Hypothetical question

[RockRaines]

Kerry Wood has had arm problems throughout his entire career, and has never been as successful as Felix has.

 

He hasnt pitched a full year yet dude. Why the man-crush on felix?

[WhiteSox311]

You would be wrong.  It's not really old but it's definately "older."  I believe 27-29 are usually a player's prime years.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

So your saying that we gave a 30 yr old paul konerko who is past his prime a 5 yr 60 million dollar contract Geeez we screwed up.........Actually i think baseball players have a much longer prime as in say oh 26-33

 

i still say your thinkin of football players cuz they really dont last that long compared to baseball players

Edited March 6, 2006 by WhiteSox311

[ChWRoCk2]

well looking at our team we could use a bullpen arm and outfielder:

 

The following id love on this team:

Duaner Sancehez-young with potential

Bobby Abreu-all around player

Carl Crawford-just imagine crawford pods at the top

mike gonzalez-young pitcher

Carlos Lee-no reason I just really liked carlos

[Elcaballo45]

well looking at our team we could use a bullpen arm and outfielder:

 

The following id love on this team:

Duaner Sancehez-young with potential

Bobby Abreu-all around player

Carl Crawford-just imagine crawford pods at the top

mike gonzalez-young pitcher

Carlos Lee-no reason I just really liked carlos

 

Rock on with your last selection there.

 

Anyway, I would say Pujols obviously, and I really do like Crawford for his potential at that age, and one of my favorite pitchers, with the nastiest sinker in the game, Brandon Webb.

[Dam8610]

He hasnt pitched a full year yet dude.  Why the man-crush on felix?

 

It has nothing to do with a "man-crush". His stuff is pure filth, he's 19 (soon to be 20) years old, and he has never struggled at any level, including times when he's come off of injuries. The fact that he's going to be 20 this season means that if he's as good as he's displayed throughout his entire career (and there's absolutely no reason to expect otherwise, considering his talent and performance record), you're going to get an ace caliber pitcher for 15-20 years barring injury, which is much better than a #3 hitter for 10-15 years IMO.

[Rowand44]

well looking at our team we could use a bullpen arm and outfielder:

 

The following id love on this team:

Duaner Sancehez-young with potential

Bobby Abreu-all around player

Carl Crawford-just imagine crawford pods at the top

mike gonzalez-young pitcher

Carlos Lee-no reason I just really liked carlos

oo, let me play. Lets see, I'd like Johan Santana cause he's good, I'd like Albert Pujols cause he's good, I'd like Ichiro Suzuki cause he's good, and I'd like Eric Gagne cause he's canadian.

 

edit: I'm just giving you s*** by the way, cause I thought we were just picking one player.

Edited March 7, 2006 by Rowand44

[ZoomSlowik]

If I'm picking one player to start a team with, I'm going with Big Al. If I'm picking someone to add to the current White Sox roster, I'd lean toward David Wright or Miguel Cabrera (that one's a tough call). If we didn't already have so many pitchers, I'd give very strong consideration to Johan, Peavy (Don't think he's been mentioned much. I'd love to have a 24 year old ace), and King Felix.

[chitownsportsfan]

King Felix Starts Hot

 

PEORIA, Ariz. — It was a picture-perfect day for the first spring-training game of the year, and a pitcher-perfect outing for Mariners phenom Felix Hernandez.

 

The 19-year-old right-hander threw the first inning in Seattle's 2-2, 10-inning tie against the San Diego Padres on Thursday, striking out the side in order on 13 pitches.

 

Dave Roberts went down swinging. Mike Cameron did, too. Brian Giles looked at his third strike.

 

"I pitched very well," Hernandez said with partial help from an interpreter. "I didn't think I would pitch that well, be in the zone like that."

 

Hernandez knew he was going to pitch just one inning, but needed no help from the interpreter when asked if he would have liked to continue.

 

"Yeah," he said. "Oh, yeah."

 

Of course, nice days are expected here with 135 straight rain-free days, and the future for Hernandez looks just as sunny.

 

Just ask ESPN the Magazine, which has him on the cover of its current issue, with the caption, "Franchise Player Felix Hernandez." So what is Hernandez's goal this season?

 

"Stay healthy," he said. "That is all I need to do is stay healthy."

 

 

This guy was the youngest player to play in MLB during 2005, and only posted an ERA+ of 165. His K/9 was 8.22. His K/W was 3.34. His WHIP was .996. Granted he only pitched 84.3 innings--but this guy is a stud, at 19--those numbers? Unreal. At age 21, Pedro Martinez was signifanctly worse in every statistical category except K/9, and it wasn't be that much. What Pedro has done in the "live player" ERA is also unreal, and he has to be one of the top 5 greatest pichers of all time, with longevity the only thing holding him back from possibly being the best of all time. Felix is already better than Pedro, with more pitches, at an age two years younger.

