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White Sox Acquire Infielder Alex Cintron


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QUOTE(easyw @ Mar 8, 2006 -> 01:24 PM)
Sorry - yeah - I meant Anderson.

 

Some of us work for a livin and I got like 5 things going on here.

 

Yes. Anderson.

 

Dye IS a streaky hitter. He has been prone to injury. He's, what, 33 years old? Is he an All-Star? What does he bring to the table? A lifetime .272 BA?

Earl is it?

 

Well, most of us work for a living, so that comment really will go unnoticed.

 

Secondly, Konerko is a streaky hitter, so whats your point. What does he bring to the table? Well yes, he was an all star in 2000 if that title actually means anything to you. Oh, and he was the WORLD SERIES MVP this year. And he led all RF'ers in hr's. But you are right, lets get rid of him. If I were you, I would just forget about walking down this road.

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QUOTE(easyw @ Mar 8, 2006 -> 12:38 PM)
Here's a thought -

 

KW is looking ahead to the trade deadline.

 

I agree that this trade doesn't make any sense give the current roster. The Sox need relief pitching, not more back-ups.

 

Ozuna and Mack can both play on the left side of the infield. But Mack prefers RF and Ozuna can play just about anywhere.

 

So...

 

Maybe, if Mack does well enough, mid-season, you put Dye on the block for some middle relief help. Or Sweeney goes back to Charlotte.

 

Dye will underperform this year, if he doesn't injure himself first.

 

Huh?

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I guess these guys are "eh" then.

 

Last years OPS+ numbers of guys that were similiar.

 

Pods OPS+ 86

Uribe OPS+ 85

AJ OPS+ 90

 

Then we have to look at frame of reference. Is Alex being asked to replace those guys. No. Here are the OPS+ numbers for the group of guys he is asking to replace.

 

Timo Perez OPS+ 48

Willie Harris OPS+ 72

Jeff Blumm OPS+ 33

 

Ok, well none of those guys is even on the team. He is probably "replacing" Gload. It's not a bad trade, it helps the team slightly. Maybe it will WARP wise translate into 1 more win on the season. The value for me in the trade is injury protection for Urbie and Gooch. In that sense it was a very smart move.

 

And yes, I do think "eh" about AJ and Pods. AJ plays catcher, so it's excusable, but Pods plays a corner outfield. Pods, in my mind, is an average player at the position, hence "eh". I don't care about Uribe's offense as much because he plays short and he's + about 25 runs there.

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QUOTE(chitownsportsfan @ Mar 8, 2006 -> 01:36 PM)
Ok, well none of those guys is even on the team.  He is probably "replacing" Gload.  It's not a bad trade, it helps the team slightly.  Maybe it will WARP wise translate into 1 more win on the season.  The value for me in the trade is injury protection for Urbie and Gooch.  In that sense it was a very smart move.

 

 

I agree with you there. I was always worried about putting Pablo in as a starting SS if Uribe would come down with an injury. Cintron makes me alot more confident in the backup situation.

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QUOTE(chitownsportsfan @ Mar 8, 2006 -> 02:05 PM)
Yea, a career OPS+ of 85.  Another "eh" trade.

What's Baj's ERA+ ?

 

Could any resident stathead, or BP Subscriber PLEASE tell me what is the point in looking at OPS or OPS+ for smaller frame baseball players whose roles are NOT to to hit hit home runs?

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I lost a lot of brain cells in Athens.

 

Dye was an All Star once? Five years ago?

 

Yes, he was WS MVP. That award easily could've gone to at least 2 or 3 other guys as well. He got hot in the series, which just reinforces my point - he is a streaky hitter. Dye's been on my fantasy team 3 years running. Weeks go by, he plays everyday and does nothing. Then, out of nowhere, goes 16 for 22 with 3 homers and 12 RBIs. So, at season end, he's got some numbers.

 

Konerko also hits like this, but to a much lesser degree. Plus, he's better in clutch situations, from what I've seen, anyways.

 

Maybe 'injury prone' isn't the best term for Dye, but he has had some notable injuries.

 

I dunno, I just get this feeling that he's gonna go down with an injury this year. Like I said, I hope I'm wrong...

 

Yeah, I was raised a Cub fan, but more importanly, I'm a Chicago baseball fan. I was at the clincher in 83, and the last game at old comiskey. I've put in just as much time on the south side as the north. The whole Cub-Sox hater thing is all hype.

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QUOTE(easyw @ Mar 8, 2006 -> 01:24 PM)
Sorry - yeah - I meant Anderson.

 

Some of us work for a livin and I got like 5 things going on here.

 

Yes. Anderson.

 

Dye IS a streaky hitter. He has been prone to injury. He's, what, 33 years old? Is he an All-Star? What does he bring to the table? A lifetime .272 BA?

 

and that helps your arguement that he'll have a down year how? He's been a consistent hitter his whole career. You can pretty much pencil him in for around a .275 average 25 homeruns and 80 rbi.

