Indians acquire Jason Michaels for Arthur Rhodes

[Chisoxfn]

Why did Philly make this deal? Rhodes is overpaid and he's not effective (hell did he even pitch much for the Tribe last year?)

[Rowand44]

Why did Philly make this deal?  Rhodes is overpaid and he's not effective (hell did he even pitch much for the Tribe last year?)

2 something era last year in about 47 innings.

[Chisoxfn]

2 something era last year in about 47 innings.

Geeze, that was pretty solid. My brain must be a goner cause I pretty much forgot he was on the Tribe.

[Rowand44]

Geeze, that was pretty solid.  My brain must be a goner cause I pretty much forgot he was on the Tribe.

Ha, ya, he was pretty solid last year but then I believe he left the team for a while due to family reasons(not exactly sure about the reason). He was pretty bad in 04 though irrc so we'll see how he does this year.

[jphat007]

Michaels is a downgrade of Crisp. Mota is a BIG downgrade from Rhodes. Marte won't play. I like it.

[Chisoxfn]

Ha, ya, he was pretty solid last year but then I believe he left the team for a while due to family reasons(not exactly sure about the reason).  He was pretty bad in 04 though irrc so we'll see how he does this year.

I'll always remember his bling bling incident. But there was a time where he was one of the best, if not the best, lefty reliever in the game.

 

If he duplicates last years numbers I can't fault Philly at all. They could use some help in the pen, especially when you consider they lost their best reliever (Wagner).

[Rowand44]

I'll always remember his bling bling incident.  But there was a time where he was one of the best, if not the best, lefty reliever in the game.

 

If he duplicates last years numbers I can't fault Philly at all.  They could use some help in the pen, especially when you consider they lost their best reliever (Wagner).

Him and Nelson setting up for Sasaki gave me nightmares when we played Seattle. Lights out.

[SSH2005]

http://cleveland.indians.mlb.com/NASApp/ml...layer_id=121125

 

Rhodes had a 2.08 ERA in 43.1 IP last season.

 

Michaels is a downgrade of Crisp. Mota is a BIG downgrade from Rhodes. Marte won't play. I like it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It's a nice trade for us in 2006 but after that...

[Rowand44]

http://cleveland.indians.mlb.com/NASApp/ml...layer_id=121125

 

Rhodes had a 2.08 ERA in 43.1 IP last season.

It's a nice trade for us in 2006 but after that...

Ya, 43 innings, 47 games, my bad.

[jphat007]

http://cleveland.indians.mlb.com/NASApp/ml...layer_id=121125

 

Rhodes had a 2.08 ERA in 43.1 IP last season.

It's a nice trade for us in 2006 but after that...

 

But after that Marte could suck. Mota could continue to suck and Michaels is probably going to be very mediocre in Jacobs field, while CC will likely still put up a solid average, solid OBP, solid power (especially now in Boston).

 

Marte could also become a superstar. You never know. BUt somehow I doubt the Braves and Indians are two teams that would easily give up a cheap can't miss for CC and Renteria.

 

Really it shouldn't affect us all that much. Unless the Indians get more SP, more dominant bullpen pitching (especially another lefty), and a better bat, I'm not worried for the next few years, and in that time they'll hvae a lot of guys ready for big raises.

[SSH2005]

But after that Marte could suck. Mota could continue to suck and Michaels is probably going to be very mediocre in Jacobs field, while CC will likely still put up a solid average, solid OBP, solid power (especially now in Boston).

 

Marte could also become a superstar. You never know. BUt somehow I doubt the Braves and Indians are two teams that would easily give up a cheap can't miss for CC and Renteria.

 

Really it shouldn't affect us all that much. Unless the Indians get more SP, more dominant bullpen pitching (especially another lefty), and a better bat, I'm not worried for the next few years, and in that time they'll hvae a lot of guys ready for big raises.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Marte may not become a superstar but it wouldn't be too difficult for him to be better than Aaron Boone. I'd rather have Marte waiting in the wings than Josh Fields.

[jackie hayes]

But after that Marte could suck. Mota could continue to suck and Michaels is probably going to be very mediocre in Jacobs field, while CC will likely still put up a solid average, solid OBP, solid power (especially now in Boston).

 

Marte could also become a superstar. You never know. BUt somehow I doubt the Braves and Indians are two teams that would easily give up a cheap can't miss for CC and Renteria.

