Recruiting Thread

[greasywheels121]

Sorry, now I understand what you were trying to say.

 

My point was that there was speculation for a long time about Gordon, when Sampson became the coach. There's a blog post in there in the July archives discussing the matter.

 

I'm sure if you look in this thread, from the time Sampson was hired from the time EJ committed, you'll see plenty of discussion on the topic. Illinois had to be curious about what was going on, but EJ definitely put them in a bad spot to where they couldn't really prepare well either way.

 

I honestly bought EJ's byline the whole time, because I wasn't expecting him to come here at all (despite all the stories and visits), until he committed on Midnight Madness.

[fathom]

I dont see how an unbiased observer can believe any of the bulls*** coming from the Gordon camp.

 

Even the old Indiana articles paint the picture horribly for him.

 

That's what I'm saying.....the fault should go totally towards the Gordon family, and Sampson doesn't deserve the hate he's received.

 

Sorry, now I understand what you were trying to say.

 

My point was that there was speculation for a long time about Gordon, when Sampson became the coach. There's a blog post in there in the July archives discussing the matter.

 

I'm sure if you look in this thread, from the time Sampson was hired from the time EJ committed, you'll see plenty of discussion on the topic. Illinois had to be curious about what was going on, but EJ definitely put them in a bad spot to where they couldn't really prepare well either way.

 

Justin Young, one of the best sources when it comes to recruiting, was one of the first to report from the summer camps that Gordon has reopened his recruitment. H

[thedoctor]

That's what I'm saying.....the fault should go totally towards the Gordon family, and Sampson doesn't deserve the hate he's received.

 

i would agree with this. although i think sampson could have handled it better (even he's acknowledged he probably should have called weber) i don't think he can be blamed for pursuing the situation, particularly after senior asked for him to recruit his son.

[Soxbadger]

Yeah thats my basic point that Weber was put in a terrible position. When your recruit is saying: "Im committed coach dont worry", what can you do. If you start to believe the internet rumors etc, then you look like you dont believe the player. If he really wasnt considering reopening his committment, maybe it makes him change his mind because he will feel that the coach isnt 100% behind him and doesnt believe in him.

 

The only thing I dont like about Sampson is he could have told Weber out of respect. Its not a rule, its not necessary, and its my own opinion. I feel that if a call had been made to Illinois to the extent of:

 

"Hey Gordon is interested because Im a new coach at Indiana, as you understand I have to recruit this player. Im gonna try my best to take him from you, so if you want make back up plans."

 

For example if Weber had been fired while a guy like Collins was in Illinois, the coach would have had to recruit him even if he was already committed to KU. The failure to go after such a big recruit would be a disaster. I think that most fans of college sports understand this reality, I just believe that there was a better way to handle this situation.

 

Not like I really care as Gordon on Illinois or Indiana probably poses the same threat to Wisconsin.

[hitlesswonder]

I dont see how an unbiased observer can believe any of the bulls*** coming from the Gordon camp.

 

Even the old Indiana articles paint the picture horribly for him.

 

Exactly what did Gordon do wrong? He's a 18 year-old kid that saw a better opportunity and he took it. He didn't break a legal contract. I, for one, have no trouble believeing the Illinois coaching staff knew he was reconsidering Indiana. Gordon says he was upfront with them; I've never heard Weber say that he wasn't. The bottom line is that if the Illinois coaching staff had made Illinois a more attractive destination, Gordon would have gone there. The fact that all Illinois has to replace him is a 3 star recruit is on Weber, not Gordon. It would be nice if Illini fans could simply respect Gordon's decision.

[WHarris1]

The fact that all Illinois has to replace him is a 3 star recruit is on Weber, not Gordon.

I said I made my last post, and then some bulls*** like this is thrown out there. Ugh.

 

How the f*** can you honestly expect a 4-5 star player wait around until 2 months before LOI day to commit to a program when there is a 5 star guy (Gordon) already there ahead of them?

[Palehosefan]

Here is an interesting quote from the Gordon recruitment in early March of last year...

 

"How committed is Eric Gordon to the University of Illinois? “Well, I’m 100% committed. But like right now, “they” the people at Indiana, are calling me a lot. They are telling me that Steve Alford is coming next year and I should think about that. But I’m going to Illinois. The Illinois coaches have been good to me"

 

Sampson just turned up the Indiana recruitment 10 notches, legal, ethical, or not.

