budget, albeit within rationality, it's now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted October 31, 2005 Share Posted October 31, 2005 Beltran is a perfect example of a guy who picked the wrong team for money reasons. He'd have been perfect in Houston forever. But he needed to take the big bucks. I think the big story here is the guy who posted that Konerko is feeling pressure from the union to take the best offer. I believe that fully. So he's gone. We aren't going to offer him the most. Jerry will make a good offer, but it won't be the best offer and he'll leave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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