witesoxfan Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(DukeNukeEm @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 04:51 PM) Oh and about Grossman, he f***in sucks.. thats UNDENIABLE. He's put up horrible statistics, and if 21 points is supposed to be impressive then we have a bigger problem. I too prefer 13 points against the same exact team with shorter scoring drives. I will say, there is something about Orton's 59.7 passer rating and 9/13 TD/INT ratio that really would make me happy as a Bears fan. (yes, I realize Grossman's passer rating in the 2 games he played was also 59.7, and his TD/INT ratio was technically worse - but atleast he's shown some sign of potential, a little bit of leadership on the field, and somewhat dangerous arm in the past...not being able to perform at 100% after friggin 3 months on the shelf is not something I expect out of a veteran QB, let alone one as young and undeveloped as Grossman) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodAsGould Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Yeah Duke in this thread you really come off as a guy who thinks he knows a lot about football but really knows nothing at all..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 05:09 PM) Yeah Duke in this thread you really come off as a guy who thinks he knows a lot about football but really knows nothing at all..... ^^^^^^^^^ :lolhitting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeNukeEm Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Grossman's QB Rating : 68.8 Orton's QB Rating : 59.7 I'll take the guy who doesnt get hurt every f***in year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeNukeEm Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 BTW: I dont like using QB ratings, but I cant use other stats because Rex Grossman never plays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(DukeNukeEm @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 11:10 PM) Grossman's QB Rating : 68.8 Orton's QB Rating : 59.7 I'll take the guy who doesnt get hurt every f***in year. Duke....you would really rather have Orton than Grossman? The same Orton who all you have to do is put a blitz on, and he'll go down faster than Paris Hilton on a B list celebrity? The same Orton who is a bigger threat to throw the ball to the opposition than he is to his own receiver down the field? The same Orton who not a single player on the team had confidence in? GMAFB....use your eyes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeNukeEm Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396159/gamelogs/2004 1 TD in 3 games v. the following opponents: Minnesota, Green Bay, Detroit. OK, now you can laugh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Ive consistently been a huge Grossman supporter, but please do not hurt your credibility by saying youd rather have Grossman over Young. And to say scouts think he is the 3rd best qb, well scouts thought Ben Roeth was the 3rd best QB in that draft so I guess it must mean its true. Or when scouts thought Tom Brady was a second day player. Young should > Grossman Grossman is > Orton Grossman could be > Young. He just has to show it on the field, people who almost win a heisman as a soph have talent, he just needs to step up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeNukeEm Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Duke....you would really rather have Orton than Grossman? The same Orton who all you have to do is put a blitz on, and he'll go down faster than Paris Hilton on a B list celebrity? The same Orton who is a bigger threat to throw the ball to the opposition than he is to his own receiver down the field? The same Orton who not a single player on the team had confidence in? GMAFB....use your eyes! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I think they both SUCK. But Orton is cheaper to keep around, and at least Orton doesnt always get hurt like Grossman (I'd take that under EXTREME consideration while taking up a backup). Plus, Orton isnt in his 4th year now, and at least may have learned something by playing 15 games as a rookie. I think we need a COMPLETELY new QB in the mix.. I thought we were arguing the backup role for the Bears.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeNukeEm Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Young should > Grossman Grossman is > Orton Grossman could be > Young. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> DJ Shockley could be > Young Brody Croyle could be > Leianrt I dont see your point Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(DukeNukeEm @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 11:14 PM) http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396159/gamelogs/2004 1 TD in 3 games v. the following opponents: Minnesota, Green Bay, Detroit. OK, now you can laugh. Those stats are from 2 seasons ago. Who cares about that? I'll guarantee that if Kyle Orton starts for the Bears for a majority of games in the next few seasons, the Bears won't make the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(Soxbadger @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 11:16 PM) Ive consistently been a huge Grossman supporter, but please do not hurt your credibility by saying youd rather have Grossman over Young. I said I'd rather have Grossman than Young over the next few seasons. In 5 years, who knows who will be better. I just don't think that Vince Young is even close to being an average starter in the NFL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(DukeNukeEm @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 05:14 PM) http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396159/gamelogs/2004 1 TD in 3 games v. the following opponents: Minnesota, Green Bay, Detroit. OK, now you can laugh... ...at the receivers he had to throw to. Bernard Berrian, David Terrell, Justin Gage, and Bobby Wade...Thomas Jones too, who led the team in receptions. Orton atleast had Mush all year, and Bradley as well for a couple of games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Well I was supporting you by saying that Young is better than Grossman, or "should be" because its impossible with 100% accuracy to call any player. Anyways, you have some strong opinions, but your opinion does not mean its true. Ive seen you on other boards talk up Cutler like hes the messiah. I just see Cutler more as a Boller. Time will tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DukeNukeEm Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Those stats are from 2 seasons ago. Who cares about that? I'll guarantee that if Kyle Orton starts for the Bears for a majority of games in the next few seasons, the Bears won't make the playoffs. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> With Rex Grossman at QB we'll never win a Super Bowl. I dont care if we win the division 10 times in a row, I want a CHAMPIONSHIP. Not consistent choking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(DukeNukeEm @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 11:21 PM) With Rex Grossman at QB we'll never win a Super Bowl. I dont care if we win the division 10 times in a row, I want a CHAMPIONSHIP. Not consistent choking. Consistent choking = Bears defense the last two playoff games. I don't even want to think about how ugly that game vs the Panthers would have been if Orton was at QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted January 27, 2006 Author Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(fathom @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 05:02 PM) Considering I'm probably the last person to ever be called a homer, I'm going to call you out on this. All you have to do is use your own f***ing eyes, and you can see that Grossman can be a pretty damn good QB in this league. If both players are healthy and I had to win one game, I would take Grossman over Michael Vick in a heartbeat. Grossman might not make the highlight play, but he's not going to beat his own team like Vick might do. Grossman over Vick? Wow. I know what DukeNukeEm is talking about now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 11:23 PM) Grossman over Vick? Wow. I know what DukeNukeEm is talking about now. I hate Vick. I don't even think Grossman is anything special. Vick is the most overrated player in all of sports. And again, I think my record on soxtalk shows that I'm anything but a homer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Rex Grossman is not the reason we lost against the Panthers. Rex Grossman is not the reason that we did not get to play the Seahawks. If the defense didnt play like high school bench warmers, Rex Grossman is a hero. Blind hate does not make for a good analysis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted January 27, 2006 Author Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(fathom @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 05:24 PM) I hate Vick. I don't even think Grossman is anything special. Vick is the most overrated player in all of sports. And again, I think my record on soxtalk shows that I'm anything but a homer. You hate Vick, that's nice. But you also want to win games. Vick wins games alone. I know he isn't the greatest passer ever, but he could still throw the ball down to Crumpler and he's faster than 90% of the defense in the league. Vick > Schuab >>Grossman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(Soxbadger @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 06:16 PM) Ive consistently been a huge Grossman supporter, but please do not hurt your credibility by saying youd rather have Grossman over Young. He said he'd rather Grossman over Young for the next 3 years, which is really reasonable considering just about all the sensible analysts and people who watch the NFL and College football think that Young will take awhile to adapt to the pros. For this reason, yes, I'd rather Grossman over Young for the next 3 years as well, and hell, since I think Young will be a bust, I'd rather Grossman over Young period. Grossman isn't that good a QB, but is he bad? No. He hasn't had enough playing time to be properly judged, but in his small amount of playing time, he has been impressive in leading the Bears offense. Are his stats amazing? No. Are stats everything? No, watch the damned games. QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 06:09 PM) Yeah Duke in all your posts you really come off as a guy who thinks he knows a lot about football but really knows nothing at all..... Fixed, and yea, thats an extremely true statement. Also, over/under 20 posts before this thread is closed. I'm going with under. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Ive been watching Grossman since he was playing under Spurrier. I think Young could be a better QB than Grossman day 1. I know you think Young will bust, there just does not seem to be any reason to that statement. Here are the projected top 3 QB's stats from last year: CMP ATT YDS CMP% YPA LNG TD INT SACK RAT 283 431 3815 65.7 8.85 67 28 8 17 157.74 212 325 3036 65.2 9.34 75 26 10 13 163.95 273 462 3073 59.1 6.65 47 21 9 23 126.07 Can you decide which one is Young, Leinart, or Cutler just off the numbers? I think you would be suprised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nitetrain8601 Posted January 27, 2006 Author Share Posted January 27, 2006 QUOTE(Soxbadger @ Jan 27, 2006 -> 05:43 PM) Ive been watching Grossman since he was playing under Spurrier. I think Young could be a better QB than Grossman day 1. I know you think Young will bust, there just does not seem to be any reason to that statement. Here are the projected top 3 QB's stats from last year: CMP ATT YDS CMP% YPA LNG TD INT SACK RAT 283 431 3815 65.7 8.85 67 28 8 17 157.74 212 325 3036 65.2 9.34 75 26 10 13 163.95 273 462 3073 59.1 6.65 47 21 9 23 126.07 Can you decide which one is Young, Leinart, or Cutler just off the numbers? I think you would be suprised. Leinart Young Cutler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 (edited) lol I tricked myself yes thats right Im still shocked Young has a better QB rating. Edited January 27, 2006 by Soxbadger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 Young is a good college QB. I don't see his weak passes translating into the pros however, and I don't think he will be nearly as good a scrambler in the pros as he is in college. He has poor throwing mechanics, and hasn't shown consistant accuracy through his entire collegian career. And yea, its Leinart, Young, then Cutler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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