mmmmmbeeer Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 If I remember correctly, big Juan Uribe dumped Boras last offseason and promptly signed a 3 year deal with the Sox immediately afterward. If you're Joe "f***ing" Crede, having established yourself as a Chicago hero last postseason, knowing that the Sox have been oh-so patient with you throughout all of your struggles, knowing that the Sox WILL NOT negotiate with your agent which essentially spells your departure from Chicago, would ya dump Boras and see what a new agent could do in keeping you in Chicago? Has anyone "in the know" heard any rumbles of this being a possibility. I think Joe would have to believe that the Sox would offer him a reasonable long-term deal as long as he had a different agent, but would that be enough for him to dump Boras? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam G Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 It depends on what he's looking for. If he wants the "best deal" (i.e. most money), then Boras is the best in the business at getting that for his clients and there'd be no reason for Crede to fire him. If he wants nothing more than to resign with the Sox, he can dump Boras and negotiate himself or he can direct Boras to resign for a reasonable amount. As for Williams refusing to negotiate with any Boras client, that's just posturing for the media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UofIChiSox Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 I wouldn't dump Boras. Boras is in the best position to take what Crede did in the postseason and cash it in with millions of dollars over several years. I'm sure Joe Crede likes being in Chicago and enjoyed winning a World Series, but the fact is he isn't a diehard fan like us, he's a professional, it's his job, and he probably wants to make as much as possible doing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 Next season if you think about it could almost be a re-building season....could have Josh Fields, Chris Young, Jerry Owens all starting and Brian Anderson in only his 2nd year. A course if we keep the pitching in tact that would prob still be enough to make the playoffs possibly. Also if Joe wants to get paid I want to see him produce with the bat for a whole season not just 3 out of 5 months... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 02:16 AM) Next season if you think about it could almost be a re-building season....could have Josh Fields, Chris Young, Jerry Owens all starting and Brian Anderson in only his 2nd year. A course if we keep the pitching in tact that would prob still be enough to make the playoffs possibly. Also if Joe wants to get paid I want to see him produce with the bat for a whole season not just 3 out of 5 months... Dye will be here in 07 as long as he produces like he did last year. You might have some youngins next season but you still have one hell of a core: Paul, Thome, Gooch, AJ(he'll be back), juan, dye, mark, bmac, freddy, bobby, neal. Not bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 08:19 AM) Dye will be here in 07 as long as he produces like he did last year. You might have some youngins next season but you still have one hell of a core: Paul, Thome, Gooch, AJ(he'll be back), juan, dye, mark, bmac, freddy, bobby, neal. Not bad. Dye only signed a 2 year contract so I dont think he will return.... And yes we will still have enough pieces to win but hopefully we can figure something out with Garland and even Contreras. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 (edited) QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 02:50 AM) Dye only signed a 2 year contract so I dont think he will return.... And yes we will still have enough pieces to win but hopefully we can figure something out with Garland and even Contreras. Dye has a 6 million dollar team option for next season. As long as he produces like last year it'll be picked up. Edited December 12, 2005 by Rowand44 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 (edited) QUOTE(Adam G @ Dec 11, 2005 -> 06:27 PM) It depends on what he's looking for. If he wants the "best deal" (i.e. most money), then Boras is the best in the business at getting that for his clients and there'd be no reason for Crede to fire him. If he wants nothing more than to resign with the Sox, he can dump Boras and negotiate himself or he can direct Boras to resign for a reasonable amount. As for Williams refusing to negotiate with any Boras client, that's just posturing for the media. I agree and would really like to hear what Crede wants to do, whether he's looking for a payday or to stay with the Sox. I think that after Rowand, he would be the most likely trading piece for Kenny Williams but that depends even moreso on what he does this coming year. Edited December 12, 2005 by Drew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 08:53 AM) Dye has a 6 million dollar team option for next season. As long as he produces like last year it'll be picked up. Well if Chris Young is ready and Owens repeats his performance unless Dye has a really good season I dont think that option will be picked up. KW would prob rather save that 6 million to use it to help bring back Garland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 03:19 AM) Dye will be here in 07 as long as he produces like he did last year. You might have some youngins next season but you still have one hell of a core: Paul, Thome, Gooch, AJ(he'll be back), juan, dye, mark, bmac, freddy, bobby, neal. Not bad. assuming Freddy re-signs after this season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(mmmmmbeeer @ Dec 11, 2005 -> 07:18 PM) If I remember correctly, big