 

I don't consider batting a ball off a leg and breaking a bone or seperating a shoulder by crashing into Bengie Molina "injury-prone". I call those freak accidents.

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QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Mar 8, 2006 -> 01:44 PM)
What's Baj's ERA+ ?

 

Could any resident stathead, or BP Subscriber PLEASE tell me what is the point in looking at OPS or OPS+ for smaller frame baseball players whose roles are NOT to to hit hit home runs?

 

Amen to this.

 

 

:notworthy :headbang

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Ok, well none of those guys is even on the team.  He is probably "replacing" Gload.  It's not a bad trade, it helps the team slightly.  Maybe it will WARP wise translate into 1 more win on the season.  The value for me in the trade is injury protection for Urbie and Gooch.  In that sense it was a very smart move.

 

And yes, I do think "eh" about AJ and Pods.  AJ plays catcher, so it's excusable, but Pods plays a corner outfield.  Pods, in my mind, is an average player at the position, hence "eh".  I don't care about Uribe's offense as much because he plays short and he's + about 25 runs there.

No offense, but do statheads even care about defense or what? Gload plays one position well and it's not a hugely important defensive position. We have two starting 1st basemen in our lineup and Mackowiak on the bench who can also play 1B. Gload CANNOT play the outfield. He is a damn butcher out there. A guy who can play SS, 2B, and 3B is more valuable to a bench than a backup 1st baseman, regardless of offense.

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QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Mar 8, 2006 -> 01:44 PM)
What's Baj's ERA+ ?

 

Could any resident stathead, or BP Subscriber PLEASE tell me what is the point in looking at OPS or OPS+ for smaller frame baseball players whose roles are NOT to to hit hit home runs?

 

There is no point. Some people just live to b**** and complain. This is a good move by the Sox. End of story.

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I lost a lot of brain cells in Athens.

 

Dye was an All Star once? Five years ago?

 

Yes, he was WS MVP. That award easily could've gone to at least 2 or 3 other guys as well. He got hot in the series, which just reinforces my point - he is a streaky hitter. Dye's  been on my fantasy team 3 years running. Weeks go by, he plays everyday and does nothing. Then, out of nowhere, goes 16 for 22 with 3 homers and 12 RBIs. So, at season end, he's got some numbers.

 

Konerko also hits like this, but to a much lesser degree. Plus, he's better in clutch situations, from what I've seen, anyways.

 

Maybe 'injury prone' isn't the best term for Dye, but he has had some notable injuries.

 

I dunno, I just get this feeling that he's gonna go down with an injury this year. Like I said, I hope I'm wrong...

 

Yeah, I was raised a Cub fan, but more importanly, I'm a Chicago baseball fan. I was at the clincher in 83, and the last game at old comiskey. I've put in just as much time on the south side as the north. The whole Cub-Sox hater thing is all hype.

Sour grapes cuz your team has Neifi who will probably start at 2nd base because of Dusty and we will have Cintron on our bench? :P

 

What's Baj's ERA+ ?

 

Could any resident stathead, or BP Subscriber PLEASE tell me what is the point in looking at OPS or OPS+ for smaller frame baseball players whose roles are NOT to to hit hit home runs?

Great post. Maybe we should call up Bucky Jacobsen and go with an entire bench of 1st basemen and DH's. They have better career OPS+'s afterall.

 

BTW, I haven't noticed it yet in this thread, but......

 

WHITE SOX WEDNESDAY!!

Wow, this really holds true doesn't it? :huh:

Edited by SSH2005
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Wow!

 

I mean wow!

 

Jermaine Dye is the consummate professional. He's a man of character and class. He also happens to be a pretty damn good baseball player. For someone to take shots at this guy, after the solid year he put up last year is ludicrous.

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No offense, but do statheads even care about defense or what?

 

None Taken. Yes, that's why I explicity said that Uribe can be a very valuable player despite being mediocre offensively because he plays the hardest posisition in the game well, + 25 runs by some metrics.

 

Statheads don't care about defense much at 1B, LF, and RF--neither do scouts. This is the first thing you learn in little league: bad players to RF and LF, good players to SS, CF, and 2B--because those are far and away the 3 most important, with SS clearly the most important.

 

What's Baj's ERA+ ?

 

Could any resident stathead, or BP Subscriber PLEASE tell me what is the point in looking at OPS or OPS+ for smaller frame baseball players whose roles are NOT to to hit hit home runs?

 

OPS is a very simple stat that correlates very well with actual runs produced. It's a powerful measure of a players offensive worth. SS/2B with OPS+ of 85 are a dime a dozen. It was a good trade because the Sox get depth and a player they needed, however, it's not really a "fleecing". Both teams got rid of players they didn't need, both those players are largely inconsequential to either teams chances of success.

 

It was a minor trade with little risk, a little more reward--for both teams.

Edited by chitownsportsfan
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