Central Division

[jasonxctf]

is it just me or are teams in the Central Division much more active this off season than in previous years.

 

Twins get a new 2b, Tigers signing a new closer and new starting pitcher, royals making some moves, of course the sox getting a new dh.

[Ricky3353]

Ya the Central is gonna tough this year, but im not all that worried about Cleveland. Last year, basically everyone had a career year (granted the majority of them are young). I think it will take about 93-96 wins this year.

[YASNY]

Ya the Central is gonna tough this year, but im not all that worried about Cleveland. Last year, basically everyone had a career year (granted the majority of them are young). I think it will take about 93-96 wins this year.

 

That's what was said about Cleveland's bats last off season. Young guys that have "career years" usually are at the beginning of an upswing in their production.

[Balta1701]

That's what was said about Cleveland's bats last off season.  Young guys that have "career years" usually are at the beginning of an upswing in their production.

Actually, I would even say that several of Cleveland's guys had fairly poor years last year compared to what we might expect of them. Hafner may well hit 40+ home runs next year. Aaron Boone hit under .200 the first 2 months of the season, and put up numbers well below his career ones. Victor Martinez hit under .215 the first 2 months of the season. There's no great reason to assume that those guys will get off to a hot start next year, but there's also no wonderful reason to assume that they won't either.

[YASNY]

Actually, I would even say that several of Cleveland's guys had fairly poor years last year compared to what we might expect of them.  Hafner may well hit 40+ home runs next year.  Aaron Boone hit under .200 the first 2 months of the season, and put up numbers well below his career ones.  Victor Martinez hit under .215 the first 2 months of the season.  There's no great reason to assume that those guys will get off to a hot start next year, but there's also no wonderful reason to assume that they won't either.

 

Boone is not a "young guy" and he just might continue to decline. Martinez had a horrid start, but he was productive afterward. Expect it to continue. Hafner was probably a headache away from hitting 40 in '05.

[RibbieRubarb]

is it just me or are teams in the Central Division much more active this off season than in previous years.

 

 

That's what happens when one of teams in the division wins the whole shabang!

[watchtower41]

Call me crazy, but I'm thinking that the Tigers are gonna be the one to watch this year. The Twinkies, sorry window is closed. Cleveland will still be good sure, but lets be honest no way Wickman has that kind of year again, and thats with all their 1 run losses. My bet is on Detroit making a run at us this year. They are young(for the most part), talented and have a lot to prove. Of course, that run is gonna fall short when Rogers gives up a walk-off to Rally Crede on 9/20/06. word is bomb. "JOOOOOOOEEE CREEEEDE"

Edited December 9, 2005 by watchtower41

[YASNY]

Call me crazy, but I'm thinking that the Tigers are gonna be the one to watch this year.  The Twinkies, sorry window is closed.  Cleveland will still be good sure, but lets be honest no way Wickman has that kind of year again, and thats with all their 1 run losses.  My bet is on Detroit making a run at us this year.  They are young(for the most part), talented and have a lot to prove.  Of course, that run is gonna fall short when Rogers gives up a walk-off to Rally Crede on 9/20/06.  word is bomb.  "JOOOOOOOEEE CREEEEDE"

 

Then he'll punch out the nearest available cameraman.

[Felix]

The Tigers? What have they done? Overpaid two aging pitchers? Anything else?

[watchtower41]

The Tigers?  What have they done?  Overpaid two aging pitchers?  Anything else?

 

 

got rid of Tramell. Great guy, crap manager.

 

 

Seriosly though, if they are healthy, I see them winning some games. Their pitching staff couldnt get any worse right??

[jasonxctf]

I agree about the Tigers. They bring in a legitimate #1/#2, a new closer and have a healthy Maggs... they could be trouble. Did they lose anyone to FA?

[witesoxfan]

I don't see the Tigers doing much.

 

Kenny Rogers had the best year he's had in quite some time, and he's on the wrong side of 40, let alone 35 or 30.

 

Todd Jones had the best year of his career last year, and is also quite old.

 

I see the Tigers, at the very best, to be a .500 team.

 

The Indians look fine, the Twins look good still too, especially if they can get Baker into the rotation over Lohse, and the Royals look atleast a little improved.

 

It'll be fun next year.

[jasonxctf]

I don't see the Tigers doing much.

 

Kenny Rogers had the best year he's had in quite some time, and he's on the wrong side of 40, let alone 35 or 30.

 

Todd Jones had the best year of his career last year, and is also quite old.

 

I see the Tigers, at the very best, to be a .500 team.

 

The Indians look fine, the Twins look good still too, especially if they can get Baker into the rotation over Lohse, and the Royals look atleast a little improved. 

 

It'll be fun next year.

 

 

you're crazy.. 13 wins in '02, 13 wins in '03, 18 wins in '04 and 14 wins in '05. This guy can easily win 13-15 games next year. Maroth and Bonderman both won 14 games last year too. Not a bad 1,2,3.

[timotime]

Call me crazy, but I'm thinking that the Tigers are gonna be the one to watch this year.  The Twinkies, sorry window is closed.  Cleveland will still be good sure, but lets be honest no way Wickman has that kind of year again, and thats with all their 1 run losses.  My bet is on Detroit making a run at us this year.  They are young(for the most part), talented and have a lot to prove.  Of course, that run is gonna fall short when Rogers gives up a walk-off to Rally Crede on 9/20/06.  word is bomb.  "JOOOOOOOEEE CREEEEDE"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

a lot of people (cough gammons) picked the tigers to win the division last year. i dont think we have to worry about the tigers.

[Felix]

I don't see the Tigers doing much.

