More on Jerry Manuel

[Jim Fainter]

Someone made a comment, can't remember where, that it was odd to bat Rios in the three slot Tuesday night when Frank was benched. I agree, and it reminded me of something.

 

A few years ago, in Denver, right fielder Larry Walker was injured. At the time he was batting third and hitting a ton. So, he is out for a week or three. The manager then was Jim Leyland. He played a different guy almost every night in right, because whoever he put out there went hitless. But whoever he played batted third. Finally, after a few games, the papers scaulded Leyland, and for good reason. Jerry coached under Leyland in Miami. Maybe they were joined at the hip.

[Winning Ugly]

Someone made a comment, can't remember where, that it was odd to bat Rios in the three slot Tuesday night when Frank was benched.  I agree, and it reminded me of something.

 

A few years ago, in Denver, right fielder Larry Walker was injured.  At the time he was batting third and hitting a ton.  So, he is out for a week or three.  The manager then was Jim Leyland.  He played a different guy almost every night in right, because whoever he put out there went hitless.  But whoever he played batted third.  Finally, after a few games, the papers scaulded Leyland, and for good reason.  Jerry coached under Leyland in Miami.  Maybe they were joined at the hip.

I agree. Maggs should bat third if Thomas is not starting or hurt. Lee bats cleanup until Konerko starts SOMETHING.

 

Rios or Daubach or anyone else batting 3rd would be a mistake, and it shows.

[southsider2k5]

Someone made a comment, can't remember where, that it was odd to bat Rios in the three slot Tuesday night when Frank was benched.  I agree, and it reminded me of something.

 

A few years ago, in Denver, right fielder Larry Walker was injured.  At the time he was batting third and hitting a ton.  So, he is out for a week or three.  The manager then was Jim Leyland.  He played a different guy almost every night in right, because whoever he put out there went hitless.  But whoever he played batted third.  Finally, after a few games, the papers scaulded Leyland, and for good reason.  Jerry coached under Leyland in Miami.  Maybe they were joined at the hip.

I agree. Maggs should bat third if Thomas is not starting or hurt. Lee bats cleanup until Konerko starts SOMETHING.

 

Rios or Daubach or anyone else batting 3rd would be a mistake, and it shows.

I wouldn't hit Carlos behind Maggs. It gives Carlos more protection with him in front of Maggs. I would hit Val #2 Carlos #3 and Maggs #4, with Frank on the bench.

[Mr. Showtime]

Rios or Daubach or anyone else batting 3rd would be a mistake, and it shows.

What shows, is that this team is awful no matter who hits where.

[Chisoxfn]

Don't go comparing Leyland to Manuel.

[cwsox]

What shows, is that this team is awful no matter who hits where.

That sadly is true. However when Frank sits I'd just as soon see CLee bat 2nd and Mags 3rd. But then again, what difference does that make this season.

[elrockinMT]

Leyland, Manuel and others learned under Felipe Alou. (at least I think Leyland is in the group)

 

But, what I see with Manuel is that he either follows his idea of the book or just flat does some goofy move that makes no sense. He lets a starter go six innings and then brings in 3 relief pitchers to go one each, instead of going with who's hot. He doesn't keep a set lineup often and refuses to play small ball. He doesn't even hit and run which you would think might keep Konerko and Maggs from hitting into so many DP's. The main thinking behind a hit & run is to have runners in motion and a batter that makes contact. We don't move...

[Texsox]

You can bat a guy 1st, 3rd, or 7th and it doesn't make a damn bit of difference when the entire team manages 3 hits.

I don't buy the b.s. that someone is comfortable batting in a given spot. By the second inning you might come up at any point in the lineup. The only reason I was more comfortable batting second was I figured I would have an extra at bat most games.

Every player should be ready to contribute based on the situation. You might be batting 7th in the order but could lead off an inning, so get your ass on base. You might be 4th in the order but come up with a runner on second and no outs, hit behind the mfing runner and move him up.

Let's get a little production then worry about fine tuning it. We aint the M's

[cwsox]

You can bat a guy 1st, 3rd, or 7th and it doesn't make a damn bit of difference when the entire team manages 3 hits.

I don't buy the b.s. that someone is comfortable batting in a given spot. By the second inning you might come up at any point in the lineup. The only reason I was more comfortable batting second was I figured I would have an extra at bat most games.