[thedoctor]

Gordon says he was upfront with them; I've never heard Weber say that he wasn't. The bottom line is that if the Illinois coaching staff had made Illinois a more attractive destination, Gordon would have gone there. The fact that all Illinois has to replace him is a 3 star recruit is on Weber, not Gordon. It would be nice if Illini fans could simply respect Gordon's decision.

 

this shows a real lack of understanding of what happened in this situation, so i'm hesitant to even address it.

 

what i will say is that there is no way weber can come out and comment on this situation. if he comes out and rips the gordon's that becomes a tool for anyone who is ever recruiting against illinois. frankly, weber needs no more recruiting problems then he already has.

[greasywheels121]

Here is an interesting quote from the Gordon recruitment in early March of last year...

 

"How committed is Eric Gordon to the University of Illinois? “Well, I’m 100% committed. But like right now, “they” the people at Indiana, are calling me a lot. They are telling me that Steve Alford is coming next year and I should think about that. But I’m going to Illinois. The Illinois coaches have been good to me"

 

Sampson just turned up the Indiana recruitment 10 notches, legal, ethical, or not.

 

All that says to me is that Alford wasn't going to be the coach that was going to woo Gordon to IU. I know I wasn't excited about the prospects of Alford being IU's coach.

 

I never liked the idea of Alford coming here. And Alford's latest move is more reason for him to never end up back here.

[Soxbadger]

Im not an Illini fan.

 

Do you not see the "Soxbadger" and Bucky the Badger at the the Cell?

 

Gordon didnt do anything wrong by changing his mind.

 

Lying in an article to try and make yourself look good and everyone else look bad is not "doing something right", and I would say it is "doing something wrong."

 

Gordon is not going to Illinois, does he really need to create more trouble for them?

 

Seems like he is just trying to cover his own ass and try and create more problems for Illinois.

Edited March 28, 2007 by Soxbadger

[hitlesswonder]

Lieing in an article to try and make yourself look good and everyone else look bad is not "doing something right", and I would say it is "doing something wrong."

 

I agree -- if he is lying, that's not admirable. I'm just not sure he is.

[thedoctor]

also, let me be clear here. i have no animosity toward gordon. he's a fantastic player and will be a great addition to indiana's team.

 

i totally get the fact that he grew up rooting for indiana, has a bunch of friends there, and only didn't commit because he was not interested in playing for mike davis. i get all that.

 

but, as i've said already, people i know who are close to the situation and have no reason to lie say that neither gordon nor his father were at all straight with weber at any point of the process. weber took them at their word since they'd had a relationship dating back to gordon being in grammar school. and he got burned for that. hopefully he learned a lesson.

 

but again, i wish gordon well except for when he plays illinois. hopefully he learned something from this whole process too.

[hitlesswonder]

this shows a real lack of understanding of what happened in this situation, so i'm hesitant to even address it.

 

what i will say is that there is no way weber can come out and comment on this situation. if he comes out and rips the gordon's that becomes a tool for anyone who is ever recruiting against illinois. frankly, weber needs no more recruiting problems then he already has.

 

I'm glad you did address it -- the fact that Weber can't be candid about what happened is a good point. I don't know what happened in the recruiting process. I just wish that the media and fans wouldn't cast Gordon's move as some sort of terrible betrayal. I actually feel bad for the guy. The amount of money at stake in the recruitment process drives people to behave in pretty apalling ways, and I imagine Gordon and his family were under tremendous pressure and just wanted the best possible situation for him.

Edited March 28, 2007 by hitlesswonder

[CanOfCorn]

also, let me be clear here. i have no animosity toward gordon. he's a fantastic player and will be a great addition to indiana's team.

 

i totally get the fact that he grew up rooting for indiana, has a bunch of friends there, and only didn't commit because he was not interested in playing for mike davis. i get all that.

 

but, as i've said already, people i know who are close to the situation and have no reason to lie say that neither gordon nor his father were at all straight with weber at any point of the process. weber took them at their word since they'd had a relationship dating back to gordon being in grammar school. and he got burned for that. hopefully he learned a lesson.

 

but again, i wish gordon well except for when he plays illinois. hopefully he learned something from this whole process too.

 

 

Weber was between a rock and a hard place with this situation. If he "knew" and started to court Gordon harder, then other schools would probably realize that Gordon was wavering. If he "knew" and looked for a replacement and Gordon found out, then he might be like, "well, I guess you don't need me all that much." Or what actually happened can happen.