 

Look at Dwight Gooden's age 20 season, and look at his K/9, K/B, and WHIP stacks up to Felix's. Felix could win the Cy Young this year, he's that good. He's a once in a generation prospect. The only thing stopping him from becoming an all time great would be arm trouble or drugs.

 

It could happen, pitching is a violent motion on the arm and mind, as we all know. However, if it doesn't, Felix is on his way to Cooperstown.

 

There is not one 19 year old in baseball in 2006 that even looks like a potential GOAT, which is why people like myself get a bit excited about his prospects. He could be the "Lebron James" of baseball.

 

Another comparison: Roger Clemens didn't post a WHIP even close to under 1.00 until he was 23. Felix just did it at age 19.

[RockRaines]

I love hearing about prospects who are already destined to be in Cooperstown, because it almost never happens.

[ZoomSlowik]

Felix definitely has a ton of talent, and I'd love to have him on the Sox. However, he definitely still has some issues.

 

One major one is durability. The Mariners have been treating him with kid's gloves for his entire career. They have been extremely concerned with overworking him and causing arm trouble. The most innings he's pitched in a season thus far is a little over 170 (and has only one other season over 150), and they plan to hold him to 200 innings this year, including spring training and any potential post-season play. Eventually he's going to have to have a bigger workload, and he's going to be doing it for the first time in the majors. Also, they've told him not to throw his slider. Once he does start throwing it again, he might be at a higher risk for injury after not throwing it for a while, especially when combined with an increasing workload.

 

Another one is control. At times his walk rate has gotten a little high. It's been over 3 per 9 innings for large chunks of his minor league career, including almost 5 last year in AAA. His WHIP has also been over 1.20 for most of his minor league career. Granted there are some pitchers that are highly successful at that rate, but it will be harder in the majors, and it could go higher with better competition.

 

He's got a good chance to be a great pitcher for a while, but it's far from a sure thing. There's quite a laundry list of players that kicked ass for a year or two at the beginning of their career and couldn't keep it up. It looks like he might be the next Pedro Martinez, but he could also flame out like Dwight Gooden did, or develop arm problems like Kerry Wood.

 

I will say this, he looks like more of a sure thing than anyone to come out in a while. The only one that was even close was Prior, and the only thing that's held him back is injuries.

Edited March 7, 2006 by ZoomSlowik

[RockRaines]

It looks like he might be the next Pedro Martinez, but he could also flame out like Dwight Gooden did, or develop arm problems like Kerry Wood.

Yup. And the people on here slurping him will look just as foolish as every cubs fan who predicted sure greatness for Kerry Wood.

[ZoomSlowik]

Yup.  And the people on here slurping him will look just as foolish as every cubs fan who predicted sure greatness for Kerry Wood.

 

The only way I see him not fufilling his promise is injuries. He's a much more talented pitcher than Wood. His mechanics also seem to be a lot better, he's got better control, and he doesn't have as many mental issues as Wood does.

 

Obviously he could still have a major arm injury, or get a few nagging ones like Prior or Beckett. I doubt that pitching ability is the thing that holds him back though. The walks are of some concern, but Zambrano does pretty well despite a lot of walks, so I don't see why Felix can't do the same thing. It might hurt his ceiling a little though if he doesn't keep it under control. That would just mean that he's more of a Roy Oswalt or Carlos Zambrano than Johan Santana or Pedro Martinez. There aren't all that many pitchers I'd take over Felix right now. He'll probably be a consensus top 10 pitcher in the league by the end of the year.

Edited March 7, 2006 by ZoomSlowik

[RockRaines]

The only way I see him not fufilling his promise is injuries. He's a much more talented pitcher than Wood. His mechanics also seem to be a lot better, he's got better control, and he doesn't have as many mental issues as Wood does.

 

 

Remember, Wood was a very talented pitcher, talented enough to K 20 batters in a single game.

 

Felix has alot of talent, but he hasnt proven it over a full season yet, is still WAY too young to call him a future hall of famer, and could flame out like Gooden no problem.

[ZoomSlowik]

Remember, Wood was a very talented pitcher, talented enough to K 20 batters in a single game.  

 

Felix has alot of talent, but he hasnt proven it over a full season yet, is still WAY too young to call him a future hall of famer, and could flame out like Gooden no problem.

 

Felix is definitely more gifted than Wood though. He has better control, more zip on his fastball, a similar hard curve, and his slider is devastating whenever they let him throw it. Supposedly he's got a decent change too, although I haven't seen it when I've watched him pitch. Wood's major asset in his first year was the slurve that he couldn't throw without destroying his arm. When he had to throw a straight curve and slider, he wasn't as dominant, although he was still pretty good when healthy.

 

I'll agree that it's a little pre-mature to start carving his bust in Cooperstown, but he should be a very good pitcher. As I just posted, I don't think it will be his pitching ability that holds him back. It's going to have to be injury issues. Gooden was a bit of a rarity. He's the only pitcher with that kind of talent that I can think of that just fell off without serious injury issues. The only other relatively healthy guys that fell off that I can think of are Fernando Valenzueza and Hideo Nomo, and they didn't have anywhere near the kind of stuff that Gooden had and Felix currently possesses.