Every player should be ready to contribute based on the situation. You might be batting 7th in the order but could lead off an inning, so get your ass on base. You might be 4th in the order but come up with a runner on second and no outs, hit behind the mfing runner and move him up.

Let's get a little production then worry about fine tuning it. We aint the M's

There was a lot to agree with here, and stuff that I have been thinking all season with this club. Thanks for saying it better than I could.

[Rex Hudler]

Leyland, Manuel and others learned under Felipe Alou. (at least I think Leyland is in the group)

 

But, what I see with Manuel is that he either follows his idea of the book or just flat does some goofy move that makes no sense. He lets a starter go six innings and then brings in 3 relief pitchers to go one each, instead of going with who's hot. He doesn't keep a set lineup often and refuses to play small ball. He doesn't even hit and run which you would think might keep Konerko and Maggs from hitting into so many DP's. The main thinking behind a hit & run is to have runners in motion and a batter that makes contact. We don't move...

The coaching pipeline came Manuel and Leyland came from was the Detroit Tigers and Evansville, IN. Back in the 70's and early 80's Leyland managed the Evansville Triplets. Other managers, coaches and players in Evansville around that time were Jerry Manuel, Larry Rothschild, Les Moss, Bruce Kimm and Gene Lamont. I am sure there were others, but those are all I could think of off the top of my head.

 

Not a bad list of MLB coaches.

[YASNY]

I know one thing, our #3 hitter should not be a guy who is hitting .150 or so with RISP. Frank's done.

[Chisoxfn]

Wow thats quite a few guys all coming from the same area.

[Soxfest]

JM has claimed forever, team is going to be aggressive and NEVER is.

[witesoxfan]

I know one thing, our #3 hitter should not be a guy who is hitting .150 or so with RISP.  Frank's done.

You know, I agree with this.

 

But Frank is about the last guy that we should be complaining about who is struggling. Atleast Frank is still getting on base.

[southsider2k5]

You know, I agree with this.

 

But Frank is about the last guy that we should be complaining about who is struggling.  Atleast Frank is still getting on base.

As of the last few weeks he hasn't even been doing that much. He was great at getting on in April, but lately he hasn't even been walking at all.

[YASNY]

You know, I agree with this.

 

But Frank is about the last guy that we should be complaining about who is struggling.  Atleast Frank is still getting on base.

Bulls***. Frank's job is to drive in runs. His damn walks with a runner on 2nd just sets up a DP. Frank is toast.

[elrockinMT]

Did Manuel pinch hit Rios for Thomas in the 8th??? What was going on here? Or did he pinch run?

[elrockinMT]

I see that he pinch ran now, but I also see Konerko hits into another DP!!

[witesoxfan]

You know, I agree with this.

 

But Frank is about the last guy that we should be complaining about who is struggling.  Atleast Frank is still getting on base.

Bulls***. Frank's job is to drive in runs. His damn walks with a runner on 2nd just sets up a DP. Frank is toast.

His BBs may set up DPs, but the player has to hit the grounder to cause the DP.

 

Frank is helping the team as much as possible right now. His bat speed is down, and whether or not he realizes that that is what is causing his struggles, he does realize that he is struggling. He is getting on base, and regardless of the fact that he is a station-to-station baserunner, he is still setting the tables to bring in runs. There should be an occassional DP....not a DP every time Maggs or Paul "Flat Tires" Konerko comes ups.

 

Blame the guys who are hitting the DPs....not the guy who gets on base and is then a victim of the DP. Why not rag on Konerko instead of Thomas? Afterall, he is making more money than Frank is.

[YASNY]

You know, I agree with this.

 

But Frank is about the last guy that we should be complaining about who is struggling.  Atleast Frank is still getting on base.

Bulls***. Frank's job is to drive in runs. His damn walks with a runner on 2nd just sets up a DP. Frank is toast.

His BBs may set up DPs, but the player has to hit the grounder to cause the DP.

 

Frank is helping the team as much as possible right now. His bat speed is down, and whether or not he realizes that that is what is causing his struggles, he does realize that he is struggling. He is getting on base, and regardless of the fact that he is a station-to-station baserunner, he is still setting the tables to bring in runs. There should be an occassional DP....not a DP every time Maggs or Paul "Flat Tires" Konerko comes ups.