 

Sampson SHOULD have called Weber. He didn't HAVE to. So that's the blame I put on Sampson, especially since he's new to the Big Ten. I don't think that sat well with other BT coaches. As for Gordon, I don't blame him, like we've said, he's 18. I blame is family. They said he was committed when he wasn't. It reminds me of Jerry Maguire and Cush. "My word is oak." What a crock. For the sake of ALL schools, they need to change this process.

[aboz56]

From July 8th:

 

Q: There are rumors floating around about your recruitment. Are you still solid with Illinois?

 

GORDON: Yeah, I am still solid with Illinois, but I am thinking about Indiana too. I am giving them a look. At this point, nothing has changed.

[nitetrain8601]

From July 8th:

 

Q: There are rumors floating around about your recruitment. Are you still solid with Illinois?

 

GORDON: Yeah, I am still solid with Illinois, but I am thinking about Indiana too. I am giving them a look. At this point, nothing has changed.

 

I remember reading this before.

 

 

But over everything else...

 

WHO GIVES A CRAP ABOUT ERIC GORDON?!

[SleepyWhiteSox]

All parties deserve blame, but ultimately weber lost him. And with his track record with elite recruits, it's not crazy to assume that he may have had some missteps or not done what was necessary to hold onto gordon.

 

The excuse that weber is not to blame at all since he's dealing with immature teenagers who change their minds and are easily swayed can only go so far because that's what exactly what recruiting is.

 

He's a good coach and he's still bringing in pretty solid players, but some criticism should fall on his shoulders for not capitalizing on the succes of a couple of seasons ago and turning that into top recruiting classes. He did swing and miss on a few attainable elite recruits, so that made the gordon situation look a whole lot worse.

 

 

I only hope weber's troubles can maybe give Coach Wainwright a little recruiting edge when recruiting the same player.

[thedoctor]

All parties deserve blame, but ultimately weber lost him. And with his track record with elite recruits, it's not crazy to assume that he may have had some missteps or not done what was necessary to hold onto gordon.

 

The excuse that weber is not to blame at all since he's dealing with immature teenagers who change their minds and are easily swayed can only go so far because that's what exactly what recruiting is.

 

He's a good coach and he's still bringing in pretty solid players, but some criticism should fall on his shoulders for not capitalizing on the succes of a couple of seasons ago and turning that into top recruiting classes. He did swing and miss on a few attainable elite recruits, so that made the gordon situation look a whole lot worse.

I only hope weber's troubles can maybe give Coach Wainwright a little recruiting edge when recruiting the same player.

 

who here has said weber is not to blame?

[JuiceCruz16]

DePaul is also recruiting him. I believe he's friends with and played AAU with one of our incoming guys from indiana, Bizoukas. Haven't seen him play, but if he's good, hopefully we're still top 3 for him.

 

Oh yeah, if anybody from indiana had seen Bizoukas (PG from munster) play, I'd be interesting in hearing what people think of him. Obviously not as highly ranked as our top 30 guys Dar Tucker and Mac Koshwal, but DePaul does need a guy who can develop into a smart, efficient PG.

I've seen Bizoukas plenty over the past 3 years. He is a gritty, hard nosed, intelligent point guard. He actually had a fade away 15 footer rim out at the buzzer to beat East Chicago in the sectionals and spoil their great state championship run before it even started. He pulled an Eric Gordon by skipping out of his verbal to Northern Iowa to go to DePaul. I like his game, but he will be hard pressed to play in the Big East. I think it would have takin him at least a few years to play at No. Iowa. His game is penetration and making good decisions. Average shooter at best, his high basketball I.Q. is his strong suit.

 

As for East Chicago and Angel Garcia, I see him all the time. He is extremly skilled for a big man. He has a pure jump shot up to 20 feet, handles the ball like a guard, at 6'11. He is terribly raw as a low post player though, well he doesn't show much intrest in playing on the block. He is a typical European type big man and his upside is HUGE! He is a sophmore academically, so prep school is a given after next season. He is also just learning english so grades are a question as well. Pro teams from Europe are sniffing around him already also. Pittino and many others have been hard on him for a while now.

 

E'twaun Moore vs. Eric Gordon was fun to watch. EJ is spactaculr and as good a guard as I've seen come out in a long time, but E'twaun is so solid at every phase of the game he is going to be an impact player in the big 10 right away. He just was named to 3rd team Parade All-American and it is well deserved. E.C. played great to beat North Central. Garcia (25 pts 9 reb.), Moore (28pts. 5reb, 5assist) and 6'4 280 big 10 football recruit Kiwann Short, my pick for game MVP (24pts 10reb.) were too much for N. Central to match.