 

Really it shouldn't affect us all that much. Unless the Indians get more SP, more dominant bullpen pitching (especially another lefty), and a better bat, I'm not worried for the next few years, and in that time they'll hvae a lot of guys ready for big raises.

I don't see why Michaels will "probably...be very mediocre in Jacobs field". I think Crisp will be better, but it's not a huge difference.

 

I don't see how anyone can't be worried by the Indians after the pressure they put on us at the end of last season. They took a big hit to their rotation, the pen is a little worse, but this is still a very good team.

[Rowand44]

I don't see why Michaels will "probably...be very mediocre in Jacobs field".  I think Crisp will be better, but it's not a huge difference.

 

I don't see how anyone can't be worried by the Indians after the pressure they put on us at the end of last season.  They took a big hit to their rotation, the pen is a little worse, but this is still a very good team.

Oh, they're still a very solid team but they've regressed imo and I still think they finish 3rd in this division.

[SSH2005]

Oh, they're still a very solid team but they've regressed imo and I still think they finish 3rd in this division.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I see the Twins finishing in 3rd place. Luis Castillo was a great pickup but Rondell White and Tony Batista? C'mon...

[elrockinMT]

That still doesnt change the fact that I dont think they got a "good RF" like you stated.

 

 

I tend to agree with you on that Tony. I think they have an adequate OF'er, who may be more of a 4th option, but can be an asset either way. He just isn't the MAN in the OF for the Tribe.

[Rowand44]

I see the Twins finishing in 3rd place.  Luis Castillo was a great pickup but Rondell White and Tony Batista?  C'mon...

While Castillo helps, he's not even close to the only reason why I believe Minny will pass Cleveland this year.

[SSH2005]

While Castillo helps, he's not even close to the only reason why I believe Minny will pass Cleveland this year.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The main reason the Twins struggled last season was because of their lack of offense. And I don't think they improved it enough to not stuggle to score runs in 2006.

Edited January 24, 2006 by SSH2005

[ZoomSlowik]

I don't see why Michaels will "probably...be very mediocre in Jacobs field".  I think Crisp will be better, but it's not a huge difference.

 

I don't see how anyone can't be worried by the Indians after the pressure they put on us at the end of last season.  They took a big hit to their rotation, the pen is a little worse, but this is still a very good team.

 

They had better pitching and one of the best stretches to close the season in a long time and still finished with 93 wins. Plus they traded a solid player that was their #2 hitter and are replacing him with a guy that hasn't been a full-time player. Also, Wickman had his best season in years and might not repeat it.

 

They're extremely similar to our teams before last year, only with one fewer major lineup threat and weaker starting pitching. Because of that, they're going to have a tough time winning much more than 90 games this year. On the other hand, the Sox are a team that won 99 games and definitely got some upgrades. The Sox shouldn't have to worry about the other teams in the division unless some things go wrong. They should definitely finish with at least 95 wins unless Thome gets hurt. Even if the pen drops off a bit they should be able to reach that with a deep and talented pitching staff and an improved lineup. The Twins and Indians both will have a tough time reaching that total unless they make some major upgrades between now and then.

[Jordan4life_2007]

I don't see why Michaels will "probably...be very mediocre in Jacobs field".  I think Crisp will be better, but it's not a huge difference.

 

I don't see how anyone can't be worried by the Indians after the pressure they put on us at the end of last season.  They took a big hit to their rotation, the pen is a little worse, but this is still a very good team.

 

They're without a doubt a very good team. But after the magnificent job Kenny has done this off-season, I think we're clearly better.

Edited January 24, 2006 by Jordan4life_2006

[Rowand44]

The main reason the Twins struggled last season was because of their lack of offense.  And I don't think they improved it enough to not stuggle to score runs in 2006.

The Twins were ahead of Cleveland and a half game behind the yankees for the wc when Torii went down for the year. That, Castillo being just an enormous upgrade over anything they had their last year, the combo of Liriano and Baker who I believe will both be in their rotation eventually this season and the fact that I expect Morneau to rebound and Mauer to be a bit better are the reasons I think Minny will be better then the Tribe in 06.

[beck72]

I don't see why Michaels will "probably...be very mediocre in Jacobs field".  I think Crisp will be better, but it's not a huge difference.