 

Blame the guys who are hitting the DPs....not the guy who gets on base and is then a victim of the DP. Why not rag on Konerko instead of Thomas? Afterall, he is making more money than Frank is.

Yes, Paulie ain't hitting a lick either. But Frank is 35 years old... he's done. Stick a fork in him. If he can't drive in runs, he's useless.

[witesoxfan]

You know, I agree with this.

 

But Frank is about the last guy that we should be complaining about who is struggling.  Atleast Frank is still getting on base.

Bulls***. Frank's job is to drive in runs. His damn walks with a runner on 2nd just sets up a DP. Frank is toast.

His BBs may set up DPs, but the player has to hit the grounder to cause the DP.

 

Frank is helping the team as much as possible right now. His bat speed is down, and whether or not he realizes that that is what is causing his struggles, he does realize that he is struggling. He is getting on base, and regardless of the fact that he is a station-to-station baserunner, he is still setting the tables to bring in runs. There should be an occassional DP....not a DP every time Maggs or Paul "Flat Tires" Konerko comes ups.

 

Blame the guys who are hitting the DPs....not the guy who gets on base and is then a victim of the DP. Why not rag on Konerko instead of Thomas? Afterall, he is making more money than Frank is.

Yes, Paulie ain't hitting a lick either. But Frank is 35 years old... he's done. Stick a fork in him. If he can't drive in runs, he's useless.

IMO, you can never give up on a hitter that once was as good as Frank was. He gets his batspeed up, and he is the same dominant player that he was in 2000.

 

I just don't know how you get his batspeed up, cause if he hasn't figured it out, then I don't know how you could get him to change it. I think he's gotten too big. He loses 20-30 pounds, and his batspeed might increase.

[elrockinMT]

Leyland, Manuel and others learned under Felipe Alou. (at least I think Leyland is in the group)

 

But, what I see with Manuel is that he either follows his idea of the book or just flat does some goofy move that makes no sense. He lets a starter go six innings and then brings in 3 relief pitchers to go one each, instead of going with who's hot. He doesn't keep a set lineup often and refuses to play small ball. He doesn't even hit and run which you would think might keep Konerko and Maggs from hitting into so many DP's. The main thinking behind a hit & run is to have runners in motion and a batter that makes contact. We don't move...

The coaching pipeline came Manuel and Leyland came from was the Detroit Tigers and Evansville, IN. Back in the 70's and early 80's Leyland managed the Evansville Triplets. Other managers, coaches and players in Evansville around that time were Jerry Manuel, Larry Rothschild, Les Moss, Bruce Kimm and Gene Lamont. I am sure there were others, but those are all I could think of off the top of my head.

 

Not a bad list of MLB coaches.

I agree about the quality, but check and I think you'll find that Manuel played for Felipe Alou as a coach??

[YASNY]

You know, I agree with this.

 

But Frank is about the last guy that we should be complaining about who is struggling.  Atleast Frank is still getting on base.

Bulls***. Frank's job is to drive in runs. His damn walks with a runner on 2nd just sets up a DP. Frank is toast.

His BBs may set up DPs, but the player has to hit the grounder to cause the DP.

 

Frank is helping the team as much as possible right now. His bat speed is down, and whether or not he realizes that that is what is causing his struggles, he does realize that he is struggling. He is getting on base, and regardless of the fact that he is a station-to-station baserunner, he is still setting the tables to bring in runs. There should be an occassional DP....not a DP every time Maggs or Paul "Flat Tires" Konerko comes ups.

 

Blame the guys who are hitting the DPs....not the guy who gets on base and is then a victim of the DP. Why not rag on Konerko instead of Thomas? Afterall, he is making more money than Frank is.

Yes, Paulie ain't hitting a lick either. But Frank is 35 years old... he's done. Stick a fork in him. If he can't drive in runs, he's useless.

IMO, you can never give up on a hitter that once was as good as Frank was. He gets his batspeed up, and he is the same dominant player that he was in 2000.

 

I just don't know how you get his batspeed up, cause if he hasn't figured it out, then I don't know how you could get him to change it. I think he's gotten too big. He loses 20-30 pounds, and his batspeed might increase.

He's had one good year out of the last 5. I think he's done... he may get on a hot streak eventually. But the consistant awesome Frank Thomas is a thing of the past.