Sox Acquire Javier Vazquez

[Flash Tizzle]

We all have to remember that Garland's impending trip to free agency after 2006 shoots down his trade value a great deal, especially when teams throw 5-year, $50+ million contracts at him.

 

Which, when you consider any possible 6-man rotation, lends credence to the White Sox trading Garland now. Are you going to trade him now, with a full year of service under a team, or midseason? If you believe is value is lessened now, just wait until June. I don't believe Williams has a rotation set in mind to battle possible injuries (Garcia--WBC). And neither do I believe McCarthy deserves to be in the bullpen. He'll be lucky to work more than 3 innings in any one game he pitches. Don't do this to him.

 

Where's the Kenny Williams' of the league? Where's the person willing to overpay? Someone has to be willing to give up talent in exchange for pitching.

[nitetrain8601]

That CBS article made me a little worried on that, but hopefully that's what happens, especially since we're giving up Chris Young here.

 

But now I'm going to propose something here with Jon Garland. Miguel Tejada. That's right, you can start calling me crazy right now. But if right now we offered, Jon Garland and Joe Crede or Juan Uribe plus a prospect (would have to be top 5) for Tejada, don't you think that's the best offer the O's would have received so far?

 

And it's actually do-able payroll wise. Garland will make 7-8M in 2006 if he goes thru arbitration. Crede prob 3-4M, and Uribe makes about that, so we only take an extra 1 or 2M. I extremely doubt something like this will occur, but if you're looking at possible trade scenarios for Jon Garland, with the current market, and what teams have, Miggy Tejada looks like a pretty damn good fit.

 

Now do I like the trade? Well it's going to depend on a number of factors. How good of a player Chris Young turns into (I'm guessing he could eventually be a monster at Chase Field), the reliever we're giving up (I think Baj or Munoz possibly), what we get for Jon Garland, and how Vazquez does for us over the next 3 seasons compared to Jon Garland for what they're making etc.

 

I love Tejada as much as the next guy and I think he was given too much crap, but with Tejada onboard, I think that's just too many personalities on the team.

[SSH2005]

Doesn't the air in Arizona also mess with a pitcher's breaking stuff?

[GreatScott82]

IMO Vazquez is our 5th starter. How can our 5th starter be our highest paid pitcher? I really hope AZ pays some of his lucrative contract.

[DBAHO]

Someone has to be willing to give up talent in exchange for pitching.

Teams that come to mind, Baltimore, Seattle, Texas, the Dodgers and the Reds.

[GreatScott82]

And for those who got there wish- we officially have 4 starters in our 2007 rotation: Buerhle, Garcia, Vazquez and BMac. Now its a matter of having Contreras commiting now that we know Garland wont.

[nitetrain8601]

Doesn't the air in Arizona also mess with a pitcher's breaking stuff?

 

Yeah, something about it makes all breaking stuff less effective. That's why when McCarthy's curve was working well last year in ST, people were raving about him.

[daa84]

Yeah, something about it makes all breaking stuff less effective. That's why when McCarthy's curve was working well last year in ST, people were raving about him.

actually it shouldnt...phoenix is not up in teh mountains like tucson is. arizona's ball park is a fairly nuetral park, favors pitchers slightly. but the thin air doesnt exist there. Tucson is a different story and that is why the sox want to move out of there

[nitetrain8601]

Which, when you consider any possible 6-man rotation, lends credence to the White Sox trading Garland now. Are you going to trade him now, with a full year of service under a team, or midseason?  If you believe is value is lessened now, just wait until June. I don't believe Williams has a rotation set in mind to battle possible injuries (Garcia--WBC). And neither do I believe McCarthy deserves to be in the bullpen. He'll be lucky to work more than 3 innings in any one game he pitches. Don't do this to him.

 

Where's the Kenny Williams' of the league? Where's the person willing to overpay? Someone has to be willing to give up talent in exchange for pitching.

 

Kenny Williams is a smart man who knows what he's doing. I don't but this whole, "McCarthy doesn't deserve this" jargin. McCarthy in the pen would be excellent for us because he would still get his time in. You act like we've never thrown someone in the bullpen and let them start as well. Look at Buehrle. He was a bullpen arm for us in 2000 and started in 2001. I like my pitching staff to be deep. Without McCarthy we have no insurance just in case 1 memeber of the staff goes down.

[hitlesswonder]

You've got to remember, Chase Field is one of the best hitter's parks in all of baseball right now.

 

His road ERA was 4.40 with a .280 BAA and 19 HRs allowed (he had 16 at home). Chase may not have helped him, but it wasn't his only problem last year. Pitching at the Cell and in the AL doesn't make me optimistic.

 

Baseball is filled with under-performing pitchers who star pitching coaches thought they could fix and failed (Kris Benson with the Mets and Rick Peterson just to name one). I hope it works out for the Sox.

