Soxplosion Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Ive never considered doing it. But I have thought about it before. Oh its hard to explain... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 i think unless you have been to the brink and back, you can't call someone selfish for committing suicide. when you are deeply depressed of course you are going to think of yourself first. the reason you are depressed in the first place is that you feel the world has let you down. if you were making decisions based on the consequences for other people, then you wouldn't be so depressed, because you would care about other people, and feel like they cared about you. what you need to understand is that people who are suicidal view the world in a totally different way than the average person, and often it is not their fault. things happen, circumstances arise that they have no control over, and it is not always easy to pick yourself up and fight again. Absolutely friggin right! Like I said earlier.. unless you've lived it in some way you can not have a true understanding. steff not every view of suicide is from the "victims left behind" view. Thats all you insist on seeing. When you get to the point of hurting so bad, that you kill yourself, other people SHOULDNT matter. Until you are there, or ever are there, your view really doesnt count. Bmr.. maybe you should read a little better. I HAVE been there. Then i dont understand how u can think its selfish. When it comes to the people i love, I am the most selfless person you would ever meet. The times i have been hurt, and they have been many, I fought through it. However, if it had been just a little worse, and i had actually done the act, believe me, the reason would NOT have been selfish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Ive never considered doing it. But I have thought about it before. Oh its hard to explain... Nah i understand. You thought u might be better off dead, but you never seriously considered the actual act. Been there done that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted May 23, 2003 Author Share Posted May 23, 2003 Nah i understand. You thought u might be better off dead, but you never seriously considered the actual act. Been there done that. As have I Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 i think unless you have been to the brink and back, you can't call someone selfish for committing suicide. when you are deeply depressed of course you are going to think of yourself first. the reason you are depressed in the first place is that you feel the world has let you down. if you were making decisions based on the consequences for other people, then you wouldn't be so depressed, because you would care about other people, and feel like they cared about you. what you need to understand is that people who are suicidal view the world in a totally different way than the average person, and often it is not their fault. things happen, circumstances arise that they have no control over, and it is not always easy to pick yourself up and fight again. Absolutely friggin right! Like I said earlier.. unless you've lived it in some way you can not have a true understanding. steff not every view of suicide is from the "victims left behind" view. Thats all you insist on seeing. When you get to the point of hurting so bad, that you kill yourself, other people SHOULDNT matter. Until you are there, or ever are there, your view really doesnt count. Bmr.. maybe you should read a little better. I HAVE been there. Then i dont understand how u can think its selfish. When it comes to the people i love, I am the most selfless person you would ever meet. The times i have been hurt, and they have been many, I fought through it. However, if it had been just a little worse, and i had actually done the act, believe me, the reason would NOT have been selfish. Bmr.. I never said my opinion is law. Based on me and my personal experiences, to me it WAS selfish. As far as me personally.. I did not have a gun to my head or anything like that (actually it was a very dark time after I lost both of my grandfathers within 5 weeks of eachother) and I was taking complete care of my grandmother. Things were VERY hard and one reason I snapped out of it was because if I had done something stupid it would have been my grandmother who had to resolve things for me (my parents were still living out of state at the time). To me.. had I decided to end my life, my grandmother would have been left to deal with the "mess". To me, that would have been selfish of me to just not care about what she would have to deal with. Am I making any sense here..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 i think unless you have been to the brink and back, you can't call someone selfish for committing suicide. when you are deeply depressed of course you are going to think of yourself first. the reason you are depressed in the first place is that you feel the world has let you down. if you were making decisions based on the consequences for other people, then you wouldn't be so depressed, because you would care about other people, and feel like they cared about you. what you need to understand is that people who are suicidal view the world in a totally different way than the average person, and often it is not their fault. things happen, circumstances arise that they have no control over, and it is not always easy to pick yourself up and fight again. Absolutely friggin right! Like I said earlier.. unless you've lived it in some way you can not have a true understanding. steff not every view of suicide is from the "victims left behind" view. Thats all you insist on seeing. When you get to the point of hurting so bad, that you kill yourself, other people SHOULDNT matter. Until you are there, or ever are there, your view really doesnt count. Bmr.. maybe you should read a little better. I HAVE been there. Then i dont understand how u can think its selfish. When it comes to the people i love, I am the most selfless person you would ever meet. The times i have been hurt, and they have been many, I fought through it. However, if it had been just a little worse, and i had actually done the act, believe me, the reason would NOT have been selfish. Bmr.. I never said my opinion is law. Based on me and my personal experiences, to me it WAS selfish. As far as me personally.. I did not have a gun to my head or anything like that (actually it was a very dark time after I lost both of my grandfathers within 5 weeks of eachother) and I was taking complete care of my grandmother. Things were VERY hard and one reason I snapped out of it was because if I had done something stupid it would have been my grandmother who had to resolve things for me (my parents were still living out of state at the time). To me.. had I decided to end my life, my grandmother would have been left to deal with the "mess". To me, that would have been selfish of me to just not care about what she would have to deal with. Am I making