 

I don't see how anyone can't be worried by the Indians after the pressure they put on us at the end of last season.  They took a big hit to their rotation, the pen is a little worse, but this is still a very good team.

 

I agree the indians are still a very good team. But there's a huge difference between Crisp and Michaels IMO. Having a one-two of Sizemore and Crisp for years to come would have really given the sox headaches. Michaels isn't anything special.

[3E8]

When Michaels gets 500 AB's he won't produce like he has as a role player in the past but the dropoff from Crisp to Michaels will be minimal. When you factor in that the comparison between Millwood + Elarton and Byrd + Johnson is a wash, I still see the Central going to us or the Indians.

[SSH2005]

Interesting...

Latest News    Jan. 24, 2006 - 5:05 pm et

 

WIP radio in Philadelphia is reporting that the Coco Crisp trade is being held up because Red Sox reliever Guillermo Mota failed his physical.

Concerns about Mota's elbow or shoulder are apparently providing a stumbling block, but they may not kill the deal. There's been talk of Red Sox reliever Manny Delcarmen being involved, with him maybe replacing Mota in the deal. It's also possible that David Riske could be taken out of the trade. If the Indians can get Andy Marte, they shouldn't let the relievers stand in the way. It's just too good of a trade for them. The Phillies would also come away disappointed if the Crisp deal doesn't go down, as they won't be getting Arthur Rhodes in return for Jason Michaels.

[ZoomSlowik]

The Twins were ahead of Cleveland and a half game behind the yankees for the wc when Torii went down for the year.  That, Castillo being just an enormous upgrade over anything they had their last year, the combo of Liriano and Baker who I believe will both be in their rotation eventually this season and the fact that I expect Morneau to rebound and Mauer to be a bit better are the reasons I think Minny will be better then the Tribe in 06.

 

I don't know about all of that. Even if Morneau turns into the monster people thought he would be, their lineup wouldn't have all that much punch. They'd be similar to our offense last year, which isn't exactly a compliment. They just don't have a real #3 or #4 hitter right now. Two of the following 3 have to happen for them to have even an above average lineup: Mauer developing at least 20 homer power, Morneau putting up at least a .270-30-90 type year, or Hunter getting on base a bit more.

 

Plus their pitching isn't exactly dominating. They don't really have a solid compliment for Santana. Radke is their number 2 starter even though he's really only had one good year since 2000. He'd might not even be in our rotation if he were with the Sox. Silva was starting to look decent, but now he's coming off a major injury. Liriano or Baker would have to pitch like a #2 starter for them to keep up, and I really don't see that happening. Also, their pen only has three credible arms, and none of them are lefties.

 

I really don't see them getting past the high 80's in wins unless an awful lot of things go their way. In my book they're a Santana injury away from 4th place.

Edited January 24, 2006 by ZoomSlowik

[Rowand44]

I don't know about all of that. Even if Morneau turns into the monster people thought he would be, their lineup wouldn't have all that much punch. They'd be similar to our offense last year, which isn't exactly a compliment. They just don't have a real #3 or #4 hitter right now. Two of the following 3 have to happen for them to have even an above average lineup: Mauer developing at least 20 homer power, Morneau putting up at least a .270-30-90 type year, or Hunter getting on base a bit more.

 

Plus their pitching isn't exactly dominating. They don't really have a solid compliment for Santana. Radke is their number 2 starter even though he's really only had one good year since 2000. He'd might not even be in our rotation if he were with the Sox. Silva was starting to look decent, but now he's coming off a major injury. Liriano or Baker would have to pitch like a #2 starter for them to keep up, and I really don't see that happening. Also, their pen only has three credible arms, and none of them are lefties.

 

I really don't see them getting past the high 80's in wins unless an awful lot of things go their way. In my book they're a Santana injury away from 4th place.

Besides us and the A's you'll have a hard time finding teams with a better rotation in the AL then the Twins. As far as their bullpen goes, they have 3 absolute studs at the back end, Matt Guerrier who is a solid long reliever, and then they have a bunch of kids who knowing Minny will do just fine as the 5th or 6th relievers out of that pen. Their offense is nothing special but it'll be better then last season and their pitching overall will be better as well imo, they're going to ride their arms all year and I think they win the WC but obviously that's jmo.