Edited December 14, 2005 by hitlesswonder

[Rowand44]

Yeah, something about it makes all breaking stuff less effective. That's why when McCarthy's curve was working well last year in ST, people were raving about him.

Thin air.

[3E8]

Kenny Williams is a smart man who knows what he's doing. I don't but this whole, "McCarthy doesn't deserve this" jargin. McCarthy in the pen would be excellent for us because he would still get his time in. You act like we've never thrown someone in the bullpen and let them start as well. Look at Buehrle. He was a bullpen arm for us in 2000 and started in 2001. I like my pitching staff to be deep. Without McCarthy we have no insurance just in case 1 memeber of the staff goes down.

That's kind of the path Garland entered on. He started about a dozen games the first year, worked a couple games out of the pen. Second season he worked more out of the pen than he did start games. I think if the young pitcher is meant to be a starter, don't retard development for his future in that role by sticking him in the pen without regular starts. Maybe a commitment to Garland's future years ago would've let us have one more year of the 'new' Jon.

[hi8is]

oh while we're dreaming... how about garland for manny rameriz

 

HAHA

 

never happening

but...

 

move pods to center....

 

1. Pods

2. Uribe

3. Thome

4. Rameriz

5. Konerko

6. Dye

7. AJ

8. Crede

9. Anderson

 

 

that line up is just plain stupid sick

hah

 

to bad mannys a nutcase

[Rowand44]

This trade just got much worse.

 

According to Newsday, the Diamondbacks will receive Luis Vizcaino along with Chris Young and Orlando Hernandez from the White Sox for Javier Vazquez.

[fathom]

This trade just got much worse.

 

According to Newsday, the Diamondbacks will receive Luis Vizcaino along with Chris Young and Orlando Hernandez from the White Sox for Javier Vazquez.

 

No surprise there, as Vizcaino was rumored to possibly be traded to Arizona last season. I'm not too worried about losing Viz.

[hi8is]

Vizcaino

 

 

hummmmmmmmmm

 

 

hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

 

hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

 

 

 

hopefully their wrong

if not a couple of FA arms are coming to our BP

[fathom]

BTW, may I just add that I really hope KW has a plan for what he's doing, and what upcoming moves he's going to have to make. Our bullpen needs one or two arms, and I hope he made this deal knowing what he was going to do with Garland/Contreras.

[daa84]

Vizcaino

hummmmmmmmmm

hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

hopefully their wrong

if not a couple of FA arms are coming to our BP

if this is true we made a bad decision with our pen. our pen is now alot worse off than last year....no marte no viz a big question mark with hermansons health leaves politte jenks cotts as the only sure things. i hope KW knows what he is doing and gets us anotehr reliever

[hi8is]

the title of the article is also

:

"Mets lose Vazquez to White Sox"

 

 

who knows how accurate they really are =P

 

 

oh, i get it.... news day is a NY site and they are pissed we traded for vazquez and not us.

Edited December 14, 2005 by hi8is

[Rowand44]

No surprise there, as Vizcaino was rumored to possibly be traded to Arizona last season.  I'm not too worried about losing Viz.

Viz was solid, he was some nice added depth. This helps make the money issue a little closer that's probably why he was tossed in. I think this just about guarantees that Jon won't be traded unless it's for extra pitching. Brandon will need to be in the pen now.

[fathom]

the title of the article is also

:

"Mets lose Vazquez to White Sox"

who knows how accurate they really are =P

 

That's the title of it because the Mets were also in the hunt for Vazquez.

[hi8is]

stop raping my mind.

 

also from the news day article:

"In return for Vazquez and money"

 

so we get cash supposedly

Edited December 14, 2005 by hi8is

[fathom]

Viz was solid, he was some nice added depth.  This helps make the money issue a little closer that's probably why he was tossed in.  I think this just about guarantees that Jon won't be traded unless it's for extra pitching.  Brandon will need to be in the pen now.

 

Even though he's nuts, Tavarez is still an option for an arm in the pen. I disagree with you about Garland's future, and think that he needs to be traded.

[SSH2005]

This trade just got much worse.

 

According to Newsday, the Diamondbacks will receive Luis Vizcaino along with Chris Young and Orlando Hernandez from the White Sox for Javier Vazquez.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Not a big loss, IMO. Vizcaino was the reliever version of El Duque. Vizcaino was also eligible for arbitration and would have been due for a raise on his $1.3 million salary of last season. Vizcaino had a 1.47 WHIP, 5.52 K/9, and 3.72 BB/9 last season.

Edited December 14, 2005 by SSH2005

[fathom]

I doubt I'm the only one happy to get rid of Duque and Viz. They were clearly out two worst pitchers that we sent out to the mound on a consistent basis. And might I be the first in this thread to say that Baj shouldn't be considered a legit fill-in for our bullpen holes. He's shown nothing at the MLB level to suggest he can be a quality reliever.