any sense here..? The main reason for suicides or attempts is the person feels completely alone, completely un-needed, coompletely worthless. No point of living. What about those millions of people who were to your point but have NO ONE to live for NO ONE who needs them and NO ONE who loves them? There are many. The reasoning is not selfish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Nah i understand. You thought u might be better off dead, but you never seriously considered the actual act. Been there done that. Yeah, something like that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 As far as me personally.. I did not have a gun to my head or anything like that (actually it was a very dark time after I lost both of my grandfathers within 5 weeks of eachother) and I was taking complete care of my grandmother. Things were VERY hard and one reason I snapped out of it was because if I had done something stupid it would have been my grandmother who had to resolve things for me (my parents were still living out of state at the time). To me.. had I decided to end my life, my grandmother would have been left to deal with the "mess". To me, that would have been selfish of me to just not care about what she would have to deal with. Am I making any sense here..? Well steff, as much as I dislike you, I feel obliged to apologize for the deaths of your grandparents. Ive been there before and let me just say it wasnt cool at all... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 The main reason for suicides or attempts is the person feels completely alone, completely un-needed, coompletely worthless. No point of living. What about those millions of people who were to your point but have NO ONE to live for NO ONE who needs them and NO ONE who loves them? There are many. The reasoning is not selfish. Oh for the love of God.. did I say they were ALL selfish? Did you not see me say "IMO" about 100 times in this thread? WTF Bmr..? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Oh for the love of God.. did I say they were ALL selfish? Did you not see me say "IMO" about 100 times in this thread? WTF Bmr..? Im just trying to let you see another view, I really dont want to fight with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 The main reason for suicides or attempts is the person feels completely alone, completely un-needed, coompletely worthless. No point of living. What about those millions of people who were to your point but have NO ONE to live for NO ONE who needs them and NO ONE who loves them By the way.. there are not "millions" of suicides committed by people who have no one. I can't get the exact stats right now (f'ing firewall restriction at work! ) but most suicides are committed by middle to upper class professionals. Most are females - and the majority of them are mothers. I don't even think there were a million suicides in 2002, but I could be wrong. Although I'm pretty sure the number is a LOT less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 The main reason for suicides or attempts is the person feels completely alone, completely un-needed, coompletely worthless. No point of living. What about those millions of people who were to your point but have NO ONE to live for NO ONE who needs them and NO ONE who loves them By the way.. there are not "millions" of suicides committed by people who have no one. I can't get the exact stats right now (f'ing firewall restriction at work! ) but most suicides are committed by middle to upper class professionals. Most are females - and the majority of them are mothers. I don't even think there were a million suicides in 2002, but I could be wrong. Although I'm pretty sure the number is a LOT less. K the numbers are wrong, the point isnt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Im just trying to let you see another view, I really dont want to fight with you. I said at least a couple times (to cw I believe) that I understood his point and that for ME and my experiences it was selfish. To think any other way would make me a complete retard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 I said at least a couple times (to cw I believe) that I understood his point and that for ME and my experiences it was selfish. To think any other way would make me a complete retard. Okay cool. Gotta go back to work, see ya. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 The main reason for suicides or attempts is the person feels completely alone, completely un-needed, coompletely worthless. No point of living. What about those millions of people who were to your point but have NO ONE to live for NO ONE who needs them and NO ONE who loves them By the way.. there are not "millions" of suicides committed by people who have no one. I can't get the exact stats right now (f'ing firewall restriction at work! ) but most suicides are committed by middle to upper class professionals. Most are females - and the majority of them are mothers. I don't even think there were a million suicides in 2002, but I could be wrong. Although I'm pretty sure the number is a LOT less. K the numbers are wrong, the point isnt. How can the point not be wrong? You said what about the millions who are alone? That group makes up less than 5% of total suicides. The female # is something like 74%. These are females with children. How do you kill yourself when you have a child to take care of? How will that child survive? Do you not put your childs well being ahead of your own? And if not.. aren't you selfish? I've seen your point.. now take a look at mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmr31 Posted May 24, 2003 Share Posted May 24, 2003 The main reason for suicides or attempts is the person feels completely alone, completely un-needed, coompletely worthless. No point of living. What about those millions of people who were to your point but have NO ONE to live for NO ONE who needs them and NO ONE who loves them By the way.. there are not "millions" of suicides committed by people who have no one. I can't get the exact stats right now (f'ing firewall restriction at work! ) but most suicides are committed by middle to upper class professionals. Most are females - and the majority of them are mothers. I don't even think there were a million suicides in 2002, but I could be wrong. Although I'm pretty sure the number is a LOT less. K the numbers are wrong, the point isnt. How can the point not be wrong? You said what about the millions who are alone? That group makes up less than 5% of total suicides. The female # is something like 74%. These are females with children. How do you kill yourself when you have a child to take care of? How will that child survive? Do you not put your childs well being ahead of your own? And if not.. aren't you selfish? I've seen your point.. now take a look at mine. Yes, anyone who kills themselves and has someone depending on them is totally selfish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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