Edited March 29, 2007 by JuiceCruz16

[SleepyWhiteSox]

who here has said weber is not to blame?

 

Well, by agreeing that the gordon family deserves full blame, that's what it sounds like, but I meant weber loyalists in general. Plenty of weber supporters on other boards and probably on here have used that type of argument to combat all the criticism he gets.

 

 

I've seen Bizoukas plenty over the past 3 years. He is a gritty, hard nosed, intelligent point guard. He actually had a fade away 15 footer rim out at the buzzer to beat East Chicago in the sectionals and spoil their great state championship run before it even started. He pulled an Eric Gordon by skipping out of his verbal to Northern Iowa to go to DePaul. I like his game, but he will be hard pressed to play in the Big East. I think it would have takin him at least a few years to play at No. Iowa. His game is penetration and making good decisions. Average shooter at best, his high basketball I.Q. is his strong suit.

 

As for East Chicago and Angel Garcia, I see him all the time. He is extremly skilled for a big man. He has a pure jump shot up to 20 feet, handles the ball like a guard, at 6'11. He is terribly raw as a low post player though, well he doesn't show much intrest in playing on the block. He is a typical European type big man and his upside is HUGE! He is a sophmore academically, so prep school is a given after next season. He is also just learning english so grades are a question as well. Pro teams from Europe are sniffing around him already also. Pittino and many others have been hard on him for a while now.

 

Thanks a lot. DePaul needs high basketball-IQ players, particularly at PG, but I was hoping he was a shooter too.

 

How's his speed and quickness? Hopefully good if he's a penetrator.

[JuiceCruz16]

Well, by agreeing that the gordon family deserves full blame, that's what it sounds like, but I meant weber loyalists in general. Plenty of weber supporters on other boards and probably on here have used that type of argument to combat all the criticism he gets.

Thanks a lot. DePaul needs high basketball-IQ players, particularly at PG, but I was hoping he was a shooter too.

 

How's his speed and quickness? Hopefully good if he's a penetrator.

He's not blow your socks off quick, but he is deceptive and knows how to turn the corner on most defenders. He is a capable shooter, it's just not anything special. E. Chicago laid off him and almost dared him to shoot it taking away his penetration to create for others, and he struggeled. Good Luck to the Munster kid, and your Blue Demons next year.

[thedoctor]

Well, by agreeing that the gordon family deserves full blame, that's what it sounds like, but I meant weber loyalists in general. Plenty of weber supporters on other boards and probably on here have used that type of argument to combat all the criticism he gets.

 

well there's a lot of blame to go around in this situation, plenty for weber and the gordon's both.

 

again, on this board, the one we are posting on, i haven't seen anyone absolve bruce of blame. if you want to start citing things you see elsewhere we can start holding depaul fans here accountable for some of the absurd things their fans state on other boards. to me, that's a bit weak. i'd prefer to debate the people who are here for the debate, not try to incite further disagreement by citing things no one here is saying.

[SleepyWhiteSox]

well there's a lot of blame to go around in this situation, plenty for weber and the gordon's both.

 

again, on this board, the one we are posting on, i haven't seen anyone absolve bruce of blame. if you want to start citing things you see elsewhere we can start holding depaul fans here accountable for some of the absurd things their fans state on other boards. to me, that's a bit weak. i'd prefer to debate the people who are here for the debate, not try to incite further disagreement by citing things no one here is saying.

 

 

That's what I'm saying.....the fault should go totally towards the Gordon family, and Sampson doesn't deserve the hate he's received.

 

i would agree with this. although i think sampson could have handled it better (even he's acknowledged he probably should have called weber) i don't think he can be blamed for pursuing the situation, particularly after senior asked for him to recruit his son.

 

Just one example, and the same sentiment has come up from illini fans on this board.

[Soxbadger]

Your completely taking that quote out of context, I believe what Fathom was saying:

 

"the fault should go totally towards the Gordon family, and Sampson doesn't deserve the hate he's received."

 

Is that SAMPSON is not at fault. It has nothing to do with Weber at all, and I may be wrong on this but I do not believe that Fathom is even an Illini fan.

[Palehosefan]

http://recruiting.scout.com/2/631282.html

 

Noel Devine finally signs his LOI.