 

Kenny Rogers had the best year he's had in quite some time, and he's on the wrong side of 40, let alone 35 or 30.

 

Todd Jones had the best year of his career last year, and is also quite old.

 

I see the Tigers, at the very best, to be a .500 team.

 

The Indians look fine, the Twins look good still too, especially if they can get Baker into the rotation over Lohse, and the Royals look atleast a little improved. 

 

It'll be fun next year.

exactly my thoughts.

[Balta1701]

The Tigers need several improbable things to happen.

 

1. Kenny Rogers needs to somehow pitch like he did before his suspension last year.

2. Jeremy Bonderman and their other starting pitchers need to grow up, even more rapidly than was expected.

3. Magglio Ordonez must stay healthy.

4. The team must want to play.

5. Jones and Percival must stay healthy and productive, allowing the other guys (isn't German still up there?) to fill a relief role.

6. Shelton must not be a fluke.

7. Several other young guys (i.e. Nook Logan) must perform better.

8. Ivan Rodriguez must perform better.

 

I'm sure I could think of more if I tried.

[Kalapse]

you're crazy.. 13 wins in '02, 13 wins in '03, 18 wins in '04 and 14 wins in '05. This guy can easily win 13-15 games next year. Maroth and Bonderman both won 14 games last year too. Not a bad 1,2,3.

3.84 ERA in '02, 4.57 ERA in '03, 4.76 ERA in '04, 3.46 ERA in '05. Wins do not a good pitcher make.

[The Ginger Kid]

Wins do not a good pitcher make.

 

If you say so.

 

The Tigers were a great hitting team last year with some pretty decent pitching. They'll be much better this year. Even a disinterested Jim Leyland is better than Trammel and most other managers in the league. Mags will be there the whole season. I think they'll be very competetive in the AL central, by far the best division in baseball. Weird, isn't it?

[SSH2005]

Wins are overrated. Just look at Millwood's numbers from last season.

 

2.86 ERA

9-11 W-L

 

A pitcher can't earn wins if his offense doesn't score any runs for him.

[SoxRock05]

Let them go against Bobby...no youngsters will hit him.....Sox win divsion easily...stop looking at these other teams in the division...no one has the pitching like the Sox...no one has the power like the Sox...they're the team to beat (CHAMPIONS)....but they wont beat them gauranteed...stop lookin at the TIGERS (haha) the Royals (HAHA) the Indains (F*** them) and the Twins (Last place)....Don't down our team...Back to Back....They'll do it...

 

JiYea!!!

[The Ginger Kid]

Wins are overrated.  Just look at Millwood's numbers from last season.

 

2.86 ERA

9-11 W-L

 

A pitcher can't earn wins if his offense doesn't score any runs for him.

 

so following this logic, Millwood would've been a WORSE pitcher had he had, let's say, a 3.86 ERA but gone 15-5.

 

Gee, I wonder which the Indians would've preferred.

[DBAHO]

so following this logic, Millwood would've been a WORSE pitcher had he had, let's say, a 3.86 ERA but gone 15-5.

 

Gee, I wonder which the Indians would've preferred.

This all goes back to the Jose Contreras argument. Jose Contreras in the 1st half of 2005 had the same problem, he wasn't winning his games. But was that his fault? No, and you know why? Run Support.

 

If Millwood actually got run support in the games he started, he could have won 20 games, not 9.

[SSH2005]

so following this logic, Millwood would've been a WORSE pitcher had he had, let's say, a 3.86 ERA but gone 15-5.

Yes, he would have been worse. Is Rodrigo Lopez a better pitcher than Millwood because he went 15-12 with a 4.90 ERA last season? Nope, it just means that the Orioles scored more runs for Lopez than the Indians did for Millwood. Do you think that Shawn Estes is a great pitcher because he won 15 games in 2004 with a 5.84 ERA? I hope to God not. Wins are the absolute worst stat to judge pitchers by.

 

Gee, I wonder which the Indians would've preferred.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think the Indians would have preferred to score more runs for a guy with a 2.86 ERA. It isn't Millwood's fault that his record sucked last season. He did more than enough to win more than 9 games. It's his offense's fault for not scoring him any runs.

Edited December 10, 2005 by SSH2005

[YASNY]

Yes, he would have been worse.  Is Rodrigo Lopez a better pitcher than Millwood because he went 15-12 with a 4.90 ERA last season?  Nope, it just means that the Orioles scored more runs for Lopez than the Indians did for Millwood.  Do you think that Shawn Estes is a great pitcher because he won 15 games in 2004 with a 5.84 ERA?  I hope to God not.  Wins are the absolute worst stat to judge pitchers by.

I think the Indians would have preferred to score more runs for a guy with a 2.86 ERA.  It isn't Millwood's fault that his record sucked last season.  He did more than enough to win more than 9 games.  It's his offense's fault for not scoring him any runs.

 

That arguement only goes so far. You've heard of situational hitting and clutch hitters? Well, there are situational and clutch pitchers as well. Jack McDowell was one of those guys. If the Sox gave him 5 runs to work with, he would very easily give up 3 or 4, yet if they needed a shutout to win the game, McDowell was good about delivering under those conditions as well. Garcia is an example of a situational pitcher also. The bigger the game, the better he pitches. It's more than just straight ERA vs Win totals.

[DBAHO]

Garcia is an example of a situational pitcher also.  The bigger the game, the better he pitches.  It's more than just straight ERA vs Win totals.

But I guess that also shows why people get frustrated with Freddy sometimes when he doesn't perform well against teams like Kansas City when he should be dominating them.