Edited March 7, 2006 by ZoomSlowik

[CWSGuy406]

Felix is definitely more gifted than Wood though. He has better control, more zip on his fastball, a similar hard curve, and his slider is devastating whenever they let him throw it. Supposedly he's got a decent change too, although I haven't seen it when I've watched him pitch. Wood's major asset in his first year was the slurve that he couldn't throw without destroying his arm. When he had to throw a straight curve and slider, he wasn't as dominant, although he was still pretty good when healthy.

 

King Felix is 'as-advertised'. If you get the chance to watch him, do so as much as possible -- if you're a baseball fan, I'm sure you will appreciate his nasty stuff, yet great ability to paint the corners.

 

Here's an excerpt from the 'Top 2006 Sophomores' article at The Baseball Analysts:

 

Let's start with his four-seam fastball. At 96-98 mph, his velocity alone makes it extaordinarily hard to hit. This isn't a Matt Anderson "Hit Me" fastball. Throwing it with movement, it draws stares more often than not...

 

If he bores of peppering the zone in the high-90s, he can easily switch to his two-seam fastball, the sinker that caused worms and gophers to leave the grounds of Safeco Field en masse. This pitch is nearly always thrown at the knees and, with late downward movement, it is a groundball machine...

 

As good as his two high-velocity options can be, neither is his best pitch. In fact, you would be hard pressed to find a better pitch in baseball than the Royal Curveball. Thrown as a classic 12-to-6 over-the-top curve and coming in at 82-86 miles per hour, Felix's curve is the kind of breaking ball that makes batters wobble...

 

And, just for fun, Felix also has a change-up that, on its own merits, is one of the best in the American League. A true straight change, he drops it in at around 84 mph, usually just below the knees of a batter who has already completed his swing by the time the ball actually gets to the plate.

 

The thing is, none of this is overexaggerated. From the starts I saw him in last year, he can place ANY of these pitches wherever he wants.

 

That's not to say that I'd take him as the #1. That would go to Pujols, with A-Rod at SS a close second.

[rangercal]

Johan, Pujols, Felix, cabrera, Crawford my top 5 in no particular order

[ChWRoCk2]

oo, let me  play.  Lets see, I'd like Johan Santana cause he's good, I'd like Albert Pujols cause he's good, I'd like Ichiro Suzuki cause he's good, and I'd like Eric Gagne cause he's canadian.

 

edit: I'm just giving you s*** by the way, cause I thought we were just picking one player.

Too hard to pick just one, but ok ok Id choose Bobby Abreu.

 

Happy

[ZoomSlowik]

That blurb doesn't even include his slider, which is probably his best pitch. One thing that's weird is that I haven't really seen much of the changeup on the occasions where I have seen him pitch. It looks like he almost exclusively uses the fastball and the curve. Guess I don't have a future career as a scout.

 

Seriously though, how many really good pitchers are there that you'd take over this guy without any doubt? Right now I've got about 10, and he can easily pass some of those guys with a good season if those guys don't match it. Granted I'm leaving out a couple because they're either ancient or haven't produced in the long haul, but it isn't that long until you get to guys like Beckett and Burnett that have some serious question marks.

Edited March 7, 2006 by ZoomSlowik

[Balta1701]

The one reason I'd consider King Felix to be very near the top whether or not he's fully proven that he can pitch 200 innings and stay healthy every year is that for the next 6-7 years, he's going to be making vastly less than he would if right now he hit the FA market. He's certainly worth 400k even if he winds up hurt.

 

But this thread asked us to ignore cash. When I ignore costs, I have to go with someone who's proven but still young. Santana fits that mold. So does Pujols. That's why they're my top 2. When I get to ignore $$, they put up better numbers than anyone else I see in baseball right now.

[Balance]

"I don't think that taste is there."

Heh heh heh. I caught it.

 

(Seconds after that was uttered, Podsednik takes Lidge deep for the walk-off HR.)

 

[CSF]

I'd take any of these 3 (all pitchers):

 

Johan Santana

Felix Hernandez

Carlos Zambrano

[mr_genius]

Brian Giles

[GreatScott82]

#1 Johan Santana (best pitcher in baseball IMO)

#2 Albert Pujols (imagine him as our DH?!?)

#3 Carl Crawford (very young, awesome athlete)

#4 A-Rod (don't like him, but he is w/o a doubt the best player in the game)

#5 Ichiru (getting up there in age, but he has a good 4 to 5 years left in him)

#6 Felix Hernandez (this young phenom is awesome!)

#7 Joe Maur ( what is it with Twins catchers that make them so good?)

#8 Carlos Beltran (he's over payed, but if he wasn't i'd take him)

 

Those are the 8 guys i wouldn't mind having on our team! Do we need them? Hell no! We're the champs