Juan Uribe dumped Boras last offseason and promptly signed a 3 year deal with the Sox immediately afterward. If you're Joe "f***ing" Crede, having established yourself as a Chicago hero last postseason, knowing that the Sox have been oh-so patient with you throughout all of your struggles, knowing that the Sox WILL NOT negotiate with your agent which essentially spells your departure from Chicago, would ya dump Boras and see what a new agent could do in keeping you in Chicago? Has anyone "in the know" heard any rumbles of this being a possibility. I think Joe would have to believe that the Sox would offer him a reasonable long-term deal as long as he had a different agent, but would that be enough for him to dump Boras? If you are Joe Crede and watching as the greatest Sox batter of all time moves on to another team, do you realize it's a business, and the team will dump you in a heartbeat, so you better get all you can, when you can? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(Texsox @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 09:15 AM) If you are Joe Crede and watching as the greatest Sox batter of all time moves on to another team, do you realize it's a business, and the team will dump you in a heartbeat, so you better get all you can, when you can? Crede's my favorite guy, now that you know who's gone. I'm positive he knows it's a business. Rowand was supposedly his best friend on the Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmmmmbeeer Posted December 12, 2005 Author Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(Texsox @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 02:15 PM) If you are Joe Crede and watching as the greatest Sox batter of all time moves on to another team, do you realize it's a business, and the team will dump you in a heartbeat, so you better get all you can, when you can? Agreed. But.... we've seen Joe and his personality, my impression is he doesn't like big changes. I think if given the choice of the same money here or elsewhere, he'd want to stay here. So, if he keeps Boras it's because he has somehow gotten the impression that the Sox would lowball him on a contract offer. That's the only reason I can see him staying with Boras. I don't know what's given Joe this impression, I think the Sox have been VERY fair with players we've signed as well as the offers made to players we didn't sign. So, if Joe thinks he'd get a fair offer and wants to stay in Chicago, he'd dump Boras, IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RME JICO Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(mmmmmbeeer @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 10:19 AM) Agreed. But.... we've seen Joe and his personality, my impression is he doesn't like big changes. I think if given the choice of the same money here or elsewhere, he'd want to stay here. So, if he keeps Boras it's because he has somehow gotten the impression that the Sox would lowball him on a contract offer. That's the only reason I can see him staying with Boras. I don't know what's given Joe this impression, I think the Sox have been VERY fair with players we've signed as well as the offers made to players we didn't sign. So, if Joe thinks he'd get a fair offer and wants to stay in Chicago, he'd dump Boras, IMO. The player decides what he wants to get, not the agent. So the only time there would be an issue is if the agent convinces the player that he is worth more money or years than he is being offered. Player gets more money, agent gets more money. This is then backed up by external offers or where the agent compares the current offer with other similar offers around the league. I agree that the Sox are not in the business of lowballing, they normally give the fair market rate to players, but they also do not over pay anyone, and that is where the problem lies. If Boras convinces Joe that he can get more money, then it is up to him to decide. The bottom line is he is not going to dump his agent just to stay in Chicago. If the Sox make him a fair offer then he stays, if he feels like it is undervalued, then he goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(WinninUgly @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 11:23 AM) The player decides what he wants to get, not the agent. So the only time there would be an issue is if the agent convinces the player that he is worth more money or years than he is being offered. Player gets more money, agent gets more money. This is then backed up by external offers or where the agent compares the current offer with other similar offers around the league. I agree that the Sox are not in the business of lowballing, they normally give the fair market rate to players, but they also do not over pay anyone, and that is where the problem lies. If Boras convinces Joe that he can get more money, then it is up to him to decide. The bottom line is he is not going to dump his agent just to stay in Chicago. If the Sox make him a fair offer then he stays, if he feels like it is undervalued, then he goes. Which Boras will do this to his clients. But also his negotiating tactics will decide if a player can stay with the original team. Look at Boras' two big clients: Milwood and Damon. He is holding them out until they are the last two queality players at their respective positions. This will get them more money and they have every right to do this. But do you think KW would have waited until Jan. for PK to decide what he was doing? I think KW wouldn't have waited so long to determine who was going to be on the team. In this case, it is the agent's negotiating tactics whichwould have determined that the player not go back to the