WCSox Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(sayitaintso @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 03:48 PM) At stanford they use metal bats because it is college, so the difference is huge from metal to wood. He was injured so he can't play, after he came back he went almost straight to AAA after a whopping 29 games in rookie, A, and AA ball. I would defenantly consider that being rushed. That's a weak excuse. MANY players go through four or five years of college without needing an additional four years to adjust to using wooden bats. QUOTE(sayitaintso @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 03:49 PM) They traded takatsu because they believed he could do it. They traded Takatsu because he was getting shelled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSH2005 Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 (edited) They traded takatsu because they believed he could do it. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yep, the Sox traded Shingo (a proven player because of his 2004 season just like Willy Taveras and his 2005 season) because they thought that the unproven player Bobby Jenks would be better. Funny how that works out, huh? Edited December 31, 2005 by SSH2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(WCSox @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 04:48 PM) If given the choice, yes, you should. Do you think that they would've gone with Jenks had Hermanson not had back problems? Jenks would have been called up, he probably wouldn't have closed, but it is another example of a guy with no major league track record getting the job done. Anderson can get the job done. If he doesn't KW will make a move and bring in someone far better than Willy Taveras. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sayitaintso Posted December 31, 2005 Author Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(WCSox @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 04:51 PM) That's a weak excuse. MANY players go through four or five years of college without needing an additional four years to adjust to using wooden bats. They traded Takatsu because he was getting shelled. Some people can't make the transition from metal to wood. And that was part of why they released him, and they had to have a back up plan for someone to replace him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 03:52 PM) Yep, the Sox traded Shingo (a proven player because of his 2004 season just like Willy Taveras) because they thought that the unproven player Bobby Jenks would be better. Funny how that works out, huh? They traded Shingo after only 31 appearances and a disasterous 5.91 ERA. And, IIRC, Hermanson was still the closer at that point. Comparing Shingo's performance to Taveras' is just silly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSH2005 Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 (edited) They traded Shingo after only 31 appearances and a disasterous 5.91 ERA. And, IIRC, Hermanson was still the closer at that point. Comparing Shingo's performance to Taveras' is just silly. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> But your argument is that Willy Taveras is a "proven player" because of his one good season (2005). Shingo was also good for only one season (2004). Couldn't Taveras very well suck in 2006 just like Shingo did in 2005? A "proven player" is a player who has put up more than one good season. Edited December 31, 2005 by SSH2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(WCSox @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 04:54 PM) They traded Shingo after only 31 appearances and a disasterous 5.91 ERA. And, IIRC, Hermanson was still the closer at that point. Comparing Shingo's performance to Taveras' is just silly. But Shingo's ERA in 2004 was stellar, so by your definition it shows he should still be far more effective than a guy like Jenks who replaced him who never pitched above AA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSH2005 Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 ^^^^^^^^^^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 03:55 PM) But your argument is that Willy Taveras is a "proven player" because of his one good season (2005). Shingo was also good for only one season (2004). Couldn't Taveras very well suck in 2006 just like Shingo did in 2005? Sure, but Taveras isn't at the tail end of his career. The chance of his skills declining quickly is significantly less. It's been real fun, guys, but you're not going to change my mind. Have a Happy New Year's Eve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sayitaintso Posted December 31, 2005 Author Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 04:55 PM) But your argument is that Willy Taveras is a "proven player" because of his one good season (2005). Shingo was also good for only one season (2004). Couldn't Taveras very well suck in 2006 just like Shingo did in 2005? A "proven player" is a player who has put up more than one good season. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sayitaintso Posted December 31, 2005 Author Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(WCSox @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 04:57 PM) Sure, but Taveras isn't at the tail end of his career. The chance of his skills declining quickly is significantly less. It's been real fun, guys, but you're not going to change my mind. Have a Happy New Year's Eve. We're not trying to get you to change your mind, just to shut up and let it be already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSH2005 Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 Not to mention the fact that Taveras's 2005 season really wasn't all that great. Well, it was great if you only look at things like AVG and SB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 04:55 PM) But your argument is that Willy Taveras is a "proven player" because of his one good season (2005). Shingo was also good for only one season (2004). Couldn't Taveras very well suck in 2006 just like Shingo did in 2005? A "proven player" is a player who has put up more than one good season. And when you look at Taveras' one season, it isn't all that stellar. Its not like they are making room for him in Cooperstown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 04:59 PM) Not to mention the fact that Taveras's 2005 season really wasn't all that great. Well, it was great if you only look at things like AVG and SB. Beat me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSH2005 Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 Beat me. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Sox Josh Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 What is the point of trading Contreras unless it is for an impact player? I mean honestly. I think having Contreras for 1 more season gives the Sox a better shot at repeating instead of having a Brandon McCarthy in the 5th spot. Let Contreras walk and in 2007 have Brandon be your 5th starter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(qwerty @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 01:10 PM) What are we really looking for from our centerfielder this year? Either way anderson is very good defensively. He will be one of our three fastest guys... he is a good base runner... just not a base stealer. He will struggle with the bat but in the end all that the sox are looking for is really good defense from him, which they will get. This season Anderson won't be much different than Arow was last season. Arow will be better offensively and defensively, but over the long haul Anderson is going to be the better player, imo. He's got the ability to be similar to Torri Hunter (in fact I think they have similar swings). However, those pencilling him to put up these amazing numbers, well I think they are wrong. For some reason people always expect rookies to come in and live up to there hype. They will develop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 01:14 PM) You don't waste a top prospect for a full season in the majors as a fourth outfielder. You may as well keep him at AAA if that's the scenario. Why not ease a player into a situation. With Ozzie the 4th outfielder gets tons of Ab's and it takes pressure off the youngster. That said I'm not a proponent of this trade. I'd rather stick with Anderson over the long haul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(sayitaintso @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 02:24 PM) Are you serious? Ya, it was one of the big reasons he gets ripped as much as he did. The kid had talent, lots of it, but he refused to work and was hitting the bong all the time. He thought he was great and wasn't willing to go out and do the things it takes to become a good ballplayer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(White Sox Josh @ Jan 1, 2006 -> 10:23 AM) What is the point of trading Contreras unless it is for an impact player? I mean honestly. I think having Contreras for 1 more season gives the Sox a better shot at repeating instead of having a Brandon McCarthy in the 5th spot. Let Contreras walk and in 2007 have Brandon be your 5th starter. If you can upgrade your bullpen when you currently have holes to fill in it, and get a top prospect or two in the deal, KW's probably gonna take that oppurtunity. We won't get 2 draft picks for Contreras if he bolts, so KW may want to get at least some compensation for him, and it opens up the payroll for some trade deadline acquisitions. The Sox have just got to decide whether or not it's better to keep Jose, or to trade him and possibly improve the bullpen and in the long - term. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 02:30 PM) The Yankees are contenders every year and have the largest payroll in baseball and even they went with the completely unproven Robinson Cano at second base. We don't even have half the Yankees' payroll so it would make even more sense for us to try the unproven Brian Anderson. That kind of refutes your whole point, doesn't it? Technically I thought Womack was going to play 2nd (or maybe they planned on him playing in the OF) but he stunk and Cano eventually replaced him. Cano didn't start the year as the starter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawnhillegas Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 all ive learned in reading this thread is that WCSox has a man crush on willie taveras and that juan pierre and sammy sosa have the best arms in baseball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 QUOTE(sayitaintso @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 02:42 PM) the only time he played more than 15 GAMES for a minor league team was in 2002. He missed all of 2001. No, he spent all of 01 ripping up the Southern League putting up awesome numbers with the Barons. The Baseball Cube just doesn't have his 01 stats in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 Just a FWIW on Taveras. The guy had a .325 OBP in 2005 with a 103/25 K/BB ratio. Aaron Rowand in 2005 had a .329 OBP. Don't forget in 2005, Rowand was a main target of the Sox fans anger for not performing better then they should on offense. Basically from those 2, all Taveras offers you are some extra stolen bases. Anderson can be a Jacque Jones like player, and at the Cell he could probably hit at least 15-20 HR's for 2006. Sure he'll K a lot, but there's a reason KW kept him and traded Chris Young, they like him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 QUOTE(shawnhillegas @ Dec 31, 2005 -> 03:57 PM) all ive learned in reading this thread is that WCSox has a man crush on willie taveras and that juan pierre and sammy sosa have the best arms in baseball. And of course that Arnie Munoz is the best prospect in baseball or thats what were all passing on to the Orioles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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