original team. To say the player decides where he goes and not the agent is many times naive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxPride56 Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(kyyle23 @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 07:52 AM) assuming Freddy re-signs after this season freddy is signed though 2007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(ptatc @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 12:31 PM) Which Boras will do this to his clients. But also his negotiating tactics will decide if a player can stay with the original team. Look at Boras' two big clients: Milwood and Damon. He is holding them out until they are the last two queality players at their respective positions. This will get them more money and they have every right to do this. But do you think KW would have waited until Jan. for PK to decide what he was doing? I think KW wouldn't have waited so long to determine who was going to be on the team. In this case, it is the agent's negotiating tactics whichwould have determined that the player not go back to the original team. To say the player decides where he goes and not the agent is many times naive. Washburn and Weaver are also his clients, and it just so happens that those three pitchers are just about the only starters left on the market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 Baseball Free Agency is the death of the modern dynasty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(knightni @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 11:50 AM) Baseball Free Agency is the death of the modern dynasty. Dammit! Just when we were hitting our stride! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KJean Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(mmmmmbeeer @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 10:19 AM) Agreed. But.... we've seen Joe and his personality, my impression is he doesn't like big changes. I think if given the choice of the same money here or elsewhere, he'd want to stay here. So, if he keeps Boras it's because he has somehow gotten the impression that the Sox would lowball him on a contract offer. That's the only reason I can see him staying with Boras. I don't know what's given Joe this impression, I think the Sox have been VERY fair with players we've signed as well as the offers made to players we didn't sign. So, if Joe thinks he'd get a fair offer and wants to stay in Chicago, he'd dump Boras, IMO. I agree. There were plenty of articles during the season asking Joe what he wanted to do for the rest of his career and he always said he wants to spend all of it in a White Sox uniform. So, I'm pretty sure he'll do his best to stay on this team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 QUOTE(KJean @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 02:39 PM) I agree. There were plenty of articles during the season asking Joe what he wanted to do for the rest of his career and he always said he wants to spend all of it in a White Sox uniform. So, I'm pretty sure he'll do his best to stay on this team. So how much of that is just Joe being politically correct and not doing anything to cause turmoil with fans and the clubhouse? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JUGGERNAUT Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 Crede's celebrity status grew beyond his ability to play the game in CHICAGO. Boras may or may not be able to get him the best MLB contract but that decision might ruin any chance for him to earn money thru endorsements. When his career ends those endorsement opportunities will loom large. I have a feeling he is going to learn quickly what that means playing for the Chicago White Sox by looking at Kong. If Kong get the deals we expect him to get Crede would be a fool to stick with Boras. It's not just the White Sox who have grown tired with Boras' tactics. The NYY's are not budging from their $40M/4 deal which at this time looks to be Damon's best offer. That's a far cry from the $84M/7 yr deal his agent's been demanding. If the league as a whole has come to conclusion that it's best to wait out Boras' clients that's not going to help him or his clients. He might start losing more of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 Well Boras is never going to be short of clients ill say that much.... but yeah he is starting to lose some of idonno what you call it power? Teams not named the Mets are getting smarter on how they spend money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allsox Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 I think it should be mandatory that Scott Boras should always be spelled Borass or Bora$ on this board I dunno what a fair offer is for Joe....3 yrs, 6 million maybe?!? After Joe came back from his fractured finger, the guy was a stud in Sept and in the playoffs BUT the first 4 months were pretty quiet.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allsox Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Dec 13, 2005 -> 05:08 AM) Well Boras is never going to be short of clients ill say that much.... but yeah he is starting to lose some of idonno what you call it power? Teams not named the Mets are getting smarter on how they spend money. The only team dumb enuff to even listen to Bora$'s ridiculous demands are the Detroit Tigers and they still sucked last yr....Signing Kenny Rogers to 16 million over 2 yrs ensures another 4the place finish for that team....Why the Tigers can't see they're Bora$'s personal dumping grounds for his clients is beyond me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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